post here if you favor replacing our Suggest Ban system with a Killfile system

polls are disabled on IMP??? smdh

anyway, i know we've done the SB debate to death but fuck it. also, i know the answer to this is "go code it yourself" but that's never going to happen, sorry. i bring good ideas to the table, not coding. also, the code for this already exists in the greasemoney app, right??

personally i think it's fucking disgusting that ILX has a "suggest ban" system at all let alone next to every single post, and i know i may be in the minority when it comes to that. but how hard would it be to replace the SB button with a "hide this user" button??? wouldn't that save EVERYONE a lot of grief? other boards employ this to great effect, and it makes for way less "hard work" for mods and less of a butthurt environment.

look if you don't want whiney around, it doesn't mean i should get deprived of one of my favorite posters. i don't get to KIP and cast vote for someone to stay. its fucked up. 51 is as arbitrary a number as 2 or 3 or 5,000. guarantee you there's at least 52 posters/lurkers who would rather whiney stayed around.

so lets do it-- lets try out killfile for a month instead of SB's.

we deserve better!!!!!!!

sounds like u have stumbled upon a suggest unban option

which I would support, kill file wouod make threads flow kinda awkward

this sucks for you gr80 and my heart bleeds but srsly lol

bad timing to start this terrible thread when the suggest ban function has had such a banner day

ugh. gr80 otm

lol i guess but its still stupid, basically disgusting and generates so much fucking noise

basically agree with gr80 - SBs are good for knowing when you're being a dick (my own level has been fluctuating accordingly of late) but if you cross that line then the reality of the ban is pretty barbaric - plus it engenders the sort of tedious debate we nonetheless have to have

also, 'next to every post'...yes, it's really bad karma for the messageboard to be like this, i often think

you should at least have to visit a user's profile to SB them

its fucking gross that its next to EVERY SINGLE POST

which I would support, kill file wouod make threads flow kinda awkward

― fuck wit my dinner with andre day (m bison), Friday, February 4, 2011 2:16 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark

agreed but 60 days w/o LJ or whiney does this already imo

how about if each user could see their suggest ban count like a yellow card. maybe they would give themselves a chill pill.

hes gone for 90 days now right?

like itll be summertime

sure, plax. dance on his grave.

in the interest of clarity

did he get the mods to delete those SBs j0rd gave when he got sent packing on the mods love rape ban

i don't really post here often but fwiw i totally agree, lots of my most fav. posters seem to get tagged regularly and it's weird and p. uncool imo

post here if you flavor our pumpkin pie system with a Bread Sauce system

btw i am also a major fan of killfile. dont understand why this needs to be an either or deal when i am right now eating this enormous cake i have.

post here if you favor eating an enormous cake

Slip inside my sleepingbag

FREE WHINEY

i have sb'd fewer than five times during its existence and did not particularly come into contact with whiney, let alone sb him.

but dude has got to 51 three times. he was being a dick, he knew ppl thought he was being a dick, and he continued to be a dick. i don't support a truly perm ban for him, but both he and us will survive nicely during however long his timeout is

who will rep kayo dot now

-_-

the problem is, its not 51 sb's off one huge banworthy dick move. its 3 casual SB's at a time spread over 17 boards.

no one should get posting privileges revoked for 60 days because of some innocent hardmanning and/or opinions4u bullshit

abolish ban culture

we deserve better

i agree people shd be allowed to post what they want

the standard rhetoric is that the SB system is designed to curb low-level dickishness, and if whiney isn't the def of low-level dickishness on ILX then I don't know what

90 days tho right?

Gramey G. Gramsci

can the sugbanned speak?

i would argue that a 90 day ban for low-level dickishness is crazy

yeah this is a lol internet message board not a democratic judicial system, but no one should have posting privs revoked unless they're like outright abusive/ obviously spamming in a way that isnt lol/ posting racist shit/ posting other ppl's personal info

30 day ban is for low level dickishness, 90 day is for low level dickishness repeated to the point of cluelessness

anyway pretty sure whiney is just gonna dig in his heels more. it'll be pretty much whiney perm'd or the removal of the SB system whenever this comes to a head.

Replace SB button with link to DealWithIt.gif

This isn't day care.

its insane either way

unban whiney

give the butthurt a killfile

everyone else dealwithit.gif

lol xposts

also the fuck is up w/ polls being disabled on IMP?

deal with it

i must polltest

goddammit the SB system was designed to remove rude permanently confrontational nob-ends, not Whiney

i see what you did there

he took himself seriously

for reals tho SB was introduced as an answer to "why do mods get to decide who gets banned and we the ppl dont"

the problem is, as nice a gesture it was on behalf of stet and keith to work to code it, its flawed from the outset. 51 is as arbitrary a number as etc etc etc

How come boring people no one will ever miss never get 51'd? ~think about it~

everytime you click "suggest ban" a milquetoast poster gets its wings

max got his wings!!

http://www.britposters.com/images/the%20blue%20max%20320x240.jpg

you should at least have to visit a user's profile to SB them

its fucking gross that its next to EVERY SINGLE POST

I agree with this 100% BUT a killfile only blocks the user, not all the responses to that user. So you'd still get all of the clusterfuck but none of the context.

seems like the ppl who get all up in arms abt sb are the real killjoys. i mean this was a p good punchline u have to admit.

the ppl who want one of the funniest posters on ilx banned are the real killjoys tbh

yeah but Dom's not coming back so hey

hmm idk i am still laughing what are u doing markers? hmm?

like, u are killing my joy right now

sorry bro ;_;

*killing* my *joy*

i guess we know who the real killjoy is

maybe people should only be able to have their sb against a poster count once, so it they are instrumental in a banning any future sb they give them doesn't count. this would help thwart unprovoked new sbs being dished out as soon as someone returns from a ban.

Jesus. I just wanted to say hello. For the love of God.

― from The ends of your fingers (prosper.strummer.), Sunday, 30 July 2006 17:48 (4 years ago)

I agree with this 100% BUT a killfile only blocks the user, not all the responses to that user. So you'd still get all of the clusterfuck but none of the context.

― sexy Santa cosplay (Autumn Almanac), Friday, February 4, 2011 3:09 PM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark

right i get this.

would still rather live in an ILX where ppl have to deal w/ that vs one where that trumps my right to post

maybe people should only be able to have their sb against a poster count once, so it they are instrumental in a banning any future sb they give them doesn't count. this would help thwart unprovoked new sbs being dished out as soon as someone returns from a ban.

a modest proposal but the time for modest proposals is behind us

damn why do i always get awesome ideas late on fridays when no one is posting

urban deeznuts

unban everyone

^^^

http://stylerumor.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/hair-musical.jpg

so for every SB'ed poster, we get a new thread about abolishing SB.

that's like getting a bottle of cyanide with every box of Cheerios

if you consider awesome posters being banned a box of cheerios

WHICH THEY CERTAINLY ARE NOT MY FRIEND

uh, which their being banned certainly is not, rather

it's night and i'm not making sense, so later

no shit, you called whiney one of the funniest posters

hey plax i know you're still kind of new here but he is

markers, thank you for offering your snaxpert opinion.

whiney is funny but it's like even though deej should just know when to let it go, there is something pretty annoying about somebody who knows he's going to provoke a clusterfuck response that shits up a thread continuing to do so just for his own amusement.

admittedly it was funny at first but it got to the point where I didn't wanna open up rap threads anymore.

http://i645.photobucket.com/albums/uu176/msladee06/Shaking-My-Head.gif

whiney is nowhere near as funny or as big a board asshole as ethan (whom i sb'd, i'll admit) was.

yet we carry on, however poorer for their absence.

http://threadbombing.com/data/media/2/G.smh1.gif

whiney is funny but it's like even though deej should just know when to let it go, there is something pretty annoying about somebody who knows he's going to provoke a clusterfuck response that shits up a thread continuing to do so just for his own amusement.

admittedly it was funny at first but it got to the point where I didn't wanna open up rap threads anymore.

― i pl0p bombs like hiroshima (San Te), Friday, February 4, 2011 4:05 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

i wont argue this.

i still think its stupid to ban someone for so long for behaving that way. grow a pair and engage them or just learn to ignore it.

i don't really like the SB system either fwiw, i'm used to message board mods determining my fate on other boards

oh we have plenty of that here too

I know, I've suffered the fates several times, and one SBing!

but I deserved them all

echoing gr80, markers, etc. etc. & missing whiney so throwing my opinion in the hat

Imo suggest unban would allow for trolly hateables to get the boot while divisive but lovable rogues will be free to be gangster

agree with gr80 that ban unbar should be profile and not post based

UNBAN

http://www.thedailyrock.com/wp-content/uploads/killswitch-engage-cd-cover.jpg

or maybe when you hit 51 you have to beat a benchmark score on Arkanoid to stay

maybe we could just have a system where you could mysteriously be sent sent to boarding school/bootcamp/juvie/who knows after your mum reads your posts?

