Psychoactive Substances: Rolling UK Politics in The Neo-Con Era

i accept it's entirely possible Janet Daley has mingled with a different sample group to me

almost no hostility to the British Muslim community

http://static.radicalisationresearch.org/wp-content/uploads//2015/11/UK-tabloid-islamophobia.jpg

i accept it's entirely possible Janet Daley has mingled with a different sample group to me

She lives on a different planet to most of us.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/sadiq-khan-britain-first-london-mayor-threaten-direct-action-a7047991.html

The far-right group Britain First has threatened to target where Sadiq Khan “lives, works and prays” as part of their apparent organised action against British Muslim politicians.

In a press release, the “loyalist” group claim they specialise in direct action which they will use against Mr Khan

can we just call them a terrorist group and be done, or does this set a dangerous precedent

> In town today, lots of Remain campaigners, absolutely no Brexiters at all.

A dozen remainers in w12 that I saw, at least two of which were being earholed by Leavers.

http://crookedtimber.org/2016/06/17/making-our-peace/

very good, even at the points where i disagree

Baroness Warsi out of the Leave campaign now. I'm not a big fan but I appreciate that as the highest profile minority in the Tory party, she probably has to make a call a dozen times a day regarding "What course of action will further my aim/goals while also facilitating the least racism and exposing myself to the least racism?" (while the highest profile minority in the Labour party - probably Sadiq Khan? - would only have to do this two or three times a day). And as such my understanding is that the actual point of saying "no we've crossed a line" can come some time after the line has actually been crossed.

All that taken, there are probably 20 better ways for the Guardian to express this than "although some question her commitment to campaign".

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/20/sayeeda-warsi-quits-leave-campaign-over-hateful-xenophobic-tactics

EXCELLENT shade in "Speaking earlier of the leave campaign, she told the Times: 'I look at that group of people and I think they’re not the kind of people I’d get on a night bus with. Why would I want them to run my country?'" though.

https://twitter.com/econbuttonwood/status/744787791758819329

Yeah I think Gove would relish the chance to restart the troubles

iirc there are sensible arguments against some of the details of the Good Friday Agreement (which was an amazing and impossible-seeming enough achievement that it was probably worth it)...

...but that certainly wasn't one of them

his pea-brained imperialist jingoism was all over the changes to the History syllabus when he was Education sec

What's the polling looking like in Northern Ireland? Is it overwhelmingly Remain or is there a substantial Protestant Leave contingent?

The Belfast Telegraph had an article about poll results this morning: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/eu-referendum/eu-referendum-growing-support-in-northern-ireland-for-brexit-but-balance-of-power-lies-with-the-undecided-34815075.html

which is slightly confusingly laid out, so: Remain still in the lead in NI but Protestants somewhat pro-Leave (iirc the DUP are for leaving and the UUP for remaining), with higher %s undecided than in recent all-UK polls; 37% are still undecided and about the same for Remain

37% undecided is pretty fucking high.

Not like the Norn Irish not to know their own minds :)

the ones i know are pretty forthright in their views oh wait is that the joke damn damn that's the joke isn't it damn damn

Nothing happened for two days? Blimey.

I believe Rick Astley (remain) and Ulrika Jonsson (leave) competed for the vote of Clarke Carlisle (undecided) on Channel 4.

The leave campaign appears to have taken £600k from a woman who claims she joined the BNP accidentally and one of their board members has resigned after retweeting racist memes.

The dignified silence seems entirely justified.

I've just realised I haven't had a polling card and am a bit worried. Has everyone else had one?

(I know you don't need one to vote but I hope it doesn't mean I'm not registered - I was registered for the police commissioner elections in May but re-registered online "just in case" after they extended the registration date, so it would be typical if I had typed my details wrong and got myself removed from the register or something)

Nothing happened for two days? Blimey.

fatigue.

xpost : my polling card arrived months ago.

don't think I've had a card, am definitely on register, maybe they aren't sending them out or they look like the advertising crap I keep getting and I've ignored it or it arrived months ago like mark e said

xposts - If you were registered for the police commissioner elections in May you'll be fine, you only need to register once don't you?

oh er... having arrived months ago would definitely defeat my non-existent filing system, yes. ta!

(ahem)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cli2TCdVAAE1_W7.jpg

This is how I feel, basically.

reasonable points, think he's gonna get his worst case scenario tho

whatever the outcome, its going to be nasty.

everything's nasty without full communism

lol.

I think it'll be WCS too.

Yes, though i don't think a majority of 55%+ would change anything.

