tv shows within tv shows: an ocd thread for jaymc and nabisco

Sometimes when watching a TV show I get really bothered by the fact that the show take place in a world where the show and its actors don't exist.

― total mormon cockblock extravaganza (jaymc), Friday, December 12, 2008 4:14 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I have the same problem Jaymc does, though it's all just dependent on how shows handle things. Weird example: 30 Rock bothered me last season when David Schwimmer appeared as not-himself (even though the show is set at a "real" NBC where Seinfeld was Seinfeld, so surely Schwimmer was on Friends), but it didn't bother me when Jennifer Aniston was on as not-herself (because ... she's less tied to Friends in my head than Schwimmer is?).

But yeah, it weirds me out when popular characters/actors refer to real things in the entertainment world but they remain fictional, and some shows are really fast and loose about this -- I got a little vertigo once from two characters on some show talking about a real movie that one of the actors was in, and just ... I dunno, it's just weird.

(Note: I don't get all geeky-angry about this, I understand that it's fiction and doesn't matter, but it's just ... weird, sometimes, to think about.)

― nabisco, Friday, December 12, 2008 4:36 PM (31 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

you guys, dont ever see "jay and silent bob strike back" or your might have some kind of seizure

― beyonc'e (max), Friday, December 12, 2008 4:39 PM (27 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Haha.

― total mormon cockblock extravaganza (jaymc), Friday, December 12, 2008 4:40 PM (26 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I don't mind when it's done purposefully, just when the weird tangles show up on their own. Like a world where Brad Pitt movies exist but then Brad Pitt plays a guy named Lou, and nobody goes "omg Lou, you look exactly like Brad Pitt."

― nabisco, Friday, December 12, 2008 4:42 PM (24 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Totally.

― total mormon cockblock extravaganza (jaymc), Friday, December 12, 2008 4:44 PM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

NB: Marijuana heightens these thoughts.

― total mormon cockblock extravaganza (jaymc), Friday, December 12, 2008 4:45 PM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

This is possibly a whole other thread.

I have never had those kinds of thoughts with certain things (e.g. Curb Your Enthusiasm seems to keep it very clean?), but then I'll be totally fascinated by, say, the SVU episode where future-ADA Novak is on trial for raping a guy.

― nabisco, Friday, December 12, 2008 4:51 PM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Why its annoying on 30 Rock... there are loads of Friends (in this case) jokes and references. In the first series, doesn't Baldwin go through a whole phase of watching Friends... and yet he sleeps with this woman who looks incredibly like Jennifer Aniston and doesn't seem to notice it?

i dont really care but i can understand why its annoying.

― a hoy hoy, Friday, December 12, 2008 5:01 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Ocean's Twelve had a gag about all this stuff, where Julia Roberts's character met Bruce Willis and he mistook her for Julia Roberts.

the 30 Rock/Schwimmer/Seinfeld thing bothered me too, though. but then i'm on record as being OK with celebrity walk-ons on that show and would prefer if people just played themselves since the show takes place in a TV studio.

― The strawman from the hilarious 'ilx' race threads (some dude), Friday, December 12, 2008 5:03 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

wasn't the julia roberts thing like a major plot point?

yeah, this should probably be a new thread.

― Tracy Michael Jordan Catalano (Jordan), Friday, December 12, 2008 5:04 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Please start it! (Please also note that I'm not "annoyed" by this stuff, I just wind up fixating on how odd it is.)

― nabisco, Friday, December 12, 2008 5:06 PM (34 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

you guys need to get STRAIGHT

i like how on arrested development the bigger name guest stars play roles but carl weathers is carl weathers. did anyone else play themselves on that show?

I have never had those kinds of thoughts with certain things (e.g. Curb Your Enthusiasm seems to keep it very clean?), but then I'll be totally fascinated by, say, the SVU episode where future-ADA Novak is on trial for raping a guy.

in the same vein, it drove me nuts when Jon Lovitz guested on "Newsradio" twice as completely different characters, then joined the cast in its final season as a third character.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andy_Richter

xpost

wow u guys are so fucking crazy

Hey this is kind of like on Scrubs where the main character recognized the janitor as having had a small role in The Fugitive (which the actor playing the janitor really did)

I'm sure there is a show out there where an actor has appeared both as a character and as him/her-self, the actor

oh shit at that Scrubs clip

Other OCD-ish things I do when watching TV shows:

1. When characters make reference to having been a certain age in a certain year (or having done something that gives their age away within a particular time frame, like being in college or giving birth), I always immediately calculate how old that makes them now, and if that's plausible. (Or vice versa, like if we already know they're in their 40s but then they say their son was 12 when "The Macarena" was a hit, etc.) I invariably miss the next minute's worth of dialogue because of this.

