WE'RE GETTING MARRIED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2044/2251486406_f8c3285c77.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3105/2861708720_e9d8098c2f.jpg?v=0

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2011/2369874422_3b08e6d9cb.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/108/309792635_4ff3c9776a.jpg?v=0

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/171/412810683_23b64938b9.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3033/2929913787_839d01b0a4_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3167/3077712985_3be7162891.jpg?v=0

http://l.yimg.com/g/images/spaceball.gif

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3050/3059432337_9a6e12abc4.jpg

yuck gr8080

i will do the whole gay wedding thing but i'm never gonna fucking do this shit ever.

http://vegasblog.latimes.com/vegas/images/2008/08/11/20080809_9601.jpg

you would get gay married but not otherwise married?

no i will pobably get married regular style but i'd do the adam and steve thing if it was to help a bro out.

i would sham marry someone to help them get U.S. citizenship if they paid me $1,000 and a dog cage

http://www.drewandangel.com/img_6217.jpg/img_6217-full;init:.jpg

http://www.shahbazian.org/876610049207_0_BG.jpg/876610049207_0_BG-full;init:.jpg

you can dj my sham wedding

those are killer.

http://www.dallasnews.com/img/photo/08-02/first_image.jpg

i would sham marry someone to help them get U.S. citizenship if they paid me $1,000 and a dog cage

― schwww im tired (harbl), Sunday, December 7, 2008 2:21 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

how big a dog cage u wahnt

and a working sewing machine please with all the accessories

Z_S those 3 do not belong on this thread

http://www.kauai-bedandbreakfast.com/gallery1/images/How%20exciting%20we%27re%20getting%20married%20here%20on%20Kauai%20-%20Becky%20&%20Brian.jpg

that looks like a WEDDING photo but i'll let it slide

dude is getting married dirt bag style^^

i would check the eSORN before i married that guy for sure

oh they don't have that in every state i guess

(electronic sex offender registration and notification)

http://www.maximphotostudio.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/bw-bc-03.jpg

H1pst3r 3Ng4g3m3nt

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2328/2376620349_afb86f22c4.jpg

this is supposed to be a picture thread but i gotta share this:

one of the caterers/wedding planners i work with was just talking to me about a couple she's working with. they're getting married in a kind of remote part of the resort and she has to give them a ride out there this PM at sunset to "look things over" but in actuality its so that he CAN ACTUALLY PROPOSE TO THE WOMAN HE IS ALREADY PLANNING A WEDDING WITH AND THEN THEY WILL HAVE GOTTEN ENGAGED AND MARRIED AT THE SAME ROMANTIC SPOT DHGDSGHJDKASGAHJAK

what is even the point jesus

savages

magical day

they'll prob get divorced anyway, after all that trouble

at the same spot

this thread basically sexy photoes 2

http://www.gps.caltech.edu/~barkume/engagement/engagement-Images/101_BW.jpg

http://ob81.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/happy_couple.jpg

http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa204/mpschweitzer/happycouple.jpg

http://www.masonminerdds.com/assets/images/happy-couple.jpg

http://dating.bellamo.co.uk/images/happy_couple.png

http://chickspeak.com/wp-content/uploads/happy_couple.jpg

http://www.romancetracker.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/happy-couple.jpg

thread is depressing me

so many future ugly babies

http://www.wilkinsonquints.org/images/Wedding.jpg

^^ those are gonna be hot babies

then:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_818u2CavTS0/R4Qxi9LRQzI/AAAAAAAAAdE/jmsKrXpSs2g/S220/Engagement%2B049-2.jpg

"hot babies"

first month anniversary!

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_818u2CavTS0/R3nTT9LRQsI/AAAAAAAAAa0/Jqm42LQweIg/s1600/pics%2B047.jpg

she cut her hair and lost a little bit of that tan lol

http://www.hodgefamily.net/wedding/engage.jpg

http://www.mnkilmer.com/pictures/030727.jpg

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x10/cgiddings84/Engagement436a.jpg

lolbrushing

her arm was mauled, i guess

twilight purity for teh temple

x-post omg

gr8080 was pretty OTM in starting this thread-- big ups

omg

people at my school are tacky and sometimes put these pictures on their facebooks but i'll be nice and not post them here :[

get drunk one nite and forget to be nice and then post them

it is very tempting!!!!

http://theadventureofalifetime.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/drunken-toronto-wedding.jpg

erica how do you not get this thread

i mean, you're a married person for christ sakes

uh o careful what u post on gradys special thread!

lol

http://i35.tinypic.com/2s1kk6r.jpg

I know, I know. I just couldn't pass that one up. Sorry. Will only post engagement photoes. :-(

you can make it up by posting your super gay engagement pictures that you obviously had taken and sent out to all your friends and families

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2221/2480143818_22be009a6b.jpg?v=0

did you have one framed with an extra huge mat that everyone at your wedding signed w/ a sharpie marker?

tru story: at my cousins wedding my rat bastard uncle that the rest of the family "doesn't talk about" showed up unexpected and signed the photo frame in RED sharpie when all 300 other people used the black sharpies that were clearly provided for such use

RAT BASTARD UNCLE 4 THA OWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes and it's now framed in our living room.

^^knew it.

http://bkcphoto.com/engagement_images/engagement_photo_20.jpg

SICK.

did u guys hear about the lady that was swept away by a wave during marriage proposal?

http://api.ning.com/files/no5IbvTRqFt5m81aGrFyArkYoDTj*GworeGGP2OLhdDTbQll36tGz5ePq0kGtdtnazZJJD8hUc92E-6oeviuOKhZRGeZVDq8/engagementVanHorn.jpg

no but for real a dude got swept away by a wave and drowned on his honeymoon not far from where i work.

yeah they were on some special romantic rock in oregon and as the guy was proposing a wave came up the lady (who was very small) was taken away and died :((((

lesson: propose at the bowling alley or something!!!!!!!!

