I like the spectacle, but watching them all lay intricate plans without ever thinking about the fact that Euron Greyjoy has a fleet and is mad at them, then a while later seeing their plans destroyed by a mad Euron Greyjoy, it's just so stupid.
― Frederik B, Monday, 24 July 2017 12:44 (six years ago) link
How do you know they never thought about it?
Like at a war council they're going to talk about resolving beef between Iron Island factions?
― President Keyes, Monday, 24 July 2017 13:00 (six years ago) link
i mean, in their defense they stole the iron fleet so probably had no idea euron somehow magicked up the greatest armada westeros has ever seen. if you're going to take issue maybe it ought to be with that. the show is a colander at this point, i don't understand the motivation to poke yet more holes in minor plot points. if something like that actually bothers you, which is certainly fair, then you've kept watching for at least a season too long.
― Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 24 July 2017 13:04 (six years ago) link
I think it's funny how poorly the pacing of the show was planned, like so much time in seasons 2 through 5 was spent crawling to one big event episode or another and now it's big ol' payoffs (and deck-clearing deaths) left right and center. the perils of respecting yr author god or w/ever
― a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Monday, 24 July 2017 13:07 (six years ago) link
x-post: I did stop in season four, actually, but then picked it back up to see how it resolves since GRRM can't figure out how to finish it. And yeah, you're right, the problem is with Euron all of a sudden having the fleet. But that still makes it really stupid.
― Frederik B, Monday, 24 July 2017 13:33 (six years ago) link
I'm still enjoying it or whatever, but things definitely feel a bit more boring, like we know most of the beats they're about to hit and everything feels a bit rushed and fan-service-y. And even though all these plot points have been predicted for years, the way they're being spelled out and moving so fast just feels kinda shallow. Jon saying "I just learned that guess what Dragonstone is on top of? Dragonglass!" Shocking.
― dan selzer, Monday, 24 July 2017 14:54 (six years ago) link
I thought he did a decent job trying to make that line reading sound less dumb that it looks on paper.
― El Tomboto, Monday, 24 July 2017 15:13 (six years ago) link
Drag-Gon Stone is on top of a mountain of draggin-glass
― El Tomboto, Monday, 24 July 2017 15:14 (six years ago) link
I'm still enjoying it or whatever, but things definitely feel a bit more boring, like we know most of the beats they're about to hit and everything feels a bit rushed and fan-service-y. And even though all these plot points have been predicted for years, the way they're being spelled out and moving so fast just feels kinda shallow.
Yeah, it's basically been a different show since they unkilled Jon Snow.
― a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Monday, 24 July 2017 15:16 (six years ago) link
also Euron is Lord Nelson and Yara is Villeneuve, he clearly approached perpendicular to their fleet's line and from a position of concealment, he doesn't necessarily have a bigger fleet than them although he did have some decent time to replenish his during the time it took the kids to sail all the way to Slaver's Bay, load up half the horses in Essos and then sail back.
― El Tomboto, Monday, 24 July 2017 15:22 (six years ago) link
It's just so rushed. How many minutes of the show passed between iron islands and dorne will be a huge force and whoops not quite. They just left like 5 minutes for bisexuals and castrati laffs.
― dan selzer, Monday, 24 July 2017 15:33 (six years ago) link
Resurrection is like the ur-jump the shark. Jon Snow=JS=J ...S ...=Jesus!
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 24 July 2017 15:37 (six years ago) link
Anyway, this and Broad City, I have no idea how much of the last season I saw, or where I left off. Debated diving back in, but sounds like it's the same ol' erratic.
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 24 July 2017 15:38 (six years ago) link
I did enjoy that this was a good old fashioned ass-whoopin'. It played better than Bolton decimating Stannis' army.
― Max-Headroom-drops-a-deuce-while-shredding (Sparkle Motion), Monday, 24 July 2017 17:20 (six years ago) link
http://www.vulture.com/2017/07/game-of-thrones-season-7-stormborn-questions.html
Who is the most powerful person in Westeros?Duh — Samwell Tarly with a library card.