2. I know there are a million reasons, mostly having to do with contracts, why certain actors appear in the opening titles and others are relegated to "guest starring" or "with special guest star" credits -- but I still get really hung up on this stuff. The most egregious example being Seth Rogen being in the main credits of Freaks and Geeks despite having probably less overall screen time than the perpetually guest-starring Busy Phillips. Every episode I'd mention this, much to my girlfriend's chagrin.

^^ I don't do that latter, that sounds a bit annoying

Although I probably do some girlfriend annoyance with a whole lot of "where do I recognize that actor from" and "oh hey it's that actress from XXX," sometimes with DVR rewinding while I try and remember

1. When characters make reference to having been a certain age in a certain year (or having done something that gives their age away within a particular time frame, like being in college or giving birth), I always immediately calculate how old that makes them now, and if that's plausible. (Or vice versa, like if we already know they're in their 40s but then they say their son was 12 when "The Macarena" was a hit, etc.) I invariably miss the next minute's worth of dialogue because of this.

^^^^how has the simpsons not made your head explode?

I'm sure there is a show out there where an actor has appeared both as a character and as him/her-self, the actor

now i'm going crazy trying to think of an example

Andy Richter in AD, again.

haha on 1.: the last season of The Wire when they showed Omar's birthdate, I immediately went and figured out that either Michael K. Williams is 6 years younger than his character or that they were deliberately showing city's paperwork on him to be wrong.

Although I probably do some girlfriend annoyance with a whole lot of "where do I recognize that actor from" and "oh hey it's that actress from XXX," sometimes with DVR rewinding while I try and remember

Yeah, we do this all the time.

I don't mind when it's done purposefully, just when the weird tangles show up on their own. Like a world where Brad Pitt movies exist but then Brad Pitt plays a guy named Lou, and nobody goes "omg Lou, you look exactly like Brad Pitt."

― nabisco, Friday, December 12, 2008 4:42 PM (24 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

one of my personal pet peeves IRL is people constantly going "omg you like just like so-and-so celebrity" when there really isn't much of a resemblence, so I think I'm going to start pretending that most movies and shows take place in some wonderful world where noone says that.

But somedude, it is the same person

I immediately went and figured out that either Michael K. Williams is 6 years younger than his character or that they were deliberately showing city's paperwork on him to be wrong.

I hadn't thought about that latter possibility, but I did definitely calculate the age.

but i'm saying, it'd be nice of character-that-looks-like-Brad-Pitt could coexist in a world where Brad Pitt is a famous actor and people aren't constantly talking about the similarity. xpost

but I'm saying it is actually Brad Pitt

haha the thing with the actor-recognition and girlfriend-annoyance is that I am occasionally entertained by it, like "omg look it is so-and-so in this," and I get back a look that says "you realize these people are actors who do various kinds of work and appear in various projects over the courses of their careers, right?"

it surprises me comedies never play on it - i'm sure the 30 rock writers could write a good joke about jennifer aniston playing someone else, post-friends/brad etc. and that the boundries are never fucked with.

but* the boundries etc.

nabisco, there is only one correct answer to that look, and it is "YAAAAAAAAAAAAH TRICK YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH"

When Schwimmer was on 30 Rock, Donaghy immediately referred to him as whatever his character-name was (Jamie?), and I interpreted it as a joke about how Donaghy can't be bothered to learn Schwimmer's name. (I think that one was just weird because NBC was hiring him as a national spokesperson: when NBC unveils a spokesperson and it's David Schwimmer, how are we NOT meant to assume that's intended as actual David Schwimmer?)

there was some ludicrous apotheosis of this on uk tv recently when the main actors in the british civil war were detective mcnulty, alastair campbell, and him out of life on mars/doctor who

Well because Schwimmer wouldn't be some nobody who does adverts for whoever ran against Hillary? Although that could have worked even better knowing it was Schwimmer and he just decided to make some crazy ad, like if Extras was funny.

xpost - Wait, how does that count? Were they watching Dr Who during the war?