We r serious engaged couple

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t295/threewinks/nicole%20and%20rich/kiser_engagement_01.jpg

a lot of these people look related to each other

No actual engagement pics were taken to show how extreme our love is however if we had done it, I think the matching double denim as evidenced upthread is the way to go.

Don't look too long at that last guy. He may kill you.

love the all denim outfit

Another couple who matched and also included their dog!

http://www.hollyabolton.com/wedding/engagement_3_2.jpg

dog is silently crying out for help.

totally relatd!

a lot of these people look related to each other

I knew a guy who was married to a woman that more or less looked like him in a wig.

I am into marrying a guy that looks like meself, only in a wig
what a smashing young gent he would be

i am an only child solely so i won't grow up to be rat bastard uncle

uh, wait. my parents decided to have another when i was 27.

the chance is still there!!!!

also matt p with the subtle "cactus" post a+

also matt p with the long haired brian posehn/bruce vilanch engagement photo a+

several gay wedding pics on enbb's facebook but no gay engagement pics unfortunately

erica next time you get married make sure you take some engagement fotos k?

erica's harem

mens in each room

i think i am going to be the rat bastard aunt :(((((((((

http://image50.webshots.com/150/3/77/50/2258377500084036165dYRjKh_fs.jpg

sooo glad me and the wife didn't do this shit, all wearing bitchmade sweaters and doing prom poses

but did u still have a gay wedding

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3268/2830385093_8997488f5b.jpg?v=0

http://l.yimg.com/g/images/spaceball.gif

that "peep my bling" pose is killing me inside

http://www.angleton.isd.tenet.edu/secondary/hs/smith/web/Group%20Project%20A/Assets/arguing.jpg

several gay wedding pics on enbb's facebook but no gay engagement pics unfortunately

― beyonc'e (max), Sunday, December 7, 2008 2:30 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Sorry to disappoint. Will heed yr advice next time.

A couple I know just hired their wedding photographer to take pics of them on their 1st anniversary dinner outing. Who the hell does that? Oh yeah, those idiots.

i will bend the rules if you can get copies and post them here

Will see what I can do.

lol

i don't understand the ritual of engagement for anyone not going thru an arranged marriage. but i appreciate the lulz it brings.

and she has to give them a ride out there this PM at sunset to "look things over" but in actuality its so that he CAN ACTUALLY PROPOSE TO THE WOMAN HE IS ALREADY PLANNING A WEDDING WITH AND THEN THEY WILL HAVE GOTTEN ENGAGED AND MARRIED AT THE SAME ROMANTIC SPOT DHGDSGHJDKASGAHJAK

I don't understand: they're planning their wedding before they are engaged?

i think it means like they talked about getting married and then the guy was like oh i got an idea let's get real engaged and have a photo op somewhere "special" and act totally gay and you can pretend to be surprised. and i'm guessing the girl's not the type to disagree she just goes along with whatever he says even though it's clearly stupid.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3268/2830385093_8997488f5b.jpg?v=0

BIGGIE FINGAZ

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/8247/biggiefingazeh6.gif

that guy looks like he is in for a life of pain

never forget
http://www.ilxor.com/ILX/ThreadSelectedControllerServlet?boardid=63&threadid=803

put a grenade in your mouth and spit out the pin

― El Tomboto, Friday, February 15, 2008 11:41 AM (9 months ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Sunny if you see this you should post the 409 pic.

missed the drama =(

http://image.blingee.com/images15/content/output/000/000/000/4a1/336969706_1196352.gif?4

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/3088/409ts4.jpg

hey, it's Ed Norton

nice

that is you, right

yah. its the 409 pic requested above.

a cleaner from the gods, apparently

also that pic is like american gothic but with amps and 409

was that your engagement announcement pic?

http://i33.tinypic.com/wk0bxw.jpg

YES (xp)

and YES (XXP)

we were so engaged then.

you should have gotten that picture framed in an oversized mat and had all your wedding guests sign it

we just had them sign the 409 bottle instead.

kinda like the biggie fingaz pic actually

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x18/gr8080/untitled-23.jpg

may jah have mercy on their souls

"Do you take this man to be your lawful weed-ed husband?"

irie do

do you toke this, man

http://images.mmosite.com/my/upload/9a/22/littleshine/09/0803/2009080321431_205.jpg

http://buffetoblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/halo-themed-wedding.jpg

oh my

Halo-y Matrimony

ban nerd marriage

bahahahaha

so is that a woman supposed to be lois lane?? cuz.. you know..

lol at "Robin" pointing at the camera

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/9774/landap.jpg

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/2126/lindsey038.jpg

dying

the babys expression

WE'RE COMMITTING SEXUAL ASSAULT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lolz

btw did pp and grady plan to return on the same day?

was pp gone?

i think me and omar returned on the same week. the whole gang's back together again ^_^

I went a year for the most part, though Tuomas was pretty much responsible for making me break my monk's vow.

The moderators here are still thin-skinned and blue-blooded, but hey lol it's a fucking messageboard.

^_^

put a grenade in your mouth and spit out the pin

― El Tomboto, Friday, February 15, 2008 11:41 AM (9 months ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

― ♪☺♫☻ (gr8080), Sunday, December 7, 2008 2:01 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark

^_^

wow that's where ttyih came from too. what a treasure!

ttyih?

uze sick

― Arms, Sunday, February 17, 2008 7:39 AM (2 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

it's like if u actually kiss a girl u got tu trust her

― Arms, Sunday, February 17, 2008 7:39 AM (2 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

american drunkyard

― Arms, Sunday, February 17, 2008 7:40 AM (2 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

eating 4 cancer

― Arms, Sunday, February 17, 2008 7:43 AM (2 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

uh

― Arms, Sunday, February 17, 2008 7:44 AM (2 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

rip

― Arms, Sunday, February 17, 2008 7:44 AM (2 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ttyih

― Arms, Sunday, February 17, 2008 7:45 AM (2 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

"talk to you in hell"?