― El Tomboto, Monday, 24 July 2017 17:58 (six years ago) link
They leaned hard on the "Samwell is GRRM" thing last night
― President Keyes, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:01 (six years ago) link
I saw it pointed out on twitter that Euron's magic fleet is even more annoying since the show spent five seasons of Daenerys trying to find a fleet to get back...
They gave up on any kind of rules guiding Westeros, all sense of geography is out of the window, and nobody knows anything about military strength anymore. Which is ok, but the exhausting things is that they still have all these scenes of planning and strategizing which clearly don't mean a thing anymore, and is just a complete waste of time.
― Frederik B, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:16 (six years ago) link
jesus
― President Keyes, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:18 (six years ago) link
trouble is, what made this show great at its best was that the big moments and reversals were rooted in well-drawn characters behaving in character in a specific context- jaime lannister resignedly pushing a kid out a window- joffrey baratheon choosing cruelty over honor and reputation- tyrion lannister using cleverness and charm to extricate himself from certain doom- robb stark neddily trusting in custom while walder frey did what was best for walder frey- oberyn martell overplaying his hand for style points at the crucial moment- etc etc
i know i said this last season but it still feels true: without GRRM's words to work off of, this feels like just a TV show, and the more fan service we get the less interesting it becomes
― Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 24 July 2017 18:22 (six years ago) link
i think the first four seasons are almost completely outstanding (the fourth less so), but the last two were this mix of source material and original ideas that didn't always work even remotely. i think the last two episodes of last season were very good though and this season is as well. nothing as knife-twisting and intelligent as the best of seasons 1-3 but i think it will finish strongly. albeit very predictably. i don't think this is a GoT problem, so many of these prestige shows, even the better ones, have moments that are easy to telegraph far in advance.
― nomar, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:26 (six years ago) link
Euron seems like a good antagonist. better to have a cackling glam pirate than a dinner table sadist like ramsay.
― nomar, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:27 (six years ago) link
I do like the idea of a guy who basically hijacks the kingship of a shithole land just to strip it of its trees and build a fleet he can use to sail around and swing his dick at everything
― President Keyes, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:32 (six years ago) link
the books and early seasons felt as if they had some substance you could dig into, and while grrm is tying himself in knots trying to maintain that in the books, the show has gleefully jettisoned the conceit and we just have surface now, theater, spectacle and set pieces, often very entertaining and i believe worthwhile in its own right but not the same thing as it was.
― Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:35 (six years ago) link
and the thing with euron's armada is not just building the ships, which is logistically improbably enough on its own, but the crewing of them. their whole fleet has just fucked off, exactly how many sailors are still around? and hell, they're a rape and pillage based economy, how much of the adult population just left?
― Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:39 (six years ago) link
it doesn't matter anymore. there were big ships and fire. it was good.
― Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:40 (six years ago) link
Theon and sis only took the best ships (about 50?) from the fleet. Doesn't seem like it would drain the entire population to man that many boats.
― President Keyes, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:42 (six years ago) link
I have been enjoying Jim Broadbent, he's way overqualified for that role
― a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Monday, 24 July 2017 18:43 (six years ago) link
But yeah they're running full on with the "only nerds care about some of these details" mindset now
― President Keyes, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:44 (six years ago) link
Nah. I wish they would run full on with that. Instead of wasting time arguing whether or not it's 'right' for Jon to go to Dragonstone.
― Frederik B, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:48 (six years ago) link
It was just a way to show more tension with Sansa, and so we could see Littlefinger sneer.
