T/S: loving both La Jetee and 12 Monkeys vs. choosing one over the other

/morbius

THIS HAPPENED TO ME WHEN WATCHING DENZEL IN DEJA VU

I haven't seen La Jette yet, but intend to, oh, let's say tonight.

oh, but i much preferred Flight of the Navigator

The only thing LJ has going for it is antiquity, and I can't STAND it when people err on the side of the more established work of art, because 'it got there first', or 'they don't make 'em like they used to'. In 50 years, 12M will be regarded as the classic, mark my words.

Which genre? You've got about 6 to choose from! La Jetee may have been highly original in the early 60's, but technical and creative advances (yes, advances) have seen its methods outstripped. The only justification for showing LJ in a film student class is that it's the kind of film those students will be making for their assignments.

You are right in that the two films, aside from sharing a certain conceit, have little in common.

UH

When I first saw La Jetee, I knew it was a series of stills rather than a proper moving picture, but somehow I forgot about that about 5 minutes in and just watched the movie. It's not a conventional movie, but it's not like it's some bizarre artifact. It's very watchable.

And I wouldn't choose one over the other, necessarily, but I would buy the DVD OF 12 Monkeys (in fact, why don't I already own it?), but La Jetee would be much farther down on my list. Because I won't watch it much, if ever. Because it's not as much fun to share with friends. It stays in my memory, certainly, but I've seen it twice, and that's fine for now.

that said, gilliam's one great film is "fear and loathing," not "brazil."

OK I love 12 Monkeys, but this is complete twang.

We're getting into murky waters here, because I do like Fear and Loathing a lot, but it is in no way as good as Brazil. Brazil is one of the best movies of... I dunno... the 80's, certainly, if not the 20th century. ("Somewhere in the 20th century.") Fear and Loathing is merely very well-done. But what does it say?

is a reason to destroy it though.

Gilliam does this odd thing with 12 Monkeys, made clear(er?) in the scene in the movie theater where they're watching Vertigo and putting on their disguises. I still haven't gotten to the bottom of that one. It's amazing, though, with the callback to the movie about people who use their identities as persona. And he's definitely doing something very deliberate there. The opening credits of 12 Monkeys, after all, are an homage to the opening credits of Vertigo, only with spinning monkeys instead of spinning... I dunno... cool-looking Saul Bass thingies.

xpost

marker was a huge 'vertigo' fan and putting a ref to it in '12 monkeys' makes total sense.

So, I say La Jetee today, loved it. Either way, is 12 monkeys good. If it helps, I'm a huge fan of Brazil and a huge non fan of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas.

OH GOD

why didn't i just not post to ILX in the first place ;_;

Brazil is my all-time favorite film, and 12 Monkeys is no slouch either. I always lol at the movie's only funny line ("I just got mugged by a coked-up whore and a fuckin' crazy dentist!")

I came close to losing it during the "they came back to make him one of their own, but he had a different request" sequence. He just wanted/needed to cling to that one shred of sentimentality, refusing to move on no matter what the reward. The travel to the future would have been "easy" but he choose the crippling, painful route back instead, the euphoria of comfort and familiarity too good to miss. I think everyone can relate to that.

Also, was that a doorbell on the future woman's head?? WTF???

They have some pretty sweet looking glasses in the future too.

xxpost: huh?

Brazil was for quite a bit my all time favourite too, so: hmmmmn.

my relationship to La Jetee is really kinda key for me - I was living in Portland, drinking pretty heavily and taking a lot of drugs, going to school but not being a good student. but I had this one class a friend had urged me to take so we'd be in a fun class together - "science fiction in film" (this was a community college in '86, mind). OK so a friend of mine from California comes to visit me for a week. We stay drunk the whole week, like mad drunk all the time. Come Wednesday night it's time for my SF film class, I bring my friend along. We watch Things to Come (hilarious) and then the teacher shows Le Jetee, only the last bus back to my apartment is pretty soon and my place is an hour away by car. So we take note of the time and start watching Le Jetee, figure we can get to the bus stop in time if we're careful. Whoa this movie is awesome what's gonna happen! Well, we don't know and we won't know, 'cause we have to haul ass to the bus stop before the movie's over. We leave just as it feels like all is about to be revealed.

I finally saw the movie all the way through about three months ago. It is considerably more intense than 12 Monkeys. the end

In 50 years, film students will be watching La Jetee in class

i took a class where we watched both WRAP YR BRAIN ROUND THAT

Wrap your troubles in dreams.

Just watched TM again. I really like it but I kinda wish at the end that (SPOILER) he hadn't got the message through about the Army of the Twelve Monkeys being a red herring. I'd have preferred it as an endless bleak loop of hopelessness.

La Jetee is good 'n' all but I don't quite get the acclaim - it's a neat and clever little scifi tale which would be all but forgotten if it had just been a story in an anthology. I wonder if any other stories could be transformed with a haunting series of still black and white images...

this thread contains my most brainless ILX rantathon

:(

just pretend you were high.

yeah, that's what everyone else does

"casual mentions" as a justification technique

I just watched La Jetee a few nights ago. It's really great! Someone say something intelligent.

Twelve Monkeys is better.

SIKE

There's no such thing as a "still" film.

or, there are only still films.

there are only films, still

anyway if you are suggesting there is no visual, psychological, or conceptual difference between la jetee and twelve monkeys, you are rong.

I wrote a whole essay on the still of the woman's face at the airport La Jetee for film theory class (and got a really good mark on it too :D )

I think this film is stirring up what might be something of a latent fondness for science-fiction, which is kind of taking me by surprise.

although supposedly the choice to do the film in stills resulted from the lab ruining a lot of the film (which I read and wouldn't mind confirmation regarding that this is the same reason why the jump juts in Breathless are there) Which on one hand is kind of hmmmn, but then again, it is what it is and it is beautiful.

watching this now on tv and i was all "this is exactly like la jetee but way longer and with loads of retarded shit added in and not as beautiful but madeleine stowe is the most beautiful woman that ever lived maybe" did not realise this was a remake or whatever but then again I probably did

isn't there another movie where old bruce willis meets young bruce willis? how does that compare?

i dunno, but the slideshow but is kindof a nice reference

La Jetee is good 'n' all but I don't quite get the acclaim - it's a neat and clever little scifi tale which would be all but forgotten if it had just been a story in an anthology. I wonder if any other stories could be transformed with a haunting series of still black and white images...

This last sentence is a really interesting thing to ponder!

okay i've decided that this is really awesome if you forget that its a remake and that is largely due to madeleine stowe's face+fats domino

It's a sideways remake since Gilliam hadn't seen it when he made the film, and there are huge odd Gilliamisms all over it.

ha I would love to see gilliam remake sideways (with surviving python cast)!

That would be great!

the action-ey scenes look like xena or something tho

whatever happened to madeline stowe?

ugh i found it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRjhR78ysN4

"I wonder if any other stories could be transformed with a haunting series of still black and white images..."
this movie looks like it could stand to use this treatment. it's kind of halfway there with the subtitles.

david fincher should remake sans soleil with a subplot about futuristic cyber hackerz, not sure how that would work tbh

Good god, "The Kid" made $70mn domestically

I basically love all freaky friday type movies

okay there are lots of awesome bits in this movie alternated with really retarded batman forever shit

Do we have a thread about the syfy 12 Monkeys series?