― roxymuzak, Sunday, February 17, 2008 7:53 AM (2 years ago) Bookmark

hahahah rip usic

i will definitely tt him ih if it comes to that

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/5734/ohlindsey.jpg

they look very happy together.

PP! YAY!

http://i80.servimg.com/u/f80/12/20/78/90/gangs_10.jpg

Tuomas was pretty much responsible for making me break my monk's vow.

Eh? What did I do? Glad to see you back anyway!

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3267/3207592085_31b2d4121e_b.jpghttp://farm4.static.flickr.com/3267/3207592085_31b2d4121e_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3330/3208694030_a6d5c7bbfe_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3267/3207592085_31b2d4121e_b.jpg

hahaha

That looks more like a stock photo for "miserable marriage" to me o_0

http://www.kellicarnahanblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Jennifer-and-Doug-Engagement-84-1024x682.jpg

do you toke this, man

― latebloomer, Thursday, 22 July 2010 22:45 (6 months ago)

They're not engagement pics, but I think I need to post this link for posterity's sake:

http://s-ak.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web03/2011/2/21/12/enhanced-buzz-5469-1298309587-4.jpg http://s-ak.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web03/2011/2/21/12/enhanced-buzz-5966-1298309501-3.jpg

http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763
http://vimeo.com/15796763

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/7972/screenshot20110309at124.png

how come you and sunny didnt do one of those

Couldn't get the music rights from Melanie.

So how did you and Dad meet?

http://imageshack.us/m/196/4010/brittanyvaughanjoeybarr.jpg

cannot get over those photos of the couple fighting

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/9774/landap.jpg

the baby looks so uncomfortable

Those came from a guy on an old private messageboard I used to frequent. That's his niece, and his post was "Um, be honest, what do y'all think of this?" And the responses were all "Kinda rapey, Jed."

I wasn't supposed to post it elsewhere, but it was too good not to share.

Y'all don't get Jed after me, though.

the "jah is my witness" one is a guy i went to HS with and when max posted it to his tumblr a non-ilx HS friend saw it and was all o_O

lol

i posted some of the rape wedding pics to tumblr too and then PP said they came from a private msg board so i took em down

I mean, I don't care really if those get out. I think del griffith even found the original page they came from.

Just don't want to be frog gigged by Google, that's all.

gah wedding photography is the worst. the money you can wring out of people with some short DOF... ugh.

the number of times friends have said to me after their wedding, "Our photographer was such an asshole... darn, we should've just given you all that money."

"frog gigged"......?

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/2825/brittanywixsonandalexsu.jpg

wacky

http://gadgether.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/Crazy_Wedding_Theme_16.jpg

sigh
http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/gawker/2009/11/geek-wedding-2.jpg

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_sCmJb0PbkSE/TDUiAs7HwFI/AAAAAAAACp4/J-7bjaozwmM/s1600/1.jpg

why would you throw good food

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/262376_1955912551803_1662396947_1948696_258666_n.jpg

hhahahahaha

lol

http://i.imgur.com/VCeWN.jpg

ha, the hellokitty one is basically my little sister's dream-come-true wedding ceremony (she is 25 and engaged)

a+ revive

we found love in a photoshop layer

http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/4061/brandjnew.jpg

IT'S AN ENGAGEMENT PHOTO, NOT YOUR CHRISTMAS CARD!

noodle vague?!

http://i.imgur.com/ifxkV.jpg

http://gawker.com/5940288/before-proposing-to-girlfriend-man-fakes-his-own-death-to-show-her-how-meaningless-life-would-be-without-him

A wealthy Russian businessman who wanted to propose to his girlfriend decided to test her love for him before popping the question — by faking his own death.

After working with a stuntman, a make-up artist, a screenwriter, and a directer to stage a phony car crash, 30-year-old Alexey Bykov of Omsk told Irina Kolokov to meet him at a certain place at a certain time so she could witness the accident.

"When I arrived there were mangled cars everywhere, ambulances, smoke, and carnage," Kolokov told Russian media. "Then when I saw Alexey covered in blood lying in the road a paramedic told me he was dead and I just broke down in tears."

With his mission accomplished, Bykov rose from the dead and proposed to his stunned partner while drenched in "blood." Kolokov said she contemplated killing him "for real this time," but decided to agree to marry the lunatic instead.

"I wanted her to realise how empty her life would be without me and how life would have no meaning without me," Bykov said. "I think it worked but I promise it's the last time."

"I wanted her to realise how empty her life would be without an attention seeking dickhead."

Second word was all I needed to explain the rest of the article.

what a creep

Holy fucking shite

repulsive

He should make an annual thing of it

Too young an exposure to Harold & Maude messes people up.

he should have waited until after the funeral to make sure that she wouldn't move on within the next 5 years

"PS in case it's not clear I have have the means to make you a very happy woman for the rest of your life, or you could have an 'accident' right here right now"

http://chicago.barstoolsports.com/files/2012/08/couple-480x321.jpg

Why did they have to bring the tree into this.

wtf

got wood?

http://i.imgur.com/gPdRp.jpg

!

no way

Surely that's a joke? Surely?

Don't think so.

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=545145712168258&set=pb.171521896197310.-2207520000.1351046045&type=1&theater

That seems to lend credence to them realising it was funny straight away and posting it for lulz anyway.

http://assets.inarkansas.com/35011/fayetteville-engagement-brooke-arnold-nick-petrino.rooke-Arnold-&-Nick-Petrino-5

Oh, and only a few of you may get why this is so funny.

