Psychoactive Substances: Rolling UK Politics in The Neo-Con Era

Kind of appropriate that my attempt to ridicule Ed Balls should flounder due to a computer cock up

can't understand why Remain isn't gaining traction, another week's hectoring from middle class Blairite ultras should rescue the situation tho

The Footsie has now shed 378 points since the start of trading on Thursday, when Brexit fears began to mount.

That means a staggering £98bn has been wiped off the value of Britain’s biggest companies in four trading days.

Might concentrate a few minds if they can start communicating the link between economic risk and personal finances more effectively. Cameron seems to have given up though.

Hard realisation for him that he's actually a really inept campaigner when not carried by fascist newspaper magnates

Comments from former cabinet secretary Lord Butler on a post-Brexit vote.

"I am not a member of any political party but I think British politics might be a great deal healthier if the Conservatives, and Labour, did split into pro and anti-European parties. You could just possibly see a realignment of the political institutions. The Conservative Party would split: let us say, the Brexiteers join UKIP and say we are going to maintain our campaign, and leave a pro-EU Conservative Party. Similarly you could have Labour sceptics joining an anti-EU conglomeration.

https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/government-and-public-sector/house/76094/lord-butler-if-david-cameron-loses-he-has-go-%E2%80%93-and

That sounds horrible.

Got my always independently minded MP Kate Hoey's Brexit propaganda today, all bogus statistics and flag waving. Apparently all British workers' rights were won by British trade unions and are enshrined in British law.

http://images1.persgroep.net/rcs/xZNu4O2n8fSuzJj3WQdGMTICjJk/diocontent/67281332/_crop/0/0/1081/1553/_fitwidth/694/?appId=21791a8992982cd8da851550a453bd7f&quality=0.9

Cover of one of the biggest Dutch newspapers tomorrow. Tag line says: "Because they can be difficult at times. But we can't and don't want to go without them."

English op-ed: http://www.ad.nl/nieuws/oproep-aan-de-britten-please-don-t-leave-us~ab721864/

Der Spiegel had some similar dual-language editorials on Saturday, though the main one seems to have vanished behind a paywall now. I like the idea!

Sry for crankiness y/day. My trip to work went past a long wall of hoardings with giant swastikas sprayed all over them as part of some "do you see" anti-EU commentary and I was perhaps unduly rattled. Hey thanks, incisive spray-painting commentator.

Apparently all British workers' rights were won by British trade unions and are enshrined in British law.

...ah yes, all these glorious egalitarian rights-granting British laws which will definitely not be dismantled by any future British govts without (or even with) the EU to keep an eye on them

I wish someone from the Remain camp would explain (obv in high octane scaremongering sound bites:P) that despite what you think of the EU as a long term project, no good will ever come from giving Tories another free hand to throttle you.

I know. This could have been Labour's moment of triumph. They could have taken the reins of Remain for themselves, put their stamp on it, and swatted the baffled, riven Conservatives into irrelevancy

But yeah both parties so useless. Thank God Nigel Farage is too

I know. This could have been Labour's moment of triumph. They could have taken the reins of Remain for themselves, put their stamp on it, and swatted the baffled, riven Conservatives into irrelevancy

― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, June 14, 2016 9:41 PM (25 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

OTM, such a wasted opportunity and one that has led to a simply desperate situation.

The whole thing is such an own goal for the Tories. Why put the country at such risk? If you're the safe pair of hands why throw the chessboard up in the air? What does your party stand for? etc.

Hasn't Hilary Benn got any inspirational speeches in the tank? Or are these to be just solely used for leadership challenges/military propaganda ?

Or Killing an Arab.

I keep hearing about this plague of insecticide resistant Diamond back moths coming from Europe, even Goebels didn't try and demonise moths:p

Hasn't Hilary Benn got any inspirational speeches in the tank? Or are these to be just solely used for leadership challenges/military propaganda ?

he made a big remain speech on Monday, possibly it was not that inspirational though, judging by the fact that appears to have passed everyone by

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-remain-campaign-hopes-hilary-benn-speech-will-reinvigorate-campaign-a7078801.html

the independent have chosen to accompany the article with an impressive example of the "this facial expression" expression

http://cdn2.spectator.co.uk/files/2015/11/f1.jpg

He looks like he is pulling a long hair out of his nose

That might just win back some people from the Brexit camp though.

Osborne threatens to cancel Christmas:

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/osborne-to-raise-taxes-if-voters-go-for-brexit-3sgvlmw3s

Except he won't be in the job.

he made a big remain speech on Monday, possibly it was not that inspirational though, judging by the fact that appears to have passed everyone by

This is a problem – there's such tumult at the moment that only the loudest soundbites from the biggest names make any waves at all. It basically has to be a shriller than ever doom prediction, or anything to do with immigration. Gordon Brown's Monday speech barely registered either.