Maybe if you get 51 you get to have an avatar?

maybe the suggest tool could be turned into something absolutely helpful, like if someone posts an ugly pic of themselves in the WDYLL thread, you can 'suggest haircut'

30 day ban is for low level dickishness, 90 day is for low level dickishness repeated to the point of cluelessness

― plax (ico), Friday, February 4, 2011 7:56 PM (1 hour ago)

lol he really got under your skin huh

i'd be *shocked* if modship makes a retarded call like banning a sometimes annoying but ultimately harmless poster for 90 days over some bullshit

maybe we should only ban people who are blatantly racist, abusive, posting other ppl's personal info, or non-funny spammers

~re-think banning w/ me~

Well, to posit a few questions that come up every time this is discussed - where do we draw the line at racist? Abusive?

Would old-time cankles comedy racist posts be considered prejudiced? What about discussing Burzum? What about some Britisher not understanding black people?

Not really talking about myself. Just trying to draw out your whole platform.

when i say abusive i'm talking about the kind of horrible, un-clever, humorless shit no one ever posts on ILX because as a community we're almost always above it, which is what makes ILX so great compared to most other internets

speaking of cankles, its kind of funny that he's allowed to post again (don't get me wrong, i'm glad this is the case) considering his perma-banning in august of 2008 led to a backlash of posters that resulted in a rollout of the suggest ban function 4 or 5 weeks later.

also as much as mods still have poor judgment wrt non-SB long term bans, its nowhere near how bad it was under TOMBOT and his hair trigger response, making SB's obsolete?

Draw the line where in real life you would punch them in the face or call the cops. Not where you would throw a drink in their face. Certainly not the SB system where if you're obnoxious 50 times in 6 months you get a month in solitary.

abolish ban culture

let us post freely

believe with me

no way dude suggest ban is effing hilarious

^^

more hilarious than a board cancels, ethan, dom, and whiney can all post to?

cankles*

ethan hasn't been banned in ages. he just decided not to come back after the ban was lifted.

the point stands

dom

u drunk, meng

he left in part cuz dom was permabanned

cancels(?) posts here under a new name

he just said that

said what

and what

as far as http://i54.tinypic.com/11l4yvn.gif goes.. well http://i54.tinypic.com/11l4yvn.gif is http://i54.tinypic.com/11l4yvn.gif i guess

bad timing to start this terrible thread when the suggest ban function has had such a banner day

― Roberto Spiralli, Saturday, February 5, 2011 12:19 AM (4 hours ago)

more otm now than ever before

Draw the line where in real life you would punch them in the face or call the cops. Not where you would throw a drink in their face. Certainly not the SB system where if you're obnoxious 50 times in 6 months you get a month in solitary.

― Kerm, Friday, February 4, 2011 9:30 PM Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink[

Uh-oh. Looks like you're going to get banned too.

move on.

don't concern yourself w/the dead.

work on making your posts worthwhile and being a fun kip poster who adds something to the board.

the threadstarter already does a great job of this tbh.

you should at least have to visit a user's profile to SB them

agree with this

(don't agree with the rest of it btw but wgas.jpg, kip)

don't fret gr8080, sb or no sb i'm sure there will be many ways to keep us all fully informed about the tropical bro lyfe

me inviting mookieproof to S my B's:
http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/hs040.snc6/167068_1716824553104_1012921167_31949337_7037556_n.jpg

otm

i am srsly baffled as to how this recent double sbing is a surprise to anyone at all. thats not a comment on whiney or deej, but kind of a choose your battles vibe - like is it really a shock that given the last few days this happened to either of these dudes?

I don't think that anyone is shocked or baffled.

nobody said they were surprised
(xpost)

OPERATION: SHOCK & BAFFLE

Oh he said "choose your battle." Well, that's the telephone game for ya.

it is still a terrible system and just about every forum on the internet gets along fine without it.

amazed at jjjusten missing the point entirely.

i am srsly baffled as to how this recent jjjusten post is a surprise to anyone at all.

i just think that every time this comes up, if you boil it down to the essentials, it isnt a question of fairness, its a question of liking banned dude vs other people getting sick of banned dude doing shit that drives them crazy - whats weird to me is that the liking banned dude camp doesnt really argue the case for them, they just kinda say that people that dont enjoy banned dudes hilarious steez are pussies or jerks or humorless or assholes, often with a sorta superior fuk u newbs vibe. i get that its a bummer when somebody you enjoy gets sbed, but turning to DUMB PEEPS CANT HANDLE THE HOTBOX is a shit argument, and is just more of the same old ilx oldster priv vibe that frankly sucks

xpost oh good, now its about me

maybe if there were a way to suggest ban the suggest ban system...

work on making your posts worthwhile and being a fun kip poster who adds something to the board.

the threadstarter already does a great job of this tbh.

― call all destroyer, Saturday, February 5, 2011 12:19 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

eh

I use the SB feature all the time, but admit that it would be better for the board if there was a killfile feature.

who have you sb'd?

one of the things that is kinda dumm about sb is that ilx has been noticeably meaner & less fun lately but instead of ppl getting ~feedback~ right away were just going to end up w/ a bunch of random bannings in march

i've sb'd a lot of ppl

dudes, btw, it would be a lot easier to just not ever respond to this stuff when it comes up and live in fortress silent mod, but i feel like its kinda my responsibility to address it rather than just let threads get unacknowledged - but i gotta say, crut, when you do shit like that i get a little why do i bother about the whole deal.

xposts

i used to sb people all the time but then once the expiration policy was put in place it seemed kind of pointless

i think ive only sb'd once out of genuine "plz stop posting, you're a terrible human being" impulse but for awhile i thought it was lol to sb ppl who had asked for their totals on the 77 thread

oh def anyone who posts on that thread deserves an sb, thats a given

the +1 joke is a classic

also, no one has been permabanned because of sb iirc. which i feel is one of the things that kinda gets glossed over in these discussions - if anything permabans are less frequent with this in place. which is good, right?

i generally agree w/that sentiment but on the other hand we have lost some of our mightiest posters to the permaban

if i cld choose btw getting rid of site new answers or suggest ban i would choose site new answers

yeah, site new answers is such an unavoidable presence on the board

right, so the big permaban list is

jw
abcmovieoftheweekfaceslap.jpg
heave
dom
roger adultery
pew
nude spock
spammer assholes
(peeps i am missing that i dont remember that somebody will bring up i am sure)

none of this is thx to sb tho

xpost: see the secret to site new answers is "set font color to light tan for iltmi the boards which you have limited interest in"

I have iltmi to light tan! But that's so I don't get weird looks.

i miss backwater boards

will never miss whiney or deej.

it's a good point though that 'Suggest Ban' next to every post is oppressive. aesthetically it just looks mean

yeah its been pointed out a million times but its just so negative, theres no button for loving someone

gabbneb was permab& after his 102 iirc

fwiw my problem w/ sna is that it prevents any of the subboards from developing & maintaing a distinct personality & stlye bcuz ppl just sort of read & post to everything

well except I LOVE CRICKET: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX no1 reads that board

the problem is if you read I LOVE CRICKET: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX it blows yr mind and you cant post anymore

stet once said that the code could be written for boards to opt out of site new answers. that would be dope.

huh you might be right about gabbneb - if so thats probably dumb and should be reversed because dude was never a real problem iirc. so hey gabbneb if you are reading this come home all is forgiven (until yer next sb)

the lack of a like button to offset the sb is a big part of this phenomenon btw: "it isnt a question of fairness, its a question of liking banned dude".

also as far as i can tell deeznuts and burt were both permab& after just 51 burt even had a thinly-veiled new account he made mod banned like six months after he was 51'd

no one would ever get sb'd w/ a counter button

you'd need like 75-80 diff ppl to SB you just to reach 50 prob

just to be clear here - outside of crazy real deal racist/sexist/homophobic bullshit from the heart and stalky personal creepy i am pretty much 1000% agin permabans - and thats prob why i am capn pro sb, because i think its like a parolee thing. which gets back to the last 2 sbs - whiney was kinda willfully hell bent for sb leather, and deej was sorta so wrapped up in the whole impenetrable me right u rong vibe that maybe a timeout isnt the worst thing ever for either of them.

i used to sb people all the time but then once the expiration policy was put in place it seemed kind of pointless

― ice cr?m, Saturday, February 5, 2011 1:59 AM (37 minutes ago) Bookmark

this is why i frequently refresh my SBs on people i desire to see banned - not sure how long theyre in the system but i dont want to be the guy who could push someone over the top and failed to do so

fwiw in my head i still blame the advent of SNA for a couple of my old bans - it was just such a sea change and i'd suddenly find myself exposed to all kinds of threads i previously would've ignored, like R.I.P. threads for guys in power pop bands

i just noticed recently that you can customize your SNA view though which is cool - bye bye ILM and ILTMI!

i do feel like getting 51'd now that they expire is a much more impressive feat its like we're in the open era of annoying other ilx posters

but man since tombot stopped modding these threads are so much less hilarious cf. mods are manipulating suggest ban totals fyi

a bold suggestion: imprison all sb'd posters to I LOVE CRICKET: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX for three months

*makes drinky drinky motion*

ok that thread is hilarious (much because of my serious mod is serious vibe at that point whoops)

but the gem (and plz dont take this as a rescinding of the kip jjj and gr8080 beef destructo) is:

hey everyone wouldnt this issue totally go away if a SB resulted in a TEMP BAN instead of a PERMA BAN????

i mean think about this.