But.

That's Nick Petrino, son of Bobby Petrino.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41mA1yPJ03L._BO0,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,48,-75_AA500_SH20_OU01_.jpg

ha this hasn't hit sports blogs yet...

Oh they've been tipped.

Pa and son, um, have similar tastes:

http://assets.inarkansas.com/35509/fayetteville-engagement-brooke-arnold-nick-petrino.jpg

oh this poor child

http://i.imgur.com/FSDnluF.jpg

Weird. Looks sordid, somehow, and makes me feel uncomfortable.

"now I'm gonna take a step back to be sure that we get the electricity meter in the shot. good. now lean against the wall. great. oh and punch her in the back, craig. perfect"

Ha!

lol exactly

they'll prob get divorced anyway, after all that trouble

― schwww im tired (harbl), Saturday, December 6, 2008 5:12 PM (4 years ago)

lmao harbl <3

otm

Congrats you two

I mean that

http://i.imgur.com/RscbZzX.jpg

god

those people look like they have weird secrets

I like how each half of the heart is RAWR cat claw!

"We'll just row this boat a mile out to sea, and then dump your ex business partner's body over the side."
"Whatever you say honey."
"I love you."
"I love you too."
*sounds of thumping from inside a sack in the boat*
"MMPH! MMPH! HLP!! HLP!!!"
"Shut up in there."

for a second I thought gr8080 had found that special l8080

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-_1NlBw1b7AY/UAxinvXN5YI/AAAAAAAABws/HV9V4SHXhoo/s1600/engagement+session+ideas+creative+36.jpg

she kind of looks like she's about to slice his jugular open with her retractable claw xp

Lot of body language in gr8080's and I get this "So it is gonna happen, but no one really feels great about it," sort of vibe from it.

And that's a half-assed heart, tbqfh.

It's like he suddenly realised that he's got married to one of the aliens from 'V'.

I just wonder how much his dad's investment firm brought in last year.

Totally stolen from Buzzfeed, which is fine since they totally stole these from somewhere else:

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr06/2013/4/10/5/enhanced-buzz-23001-1365586284-0.jpg
http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr03/2013/4/10/5/enhanced-buzz-20724-1365586402-21.jpg
http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr06/2013/4/10/5/enhanced-buzz-22323-1365586639-0.jpg

Aaaannnnnd.....

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr03/2013/4/10/5/enhanced-buzz-24374-1365586660-1.jpg
http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr06/2013/4/10/5/enhanced-buzz-6856-1365586868-0.jpg

yiiiikes to all of those

wtf at no dumping

should hook them up with these weirdos

http://www.xojane.com/relationships/relationshit-how-much-bathroom-talk-is-too-much

http://img.chinasmack.com/www/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/nazi-cosplay-09.jpg

http://img.chinasmack.com/www/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/nazi-cosplay-19.jpg

thier wedding carriage
http://img.wiocha.pl/images/6/5/6509a1293d7057db8bd3958f3471cd08.jpg

http://www.eleganceandenchantment.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Carnival-Engagement13.jpg

http://www.photographyschoolsonline.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/20-Awkward-Engagement-Photos-12.jpg

lot of hiding from the photographer happening here.

http://cdn.greenweddingshoes.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/notebook_engagement_photos_08.jpg

well, except for this one maybe.

http://www.daydreamercinema.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Amy-+-Rory-Engagement-40.jpg

*checks couple's homestate*

*breathes sigh of relief*

http://craigphotography.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/gay-surprise-engagement-0021.jpg

"We were kinda hoping you could make it look like something from a movie."

"Hmmm, yes. Have you ever seen The French Connection?"

"Oh that sounds romantic!"

http://assets.inarkansas.com/43229/conway-engagement-allison-franks-kyle-land.jpg

Did dog flip his nose up and gobble the ring down like a doggie biscuit? Or is this a taxidermied dog?

omg i totally did a double-take on the nazi one

http://i.imgur.com/yCock57.jpg

I'm glad they found each other.

would've been hard to miss.

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/969179_673090612731337_1899394547_n.jpg

"Last requests? A cigarette, maybe?"

needs more blinfolds

your my

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z04VIhagpko

brought to you by

http://www.centergrove.k12.in.us/cms/lib4/IN01000850/centricity/domain/444/drama.jpg

http://leahandmark.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Zombie-Engagement-Session-LeahAndMark-0006.jpg

(To provide context, this lovely couple got their friends to dress up as zombies. What do you mean that doesn't really provide any context?)

http://www.35atlanta.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/engagement-portfolio-002.jpg

HER: Did you hear that?
HIM: No, I didn't. [tightens grip]

http://www.gavinphotography.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/engagement-mariaoliver-12.jpg

She's so beautiful. I can't believe I'm marrying her! ... I'll ... I'll just lay down my arm and put my hand here.

http://www.chicagoillinoisweddingphotography.com/uploads/2010/02/railroad-tracks-northbrook-oakbrook-engagement-photos.jpg

Wonder if she's found someone to hold her train at the cerem – oh forget it.

pp you're good at this thread

this is what living in flyover country does for you. this shit is just in the air.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/05/27/article-2640611-1E3F05A500000578-588_964x728.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/WE7UNgn.jpg

dying.

taylor swift?

feel like the groom was told 'do something natural with your hands', and he just knocked it out of the park

http://i.imgur.com/pv0EOnf.jpg

Something to do with the dull, lifeless eyes focusing on nothing.