I don't understand that sentence, hoy

no, it was just them acting, no intertexuality. it was shit, and it was impossible watching mcnutty play oliver cromwell (tbh i only saw bits of it tho)

xpost - But I think the issue is that Schwimmer is an actor who has appeared on and done public service for NBC, and in the 30 Rock episode he was playing ... an actor who appears on and does public service for NBC. It's too close. If he'd been playing some random guy from accounting, it wouldn't have jumped out as weird.

my bad. Schwimmer couldn't be Schwimmer because the character is written as a nobody actor who took any work, including a batshit political ad (I tried youtubing it but couldn't find it.) If it was Schwimmer, the joke would have been totally different. (Like in that shit Ricky Gervais show Extras that was always "haha actors aren't like how you think they are.")

"Hilary Clinton wants an all homosexual army. How will that affect my family?"

I am so glad I am rewatching this episode. It's the one with Kenneth's party!

i want bow- wow to play himself on Entourage like all the other celebrities

which shows were spun off of Supercomputer, again?

Argh, now you bring it up. Real life Melinda Clarke playing her character from the OC Julie Cooper but married to fictional character head-of-Aris-old-company in Entourage! That pissed me off.

Oh, hoy, sure, it wouldn't have worked if it was SUPPOSED to be Schwimmer, but that's not really the point here -- the point is that it's weird to cast Schwimmer as not-himself on a show in which real-Schwimmer basically used to work for the company the show's about!

I know. I was just saying that it could have worked if he was just Schwimmer playing himself as crazy.

("Do you even bother to compost your own faeces?" I love this show.)

geez how do you guys cope with Curb Your Enthusiasm?

One I thought was funny was on Studio 60, which obv. had tons of actors from The West Wing and Sports Night. one episode had Felicity Huffman hosting the show-within-a-show, and made no mention of SN, which made sense because it's not really her most famous project. But then a few weeks later the host was "Allison Janney from The West Wing" because I guess they really wanted to have her on the show but couldn't pretend she'd be on there for any other reason.

There's an episode of The A-Team where a woman asks George Peppard, "Are you George Peppard?". Oh and I've just remembered this - the lolness of Dirk Benedict, as Templeton Peck, recognising a Cylon in the title sequence.

AD played with this all the time.

Like Justine Bateman constantly saying how weird it is that she's dating whats his name and then turns out to be his sister. And Dr. Dan Castallaneta saying "d'oh" all lazily and then mom goes "I knew it!"

That all being said it was a LITTLE weird with all the Sopranos/Oz/Wire actor crossovers

also, awesome joke Scrubs, was even funnier when i saw it on the Simpsons.

The Larry Sanders Show had me wondering these same things--well, wondering in an idle, bored way. Ben Stiller appears as himself, so one assumes that Ben Stiller exists in that world, yet Bob Odenkirk and Janeane Garofalo, who worked on The Ben Stiller Show, appear as fictional characters. I'd always wonder if this meant that either a) those characters just happened to look a lot like JG and BO, b) to everyone else in that world, maybe their characters look completely different and look to us like JG and BO simply because we see the actors or c) in that world, some other fictional characters fill the role that BO and JG did. (So, Mr Show is created by David Cross and, I dunno, some guy named Gary Jenkins who just happens to have the exact talents and life path that our BO did).

Christ, that is too much thinking.

https://i.redd.it/abnaxbr06rqy.jpg

ideally, every character who meets tej should initially mistake him for ludacris and then he has to say "why does everyone keep saying that, i look nothing like that guy"

This is also very much what happened when Glenn Frey guest-starred in the Miami Vice episode, "Smuggler's Blues".

the GOTG universe is walking a VERY fine line having a protagonist obsessed with 80s pop culture and then filling the cast out with notable 80s actors

does kurt russell not exist? he turns into david hasselhoff, who does exist, but why doesn't star lord ask his dad why he looks like kurt russell? and i don't think he ever came into contact with stallone's character but they're making a PRETTY huge leap here. are you really suggesting sylvester stallone doesn't exist in the GOTG universe? does this not drastically change the foundation of who star lord is, as a child of the reagan/stallone 80s?

also why wasn't debbie harry in it, debbie harry should totally be in the next one

don't give them idears!

I'm sure in the Marvel universe Stallone's roles were played by Schwarzenegger, in a reversal of that Last Action Hero gag.

http://www.filmsinfilms.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Last-Action-Hero-3.jpg

And Russell's roles were probably played by Patrick Swayze.

So, the Doctor Who serial 'Remembrance of the Daleks' is set in November 1963, in the days immediately preceding the very first Doctor Who serial 'An Unearthly Child'. A tv is on in one scene, which trails "This is BBC Television, the time is quarter past five and Saturday viewing continues with an adventure in the new science fiction series Doc-" before being abruptly cut off.

