This is the thread where we complain about New York.

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Hurting (Hurting), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:22 (nineteen years ago) link

i think eisbar is otm about the glorification of the bad old days. if i had a nickel for every time someone complained about the soullessness of present-day nyc while strolling down a busy avenue lined with businesses that even 8 years ago was a junked-out no-go zone then i could have bought myself a mcmansion in connecticut.

lauren (laurenp), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:22 (nineteen years ago) link

cherry hill has a really good diner. there's not much else there.

jody von oy (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:23 (nineteen years ago) link

For reals! South Jersey might as well be another state. No hateration, just facts.

Je4nne ƒury (Jeanne Fury), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:24 (nineteen years ago) link

i dunno lauren, there's a difference between "soul" and crackhouses. there can be stuff in those gentrified areas besides expensive bistros and department stores.

jody von oy (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:25 (nineteen years ago) link

I have a lot of friends from South Jersey who just seem to have this more plain, less edgy, almost midwestern quality to them. It is like another state down there. Different culture, different accents, different landscape, etc.

But where the fuck did that strange breed of tight-shirted, slicked-haired thuggish pod-person that clogs old city in Philly every weekend come from?

Hurting (Hurting), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:26 (nineteen years ago) link

view of rest of NJ from around princeton (where i'm originally from -- pretty much the dividing line b/w north & south jersey):

north jersey = guidos, ghettos, gangsters AND gangstas, smelly petrochem factories, ASSHOLE NYCers

south jersey = hicks (a/k/a "pinies"), ghettos (camden and trenton)

Eisbär (llamasfur), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:27 (nineteen years ago) link

ideally, yes. but no matter what i do find it distasteful when people act like it's somehow preferable to have a crackhouse than a bistro, and i've encountered a fair share of that sentiment.

xpost to jody

lauren (laurenp), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:27 (nineteen years ago) link

But back to NYC -- what's really upsetting me lately is that now the village and lower east side are starting to lose a lot of their good music venues.

Hurting (Hurting), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:28 (nineteen years ago) link

I have a lot of friends from South Jersey who just seem to have this more plain, less edgy, almost midwestern quality to them.

otm. while we're on the subject, cape may might as well be delaware. it's so NOT what people from other states would think of as "jersey."

jody von oy (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:29 (nineteen years ago) link

I object to the gross influx of luxury gentrification, but that doesn't mean I want the NYC my mother remembers -- taking her life in her hands every time she was in Port Authority or on the subway.

Je4nne ƒury (Jeanne Fury), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:29 (nineteen years ago) link

Jeanne on the money. I'd like to find some happy medium between getting mugged for $5 and paying $1000 for an omelette.

Hurting (Hurting), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:31 (nineteen years ago) link

ideally, yes. but no matter what i do find it distasteful when people act like it's somehow preferable to have a crackhouse than a bistro, and i've encountered a fair share of that sentiment.

haha my guess is that they weren't even THERE when the bistro was a crackhouse.

if i prefer the "crackhouse" era at all, it's just because rents were lower and small businesses (not just trust-funded bistros) could actually thrive. places like see/hear could actually afford to stay open.

jody von oy (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:33 (nineteen years ago) link

je4nne, key to not paying $1000 for an omelet = don't eat at the parker meridian. shouldn't be that hard.

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:35 (nineteen years ago) link

if i prefer the "crackhouse" era at all, it's just because rents were lower and small businesses (not just trust-funded bistros) could actually thrive. places like see/hear could actually afford to stay open.

and it hurts me in my heart cuz there are small cities where lots of independent businesses thrive and are in little danger of being crushed by 800-ton corporate gorillaz. i lived in one. it was great.

jody von oy (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:36 (nineteen years ago) link

haha hstencil otm. go to the greek diner down the street or better yet, buy some eggs and make your own omelette!

jody von oy (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:37 (nineteen years ago) link

Ok, ok, you know what else I hate in New York? The political atmosphere, as in:

"I'm so fucking radical because I spraypainted a graphic of Bush with vampire teeth on a wall where everyone who sees it will already agree with me,"

and

"You know, I used to hate people who joined the army, but then I heard on NPR that some of them actually do it for the money for education. Maybe I can get one of those regular youngsters to come give a talk at my activist group."

Hurting (Hurting), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:37 (nineteen years ago) link

STOP CREATING STRAWMEN AND SHOW ME REAL PPL THAT ACTUALLY DO AND SAY THIS KTHX

jody von oy (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:40 (nineteen years ago) link

Folks, Hurtin's the one who wants the omelette. Je4nne scrambles her own eggs. (ba dum bum)

Je4nne ƒury (Jeanne Fury), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:41 (nineteen years ago) link

It was a metaphor, folks.

Hurting (Hurting), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:42 (nineteen years ago) link

to be fair, it isn't as if NYC is the only city w/ limousine liberals and armchair radicals (again, here's looking at YOU boston).

Eisbär (llamasfur), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:44 (nineteen years ago) link

i did stay at the parker meridian once, it was nice. but i didn't pay for it.

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:44 (nineteen years ago) link

Oh... I'm late to my own thread.

I think I'm suffering from Second City Syndrome, which is a complicated thing, since part of it involves hating Second City Syndrome. I cringe now when the local news comes on, and they're like, "Such and such person did such and such thing, and if you stay tuned, we'll tell you about the very tenuous links to Chicago." WHO TH' FUCK CARES? Do they do this on the New York City local news? I don't know, personally, but I imagine not. New York doesn't have to try that hard. It's already New York.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:47 (nineteen years ago) link

shepherd what's-his-name lives in la.