And then, there's that painting behind them.

is the painting a combination of their human forms?

i have sooo much speculation about this couple but really i should just say mazel tov

goole otm

so happened

no

She's so pretty but then there's...that dress, but the dress is so crazy, it just might work, but then there's HIM, and that definitely does not work at all.

they should have listened to hurting, obviously

Marriage: Classic or Dud?

cmon guys

http://i.imgur.com/cAQWi5O.png

http://gawker.com/bill-murray-crashed-this-couples-engagement-photos-1589681024

he's a weird dude

People's style mismatches are always intriguing to me. That guy is dressed boringly but at a certain level of what passes for formality, and her dress is a stripey potato sack.

stripey potatoes sound delicious

Bill. Fucking. Murray.

Celebrities and their crashing.

http://cbsnewyork.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/ed-dwyer-jennifer-smith.jpg?w=420

http://www.destinationweddingmag.com/files/imagecache/enlarged_image/_images/201009/alg_bruce2_0.jpg

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/bruce-springsteen-makes-cameo-in-couples-engagement-photos/

they're just like us

because if we crashed wedding photos, the couple would love those photos and distribute them widely.

I wonder if celebrities would be interested in having me in their photos so they can brag about how down to earth they are to celebrity friends

http://i.imgur.com/iMOU5kO.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/lF3iYHf.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Um5L1fa.jpg

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/50/1a/07/501a07e1fd9bb3cb0b296ab76bd1fbbc.jpg

oh my god those first two

all of them

that first one is terrifying, like something from a horror movie about a serial killer that leaves facebook macros at the scene as his calling card.

"The solitary set of footsteps came after I threw you into the ocean..."

Footprints, where's my red pen.

http://www.ayresphoto.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/buffaloengagementphotographers002.jpg

http://exquisiteweddingsmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/e4.jpg

http://exquisiteweddingsmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Engagement-Photos-Kitchen-Canoodling005.jpg

http://www.daisyandthebear.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Paul_Shona-18.jpg

"Seriously? All your shirts with collars were still in the washer?"

when did people start doing this?

http://exquisiteweddingsmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/e4.jpg

were these ppl just huge fans of the wire?

the amount of 'dude just couldn't even begin to make an effort' is something in these pics

"Sometimes, I guess there just aren't enough rocks."

http://www.ayresphoto.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/buffaloengagementphotographers002.jpg

this is that 'slenderman' thing i was reading about right?

http://i.imgur.com/NMEzxPI.jpg

god I love this thread

"now I'm gonna take a step back to be sure that we get the electricity meter in the shot. good. now lean against the wall. great. oh and punch her in the back, craig. perfect"

― Garth Brooks In ... The Life of (Sufjan Grafton), Friday, January 25, 2013 8:38 PM (1 year ago)

^^i think abt this post all the time

Thought this revive would have been about this

http://www.oregonlive.com/aloha/index.ssf/2014/06/aloha_couples_wedding_photos_w.html

http://i.imgur.com/RJwiWRI.jpg

kinda love that, have the bride walk down the aisle to 'no quarter'

otm

teal & orange

let the garters hit the floor

jfc @ all of these recent ones

http://rmabey.smugmug.com/Other/Engagement-Photographers-Utah/i-p9mbP3K/1/XL/Engagements-Salt_Lake_City-Beth_JJ-044_48-XL.jpg
Found a match for the one above by the fence.

http://www.carrieowensphotography.com/website/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/salt-lake-city-utah-engagement-photographer-couple-with-red-truck-03(pp_w680_h510).jpg
That tow guy is never going to get here.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SEVVub1c-To/UEuc-oGFYpI/AAAAAAAAH6g/H3-Xnsd9n5c/s1600/DSC_0248.jpg
Me going through the different combinations of person holding which sign so the groom's not referring to himself in third person = me looking at too many of these this week.

http://www.deonethorntonphotography.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/101(pp_w639_h426).jpg
Isn't this the guy from the old Police Squad! shows?

ha i love the first one

still loling @ horse heads in 2014

this thread is too good

girl with horseguy visibly regretting her life choice there

http://www.ayresphoto.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/buffaloengagementphotographers002.jpg

the photos are coming from INOUTSIDE THE HOUSE

(this one:) http://www.ayresphoto.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/buffaloengagementphotographers002.jpg

Horse head one bears an uncanny resemblance to Avril Lavigne and Chad Kroeger.

http://i.imgur.com/3nZONcE.jpg

http://screamer.deadspin.com/kyle-beckermans-engagement-photos-are-a-treasure-1596447545/

strokin those dreads

loool

nsfwy

http://elitedaily.com/envision/the-latest-trend-for-bridesmaids-is-to-pull-up-their-dresses-and-show-off-their-butts-photos/645024/

cool trend

http://i.imgur.com/qjtrtJu.jpg

"uh, guys i'm gonna turn the camera off now ok?"
"no keep it on"

Ma'am do you need me to call for help

rip

he looks like a dog taking a dump

key necklace

It's the out-of-focus flowers in the foreground that put that picture into this thread.

http://i.imgur.com/1i8m8En.jpg

those shots are only possible with an xl lense iirc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UW7W3SCIoc

Hit It!
Na, na na na na, na na na na
Na na na, na na na, na na na na

Here comes the hot stepper, murderer
I'm the lyrical gangster, murderer
Pick up the crew in-a de area, murderer
Still love you like that, murderer

No no we don't die, yes we mul-ti-ply
Anyone test will hear the fat lady sing
Act like you know Rico, I know what Bo don't know
Touch them up and go, uh-oh! Ch-ch-Chang Chang

http://youarenotaphotographer.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/hay-klsses.jpg

I think this might be the best thread.

holy shit carl

i don't see no ring

it's buried in the hay

I am grateful to the artist. He or she didn't have to leave that whisper of aquamarine reassurance for my psyche.

wonder if sex with that guy is like finding a

that dude is baller

kinda think the photographer was grasping at straws here

str8 ppl are so fuckin weird

I'm getting a strong sense of like Ukranian boondocks from that photo.

haha otm

get more of a Guatemalan boondocks vibe myself
http://www.worldatlas.com/webimage/flags/countrys/zzzflags/gtlarge.gif

The important thing is that no one try to pin that Eurotrash glasses & neck chain car wreck on the American Midwest. We've made some poor choices, those of us in Farm Country, (COUGH OVERALL SHORTS COUGH) but we are not shouldering this.