― President Keyes, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:52 (six years ago) link
just wait till they hold off for like four more episodes till Jon and Dany even bang xp
― a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Monday, 24 July 2017 18:53 (six years ago) link
god, Sophie Turner is so awful
I laughed out loud when Dani said, "Bend the knee." (see Chapo thread)
― President Keyes, Monday, 24 July 2017 18:55 (six years ago) link
yeah same lol
― a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Monday, 24 July 2017 19:09 (six years ago) link
especially the way she said it after a dramatic beat, and that it was spoken by the character most frequently mocked by dirtbags
― a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Monday, 24 July 2017 19:10 (six years ago) link
and the thing with euron's armada is not just building the ships, which is logistically improbably enough on its own, but the crewing of them. their whole fleet has just fucked off, exactly how many sailors are still around? and hell, they're a rape and pillage based economy, how much of the adult population just left?― Roberto Spiralli, Monday, July 24, 2017 6:39 PM (thirty-six minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― Roberto Spiralli, Monday, July 24, 2017 6:39 PM (thirty-six minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
and that his dope new fleet is equipped with machine gun cannons firing explosive ordinance
― officer sonny bonds, lytton pd (mayor jingleberries), Monday, 24 July 2017 19:16 (six years ago) link
lol. contrasted with qyburn's super secret anti-dragon tech being a bog standard piece of iron age artillery.
― Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 24 July 2017 19:21 (six years ago) link
Just picturing the GoT writers' room puzzling over how to give Cersei's army a chance against the dragons and someone saying, "Wait, have any of you ever read this book, 'The Hobbit?'"
― Old Lynch's Sex Paragraph (Phil D.), Monday, 24 July 2017 19:24 (six years ago) link
Yara could take only the crew loyal to her over Euron and was outnumbered by the latter's followers and fleet. He also knew they'd attempt to ally with Danaerys as that was his own plan he revealed upon his return. It all made relative sense (handwaving timespan required for one or two things as you have to do every episode now).
― nashwan, Monday, 24 July 2017 19:48 (six years ago) link
Was kinda hoping Qyburn's plan involved just building a wheeled wooden AT-AT with the dragon skull as its head but nm.
― nashwan, Monday, 24 July 2017 19:52 (six years ago) link
half thought some harryhausen skeleton dragon shit was coming up
― Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 24 July 2017 20:08 (six years ago) link
― President Keyes, Monday, July 24, 2017 11:52 AM (one hour ago)
Not really -- it also showed that Jon is capable of learning politics: he left the local management with Sansa, who has the best chance of maintaining the obedience of the Northern lords, and who had previously complained that he did not acknowledge her contributions to battle strategy. Notice she appeared mollified at that announcement, where before she had been critical.
― sarahell, Monday, 24 July 2017 20:21 (six years ago) link
plot-wise, it also ties in with the conversation they had earlier where Sansa talked about how well she knew Cersei and how she learned a lot from her ... so we will assumedly get to see what Sansa has learned.
― sarahell, Monday, 24 July 2017 20:22 (six years ago) link
Power is power.
― Mad Piratical (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 24 July 2017 21:28 (six years ago) link
theon jumping ship is the first show-only development i've been excited about in a while. it offers opportunities to juxtapose with the hound's story.
euron, i don't care about him. he'll kill some people then get killed.
― Einstein, Kazanga, Sitar (abanana), Tuesday, 25 July 2017 00:51 (six years ago) link
boy that grey worm
― 龜, Tuesday, 25 July 2017 01:03 (six years ago) link
"well now i know why they call you grey worm"
― nomar, Tuesday, 25 July 2017 01:30 (six years ago) link
― nomar, Monday, July 24, 2017 1:27 PM (seven hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
cautiously agree with this so far
― gbx, Tuesday, 25 July 2017 01:38 (six years ago) link
otice she appeared mollified at that announcement, where before she had been critical.
I shouted "that oughta shut you up" at the screen at her at that point, lol
― Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 25 July 2017 01:43 (six years ago) link
So I was confused by the ending. When Theon is in the water, that wasnt Yara, hanging from a ship's prow, above him? Someone upthread implied Yara and Ellaria are kidnapped, not dead. The melee made it really messy to work out.