― gr8080, Saturday, January 17, 2009 1:31 AM (2 years ago)

http://i55.tinypic.com/2nq7jbq.gif

fyi meant a 3-day temp ban like the good old days when I posted that. 60 days is rediculous.

jjjusten I appreciate you playing the role of "only mod to hear this out" but it would be cool if you addressed my SB vs Killfile argument as stated in the OP. and while you're at it address the disgusting existence on a SB button next to every single post- something that sets ILX apart as asshole msgboard #1 on the internets.

fwiw I don't think kate is a bro and I fucking can't stand her posts but I still think it's bullshit she can lose posting privs to a board she's spent years of her life on just because 51 people anonymously bullied her to that point.

suggest ban is for shit. so is killfile, but that's up to the moron who institutes it for him/herself.

also re: my hilarious post you quoted: iirc when SB's were first rolled out it was understood that it was a permanent ban. 51'd posters being allowed to return came later.

Draw the line where in real life you would punch them in the face or call the cops. Not where you would throw a drink in their face. Certainly not the SB system where if you're obnoxious 50 times in 6 months you get a month in solitary.

― Kerm, Friday, February 4, 2011 9:30 PM Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Uh-oh. Looks like you're going to get banned too.

― Pleasant Plains, Saturday, February 5, 2011 12:04 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark

wut?

http://www.underconsideration.com/speakup/archives/su_spot-black.gif

I am so much a lover of freedom that I don't even sb evildoers

ok i am going to sound a total bitch right now but every single fucking time i went to post on ANY ONE of the threads about 'last train to paris', because i wanted to talk about how much i liked that record w/ ppl whose opinions i wanted to hear, it had just been taken over by tedious whiney/deej/somedude/whoever else in-biting bullshit, and i thought 'well fuck this' and fucked off. Yes they are all valued posters - certainly more integral to the life of ilx or w/e than i am - but lately it's felt like month upon month of every fucking thread skunk-sprayed with the same vicious clique being aggy and sniping at each other and frankly the thought that i'll get at least a month of ilxing without having to see deej and whiney bitching at each other fills me with relief.

and i didn't even have to sb either of them myself! (this time)

otm

i often think that the sb system sucks and was a terrible idea, but then every time i also remember that it got rid of dom, so for that reason alone i am fine with it.

So we've got talk on this thread about permabans (including a list), a mod misses the point on the OP and then pulls the "why should I even bother!" card, a discussion on whether users should be able to view all of the site's new answers at once, and maybe a fifth of the thread actually talking about sb's vs killfiles. Great job, everyone!

Okay, personally I think killfiles are a bad idea. If I killfiled someone, I'd still have to read everybody's responses to them on whatever thread we were mutually posting on. When you sb someone, you take them out f the picture entirely for like a month, and for the most part when they happen it's a total fucking relief.

x-post Yeah but that's not exactly surprising, is it?

I don't have a problem with any of these guys individually but everything CSM said is totally right. I've avoided many threads because the discussion seems to get derailed by cattiness and dumb bitching between a small group of people. Maybe some people find that interesting to read but I can't really think of anything I'd want to read less. OK, that's and exaggeration but you know what I mean.

I used to be totally against the SB system and I'm still not really sure where I stand on it but it seems to have worked pretty damn well today. Yes, I've used it, but I'd be surprised if I've ever done so more than 10 times in total. I think it should be reserved for extreme situations only but anyway for now I'm happy that it exists and forces some people to have necessary breaks. Maybe when they return they can grow up a little and stop acting like middle schoolers and fucking up perfectly good threads.

So I guess I'm in favor of keeping SB but I do like the idea of putting the button on the user profile instead of next to each and every post.

Yeah, that's probably not a bad idea.

And everybody's profile should have the user's baby picture on it, to drive home the fact that they too once were innocent.

my only recommendation would be some kind of auto-notification system for when you're getting close

what does placing the SB button in the user profile do - some sort of peta "you must yourself kill the cow you're going to eat" type deal?

does anyone actually look at user profile pages?

probably not but if the SB button was there I'm sure they would

most of them are empty?

the point of having the SB button next to the post is it gives some indication - a vague one sometimes but still - of what a poster says that actually makes people want them to go sit on the naughty step for a month

Yeah but nobody sees that except mods so I don't really see how that's helpful.

I just thought that putting it in the profile might make people less likely to SB left and right for every little post and reserve it for more serious occasions.

On the contrary tho, it might make the SB a personal grudge thing rather than a response to specific acts of dickery? I freely admit to having a wobbly SB finger but I've honestly never clicked somebody just because of who they are. Admittedly some people have a habit of being annoying repeatedly but I do wait until I'm actively annoyed.

man I was totally going to do That's When I Reach for My SB Button as a dn but what's the point after it's already a thread title

Yeah, there is that.

Oh fuck it, I don't know. It's obviously a very flawed system and in a lot of ways I'm still inclined to think that people should just stop being babies and learn to deal with it and ignore posters they don't like. However, in this particular instance and it's probably the first time I can actually say this, I'm glad to see certain people SBd. It was just too much! I felt like parts of the board were taken over by stupid unfunny beefs between a couple of posters.

In regards to the killfile thing I'll echo what other people have said and don't really see that as a great solution because you'd still have to view the responses and ensuing clusterfucks etc. around people that you've killfiled. Also, I'm not a child and, for the most part, can read but gloss over the posts of people I don't like.

not gloss over but you know what I mean - read but ignore or whatever

I can't think of anybody who got 51d where there wasn't clear and obvious reasons why it might've happened, right or wrong.

I only started using killfile recently & it's been very nice; the posters I've ~~eliminated~~ annoyed me but seem ok to others, & threads still flow fine to me.

Maybe a first thing before pushing strongly for replacing sb with killfile would be for more posters to see how they like ILX with the ones they dread killfiled. Like maybe the dynamic of the board would change a lot if killfile were more widespread & the things that lead to sbs would be reduced (if there's a troll in the thread & nobody reads it, is it really a troll?)

a board full of people talking to themselves would just be

no, I got nothing. sorry.

btw the reason i didnt address the the points in the original post is that i didnt think my response was gonna be terribly edifying - basically it would be that i think the sb system works just fine, i think killfile is super annoying and dont see why peeps should have to do that just so other peeps can act however they want, and as for the big problem with the sb link being by every post - i honestly dont understand at all what the issue with that is at all. plus it is the only way mods can tell why someone is getting the sbs, which ive shared with any high sb poster that asks.

i actually think that sb by user profile would make the whole system way shittier, more likely to be personal/vindictive, and more impenetrable.

and annoyingly i am about to leave for work so if that needs clarification im not going to be back for a bit, so i swear im not ignoring you

haha yeah I don't think it'd work like that exactly; my guess is that the same small group of people would be killfiled...which is why thinking that sb & killfile could play a similar functional role in ~improving the board~ is reasonable imo

xp to nv

the comedy prospects of that are intriguing but I wd want some sort of inverted site view where you could visit the valley of the killfiled and see what it looks like

y'all know that you can set up which boards show up on your Site New Answers view, right?

i dunno, i've used sb more as a "u need a break" thing than a "i actually dislike u" thing--in some cases it's been posters whose posts i oftentimes like but they've kind of gone off the rails w/r/t signal:noise ratio. i don't think there's anyone on this board today who i've found so awful that i never, ever want to read what they have to say.

(many xposts)

comedy response would be ILM but it's not what I think & anyway your q is butthurt catnip so I'm gonna stay away

xp to nv again

i mean there've been some o_O SBs but like why is it every time a completely obvious one happens, there's an ILX tribunal? Like it's the damning evidence that finally exposes the fatal flaw in the system?

I mean I like Whiney and deej both and would never vote for them to be excommunicated, but I mean asking "why?" is like saying "How come Michael Hutchence doesn't answer the phone when I call?"

imo, give whiney and deej 30 days off -- and when they come back, as a permanent punishment, ban Whiney from 'based god' nicknames, and deej from 'kl0p' nicknames as a permanent reminder of the ramifications of thread-shitting-up

I think the best solution is when whiney and deej come back, permanently killfile them from each other

won't stop them. then we'll get the 'hypothetical' beef

"if whiney just made a sarcastic dismissal of a Gucci mixtape TELL HIM TO FUCK OFF"

I don't think a killfile function would be like reading a thread with one of the stereo channels turned off or that there would be these gaping holes in the conversation. Users would likely not killfile anyone they want to engage with on a regular basis, and when you think about it really, this whole board sometimes sounds like a bunch of Sixth Sense ghosts talking about similar topics inside a thread.

For example, though I think I make some pretty good points, if you were to have me killfile and couldn't read this, your posting experience wouldn't be much different in all likelihood.

Putting the SB button on the profile and adding that extra step would be as effective as only selling alcohol from state-owned liquor stores. People are still going to get fucked up, even if they have to drive to the county line or walk the extra block.