I'm getting a strong sense of like Ukranian boondocks from that photo.

― Orson Wellies (in orbit), Tuesday, January 27, 2015 6:21 PM (44 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol yeah me too.

oh come now "eurotrash" is just as unfair to the wonderful people of the ukraine, including that dude who i'm sure is delightful

'the ukraine' is unfair to people of ukraine iirc

the kiss close-up makes me think of the ariel pink "round and round" cover

Will you just please stop it, San Francisco?

http://i.imgur.com/dwFvRhf.jpg

This also seems like an easy one, but you know what? I'm feeling this guy's "fuck it, it's her day" vibe here.

http://i.imgur.com/zrIuwVR.jpg

Here's my Ukranian entry. Maybe that brand of soda doesn't have the same connotation over there*.

http://i.imgur.com/FoVlFWg.jpg

*Of course it has the same connotation. WOOP WOOP.

This collection of garbage is as red as the oxygen rich blood that pumps through my heart. The heart is an organ to which we humans traditionally but mistakenly attribute our dear thoughts of love for each other. We sure saw a fuck ton of movies.

- Josh

You'd think I'd offer this guy the same pass that I gave the guy from yesterday, three posts above, but no. I'm not giving this guy anything.

http://i.imgur.com/577Zffa.jpg

loose french cuffs & shorts oh my

that guy did ok

http://i.imgur.com/X5SHxwp.jpg

Juust like that movie.

http://i.imgur.com/YdtVpr3.jpg

You know, the one about Mussolini.

http://i.imgur.com/ASMImfn.jpg

Found this one and thought, OK, these are from a blog that she wrote about the two of them brainstorming for engagement photo ideas, right?

http://i.imgur.com/sJDeYmf.jpg

No. This is part of the engagement photo package.

http://i.imgur.com/u71CWx4.jpg

Hey, we can't always get our first-round pick.

http://i.imgur.com/WEd2MHe.jpg

"Spare change? How about a spare change of venue?"

Finally, I again wanted to congratulate Mr. & Mrs. Z S.

http://i.imgur.com/Sayy6O0.jpg

omfg

I'm having a dick moment, Phil K. style

Bloody hell.

like.. thats really not you two, is it. But yet...

we are getting arried on the titleists is seriously next level

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/s480x480/10408523_10200349679941126_7369978729761505916_n.jpg?oh=b1fad27b5e8327276e19b95a3998fcc2&oe=55853878&__gda__=1435433582_347849e1104f46212643975922b811d1

lOl

If ZS ever does get married he needs to have an engagement gif set

and holy lol @ the hayroll

posted upthread!

it's a victory lap

so nice it gets posted twice

i welcome them

Part III in the continuing saga of one partner standing behind the other going "Damn, dat ass..."

http://i.imgur.com/Th9kwad.jpg

At least she's not wearing shorts.

Found these

http://i.imgur.com/GE4VDzq.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/MFaCmeh.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/43JdV7P.jpg

because I was looking for the source of this one:

http://i.imgur.com/ziQ9Z5O.jpg

lol

i want to see the pictures of them eating the fish, the close-up shots of dripping fish juices running through bottom teeth

i mean a friend wants to see these pictures

http://i.imgur.com/qhEwyJ1.jpg

Lol, lost another worm!http://i.imgur.com/FbvxwG9.png Goddammit, use your wrist like I told you.

ZS needs to make a business out of wedding gifs

http://proimageweddings.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/01-Baker-Beach-Engagement-Session-Photographer-Pictures-01.jpg

https://elizabethgaray.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/img_0484w.jpg

now these are legitimately cool

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0kmYniKqMv8/TsPUAzFwvNI/AAAAAAAABpU/34KP5TaH_KQ/s640/MJP-0016.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-GqAeXJ9EEzo/TsPT-xmqVCI/AAAAAAAABos/nz71ZllQAow/s640/MJP-0008.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-acQFzR_oKqA/TsPT_Gh_6vI/AAAAAAAABo0/gzlRrINRJlo/s640/MJP-0010.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-q-t0nH9vtwE/TsPT9n1M3MI/AAAAAAAABoU/2XMbgHIoO7U/s640/4.jpg

Building A Bridge of Love (to Sausalito)

and muir woods

red-faced with embarrassment at the larpers

standing on the log. omggg

there are so many Star Wars themed ones

http://ohanablog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Star-Wars-wedding-120129-SP.jpg

what in the fuck

http://i.imgur.com/hIGKh9S.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/JI90jFT.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/UMu6M55.jpg

this would be a weird one even without the cosplay

http://i.imgur.com/Kjm2AWV.jpg

This pair is off the hook this month, and this month only.

http://i.imgur.com/3HjRD3x.jpg

yup

ha, the first Han & Leia one is pretty cute imo

i sorta like the cosplay ones, not because ho ho ho lol star wars photo but because in the case of the oversized helmets one it seems like an attempt to make an end run around the expectations of doing these stupid photos at all, like, nope, we're not gonna give you soft-focus photos of us wearing three times as much makeup as we ever do and a hairstyle we never wear otherwise, etc. i mean the people might or might not be dorks but it comes from a different place than "behold, our soft-focused love is so unique"

amazing thread in any case, good job everyone

"behold, our whimsical pop-culture love is so unique"

no, i agree that it borders on that but...i dunno. at least it's not giving aunt wanda what she wants to see. i dunno.

http://i.imgur.com/nI8f6c8.jpg

Can you guess which movie they're paying homage to?

http://i.imgur.com/wsBJvSR.jpg

One more hint:

http://i.imgur.com/rVWu1fd.jpg

Zodiac

loool

loool

What the

http://i.imgur.com/vV265d5.jpg

Oh, she's painting their names on the mailbox. Nevermind...