There's also a bus in the background of the New Series 8 episode "Forest of the Night" with a poster advertising Series 8, but this is probably just a continuity error.

http://io9.gizmodo.com/chris-pratt-had-a-very-bad-idea-for-guardians-of-the-ga-1794818393

chris pratt had the same objection

germaine lusssier sounds like an idiot

lol someone made that point about a completely different article over the weekend

https://www.theawl.com/2017/08/forensics-franchises-and-fans

the grinder was great

I'd forgotten this thread. Obv Harry Morgan on MASH pre-Novaked Novak, by guest-starring as a jerk and coming on full-time as a lovable grandpa figure.

As my thoughts go deeper into this topic I remember an episode of Benson (bear with me here), in which René Auberjonois suffers an amnesic mental break in which he believes himself to be a black man. Robert Guillaume, as Benson, is trying to see if he can get Auberjonois's character back to earth. He asks R.A.'s character if he recognizes him (that is, R.G. as Benson). (Seriously, stay with me here.)

Auberjonois answers "yeah, Ben!" R.G. as Benson breathes a sigh of relief. Then R.A. adds, "Ben Vereen!"

This was only comprehensible - let alone funny - if you knew that Ben Vereen and Robert Guillaume looked somewhat like each other IRL. But the fourth-wall breakage was somewhat unusual in those days.

But then likewise, wouldn't Ben Vereen and "Benson" look alike as well? Where was the fourth wall broken?

I remember that episode too. Clayton even started wearing glasses on a chain and cardigans.

does the grinder ever confront the main characters' uncanny resemblances to actors fred savage or rob lowe OR acknowledge the divergence of a universe where these icons of the small screen do not exist

also does the awl always publish thesis papers for college pop culture classes, i have some shit i could sell

I came here specifically to see if anyone had noted the conversation from “Love” (which I just saw) and it feels appropriate that it was Jaymc who dropped it here nearly a year ago

Anyway who do we sue

(Also can someone get Leslie Grossman her own who show) (in which no one ever watched the various things she was a less-notable character in)

It occurs to me that there was a whole conversation on “Love” but like, I mean, “Love” presumably takes place in a universe where Chris Rock exists and yet everyone is just too chill to tell the character played by his brother “damn, dude, you bear a STRIKING resemblance to Chris Rock, you even talk and move your hands the same way”

So like it might not 100% want to pull threads

Oh, ha, I had no idea that that guy is Chris Rock's brother.

So, the Doctor Who serial 'Remembrance of the Daleks' is set in November 1963, in the days immediately preceding the very first Doctor Who serial 'An Unearthly Child'. A tv is on in one scene, which trails "This is BBC Television, the time is quarter past five and Saturday viewing continues with an adventure in the new science fiction series Doc-" before being abruptly cut off.

― Mud... Jam... Failure... (aldo)

true who nerds will tell you that this clearly takes place in an alternate universe because in our universe, while the first episode of "doctor who" was printed as airing at 5:15 in the radio times, its broadcast was delayed by about ten minutes due to coverage of the kennedy assassination.

Oh man, if that guy WASN'T Chris Rock's brother ... he'd be facing a long line of casting directors saying "listen, your Chris Rock impression is really good, but this audition is for just a regular guy. STOP ACTING LIKE CHRIS ROCK"

(There is another Rock brother who acts but he seems less similar)

https://io9.gizmodo.com/infinity-war-puts-adam-wests-batman-in-the-marvel-cinem-1825657160

How the hell did he manage to completely misspell “Frasier” three times in one run-on sentence

on the bright side, not misspelled three different ways

Least it was just misspelled and not bad Grammar.

Ayyy

good work pp

Abbi and Ilana referencing The Good Wife to a character played by the guy who played Howard Lyman on TGW in a Broad City subplot in which Alan Cumming is guest starring as himself

— Oriana Schwindt (@Schwindter) March 1, 2019

This blew my mind https://t.co/QPjX2J1HKV pic.twitter.com/i7wfyL2qfL

— Adam Serwer🍝 (@AdamSerwer) July 20, 2019

Stan Lee exists in the Marvel comic book too. There, he runs a company called Marvel that publishes fictional comic books based on the lives of real superheroes. (For example, at some point Steve Rogers, who in the comics is a talented artist, was drawing a Captain America comic for Marvel.) So presumably the MCU Stan Lee does the same, and is famous for that.

