HBO adaptation of Game of Thrones - will this be just for nerds? (NO SPOILERS PLEASE)

Other Ice And Fire books are Princess And The Queen, Rogue Prince, Tales Of Dunk And Egg (3 books so far with quite a lot more planned, possibly as many as 12). All of these are novellas though.

despite his total insanity, the thought of bringing such a huge, complex project to completion makes me appreciate dave sim more

Did you ever finish Cerebus?

i'm still working on it

Tales of Dunk and Egg everybody

I've finished Cerebus. The last couple of volumes are absolutely mad.

Oh man, the whole point of Cersei's scenes with Oberyn Martell and Margaery Tyrell (that she was trying to make nice with them in order to influence Tyrion's trial) initially went completely over my head. I had somehow forgotten that Mace Tyrell was the third judge. I should have known Cersei would never do anything to make her seem sympathetic without an ulterior motive!

― Dan I., Tuesday, May 6, 2014 5:02 AM (16 hours ago) Bookmark

At first I thought she was trying to bait Margaery into admitting that the Tyrells were behind Joffrey's murder

Kind of hoping that the TV show just devolves into a collection of comedic duos on the road - Hound and Arya, Brienne and Pod

Also I know I bring this up every episode but I just can't anymore

http://i.imgur.com/TrYvXLa.gif

http://i.imgur.com/kPWK2IE.jpg

I thought this was a good episode, with a few juicy developments. The fact that Dany's past 'liberations' are coming undone is interesting, and begins to put something of a new spin on the image of her as the great white liberator of dark-skinned people.

Great Arya and Hound stuff this week as well.

I read that as a metaphor for US foreign policy and the aftermath of "liberations"/revolutions. It all seems so cut and dried when you get rid of the hated rulers but then there's the unexpected blowback and dangerous new forces rushing into the power vacuum. This thread is too big to load now so sorry if this has already been said.

Or it might just be that those silly brown people need a firm hand to rule them.

I dunno I have zero faith in this series' politics, gender, racial or otherwise

good to know

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYBAMxJecLI

I'm sort of hoping that the unravelling of Dany's liberation tour is a critique of that scene — "See! It was meant to be a parody of the White Messiah Complex all along!" — but that might be giving them too much credit.

I think he is trying to do something more interesting with this series. This quote from his Rolling Stone interview is pretty salient:

Ruling is hard. This was maybe my answer to Tolkien, whom, as much as I admire him, I do quibble with. Lord of the Rings had a very medieval philosophy: that if the king was a good man, the land would prosper. We look at real history and it’s not that simple. Tolkien can say that Aragorn became king and reigned for a hundred years, and he was wise and good. But Tolkien doesn’t ask the question: What was Aragorn’s tax policy? Did he maintain a standing army? What did he do in times of flood and famine? And what about all these orcs? By the end of the war, Sauron is gone but all of the orcs aren’t gone – they’re in the mountains. Did Aragorn pursue a policy of systematic genocide and kill them? Even the little baby orcs, in their little orc cradles?

Good quotation, though he still has blind spots with regards to race and colonialism, among other things.

But Tolkien doesn’t ask the question: What was Aragorn’s tax policy?

let's ask George Lucas

quote is ludicrous, he seems to intentionally elide things Tolkien's explicit about (there are no orc babies, orcs are MADE)

lol shakey

(there are no orc babies, orcs are MADE)

this isn't completely true. Tolkien was pretty hazy about their origins but their are a couple of mentions of Orc children and Bolg and Azog are father and son

maybe I was thinking of the uruk-hai

anyway

I like GoT because it is not just another re-hash of "good v evil" or "forces of light vs darkness" fantasy tropes. It's chock-full of shades-of-grey characters, most of whom are acting out of self-interest, and Martin stirs that all together and attempts to play it all out. It ends up pretty cynical and depressing most of the time, but at least it feels more true than most fantasy.

what an interesting quote. holding Tolkien accountable to historical reality is one thing, but doing so in the context of an equally fantastical story? not criticizing it so much as fascinated it. to what end is fantasy "realistic"???

What was Glinda the Good Witch's tax policy

I suppose what Martin is getting at is something like a self-critiquing fantasy? something which exposes fantasy's inherent simplifications from within?

would be amazing if he followed through with this to the end.

dany's army and dragons land only to be decimated by smallpox or something.

Dany turns to the camera and shrugs. Credits roll.

I'm not saying all fantasy needs to be concerned with this stuff (it IS called "fantasy!"), but I like what he is trying to do.

i would be just fine with dany's whole army taking a wrong turn at cucamonga and sailing off the edge of the world; i've avoided book spoilers but if we end up with a full season of DWAGONS vs WHOEVER HAS THE IRON THRONE i'm gonna get bored quick

My good man, there are a million ways to get bored, let GRRM show you them all.

*fastens a doublet*

this show is the worst rn

*travels in a pair*

to what end is fantasy "realistic"???

To what end is any art anything? It's an avenue in the genre that GRRM perhaps hadn't seen satisfactorily explored before, and he's been pursuing it to often interesting effect.

it's "realistic" like Punisher MAX is realistic aka grim

yeah "realism" ehh just an excuse for more gore and boobs really. although I appreciate schwantz' need for moral ambiguity, I don't think that's unique to GRRM (Golem kind of the ur-text of morally ambiguous fantasy characters)

http://undergroundmgzn.com/2014/04/15/man-ruins-game-thrones-series-novels-full-spoilers/

^ guessing that contains spoilers??

Sub-Onion article, I apologize for wasting people's time.

The concept was funny, but clearly the actual Onion guys could've made it worth reading and made the headline a little less awkward.

Davos is the one true onion guy

that's SER ONION GUY to you.

my fave grrm anti-fantasy trope is the wise gandalfian greybearded maesters all being gross traitors and pawns

or at least the one in king's landing whose name i forget

Duracelle

lol.

I think he is trying to do something more interesting with this series. This quote from his Rolling Stone interview is pretty salient:

Ruling is hard. This was maybe my answer to Tolkien, whom, as much as I admire him, I do quibble with. Lord of the Rings had a very medieval philosophy: that if the king was a good man, the land would prosper. We look at real history and it’s not that simple. Tolkien can say that Aragorn became king and reigned for a hundred years, and he was wise and good. But Tolkien doesn’t ask the question: What was Aragorn’s tax policy? Did he maintain a standing army? What did he do in times of flood and famine? And what about all these orcs? By the end of the war, Sauron is gone but all of the orcs aren’t gone – they’re in the mountains. Did Aragorn pursue a policy of systematic genocide and kill them? Even the little baby orcs, in their little orc cradles?

― schwantz, Tuesday, May 6, 2014 3:50 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i know what GRRM is saying here and ive definitely said things like this in the past but this manages to both misunderstand LOTR and elide the fact that there are a lot of socio-political-economic-historical questions that GRRM isnt asking either

that being said i think GRRM has probably found the best balance btwn great-man history and price-of-grain history to tell an effective epic fantasy saga for the late 20th/early 21st century

aragorn apparently based on old school king in the north king oswald of northumbria

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-gJXoNOB8AGM/TjwHhOkjiqI/AAAAAAAAAgs/3qtcdqqOmbo/s1600/4855831753_c861feecb4.jpg