I feel like liberal use of the killfile would turn ILX into the message board equivalent of those garfield cartoons w/ the captions removed

killfile paranoia, unbearable

killfile to me = "just put up with AssholePosterA's really irritating behavior and ignore them", which kind of means let people be dicks without repercussion.

yea, if someone is merely annoying to you, I don't think that's grounds for SB at all. there's always people we don't like. however, in many cases, pedantic and frequent derailing personal arguments/insults and/or all-out dickheaded behavior really clusterfuck up threads and ruin them for everybody.

A distinction between these two types of behavior is important, and kind of illustrates why neither killfile or SB are the real answer. People should have to deal with the fact that they'll find some people annoying, and if they wanna killfile em, so be it...but there is behavior that goes beyond "annoying" and into "disruptive", and those people should be dealt with.

--spoken as a man who has been banned from more message boards then I can count on 7 hands.

And everybody's profile should have the user's baby picture on it, to drive home the fact that they too once were innocent.
― Catsupppppp Grind (kkvgz), Saturday, February 5, 2011 2:42 PM

^A+ post imo btw

peron! peron! peron!

I was sick and tired of deej and whiney fucking up every thread too but I chose to be an adult and engage them when it was an option and ignore them when it wasn't.

your SB vote should be made public, not be a chickenshit anonymous move.

also re: how weird threads would get with killfile: it's a pretty standard function on lots of other message boards who don't seem to have that problem at all whereas ILX is the only board to give you an option to kick off another poster next to every post.

problem is no matter how often some of us said "knock off the beef", it...kept...on....going.

no disrespect to either of em cuz they're valid contributors, and I want em back, but...I think both of em need time off

i wd like a killfile system

mods are manipulating suggest ban totals fyi

classic thread, classic closing post

keep it negative dickhole 77 zing posse

clearly!

Maybe when someone gets sb'ed their posts can be displayed only in WingDings font

understand people getting annoyed with snipe fest but it still holds that you need to post in the way you want the board to be. Sitting idly by with your arms crossed is just passive-aggressive worthlessness.

Sitting idly by with your arms crossed is just passive-aggressive worthlessness.

except when that's the way we want the board to be: quieter.

Bnw like 70 people gave them direct feedback in the threads geez

At least 51 people each have offered direct feedback in the last 6 months.

i mean some dude gave deej several "come on, cool out w/ it" posts in the new Diddy album thread a few months ago, and they were all otm comments

and by few months ago I mean more like one, geez January felt long

a bold suggestion: imprison all sb'd posters to I LOVE CRICKET: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX for three months
--Favourite Song, Album and Band? Icehouse. (King Boy Pato)

i would like to enthusiastically endorse this idea

^^^

The current killfile script thingo only works if you only ever use Firefox. These days a lot of us spend most of our ilx time ON IPHONE and therefore have stuff-all access to scripts &c.

One thing that strikes me about this particular 51 is the sheer number of people (inc. me) who were fed up with wgw's dickishness but didn't sb him. Clearly waaaaaay more than 51 people had had enough.

That's not to say that I support the sb system btw but I'm not prepared to argue my point yet again because it makes no difference.

I would fully endorse getting rid of the suggest ban system if I could be allowed to permanently ban a list of people from the boards.

I am pretty sure I can guess one of the people on that list.

One thing that strikes me about this particular 51 is the sheer number of people (inc. me) who were fed up with wgw's dickishness but didn't sb him.

Yeah, this has been particularly noticeable this time.

I'm pretty stoked DJP gave up on being a site mod!

i feel like it might be a nice to have suggest bans be executed on single boards only

gr80, you normally one of the board's most relaxed people, but sbanning discussions bring out the apoplectic PTA mom in you.

I'll take that as a compliment!

sometimes fighting for what u believe in is nagl :-(

posting

is the ILX source code still available? i kinda wanna poke around and see how difficult it would be to implement some stuff..

http://www.csmonitor.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/images/media/images/0901-relay.jpg/8568626-1-eng-US/0901-relay.jpg_full_600.jpg

I used to think the sb system was pretty ridiculous but I feel like mods should be given props for making it more reasonable w/ clearing out old sbs + turning it into a 1 month break instead of a permaban. anyone who posts here enough to get 51 sbs could use a 1 month break from this site once in a while. whereas a easy-to-use killfile system would be pretty disruptive and unpleasant.

anyone who posts here enough to get 51 sbs could use a 1 month break from this site once in a while.

i hate when ppl cop this 'tude. even when some of my favorite posters cop it. fuck you i'll leave ILX when i want to thanks.

look, you're coming at this from the perspective of someone who was banned for a ridiculous reason and I could understand having a kneejerk reaction towards mods and bannings, I might too if I were in your position. but I dunno how many times a day you refresh ilx but I can say for me the number is 'probably too many'. this is one website among millions and a month without being able to say something is such a lol punishment that it's not even worth arguing about anymore. (it was worth arguing about when it was a permaban.)

in conclusion no man ever sits in his deathbed and thinks "I wish I had spent more time reading whiney and deej beef with each other"

I'm pretty stoked DJP gave up on being a site mod

Me too, because now I can tell you what a useless waste of space you are without having a chorus of people screaming that I'm abusing mod powers.

Fuck off, you useless shit-stirrer.

iatee i agree w/ what yr saying but imo ppl need to make that decision for themselves. fwiw i was against sb's before by stupid 60-day ban, and i was against it before i took a self-imposed hiatus for over a year.

DJP stay on topic, please.

even though ive (rarely) clicked the SB button myself i'm pretty resolutely against the function, and i don't see how anyone could be for it given its history

oh i understand why people are in favor of it, i just think its kind of gross that it exists

I actually think few people are aware of the fact that the sb system was created to keep minorities off ilx xp

if SB's aren't going away can we add a "suggest stay" button next to every post?

http://www.acegcs.net/Storefront/images/KIP_Circle_Logo.jpg

Suggest ASBO

Me too, because now I can tell you what a useless waste of space you are without having a chorus of people screaming that I'm abusing mod powers.

Fuck off, you useless shit-stirrer.

― Indolence Mission (DJP), Saturday, February 5, 2011 10:08 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

rude!!

tombot-esque!

harlan!

funny thing is people forget ethan even stanned for the SB system

this thread and the lineage from which it comes are the strongest arguments in favor of keeping the sb system, think about how much comedy drama we would miss out on otherwise

to everybody complaining about the system I suggest man up and dealwithit.gif

sb'd you for that

the amount of weed carrying that gets done for mods around here is sickening btw, let them defend themselves, they have all the power

http://media.urbandictionary.com/image/large/internet-24591.jpg

http://dailyshite.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Serious-Dog.jpg

So since this us kinda winding down - just to clarify there aren't any actual arguments in this thread for getting rid of suggest ban other than

1. I don't like it
2. People I like get sbed so sb is bad
3. It is gross because having it by every post makes ilx look bad to the rest of the Internet
4. It enables sissies/pussies/the thin skinned/the passive aggressive and they should directly approach the sbed dude because that is what I think I would do if I were them

Absolutely none of which is convincing to me at all.

uh oh

god save the mod

5. 51 is an arbitrary number especially considering there's no "suggest stay" KIP BRO

6. reject ban culture

Right but any number is a arbitrary number so I don't see what that has to do with anything really xpost

thats exactly the point that I'm making about why SB's are gross

Balance it out with a "suggest stay" or get rid of it. 51 is bullshit.

that was a bullshit summary, jjjusten. You'd do much better saying you hear the arguments against but still think it serves a purpose, etc. Being totally dismissive just makes people who don't like the system feel they aren't being heard at all.

and also this "people I like get sb'd" is no worse then "people I don't like, I sb" i.e. why do we need a reason to justify not banning someone if the sb system requires no such reason to ban someone?

im not being dismissive, im being honest. i honestly see absolutely no other arguments being raised here, and if someone wants to point out what im missing thats great. but i dont actually think i am, and i think this kind of always boils down to i want the board to be this way vs someone else wanting the board to be a different way - which means that no matter what, people dont get what they want.

also i think that yer setting up a false dichotomy there in the second post - it seems kinda clear that people are sbing for reasons beyond i dont like this person, ie this person is making me avoid threads i want to participate in, or this person is abusing other posters and that makes this feel like this is a hostile environment where i better not open my mouth unless i am willing to take the heat. that goes far beyond oh shit this dude is a dick (which sure happens), but equating that to i like this person and now i cant read their posts for a month is kinda not in the same ballpark.

I'm going to concede that I've lost this argument.

But before Pashmina or someone else shows up to do the whole "fucks sake, people" *lock thread* routine, I want say that I started this thread to constructively address something I honestly feel is bad about a messageboard I otherwise really like. Not to have some fun stirring up shit for laughs.

Less sitewide bans in general, 51 or otherwise imo

fucks sake people

psst, incidentally: the way that there will be less people banned is if less people USE the suggestban function
and i know you don't use it either grady. but a great number of people do.

Lets get back to thread/board/3-day bans

Tomboy's been gone for a while now

Tombot too

Stop Sbitchin'

'I am going to swing this knife in your direction and you get cut it's yoooooour fault'

this whole thing reminds me of a really bad pickup basketball game

the amount of weed carrying that gets done for mods banned posters around here is sickening btw, let them defend themselves not be retarded dickheads, they have all the power

http://i.imgur.com/hcpIK.gif

hahaha

loooooooooooooooooool

ie this person is making me avoid threads i want to participate in, or this person is abusing other posters and that makes this feel like this is a hostile environment where i better not open my mouth unless i am willing to take the heat.

this is so, so otm, esp the latter part

markers, thank you for offering your snaxpert opinion.