And I didn't know this was an homage to a movie too. Learn something new each day.

http://i.imgur.com/KYHiBB8.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/vobSrOx.jpg

oh ffs

omg

http://i.imgur.com/Z1yhiOt.jpg

http://offbeatbride.com/2014/11/big-lebowski-wedding

what movie inspired the standing-around-waist-deep-in-water pics???

http://i.imgur.com/cRuITJW.jpg

xp The Notebook

Thread is heating up

love how nobody's getting close to matching rachel mcadams's swimsuit, but the grooms are all doing just fine thanks to the proliferation of old man hats

wearing clothes in water is the worst

where's the johnny roastbeef pink cadillac death scene goodfellas wedding

http://i.imgur.com/e2kNBLn.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/MlCjmtn.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/nCs53h6.jpg

this ones killing me

http://i.imgur.com/MHeYlbD.jpg

what is the concept even

if she's already checking her husband as baggage then is there really hope for anyone else

http://i.imgur.com/jzSVLCM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/wWhLFrQ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/2Vnfo91.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/cTghSha.jpg

OK I really *really* don't understand that one. She's so hot she burned down the house?

oh god that couple is terrifying i bet they destroyed that home for fun

i dont mean to kinkshame but i draw the line at forcibly evicting ppl via home demolition

is a big cause of these growing the fact that everybody has a friend who is a photographer who's at least more than a hobbyist and has some decent equip+photoshop? i dont want to buy you anything but here have some unique fotos on me friends YOURE WELCOME

that last one is from a pretty pricey full-time wedding photographer's website - they start at $5k/wedding

http://i.imgur.com/4mtBhad.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/HDym6KB.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/A82dK0n.jpg

has;l;asdb

does a mini cooper even have anything in it that could smoke

this photog really thinks fire is cool

http://i.imgur.com/62348mv.jpg

what the

do the insurance companies know about him?

first one in the burning mini cooper series sets up a great many plots, none of which are "these people get married at the end"

insurance companies hate him

As we made our way through more of the buildings we stumbled upon a vagrant who was taking a nap in a train car. He didn’t seem to mind us shooting photos and continued to nap.

http://i.imgur.com/OuK4T4j.jpg

lolololol

o u want ruin well you've come to the right guy Matthew D Ruin at yr service let me *Ruin* yr engagement pics

omg the derelict settings

Eric and Alyssa
Joining Together upon the Ruins and Wreckage of Past Relationships

Something about that Mini Cooper series reminds me of the Costacos Bros.

http://i.imgur.com/64YrVDD.jpg

the stranded car scenes remind me a tad of David Lynch (eg Lost Highway)-- very auspicious for a marriage

^^ same era though, right?

How is it that some couples can nail a pose perfectly,

http://i.imgur.com/3jz3fGO.jpg

while others trying the same thing… wind up in here?

http://i.imgur.com/ZMNwPjQ.jpg

haha

the people who are obsessed with fire have a nice lighting setup, I bet

pp furiously otm

feel like the photographer could say 'wait, no. you're doing it wrong' or 'be gentle, juiceman' to that dude, though.

that is why having expensive gear and lightroom/photoshop know-how is not enough to make for a great photographer

also if i had to guess i'd say the first couple is used to holding each other like that and the second couple probably never embrace like that

& tbh that's why i started this thread; i have nothing against an engagement photoshoot but it should capture a couple as they really are

ok sorry back to the lols

is a big cause of these growing the fact that everybody has a friend who is a photographer who's at least more than a hobbyist and has some decent equip+photoshop? i dont want to buy you anything but here have some unique fotos on me friends YOURE WELCOME

― brosario nawson (m bison), Sunday, March 15, 2015 3:36 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

that last one is from a pretty pricey full-time wedding photographer's website - they start at $5k/wedding

― gr8080, Sunday, March 15, 2015 3:40 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

tbh i think the reason these are growing is because wedding photographers include the "engagement shoot" as a part of the whole wedding package, it is a way for them to make some more $$

like you could spend $2000 for just the wedding day photos or you could spend $3000 to include the "engagement shoot"

The second couple seem to be closer to each other's size/height. Thinking about it that way, it's a pretty awkward position.

i know this because my wife and i reenacted a mumford & sons music video for our engagement shoot

lol j/k

wedding photographers include the "engagement shoot" as a part of the whole wedding package, it is a way for them to make some more $$

thanks for answering my question; was wondering wtf purpose of these is

what do couples think is the purpose; how do they use these photos? put up on a website? shared on Facebook? saved for future children’s parent-mocking?

to me seems like some horribly humiliating frat hazing initiation but into marriage

I became fb friends with our photographer. As far as I can tell, she has been skiing at awesome places all winter. So I think I'll switch careers using the knowledge gained itt.

Jeff and I got engagement photos taken despite being very much not what one would consider the engagement photos type because we'd never done anything like that before and I thought it would be a good excuse for it (Jeff remained opposed to it but went along anyway because he's a good sport) and then we could give photos to our families, who were always hassling us about it. We got a real professional wedding photographer who was also a friend of a friend and did it on the cheap (we didn't have a wedding photographer at all, but we had a very low key wedding).

They are arguably not very creative (on the shores of Lake Michigan with the Chicago skyline in the background! So original!) but I like them a lot and still have one framed in our living room and an outtake at work because it's hilarious.