"Stan Lee exists in the Marvel comic book universe too."

The article covers that in detail, though comes to a different conclusion to you.

The Last O.G. features Method Man who, in a conversation about Ole Dirty Bastard, names all of ODB's nicknames, but is playing some separate gangster character named Green Eyes

In Six Feet Under S03e13, "I'm Sorry, I'm Lost," Nate is grieving, drinking and blankly watching TV while the old dude who has been banging Nate's mum for six weeks and is marrying her tomorrow makes himself at home in Nate's living room.

"What are you doing?" asks the interloper.
"Watching Babe." mutters Nate, to this new character played by James Cromwell, the farmer and main human character in Babe.

In a recent episode of The Bold Type, Jacqueline Carlyle (played by Melora Hardin) is seen holding a mug with the logo of Dunder Mifflin, the company in The Office that employs, among other people, Jan Levinson-Gould (also played by Melora Hardin).

Rewatching Larry Sanders and noticed for the first time that the episode where Paul Mooney plays Beverly's cousin is followed shortly thereafter by an episode where someone makes an offhand remark about booking Paul Mooney on the show.

Oh hi
https://www.avclub.com/browse-threat-level-midnight-and-sick-sad-world-in-this-1847469398

very apropos!

https://nestflix.fun/

ha, thanks forks.

oi!

Really impressed with the amount of work put into that, getting an image, blurb and quote for every show etc.

Was just going to suggest Mr Banana Grabber from Arrested Development but the creator has already had to suspend submissions due to overload

My all time favorite is still Monsignor Martinez

This is great but no Rochelle, Rochelle or Prognosis Negative :(

I was confused by that, but apparently the site requires that we see "actual footage" of the fake movie/show ("not just mentioned in dialogue or seen in a poster"), which I think rules out all of the movies in Seinfeld.

The pilot of Jerry should be in there, though.

Pretty sure we got like 2 seconds of "Cry, Cry Again"

https://i.imgur.com/3gHTNPi.jpg

Or maybe...

Red Dwarf is on the iplayer and I’ve been watching it for the first time. It’s great, but I found it odd that Series 9 is missing. That is until I looked it up and it’s partially set on itv’s biggest show:

Back to Earth Pt 2

Lister, Rimmer, Kryten and Cat appear on contemporary Earth and discover that they are fictional characters from a television show called Red Dwarf. They find a DVD box for "Back to Earth" and discover that they are to die at the end. They decide to track down their creators to plead for an extension, in a parody of Blade Runner. The DVD box also refers to a series X that does not actually exist yet. Katerina arrives via a second portal, but is quickly killed by Rimmer after she makes the mistake of telling him that taking the life of a hologram is not murder as they are already dead. A discussion between Lister and two children on a bus reveals that Kochanski may not be dead.

Back to Earth Pt 3

Lister, Rimmer, Kryten and Cat use the car they take from the President of the Red Dwarf fan club, made out to resemble Starbug. They go to the set of Coronation Street, where they question Craig Charles about how much time they have left. Charles tells them they are down to their last episode, as well as giving them the address of "the creator", before joking that he needs to go back to the Priory (a reference to the actor's real life drug problems).

They find the creator, in a scene heavily referencing Blade Runner. He tells them that their deaths cannot be undone, but they will at least die gloriously. In a struggle Lister manages to kill him, before finding that this was scripted by the creator. Lister then burns the creator's script and rewrites their own ending. They then discover that the typewriter is not determining their actions.

The small origami sculptures left by the Cat turn out to be squids, leading the crew to realise that they have been drawn into an alternative reality by another squid capable of inducing hallucinations with its venomous ink - however, in contrast to the previous specimen the crew encountered in "Back to Reality" that brought on despair, the hallucinations of this squid induce joy, almost euphoria, in an attempt to prevent its prey from fighting back.

Rimmer, Kryten and Cat have formed resistance through their previous meeting with the squid during the SSS Esperanto incident, but Lister chooses to stay in the false reality where he gets together with Kochanski, despite the knowledge that she isn't real. After a period of time with Kochanski, Lister decides to head back to his own reality, with a renewed sense of his own self-worth, determined to find the real Kochanski and win her back. The episode ends with the four laughing at the fact that the fans of Red Dwarf created by the Despair Squid's hallucination (i.e. the viewers) will think that their reality is the real one, and the Red Dwarf reality dependent on it, as opposed to the other way round.