Chicago: Beef, Love and Understanding

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i saw them at the bottle.

― chicago kevin, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:11 (seventeen years ago) link

I've been eating really well all week but I think it might be the day for a greasy diner lunch. I think this time I'll try the place at Montrose and Western.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:11 (seventeen years ago) link

Though I am also making pizza for dinner tonight, so maybe I shouldn't.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:13 (seventeen years ago) link

I meant to eat well and go to the gym last night. Instead I watched a Neil Hamburger dvd, work on some beats, ate a piece of fried chicken and crashed.

Nick, what is your opinion of Neil Hamburger???

― Jordan, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:18 (seventeen years ago) link

I was all excited because I never order lunch with everyone at work, but today decided that, hell, it's Friday and, hell, maybe I'll participate in the office lunch ordering for once. I'll be a joiner. So this morning I announced that to a couple of coworkers who gave me a pitying look and said, Oh, Sarah, no one is going to be in the office for lunch. We'll all be out at the job site for a meeting.

Why did I forget to bring my book today? NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

Thankfully, it should at least be nice out when I walk to find myself some lunch somewhere.

Check out my weather forecast

― KitCat, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:18 (seventeen years ago) link

today is pay day so i think i might treat myself to a decent dinner tonight. STEAK AND TATERS, STEAK AND TATERS!

― chicago kevin, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:19 (seventeen years ago) link

SARAH YOU CAN'T WIN

― Laurel, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:19 (seventeen years ago) link

I think Neil Hamburger is funny.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:22 (seventeen years ago) link

Though I've only seen bits and pieces on YouTube.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:22 (seventeen years ago) link

I respect the schtick.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:22 (seventeen years ago) link

i think i'm the only person i know who doesn't like neil hamburger.

like i said, what do i know.

― chicago kevin, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:23 (seventeen years ago) link

You don't know much about history. Don't know much biology.

― KitCat, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:24 (seventeen years ago) link

Don't know much about a science book
Don't know much about the French you took

― KitCat, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:25 (seventeen years ago) link

Don't know much about geography
Don't know much trigonomitry
Don't know much about algebra
Don't know what a slide rule is for

― KitCat, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:25 (seventeen years ago) link

Also, I bet you don't know nuffin bout birthin babies.

― KitCat, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:26 (seventeen years ago) link

Yeah, it's good shtick. The dvd was pretty funny, although I'd heard that he got the crowd pretty riled up and it seemed to me like they were definitely in on the joke.

Even though it's part of the shtick, the throat-clearing and hocking up really disturbs me.

― Jordan, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:27 (seventeen years ago) link

actually i do know something about birthing babies, courtesy of the "marriage and family" class i took in college after the sociology class i wanted was cancelled.

― chicago kevin, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:28 (seventeen years ago) link

You're the only kind of knowledge they don't teach at any college; you're an education in yourself.

― Laurel, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:30 (seventeen years ago) link

I totally made my point with that devastating zing.

No, I was just on my way to work.

I'm not sure that I think that rock critics should be eclectic in their tastes. And I certainly frown upon the practice of deliberately making your top-10 lists eclectic to make a point. But Kot's eclecticism makes him a more interesting person to me. DeRo can be predictable sometimes, while Kot often surprises me.

― jaymc, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:34 (seventeen years ago) link

DeRo and Kot are both positively turdy.

― kenan, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:37 (seventeen years ago) link

I am listening to the new Wilco album, it's really really really boring so far.

When Renee (who goes to see Wilco/Tweedy every single time they play) said it was boring, I was like whoa, okay.

Have I ever mentioned that I know someone who made out with one of the new Wilco members a few months ago?

I'll try sendspace, all the kids are using it?

Yeah, I prefer it these days, mostly because I don't have to LOG IN. The only disadvantage is that you can't download more than one file at once.

― jaymc, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:39 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah, and sendspace has a 300mb limit, which is plenty for an album, maybe 2.

― kenan, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:40 (seventeen years ago) link

It's not about being eclectic; I wouldn't consider liking Girl Talk particularly "eclectic." It's a fun album but not really challenging or even especially innovative. I'm not saying these are bad things, I'm just saying it's not a difficult or controversial album to pick as a favorite. It's a safe "edgy" choice.

This all ties in to really complicated issues about the purpose of popular music criticism in the age of the Internet that I don't really want to get into. But it basically boils down to me wondering why I should read the writing of a music critic who I feel knows less about music than me? That's how I feel about basically all music writers at this point. That's probably pretty conceited. I guess I could want to read their writing if they were just a good writer, but I don't think Kot is an especially good writer either.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:40 (seventeen years ago) link

Sarah on the new Wilco album: "I listened to the Wilco album getting ready this morning and it was a
complete let-down. :-( I agree. It's boring. Also, Tweedy has had
some BEAUTIFUL pretty slower songs in the past, but these don't even
work as pretty. They're just.., well, boring. Some are easy listening.
Gag me with a spoon, maaaaan."

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:41 (seventeen years ago) link

Now THAT'S rock criticism.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:41 (seventeen years ago) link

Liking Girl Talk is not "eclectic" on its own, it's eclectic when it's on the same list as that slapped-together back-to-basics Neil Young album and Mission of Burma. It's also very much a blog/webzine phenomenon, which makes it surprising when a daily newspaper guy like Kot gloms onto it. I'd wager that most newspaper guys just review whatever big CDs they get in the mail. Maybe Illegal Art is sending out promo copies to the Chicago Tribune, but I'd be surprised.

I wouldn't say that Kot is a bad writer, I'd just say that he's an uninteresting one. And to be honest, I don't ever actually read him. I just like listening to him on Sound Opinions.