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:48 (nineteen years ago) link

kenan, you're not even from chicago. i don't know if that makes your second city syndrome more pathetic, but i'd guess so.

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:49 (nineteen years ago) link

I think I'm suffering from Second City Syndrome, which is a complicated thing, since part of it involves hating Second City Syndrome. I cringe now when the local news comes on, and they're like, "Such and such person did such and such thing, and if you stay tuned, we'll tell you about the very tenuous links to Chicago."

kenan, meet the philadelphia media (probably THE worst offender of the "find ANY local connection with a big national/international story" syndrome that i've EVER seen).

Eisbär (llamasfur), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:50 (nineteen years ago) link

It's a developing thing. Like, if you're going to adopt the city, you're going to have to adopt all the stupid shit that comes with it, and I think I may as well admit now that I'd rather be somewhere else than put up with this stupid shit.

"I'm so fucking radical because I spraypainted a graphic of Bush with vampire teeth on a wall where everyone who sees it will already agree with me,"

Where does this NOT happen?

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:50 (nineteen years ago) link

fuck adopting anything, except for like kitties, dude.

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:51 (nineteen years ago) link

You're probably right. But see, that's why it's complicated. Chicago wants you to care, and I just don't.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:52 (nineteen years ago) link

I do love me some smooth post-rock sounds, tho.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:53 (nineteen years ago) link

fuck adopting anything, except for like kitties, dude.

bide-a-wee is a pretty cool NYC institution!

Eisbär (llamasfur), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:53 (nineteen years ago) link

"Real" Chicagoans don't give a fuck.

()ops (()()ps), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:54 (nineteen years ago) link

and they don't want interweb mentalist bitches e-mailing 'em either!

Eisbär (llamasfur), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:56 (nineteen years ago) link

xpost Well, I guess I'm on my way, then.

sunburned and snowblind (kenan), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:56 (nineteen years ago) link

()ops you are from Naperville or some other bullshit.

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:58 (nineteen years ago) link

It must be weird/fun living on the east coast!

I say this because I have stepped foot in NYC for about, I dunno, 4 days, and its been my only time in the eastern USA.

It must be STRANGE not to see KOKOPELLI figurines nearly every day!

jill schoelen is the queen of my dreams! (Homosexual II), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:58 (nineteen years ago) link

i've never even been to chicago ... i've always heard such nice things about the place. so maybe one day i will go!

Eisbär (llamasfur), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 16:59 (nineteen years ago) link

The problem with DC is that it is dominated by middlebrow middle-class midwesterners, and that they have made much of the city over to match their beige ways.

Crackhouse-era NYC provided almost affordable space for music clubs and ethnic restaurants.

Stinking-rich yuppie New York at least has some interesting shopping (even if none of it fits me and I can't afford it). The same cannot be said of the DC area's stinking-rich yuppie enclaves.

j.lu (j.lu), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:00 (nineteen years ago) link

Small businesses are overrated. if Washington DC is improving at ALL it's because of giant megachains with well-designed websites and employee benefits programs moving in and taking over demolished, burnt-out tire shops, nail salons and poorly-stocked mom & pops. To be quite frank, Kim's is nice, but Tower whups its ass 56 times out of 59.

TOMBOT, Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:00 (nineteen years ago) link

DC is a work-oriented town. People dress dull because they don't want to seem slick. People go to bed early.

Hurting (Hurting), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:01 (nineteen years ago) link

people who hate on Naperville are more boring than the town itself (but no, i'm not from there. not that it matters anyway where i'm from)

()ops (()()ps), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:02 (nineteen years ago) link

Small business are not overrated, there's room for both of them and focusing development entirely on the H&Ms/Magic Johnson Theatres/Old Navy/Pathmarks of the world is a good way to ensure nothing more than a moving of a ghetto, not the improvement of such.

Allyzay Subservient 50s-Type (allyzay), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:03 (nineteen years ago) link

Tombot, your idea of "small businesses" seems to be limited to the kind in post-riot urban areas.

Hurting (Hurting), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:04 (nineteen years ago) link

i don't hate Naperville or any other suburb, but they're not chicago. CHICAGOLAND is a mythic media creation, much like TRI-STATE or BAY AREA or KENTUCKIANA.

seems kind of strange to me to complain that nyc doesn't have small businesses. BUY ONE DELI COFFEE.

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:05 (nineteen years ago) link

crackhouses > Broadway musicals based on Disney movies

Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:09 (nineteen years ago) link

I would like to return to NYC when the weather is decent.

When is the most pleasant time of year? It was so crappy while I was in town, like freezing rain and snow and below-freezing winds. I think JtN and I went into like 9 Starbucks just to warm up. I also recall us just standing in Old Navy for like an hour. It was pretty grim.

jill schoelen is the queen of my dreams! (Homosexual II), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:09 (nineteen years ago) link

hey, i like target and virgin, but if those were my only options i'd go mental!

jody von oy (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:09 (nineteen years ago) link

What I hate about New York City: people at my college from there who are shocked, SHOCKED, that I don't know much of the geography of the city or where things are. Yeah, it may be the center of the universe, but I live six hours away and have no car, so it's not like I spend all my weekends there, or even at home, longingly poring over maps. (Another thing I hate: that every time I've been, people are like "let's spend four hours walking around Times Square!" No, let's NOT. That's another reason I don't know the geography.)

Maria (Maria), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:10 (nineteen years ago) link

who said they were chicago?
chicagoland does exist. it's, yanno, the land around chicago that isn't farmland or water.

()ops (()()ps), Wednesday, 30 March 2005 17:10 (nineteen years ago) link


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