― estela, Friday, February 4, 2011 9:02 PM (2 days ago)

<3

Hundreds of responses already but I should probably point out that THERE IS ALREADY A KILLFILE SYSTEM. Killfiling doesn't really work with posters like Deej and Whiney because as mentioned above you still get all of the annoying clusterfuck that goes with them.

ok i am going to sound a total bitch right now but every single fucking time i went to post on ANY ONE of the threads about 'last train to paris', because i wanted to talk about how much i liked that record w/ ppl whose opinions i wanted to hear, it had just been taken over by tedious whiney/deej/somedude/whoever else in-biting bullshit, and i thought 'well fuck this' and fucked off. Yes they are all valued posters - certainly more integral to the life of ilx or w/e than i am - but lately it's felt like month upon month of every fucking thread skunk-sprayed with the same vicious clique being aggy and sniping at each other and frankly the thought that i'll get at least a month of ilxing without having to see deej and whiney bitching at each other fills me with relief.

and i didn't even have to sb either of them myself! (this time)

― c sharp major, Saturday, 5 February 2011 13:51 (Yesterday)

This is OTM and bears repeating. Whiney and Deej really were ruining ILM over the last few weeks. I don't think anyone is suggesting that either of them be permanently banned but really a time-out will be good for the board and hopefully the posters themselves.

i often think that the sb system sucks and was a terrible idea, but then every time i also remember that it got rid of dom, so for that reason alone i am fine with it.

― lextasy refix (lex pretend), Saturday, 5 February 2011 13:58 (Yesterday)

This is wrong, Dom was a mod ban rather than a Suggest Ban. One of the many reasons he hasn't been allowed back.

it is still a terrible system and just about every forum on the internet gets along fine without it.

― bnw, Saturday, 5 February 2011 06:33 (Yesterday)

Yes but most other forums on the internet are fucking terrible - ILX should be BETTER than other internet forums, it's the whole point. I think it was Noodle Vague who said that the primary job of mods should be to prevent ILX becoming like the rest of the internet.

idk, c sharp major is entitled to her point of view, but there are regular posters out there who are 100x more unpleasant and uninteresting than whiney, and who never get suggest-banned or even mildly censured -- but im hardly going to ask the board to change its ways just because im right and they're not

it's pretty simple mathematics that the most visible posters will get sb'd the most, which is one reason why it's a dumb system

suggest ban system has made ilx more like metafilter, which is fine for some i guess, but i stopped reading metafilter years ago because ilx was so much funnier

at what point will you stop reading ilx max

flopsonned

there are regular posters out there who are 100x more unpleasant and uninteresting than whiney, and who never get suggest-banned or even mildly censured

This is obviously subject to individual opinion. If poster x were never suggb'd, however annoying or boring they are to you, then 50 other posters didn't agree with you.

I think the reason Whiney gets SBed so often is because while there are bigger dicks on the boards, when he's being a dick he's being so in a very prolific way, and on an awful lot of threads.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyranny_of_the_majority

xpost

Matt OTM. I mean even if he got SBed for like 17% of the annoying, dickish 'troll'-y posts he made, 17% of like 1,783 still equals more than 51.

This is wrong, Dom was a mod ban rather than a Suggest Ban

i guess this is true but when he was first b& a big deal was made out of the fact that dom had also received 51 suggest bans which felt like an attempt to bolster 'the case' against him

I don't think anyone is suggesting that either of them be permanently banned but really a time-out will be good for the board and hopefully the posters themselves.

ill suggest it. i mean if ppl are this annoyed by them why not? what purpose does sb even serve if you just keep letting ppl back

xpost(that said I actually found the beef posts amusing up until like the last two weeks -- but, like others have said, just because I found it amusing doesn't mean I should expect everyone to).

Maybe for SB to function more democratically we should allow people to campaign openly and canvass SBers. Perhaps threads titled "Ban ______" could be used for this.

I also think the main problem many people have with these "Remove SB" threads are:

1. They're often very condescending, either directly or indirectly, to anybody who contributed to a recent SB
2. They often chastise people for using the system that they have the right to use
3. They sometimes come off as "you guys suck cuz you banned someone I like, everyone should think like me".

Maybe don't start off so confrontational and alienate people from the onset!

whiney was actually banned on 3 november -- this must be a record for re-banning?

I'm pretty sure Gabbnebb got there quicker, but yeah it was very quick.

will it really be 90 days though?

Re: tyranny of the majority --
decisions made by a majority under that system would place that majority's interests so far above a dissenting individual's interest that the individual would be actively oppressed

What would the dissenting individual's interest be here? Developing an aesthetic of uncivility?

also i have to say i think deej getting 51'd is particularly mean-spirited because his obtuse efforts at understanding just why he annoyed so many other posters was so sad & charming & authentic

reminding ILXors that ILX is the internet, and not say, COMPARABLE TO THE GOVERNMENT

^^^ talks democracy but favours the jackboot of STFU

The 90-day figure is one of the reasons why these threads can be so exapserating - what actually happened is that someone said "he's gone for 90 days now, right?" which wasn't actually confirmed or suggested by any of the mods, and before you know it there are people going "90 day ban is some bullshit" when it was never on the table in the first place.

what's this i hear about rob lowe being new celebrity guest mod and that all old posters are hereby IP banned forever? an outrage i tell you

yeah what matt dc is saying is that whiney is not going to be banned for 90 days

and will be promoted to Duke

so 30, then?

xp lamp -- agree but altho i didn't & would never sb deej i imagine many ppl's motivations were of the "this guy needs a break" variety rather than just wanting him to fuck off forever bc they think he totally sucks. deej contributes positively to ilx a lot & he seemed honestly hurt that ppl weren't acknowledging it as a result of the extent that the ilx universe had begun to revolve around his conflicts w/ other posters -- which obv he brought onto himself. whiney otoh contributes almost nothing but snark & thrives on conflict, altho often in a v funny & entertaining way--feels it's more just him fulfilling a regular obligation of his function on the board

last & i think only time i ever sb'd whiney was like 8 months ago or something & altho it's too soon the synergy is beautiful & it's perfect the way this worked out

hey san te sorry i alienated you from the start

by all means keep using the sb system as is your god given right, i'm ok

It might be longer than 30 given that he's been SBed so many times, but there's no hard-and-fast rule for multiple SBs, it's on a case-by-case basis.

From what I can see bans tend not to bother Whiney too much, which is fine in a way but not in another because he doesn't have any apparent interest in modifying his posting style to avoid them. So maybe it should be longer this time, but it's not really my call (and certainly not exclusively mine
).

lol well ill repeat - why even bother letting him back then?

got to, this america man

maybe when you guys thread ban someone you should nix the sb's accumulated in that thread, otherwise ppl are getting punished twice

snot whiney

THERE IS ALREADY A KILLFILE SYSTEM.

i guess i shouldnt expect anyone to read 300 posts on this but what i was advocating was replacing a SB system that is written into the code and works on all browsers and has an option to vote for a poster's removal next to every post on the board w/ a killfile system that had those same qualities

the current killfile system is "complicated to install" compared to SBing, and only works on firefox anyway.

Yes but most other forums on the internet are fucking terrible - ILX should be BETTER than other internet forums, it's the whole point. I think it was Noodle Vague who said that the primary job of mods should be to prevent ILX becoming like the rest of the internet.

agree w/ this for the most part but the current SB system is still nagl. this is totally anecdotal, (as is "the rest of the internet sucks!") but the board most regular/former ILXors post/lurk on in a similar way is board.crewcial.org which has practically no modding and a killfile system built in to the code

i feel like being permanently banned from multiple threads would be worse than being banned outright for 30 days

many xposts

gr8080 - wasn't solely directed at your thread, or even you at all, actually so far this thread has been a bit more civil than some of the other "Get Rid of SB" threads, mostly due to the absence of a certain person from this thread. It's just at times in this thread, and in the others, it seems to always reach a point where someone (not even necessarily the OP) going "PPL WHO BANNED (NAME) ARE ASSHOLES AND SHAME ON THEM FOR BEING BUTTHURT BY WHAT (NAME) SAID ON (DATE)."