Labour are totally fucking it up, in an admittedly difficult media landscape. Corbyn has a potentially good "Johnson and Farage are wolves in sheep's clothing" line yesterday, but within a few hours his message was overshadowed by his own deputy on the back foot making noises about "It's time to look again at free movement within in the EU".

Lots of people are highlighting the Cameron / Farage debate as a key error - Farage having little to lose and having his credibility boosted as 'the official face of the opposition'.

I see The Sun is going with "Brexit rocket boost to shares" on the front page, after four days in which shares fell by £98bn.

Lots of people are highlighting the Cameron / Farage debate as a key error - Farage having little to lose and having his credibility boosted as 'the official face of the opposition'.

That's interesting. The way I see it, anything the Remain campaign can do to bring Farage into the limelight is a good idea – he's so unpopular with the moderate majority that anything that can be done to associate Brexit with him is a good idea IMO.

I think Farage is more popular than you suspect. He's selling the "let's take back control" very well.

Assuming a brexit win, I think a lot of the little-Englander Leave voters are going to be disappointed when the realise that what they've actually voted for is the neoliberal policies of people like Grayling and Gove, who are rather keener on cheap migrant labour than them.

If the referendum is close but in Leave's favour, does the decision still have to pass the House Of Commons before we are out?

About time the Queen earned her money.

If the referendum is close but in Leave's favour, does the decision still have to pass the House Of Commons before we are out?

Absolutely. The result of the referendum is a 'recommendation', and nothing more. Close or otherwise, Parliament has the final say, and then they still have to invoke 'Article 50' to formally initiate the exit process.

I can't see them trying to ignore a leave vote unless it was very close and turnout was very low

I think Farage is more popular than you suspect. He's selling the "let's take back control" very well.

Latest favorability ratings I can immediately see (Feb) are more depressing than I thought, but I'd still say he's toxic to a lot of waverers.

http://www2.politicalbetting.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/113201617588.jpg

Meanwhile, Bob Geldof is on a boat with Rachel Johnson threatening to intercept Farage's flotilla.

https://twitter.com/mikeysmith/status/743006829408575488

Yes, still has to go through the Commons.

I don't think Farage will get a permanent boost to his viability but in a single issue debate where he can throw out all sorts of nonsense, backed by large sections of the press, safe I the knowledge that he will never have to be accountable for it, there is no reason to think he can't have an impact. Giving him equal billing with the PM adds credibility to his platform.

I still think annihilation of the Tory right is the most effective way forward but Cameron's queasiness about 'blue on blue' attacks has taken that off the table. The 57 MPs who have signalled they will vote down a post exit budget don't have the same qualms.

I'd forgotten about Nigel's flotilla! The mad bastard!!

Someone going through and itemising the 57 as 'this is the one who still has a nanny', 'this is the one who wrote an open letter to Twitter demanding they upgrade their security after accidentally favouriting a BDSM porn tweet and claiming to have been hacked', etc might lessen the impact.

About time the Queen earned her money.

does the queen like the eu

there's a fearmongering/defeatist tone in the guardian that's really feeling damaging in this campaign.

A land without Polish plumbers, the end of the Calais booze trip and no more need to learn tricky foreign languages … Welcome to post-EU Britain

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/15/brexit-survival-guide-freeze-cheese-holidays-albania

it really feels like it's getting into "don't bother voting" territory.

Meanwhile, lots of entertainment to be had watching "Sir" Philip Green having a stand up fight with allcomers on the Select Committee.

He just broke off an answer to ask Richard Fuller MP to “stop staring” at him, as it’s making him uncomfortable.

Fuller insists he doesn’t want to make Green uncomfortable, as everyone stares at Green in disbelief.

Given the UK will effectively be in the EU for some time even if Leave wins, the short term effect would presumably be a lot of people trying to get into the country while they still can? ie it could actually increase migration in the short term?

could be balanced out by the people trying to escape this nuthouse?

Independent Scotland will welcome them with open arms.

I was thinking of moving to Dublin.

Need your passport for that.

I know we're not in the habit of quoting Guardian commenters with approval, but silkmonkey here mirrors my own state of anxiety at the moment:

https://discussion.theguardian.com/comment-permalink/76427843

peter_brentiskew
15 June 2016 12:48pm
I am getting increasingly happy and upbeat as the polls awing towards Brexit.

It's a great time to be British. About to lead the way to a better future for Europe by shattering the misguided EU.

I just can't imagine how someone's perception could be scrambled enough to believe this is a great time to be British.

when is it ever a great time to be British?

Who is ever "british"?

Apart from yknow the orangemen

was just thinking on the way to work what a difference 4 years make, how it DID feel good in 2012 with the olympics and all.

Still, though, Boris and the zip-line.