If I had it to do all over again, we might have gone for the haystack setting, though.

imo it probably comes from the pre-internet tradition of running an engagement announcement (typically accompanied by a photo) in your local newspaper.

the advent of internet + social media + digital photography has changed it in to something else

?

the nytimes still does wedding/engagement announcements (lower left at http://www.nytimes.com/pages/fashion/weddings/index.html) and they are totally a vanity thing. A friend's engagement was listed and it was completely because his wife's parents were very into token status things.

what do couples think is the purpose; how do they use these photos? put up on a website? shared on Facebook? saved for future children’s parent-mocking?

"shared on Facebook" is about all the explanation this needs IMO. Presumably the photographers talk up this angle to their clients, but I doubt most need that much convincing. It lets them post something NOW, get beaucoups of likes and comments and build the brand of their wedding months in advance of the wedding shots.

I also suspect wedding photos themselves feel less personal or meaningful in 2015 than years ago when you only saw the wedding albums of people you actually gave a shit about (well, and coworkers and such) and so it was kinda rare to see images of tuxes and white gowns in front of green grass or whatever. Sorta like baby pictures. Now virtually every day I'm brushing past the wedding or baby photos of someone I don't know very well on Facebook. I could imagine couples having some (not necessarily articulated or voiced) desire to have something that feels more "casual" or "like us" or with "real reactions" to each other and/or some quirky scenario. Something with "personality" - which is tough to do in the wedding shots unless you do a theme wedding (something still way out on the fringe).

every wedding is a theme wedding, in a way

ours was drunkenness

http://greenweddingshoes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/chocolate-engagement-party-09.jpg

I would like to think the groom was looking at a print of that picture of the bride

PiP typically used to show another thing at the same time

Couples can also submit their photos to magazines like this one: http://engagedri.com/category/engagements/ for some nifty pub.

also some half-baked theory abt the secularization of middle class american culture/ 15min of fame/ capitalism making ppl consumers of everything (even when what was once tradition)

idk

I haven't been to a "cool" wedding but of friends-of-friends who had one, they had much less cool divorces

I could imagine couples having some (not necessarily articulated or voiced) desire to have something that feels more "casual" or "like us" or with "real reactions" to each other and/or some quirky scenario. Something with "personality" - which is tough to do in the wedding shots unless you do a theme wedding (something still way out on the fringe).

that makes sense. also gr8080’s social explanation: it’s a public statement/ performance not just for family but larger community, which (for many) is now expected.
photogs & couples imitate the look and tropes of on-trend engagement photos, some also (ostensibly) try to stake out some uniqueness/ originality/ authenticity.
also maybe the personal family “photo album” with candid pictures has lost its aura— world inundated with e.g. stream of flickr/ Facebook images; hence need for patina of “professional” photography to mark out these photographs (and what they commemorate) as special, as an “event”

(imo the professional sheen just flattens & drains the photographs of any aura-- makes most look like stock photography)

anyway, the props

http://www.theochoink.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/IMG_7473.jpg
http://stylesbyanndiary.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/13-SF-Bay-Area-Engagement-Session-Photography.jpg

(imo the professional sheen just flattens & drains the photographs of any aura-- makes most look like stock photography)

This is also because a lot of the photographers aren't very good though! Like very little of what's been posted in this thread really seems like it's done by photographers who (a) know their shit and (b) care about getting good photos out of their subjects (c) have the slightest idea how to do that. Not to say any of that would make them immune to photography zeitgeist and trends and so on, or that you could even really avoid that if you tried - - - most wedding photographs from the 70s (or 80s, or 90s) kinda look alike, cause of different film stock and hairstyles and so on. That can't be helped, but a good photographer should know when they're looking through the lens and seeing something awkward, stagey, inadvertently loveless, or otherwise worthy of this thread.

I know a married photographer couple in Columbus who do really solid engagement and wedding work, I think because #1 they take their craft as photographers pretty seriously and #2 they seem to actually like the couples and want them to look good.

This is also because a lot of the photographers aren't very good though! Like very little of what's been posted in this thread really seems like it's done by photographers who (a) know their shit and (b) care about getting good photos out of their subjects (c) have the slightest idea how to do that.

True! Takes great skill & sensibility to be a good portrait photographer.

Yet I think something about the genre itself (at least current incarnation of it) is intrinsically... pitfally. But this may be my (photographic & psychological) biases talking.

Soon-to-be married couples are generally pretty awkward anyway. It crosses the line when somehow the photographer emphasizes that awkwardness.

I mean, of all the goofy shit that's been posted here, I think this thread still could be summed up by this one gr8080 posted four years ago.

http://i.imgur.com/Ow1M7cC.jpg

I mean, why why why did the photographer make those people do that?

xpost Sure - for one thing, the whole impulse ("our engagement is different from all the other engagements") is fallacious, and so there are any number of ways that the photos can founder. But this is true of lots of "special" events that are only special because they're happening to you or your friends/family. Maybe what's changed is just the quantity/visibility of strangers' images; realizing just how many billions of beardos are doing the same woodland authenticity photos as you are surely has to make it harder to pull off the affect without the photos collapsing into self-awareness and/or irony.

I mean lawd…

http://i.imgur.com/2Kkdgvc.jpg

photography is so weird, you can get the lights and exposure and shutter time right, but if you're taking pictures of people, you have to have an entirely different skillset

my friend (an architect) helped this dude who is a professional architecture photographer one time and it's amazing what you can do with technique. however, the same photographer also does portraits of people who work for the studios, and I kid you not, the people end up looking like buildings

i could 100% believe that - - - over the past half-decade i've shifted to mainly shooting architecture, from primarily doing friendly people-pictures and candids and i've lost a whole set of skills related to the latter, even as i've improved as "a photographer" generically.