But I'm actually on your side, I am not really in favor of SB system, just saying in general, those who make the argument draw more flies with honey.

what if the SB system was like Yellow Card in which every time you got SBed, a little yellow tag showed up at the top of your screen, along with a personal message. and then for every new SB, it adds another yellow tag.

eventually when you accumulate enough it'll take up the entire screen, and be an entire yellow screen and you can't post. at all. until some roll off.

like the whole logic behind this 'bro needs a break' sb thing is fucking patronzing & lame. i can understand ppl that h8 whiney - i mean man i h8 whiney - but no amount of 'breaks' from ilx is going to change who he is. all it means that for a 1/3 of every year he get to hear his opinions about rap music via goon squaders posting aim transcripts instead of directly or w/e

k8 was right that sb doesnt provide any real incentive to be a 'better poster' - deej was trying in his way to do this already - it just punishes ppl for being unlikeable. & if whiney's antagonistic hipster oracle steez was that terrible - & i think we can all agree it was p terrible - than fine, ban him from ilx if thats what ppl want

get ovr it man

alright, this fucking guy http://twitter.com/#!/WhineyArea51

honest question, because i can't remember: were bans/talk of bans/fear of bans/300+ threads on bans ever this big a part of ILX culture before nu-code/TOMBOT era?

bring back ILX where most bans were from specific threads or boards and done by sub board mods unless for shit on the big 2 and a 3-day ban was the norm not 30

new rule, ppl shd be nice

ok xposts nm perma-ban whiney

― fear of a wack banning (J0rdan S.), Saturday, November 7, 2009 3:38 PM (1 year ago)

^prophetic

ugh can you imagine an ILX where everyone was "nice" 100% of the time it would be the worst

turn that frown upside down, friend!!!!

there's a lot of unclaimed territory between 'nice' and 'whiney g'

whiney was just A PRODUCT OF HIS ENVIRONMENT, man. look at what he was before ILX and what he is now.

ultimately we as a people are responsible :(

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWLvuLRoVus

I'm positive people shouldn't always be nice #KIP

# Location banned
# Bio clearly the 77 autogoon keepin' it negative dickhole zing posse should run ILX

why is a hyperlink allowing you to "killfile" a poster less gross than one to "suggest ban"

suggest murder

http://blog.wibeets.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/youtube-like.png

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/533869/garnett_biting_gif_medium.gif

l-r: whiney, ilx

Suggestban is the War on Drugs to Killfile's Pass on Grass.

fwiw it's no big deal to get killfile up on Safari 5

these threads have pretty much reduced the art of writing IMP threads to a huge unreadable mass.

people just gravitate to the "get rid of SB threads" that they want to read about and don't find other threads, because they're staring at a webpage with 2000 words of text on it.

what sb'd do is, you know, little "critical punches." little "smacks in the face."

hahaha

what if the SB system was like Yellow Card in which every time you got SBed, a little yellow tag showed up at the top of your screen, along with a personal message.

― r0b /via/ orl (San Te), Sunday, February 6, 2011 1:43 PM (1 hour ago)

yeah i know it's A LOT OF WORK and everything but can whoever is in charge work on improving the SB experience in ways like this if this godawful system is never going to be taken away

or they can't because it's a waste of time to cater to the ten fucking people who blab on about it incessantly.

the thing where the notifications take up your screen or whatever is kinda cheesy but yeah, real-timeish notifications of when and for what posts for which you've been SB'd would be an improvement

Total SBs received and issued should be on a users profile page. And every time you issue or receive 25 or so, you should get a little symbol after your username after each post... like football helmet reward decals. In general, we need a points systems so we know who the real winners are.

a post's background colors should get increasingly redder the more SBs that post earns.

looool

blacker imo, so eventually it will vanish

now we're cookin'

better option:

instead of colors, add brick JPGs from the bottom to the top of the post until it's entirely covered.

the SB of amontillado

why is a hyperlink allowing you to "killfile" a poster less gross than one to "suggest ban"

because it allows you to dealwithit on yr own w/o affecting others

everytime you get SBed, someone close to you is abducted and flogged

with great posting comes great responsibility

The mods' arguments itt are on the whole otm with the single glaring exception being that the sb system is not necessary.

In this particular case it sounds like whiney got to 51 and the mods said 'oh yeah, he's shitting up the place, temp ban', i.e. the whole sb culture didn't actually need to exist.

that's what happens every time, thanks for your input

Oh come on, if we'd banned Whiney outright exactly the same people would have been complaining.

yea then it'd be "why didn't we have a say"

no it'd still be "people who ban people for being annoying are douchebags"

honest question, because i can't remember: were bans/talk of bans/fear of bans/300+ threads on bans ever this big a part of ILX culture before nu-code era?

― gr8080, Sunday, 6 February 2011 18:48 (1 hour ago)

Can't remember if you were here during the C-man/Momus days, but yes they were, very much so.

Oh come on, if we'd banned Whiney outright exactly the same people would have been complaining.

― Matt DC, Monday, 7 February 2011 07:18 (12 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

...minus the usual sb cluskterfuck.

uh no there would have been a clusterfuck

AA i didn't mean to sound like such a dick btw, sorry

Banning posters for causing clusterfucks causes clusterfucks.

honest question, because i can't remember: were bans/talk of bans/fear of bans/300+ threads on bans ever this big a part of ILX culture before nu-code era?

― gr8080, Sunday, 6 February 2011 18:48 (1 hour ago)

Can't remember if you were here during the C-man/Momus days, but yes they were, very much so.

― Pashmina, Sunday, February 6, 2011 8:28 PM (5 minutes ago)

also 40 fucking "ban _________" threads every week

AA i didn't mean to sound like such a dick btw, sorry

np

my suggestion:

keep the suggest ban button. when a poster or posters (as in this case) starts racking a bunch up in a short period of time, mods invite them to a private mod board or thread, where the mods can let the poster know that they are annoying a lot of people, and point to particular posts that have gotten flagged. the poster can engage with the mods to tell his/her side of the story, and ultimately mods can give the poster a warning that getting more SBs in the near future for the same behavior will result in a temp ban, like a week or something.

this sort of returns some agency to being a mod, allows for a little "due process" to the whole ordeal, and actually should give the poster some direct feedback

i think this would have worked well with whiney/deej tbh

"annoying" might be the wrong word but i think you get me

my suggestion:

keep the suggest ban button. when a poster or posters (as in this case) starts racking a bunch up in a short period of time, mods invite them to a private mod board or thread, where the mods can whack them and leave the body lying there in the tall grass

keep the suggest ban button. when a poster or posters (as in this case) starts racking a bunch up in a short period of time, mods invite them to a private mod board or thread, where the mods can let the poster know that they are annoying a lot of people, and point to particular posts that have gotten flagged. the poster can engage with the mods to tell his/her side of the story, and ultimately mods can give the poster a warning that getting more SBs in the near future for the same behavior will result in a temp ban, like a week or something.

This is pretty much what we now have already. Forks emailed both Deej and Whiney when they passed the 40 mark, which is something that's going to happen as a matter of course now. It was along the lines of "this is a courtesy email to let you know you've now got 40 SBs, nothing to worry about yet but you may want to modify your posting style over the next few weeks". Neither of them did.

Forks emailed both Deej and Whiney when they passed the 40 mark, which is something that's going to happen as a matter of course now. It was along the lines of "this is a courtesy email to let you know you've now got 40 SBs, nothing to worry about yet but you may want to modify your posting style over the next few weeks". Neither of them did.
Orrite, that's sound, I'm 100% behind it.

gr80's (buried) suggestion that the sb link be moved to the user profile page needs more consideration btw.

unco at posting today

sounds reasonable enough

Only thing I can see w that is: suggest ban button next to a post in effect flags that post as being problematic. SB report page shows a list of user's posts that have received SBs, which is often a p solid indication of what exactly it is that's fucking off ppl about whoever. (this is v useful when a spammer or racist dickhead shows up) Having SB button on profile page wd just result in poster x being sb'ed by these posters for....some unidentified reason. I think?

Thanks, Pash.

(sincere response btw (I'm on a tram))

update: I'm over it

the user profile link already has a messageid that identifies the post

sure, and i think that's an improvement. i think it could be better, though - many ppl (myself included, and i'm about to hit the 40 mark) either don't check their ilx email or have since lost access to it. also what i said forces an interaction between the poster and the mods in a way that a simple email notification doesnt

i really do think instant notification when you get the sb button pressed on you is something that has to happen soon though

xp to matt

wtf have u been posting to get 40 sbs dude

i really do think instant notification when you get the sb button pressed on you is something that has to happen soon though

― originoo gun kl0pper (k3vin k.), Sunday, February 6, 2011 9:10 PM (47 seconds ago) Bookmark

this seems unnecessary labour for the mods or coders or whoever

i mean ffs, hardly anyone gets banned, and those that do are unlikely to modify their behaviour because some feeb has s-b'd them. moreover, one doesn't necessarily push the button next to an obviously offending post.

It was along the lines of "this is a courtesy email to let you know you've now got 40 SBs, nothing to worry about yet but you may want to modify your posting style over the next few weeks". Neither of them did.