Even if the UK leaves, idk if you're going to get full speed ahead on further integration given the current situations in Poland and the wider Visegrad group, France, Italy, Spain, etc.

Implications for us of a brexit are much more wide-ranging and longer lasting and if FG were in full govt i think we'd be getting much more jumpy.

Hmmm, don't think moves toward closer integration are happening any time soon, for reasons that go beyond the British situation, like Sharivari says. Also saying greece is opposed to integration feels like a category error. It's more that Greece has had the lesson driven home harder than anyone else that integration is a sham when the chips are down.

Ruth Davison seemed impressive in the bits I say of the debate. Still a Tory, obv.

Work has kicked-off into Breixt comms nonsense.

sheffield council sent me two postal ballots (they seem to be confused about whether i'm a postal voter or an overseas voter). i did the right thing.

shat on it

the wolfgang blau thing has a superficial plausibility but not a lot more. 'further integration' would either require treaty changes, which were politically possible only by engineering around rejected plebiscites even in a much more favourable climate a decade ago, or a slow accretion of measures in different areas. if the latter then the new recognition of british special pleading would probably enable this via further derogations when necessary.

the only further integration that is either sought or needed is within the eurozone rather than the eu architecture itself, which would be easier to accomplish once the uk exemption from eurozone refinancing is ratified. it's obtuse to claim that greece is opposed to further integration when it has spent years unsuccessfully pleading for eurozone debt consolidation/mutualization. nothing like this looks very likely for the time being in any case, but if a political will does develop then the uk precedent would allow a periphery of nordic/visegrad countries to self-segregate from eurozone fiscal integration (ie there is now already an actual germ for a two-tier eu).

in the case of exit, then the rest of the eu would be financially less exposed than the uk itself, but politically it could be a lot more difficult. there are comparable levels of resentment in many other countries and elections in several of them next year; insofar far as latin countries support further integration (still no more than a third of voters in any country) then it is in the hope that the solvent (=germanic) eurozone countries will consolidate with them. and any political will for that would lessen further once the uk left and the ordoliberal centre asserted itself against afd et al by clasping their lutheran prayerbooks and chastising the debtor nations.

and as sv says, it's not entirely clear how much difference 50.5% or 55% makes; the entire reactionary claim is about the will of the silent majority, and unpopular populists begin to look like born losers rather than mere unfortunates (cf the humiliation of farage last year). the snp are discussing a second referendum only in the eventuality of the uk leaving the eu, and insofar as they would have any other case to demand one, it is because the demographic trend is with them, rather than against as is the case for the overwhelmingly old and uneducated ukip vote.

the losers would continue making noise, effectively spoiling their ballots by voting ukip, but unless the conservative party decisively affirmed its opposition the eu, there would be no political constituency for it. this is possible, mostly because the ancient conservative party membership is even more estranged from the centre than the labour one, and if one of their two options was a hardcore eurosceptic they would buy it. whether the parliamentary party would give them another fundamentalist suicide candidate like i-d-s remains to be seen; northern ukip voters will not be voting for dominic raab.

I wonder to what degree places like fife, where I live and which has never returns a labour mp iirc (always Tory or ld/liberal) is because we fall between two stools? Everyone campaign in Edinburgh or Dundee, and that's maybe why the rural tends to be forgotten - it's more fri ing to campaign in cities. Mwhich may be circular.

(Was thinking after checking for nearby campaign events and not seeing any/few in my region.

I just read a facebook comment claiming an exit from the EU would more strongly ally Britain with the US

Is this a sentiment anyone is actually expressing? Because trust me, no one over here's saying that and we'd rather you stuck with the EU.

sounds like the dream of formalizing the anglosphere is picking up steam!

I just read a facebook comment claiming an exit from the EU would more strongly ally Britain with the US

Obama has already said it would not do so. But I guess he's leaving, so people are deluding themselves into thinking that he's wrong?

I feel like I could throw a rock and hit three thinkpieces on how Trump and Boris are similar but also not-similar (though I haven't read any because lifetime is finite).

the handful of US corporations who use Britain as a foothold to the EU are not on board with that!

just fwiw in case it solves anyone's problems ballots were only issued in the last ~month i think

yeah that Boris guy seems really dumb, if there's anything we can do on this side of the pond to help, let me know

I think we can handle this Trump thing but I'll send up a flare if we need assistance

Your government still regards Johnson as American for tax purposes, much to his annoyance.

I am normally conflicted on our enthusiastic taxation of citizens living abroad, but I feel this could be of use. Maybe we can get him extradited for tax evasion?