― jaymc, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:48 (seventeen years ago) link

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:50 (seventeen years ago) link

It's like, "Wow, he actually made the special effort to take the five minutes it takes to scan Pitchfork every day."

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:51 (seventeen years ago) link

why I should read the writing of a music critic who I feel knows less about music than me? That's how I feel about basically all music writers at this point.

Uh, seriously? When I wrote for Stylus, I was constantly awed at how much more all the other staff writers knew than I did. I always told myself that my music writing could still succeed on the basis of it being good, intelligent writing that just happened to use music as its subject. (I think there are a lot of critics who are primarily music fans looking to parlay their obsession into something useful, whereas I consider myself a writer first and foremost.) (And there are a couple people who write singles reviews for Stylus that I think are totally uninteresting writers. I know the format is supposed to be casual, but what's the point of saying something like, "The music is energetic, but it doesn't really do anything for me"? Why bother publishing that??)

― jaymc, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:55 (seventeen years ago) link

So guess what? Sarah's flight to Memphis leaves at 5:45 AM tomorrow morning. Meaning we are aiming to get there around 4 a.m. Huzzah!

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:55 (seventeen years ago) link

"there" = the airport

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:56 (seventeen years ago) link

I will say that M1ke P0well is one of the few music writers who consistently impresses me.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:57 (seventeen years ago) link

I scan Pitchfork, too... scan. Sometimes I read it. Most of the record reviews I read are blurby ones from retailers, strangely enough, like Boomkat or Other Music. Not like they don't have a vested interest, but I don't really want big opinions anyway. I want a description, a comparison or two, someone who sounds knowledgeable but not awfully proud of their knowledge beyond just wanting to tell me that this record exists. That's all I usually want to know: THIS RECORD EXISTS. I'll take it from there.

But I do still like feature-y music writing that tries to put things into social context or what have you.

― kenan, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Best people to recommend music to you: your friends. We should have some kind of Chi mix CD exchange.

― kenan, Friday, 9 March 2007 15:59 (seventeen years ago) link

I am considering doing a jaymc-style year-end mix this year, since I'm actually keeping on top of new music this year for a change. Or I might do four mix CDs, one for every quarter. I don't know.

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:00 (seventeen years ago) link

For instance, I'd heard Berlinette before, but it wasn't until Jeff expressed his gaga-ness over Ellen Allien that I started really listening. That's something Pitchfork or Gregg Kot would not have convinced me to do.

Now I have dreams about her sometimes. :)

― kenan, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:01 (seventeen years ago) link

And I just feel like this is something that someone whose entire job is knowing about music should not get 'extra credit' for.

He gets extra credit because the vast majority of daily newspaper critics are dumb. I mean, I guess I should couch it all in terms of "compared to other critics like him." And like I said, I do enjoy listening to him every week, too. He seems sharp, and he never falls prey to any of DeRo's juvenile faults (e.g., whenever Kot likes something that DeRo doesn't "get," DeRo will always accuse him of only liking it because of "hero-worship" or "hype" or, if it's a woman, because he has a crush on her. Kot isn't insecure.).

― jaymc, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:04 (seventeen years ago) link

I touched her once.

― Jeff, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:05 (seventeen years ago) link

Ellen.

― Jeff, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:05 (seventeen years ago) link

My favorite thing about good music writing is when a descriptive phrase gets stuck in my head, and then I hear the record later and think, "yeah, you know it DOES sound like that". Or maybe it doesn't, but I'm left wanting to hear (or make) music that sounds like what the words made me hear in my head.

― Jordan, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:05 (seventeen years ago) link

Also, specialization is more important to me that eclecticism. I'm more likely to listen to the opinion of someone who listens to nothing but ambient drone about an ambient drone record than a professional reviewer who puts one ambient drone record in his yr-end list. Even if it happens to be a good record, how do I know that he knows his shit? I get like this on last.fm users, too... find someone who seems to specialize, and go down the list of their most listened artists.

― kenan, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:06 (seventeen years ago) link

I will say that M1ke P0well is one of the few music writers who consistently impresses me.

Yeah, I like Mike, too. I always get the impression that he really listens to music and that it affects him profoundly.

― jaymc, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:06 (seventeen years ago) link

Most weekly newspaper critics are dumb too.

― Jordan, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:06 (seventeen years ago) link

I touched her once.

ooh. Did you never wash that hand again?

― kenan, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:06 (seventeen years ago) link

I washed it but I saved the bath water.

― Jeff, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:07 (seventeen years ago) link

Also, specialization is more important to me that eclecticism.

I should've known you in late 2002 when I got into a big argument with someone about the fact that an employee at Tower Records had a top-10 list filled entirely with Def Jux releases. Certain someone thought that a good top-10 list should inherently be eclectic. I was like, whatever, I appreciate the fact that dude just listens to whatever he likes and is honest about it. And also, hello, this is a top 10 list by SOME DUDE AT TOWER RECORDS, it's not Rolling Stone.

― jaymc, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:09 (seventeen years ago) link

Night Ripper is probably my favorite album from the last 5 years.

― Jeff, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:11 (seventeen years ago) link

That's probably not true, but it's up there.

― Jeff, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:11 (seventeen years ago) link

Best people to recommend music to you: your friends.

Except if your friends have bad taste in music. You realize that we're all friends because we met on a message board that was originally exclusively about music? A lot of my other friends just don't really keep up with music anymore, or else are really excited about Pearl Jam coming to Lollapalooza or whatever.

We should have some kind of Chi mix CD exchange.

We should have a mixtape party like the one EZ's old housemates hosted! That was fun.

― jaymc, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:20 (seventeen years ago) link

YEAH!

― n/a, Friday, 9 March 2007 16:22 (seventeen years ago) link

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