This seems like a good thing to do. Just wondering, if a controversial poster calms down after receiving their 40 SB notification but continues to rack up another 11 SBs from week-old posts, would this be borne in mind by the mods or wd it just be "lol well too late, sucker"? (Or are SBs almost always given within a day or two of the posts they're attached to?)

xp yeah maybe a yellow card would be good as well as an email; this is pretty much what yellow cards were introduced for originally before all the lols, right?

i have v few sb's but i think that would just hurt my feelings. also anonymity of sb's would be compromised, which is impt imo

i don't think putting the sb button on someone's profile really solves much but if you can still track the post i guess why not

yeah i mean coding the entire sb system in the first place was unnecessary labor and has been nothing but a failure, but here we are. might as well try to improve it

Not sure how a Suggest Ban system that leads to people getting banned can be considered a failure.

it's the wrong people getting banned, but that isn't the coders' fault

they can't just create a system that automatically is configured to ban l0u1s jagg3r

Just wondering, if a controversial poster calms down after receiving their 40 SB notification but continues to rack up another 11 SBs from week-old posts, would this be borne in mind by the mods or wd it just be "lol well too late, sucker"? (Or are SBs almost always given within a day or two of the posts they're attached to?)

i just cleaned out all the old sbs and, based on what i saw, it's very rare that people catch a suggest ban weeks later. It's almost always people impulse shooting.
It's worth stressing again that there are hundreds of users on ilx and generally, at any one time, maybe one or two who have over 40 sbs. Anybody on that end of the spectrum is doing SOMETHING to agitate a sizable percentage of the population. For the rest of us, we ALL have at least three or four sbs because several people use them cavalierly and with a LOL U BANNED bent. But honestly, most people don't. the system, however flawed and stupid it may be, generally works; there's yet to be a ban kicked in where everyone was SHOCKED, SHOCKED to discover that person had gone over the line... cept maybe jordan and i don't remember what the problem was there.

Change 51 to a dynamic number based on over 50% of daily unique visitors. Should take only 5 minutes.

Perhaps have ilx send that 40-sb email along with a link to every sbed post? Just a thought.

Oh come on, if we'd banned Whiney outright exactly the same people would have been complaining.

― Matt DC, Monday, 7 February 2011 07:18 (12 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

When a mod temp banned deej from one of the threads turned into beef I don't remember anyone complaining except him.

A ban from one thread that lasts a matter of hours is a totally different thing.

change that?

the ONLY idea i like from this dumb thread is board pemabans, not site permabans. and it wouldn't be v. hard to do--just count sbs per board.

where's that cankles post about how suggest bans should allow everyone to see who sb'd them so that there's a massive drama trainwreck on here everyday?

Actually I would kinda support de-anonymizing SBs.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_XZNhfZqFCH4/S9cmnNDMkkI/AAAAAAAAAGs/We5Kab3UljQ/s320/PixelFarm2+copy.jpg

Anybody on that end of the spectrum is doing SOMETHING to agitate a sizable percentage of the population.

a tiny percentage, you mean.

still h8 SB and wish it would go away but i'll admit the arguments for it are good ones, even if they mostly boil down to "its not going away, deal with it".

but i am for both these initiatives:

Change 51 to a dynamic number based on over 50% of daily unique visitors. Should take only 5 minutes.

― bnw, Sunday, February 6, 2011 11:47 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Actually I would kinda support de-anonymizing SBs.

― where'd ya get that crapp? (pixel farmer), Sunday, February 6, 2011 1:08 PM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I just had this vision - what if, when creating a new thread, the thread-creator had the option of turning off SBs for that one thread. so there would be these anything goes, wild wild west threads, with "HERE BE DRAGONS" labels affixed.

think about it

xpost -- I won't be starting any gripey threads if it doesn't happen, though.

they can't just create a system that automatically is configured to ban l0u1s jagg3r

p sure the evidence has shown that they did

lol sb redirects the clusterfuck to where im not gonna read it. approve.

Change 51 to a dynamic number based on over 50% of daily unique visitors. Should take only 5 minutes.

I think this is very reasonable. Also, if a suggest ban flags a specific post, and some mods (or at least JJJusten) already tell the people who are close to 51 what posts of theirs have been SBed, why not make it so that each poster (but no one else) can see a list of their SBed posts in their profile? This would help them see what kind of behaviour is causing the SBs, if they are blind to it (as Deejs seems to have been), and (in the best case) modify it. Plus there'd be no need for mods to send special emails to people who are close to 51 anymore.

When somebody gets 51'd, they should have to post under their mother-given government names for a month.

can't wait to welcome back Poopy G. Stinkgarten

actual lol

Change 51 to a dynamic number based on over 50% of daily unique visitors. Should take only 5 minutes.

Actually from what I can see this would only overcomplicate the system it would have the added problem of moving the goalposts every day - the number of unique visitors fluctuates quite a lot and no one would ever know where they stood or how close they were to a ban.

Can you give us an idea on the range of daily unique visitors? I'm sure that this has been brought up before, but I can't remember what it is.

It sort of assumes that everyone reads everything too. I don't know how visits to the different boards break down, but if someone was being a cock on eg ILM, maybe less than 50% of posters would encounter them on a regular basis, and some of those might want them banned. xp

and *only* some of those might want them banned (might be a large proportion though)

I don't know how visits to the different boards break down, but if someone was being a cock on eg ILM, maybe less than 50% of posters would encounter them on a regular basis

Yeah, like, would you factor in the De Subjectivisten and Aeon Flux Top Level people?

Well, just having a look at the Aeon Flux board, that probably wouldn't sway things too much.

i can at least understand people who want to do away with the SB system entirely, but people who keep suggesting these increasingly intricate Rube Goldberg modifications to the system as if that's what will magically make the whole thing totally fine and uncontroversial are just ridiculous imo.

otm

Every time the sb button gets clicked, a truck nutz jpeg should be inserted into the post in question.

WhineyArea51 Whiney G. Weingarten
Let @WizardIsHungry post again, you assholes.

kkvgz is making me sad b/c I mis-read his username.

was not trying to do that

so a problem poster is one whose presence makes it hard if not impossible for other people to enjoy/use ILX
temporary suspensions restore the function of the board for those users
some users will miss the problem poster, but so far nobody has actually left the boards because of an asshole absence (many people have left because of assholes' presences)
therefore the SB system works as well as could be hoped?

playing devil's advocate you could argue there's a smeed's law effect to encourage people to just be even more boring than ever but it's long been the case that ILX is not really all about being a site for good ol' noyz transgressive fun, so residential speed limits are in effect, deal

xp no harm, mang. Just reminds me of WizardIsHungry, is all.

thing is, the cool funny enjoyable posters who've been banned never really got banned for the stuff they did that was cool or funny or enjoyable, unless they were just taking that stuff to some obstinate extreme. so unless the thing you love about someone is how insanely incorrigible and unreasonable they are, the whole "you guys are making this place lame by penalizing awesome people" argument is just kinda dumb, and even then it's still a little dumb.

like i consider both whiney and deej bros and will probably have civil and friendly off-ilx interactions w/ them while they're banned, but they'd both become committed to posting in ways that only made them happy or fulfilled their own compulsions and had no interest in toning it down for anyone else's benefit, so getting a timeout seems like the only real option there.

I'm trying to think of a funny celebrity analogy better than paul reubens and can't

some dude is the voice of reason here.

unfortunately we can't remember who

I have never and will never sb anyone. If anyone on ILX annoys me I walk away. I wouldn't use the killfile option but it seems far less harsh than the SB.

I think this is very reasonable. Also, if a suggest ban flags a specific post, and some mods (or at least JJJusten) already tell the people who are close to 51 what posts of theirs have been SBed, why not make it so that each poster (but no one else) can see a list of their SBed posts in their profile? This would help them see what kind of behaviour is causing the SBs, if they are blind to it (as Deejs seems to have been), and (in the best case) modify it. Plus there'd be no need for mods to send special emails to people who are close to 51 anymore.

http://i.imgur.com/UhK1e.jpg

is that real? what is that?

An uphill climb from the bottom.

The symbolism was apparent to me! I just want to know if I can go visit that.

apparently it's the mt huashan hiking trail in china -

http://www.ssqq.com/ARCHIVE/vinlin27d.htm

Get to the top and an old beardy dude will teach you some serious kick ass martial arts.

I have never and will never sb anyone. If anyone on ILX annoys me I walk away. I wouldn't use the killfile option but it seems far less harsh than the SB.

― Le mépris vient de la tête, la haine vient du cœur (Michael White), Monday, February 7, 2011 11:08 AM (34 minutes ago) Bookmark

huh you might be right about gabbneb - if so thats probably dumb and should be reversed because dude was never a real problem iirc. so hey gabbneb if you are reading this come home all is forgiven (until yer next sb)

― O_o-O_0-o_O (jjjusten), Saturday, February 5, 2011 2:23 AM

"never a real problem" how is gabbneb allowed back but dom isn't, at the very least can we get some consistency w/r/t all this

reinstate jw & chakee

reinstate gw & chenee

replace current mods w/el tomboto and strongohulkington

^^

so a problem poster is one whose presence makes it hard if not impossible for other people to enjoy/use ILX

not sure how whiney or deej were making it impossible to use ILX, and if somebody's making it hard for you to enjoy ILX, don't read their posts

sure whiney and deej could be irritating at times but ILX is the only board I've ever posted on where people get banned for being irritating, bannings are usually reserved for spamming/racist/threatening behavior and the like

but the SB system is a social experiment in the taming of ILX of all negative expressions and behavior, I get it

I've posted before about how the system will just move the goalposts for what is considered irritating behavior for oversensitive people, and it seems like it's happening... whiney's posts on Is this the most adorable commercial ever? were edgy but, in general, pretty innocuous, it's not like he launched a huge personal attack against jon, engaged in namecalling, etc

I guess the plan is to ban all controversial posters, make this place a utopia of kind words and opinions, seems like a milquetoast approach, hope everybody feels safe and relaxed now that big bad whiney/deej are gone

hopefully they will return tamed, having learned their lesson, or maybe they won't return at all, good riddens to bad rubbish tally ho and all that

otm

having a "hide this poster" link is the best solution

it's not punitive, it doesn't deprive anyone who enjoys the posting style of controversial folks of their presence, but protects the feelings of those who don't want to be exposed

but keith thinks SB is the best thing he ever developed, and enough of the mods have long been in a non-negotiable stance regarding SB so

i went looking for the last thing i said on the last sb clusterfuck and i couldn't find it

but i did find this:

i liked gabbneb!

― goole, Thursday, February 26, 2009 12:03 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark

great point, you have to admit

it would be great if we could have BOTH "hide this poster" and SB

maybe there would finally be a little silence on this issue

gabbneb had turned into a total creep at the end. whiney and deej were many things but never creepy. annoying, sure. but they never posted in a manner that made me feel like they were internetting from my basement crawlspace.

i think we should all be able to edit each others posts

killfile has the benefit of comedy CAN ANYONE HEAR ME killfile paranoia too

ilx would be a total site of free play where the line btw author and utterance would be oblitarated

we would all be each others' socks, it would be so amazing.

there should be at least one board where this is possible

imo it's not hard for posters to be zingy without being perpetually annoying and thread-derailing. quietstorm zings are more effective than all caps eringrayslappedbyglennford.jpg

http://www.neb-one.gc.ca/clf-nsi/rpblctn/spchsndprsnttn/2007/gcnfrnc/mg/mg09-eng.jpg

ice cr?m, i hope this doesn't sound weird, but, there are things that i think i could only say, if i were you at the time

is it pronounced like "ghoul" or "jewel"

no man thats not weird *frantically clicks suggest ban*

my mind will be blown if he says anything other than "ghoul"

Sb and killfile are not the same thing at all and shouldn't serve the same purpose.

Killfiling is a personal choice -- if you want a certain voice to be gone, you can make it gone in your little world, just accept that some conversations will be missing certain elements, and so on. But using kf to "fix" how you experience ILX as a whole is really...passive. Fine if you are choosing the passive approach to improve your life by removing a really hated poster or two or three, and you don't want them to know/you don't want your choice to affect anyone else's ILX experience. Not so fine if the public atmosphere really IS getting "bad" or "worse" (by whatever definition) in one way or another and you are avoiding doing anything about it.

The efficacy of sb, whether everyone likes it or not, is to the public sphere. Kf cannot do the same job.

goulet

http://www.balloons4trade.co.uk/images/Circle_BalloonDrop.gif

CONGRATULATIONS GOOLE ON THE 10,000TH POST ON WHAT THE SB SYSTEM SHOULD REALLY BE LIKE!!!!

― and why?!! (Whiney G. Weingarten), Thursday, March 5, 2009 1:05 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark

ghoul, btw

:)

I've been wanting to make that post for three days, btw, but it was tl for phone typing!!

xp goolie?

honestly don't remember why i picked this name, don't think i like it even! oh well

a bold suggestion: imprison all sb'd posters to I LOVE CRICKET: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX: THE CHINATOWN OF ILX for three months

― Favourite Song, Album and Band? Icehouse. (King Boy Pato), Saturday, February 5, 2011 2:47 AM

http://www.mikogo.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/youtube-thumbs-up.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqBAPcVs5xM

http://www.fatally-yours.com/wp-content/uploads/ghoulies.jpg

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5199/screenshot20110207at113.png

Difference between gabbnebb and dom is that Dom was mod banned

I don't think gabnb us actually going to come back btw

laurel, SB improves your experience of ILX, but also makes others' experience of ILX less enjoyable. why should the rearrangement of ILX to suit your taste deprive other folks of someone's presence?

I don't want to go all argument by analogy here, but it's like banning certain music or speech from the radio. wouldn't it be great if you could ban glenn beck from the airwaves? yeah, but you could also just change the channel. I'm just not that into silencing ppl I guess. that mindset doesn't compute for me.

I'm not anti-banning, btw, but the threshold seems to be getting pretty low.

Think it's still 51

lol

I wd favour raising it to 54 just so I can make the same crappy Sammy Hagar joke once every couple of months.

But 51 has kind of entered the Kaballah now with the whole Antimony thing so

raise it to 77 imo

How long does a SB last? Is it 6 months? (Someone upthread suggested that you might collect 51 sbs over the course of six moths) How long are you banned after you get 51? If you're banned do you return with a blank slate?

a blank slate, a potty mouth and a heart full of vengeance

I think it's 30 days, with an increasing number of days with each subsequent SB... 30/60/90

though the length of the ban is subject to mod discretion and I think has been bent before?

http://rhymeculture.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/c_group_50-people.jpg

SBs are 30 days. I think from here on in, we'll be opening with repeat SBs garnering 60 with the proviso that may be lengthened/shortened/permabanned based on case-by-case complications.

http://www.hartfordmag.com/images/stories/50People_0910.jpg

Michael, to your first question, six months is correct.

so to clarify, deej and whiney are both out for 30 this go round.
so it is written so shall it be done
and now the dancing girls

http://www.kansasdisciples.org/images/QA%2050%20people.jpg

but the SB system is a social experiment in the taming of ILX of all negative expressions and behavior, I get it

this is such exaggerated bullshit, dude. i personally feel like i've had ample freedom to be curmudgeonly and antagonistic and argumentative, and have explored that freedom to my hearts' content without ever getting an especially high SB count. if there are people whose appetites for posting negativity is larger if not boundless, giving them a timeout probably isn't going to 'tame' them anyway, but it'll at least give other people a break from them.

can you unblock my work and home ip addresses?

I think there should be a SB thread that the banned alone can post to - a kind of ILX purgatory.

Voyage of the Banned

it's called THE REST OF THE INTERNET

Banned à part

haha forks otm

Actually from what I can see this would only overcomplicate the system it would have the added problem of moving the goalposts every day - the number of unique visitors fluctuates quite a lot and no one would ever know where they stood or how close they were to a ban.

― Matt DC, Monday, February 7, 2011 6:53 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark

Then take average daily counts for a week and generate a number. Point is if sb is meant to be the majority opinion then you might want to figure out how many the majority actually is.

also i just do not get the appeal of killfile, especially as a replacement for SBs. just because i don't love a particular person's posts doesn't mean i necessarily want to look at the whole board through a filter that removes their posts and probably makes threads they participate in harder to follow or enjoy. and what if your issue with someone is that they like to say mean things to or about you? killfiling them just makes you ignorant of what they're saying and less able to do anything about it.

if people think 51 is just too low a number, why get complicated about it, just change it to 101. there are some people that will hit that goal easy anyway.

Suggest Ban Permalink
I think there should be a SB thread that the banned alone can post to - a kind of ILX purgatory.

― Le mépris vient de la tête, la haine vient du cœur (Michael White), Monday, February 7, 2011 1:16 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Think that's what Whiney was going for here, before he got bored.
http://twitter.com/WhineyArea51#

Point is if sb is meant to be the majority opinion then you might want to figure out how many the majority actually is.

I am pretty sure that it was not intended to be a majority opinion.

the sad truth is that the vast vast majority of ilx posters don't make much of an impression and don't differentiate themselves in my mind at all, good or bad. this is probably true of everyone and probably true of my writing to everyone else.

i've changed my mind on sb's in the past year (used to think was ok, now don't) but i can't find the post where i talked about it. it doesn't really matter, does it?

I don't like it either, but I s/b like a demon because it's there and I can't help myself.

I am pretty sure that it was not intended to be a majority opinion.

It's just an arbitrary threshold beyond which you are no longer fit for posting society.

It's a pretty large threshhold!

also i just do not get the appeal of killfile, especially as a replacement for SBs. just because i don't love a particular person's posts doesn't mean i necessarily want to look at the whole board through a filter that removes their posts and probably makes threads they participate in harder to follow or enjoy. and what if your issue with someone is that they like to say mean things to or about you? killfiling them just makes you ignorant of what they're saying and less able to do anything about it.

yes, otm

i think we should all be able to edit each others posts
--goole

Booming post

This is almost what IRE was like when everyone was a mod

And thn everyone just benned each other

Rip lingbert

Originally there was a poll on the mod board about whether we want "democratic bans". But at some point this turned into "51 clicks and you're out", a random number which I've never heard any admin explain... Yet pro-SB tend to justify it as if it's some kind of vox populi, even though no one knows how big the populi actually is.

Here's an idea: count the average amount of unique daily visitors in 2010 (i.e. add up the unique visitors for each of the 365 days, then divide the result by 365), and is someone gets more SBed than 50% of that number, then he's banned. Do the same for the year 2012, 2013, etc. Shouldn't be too much of an effort to do this once a year, and then the results would actually resemble a "democratic ban".

i don't like the idea of using 50% of the # of active users because then i feel like my impartiality becomes a tacit approval of shitty/disruptive posting

Why does it have to be a "vox populi"? Why can't it just be "an awful lot of people"?

wish john d. was still around to tell tuomas to stfu.