I said this upthread but several of their earlier songs have references to being straight-A goody-two-shoes before being claimed by the Dark Carnival
― HI DERE, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:26 (fourteen years ago) link
so.... do they know how magnets work, or...?
― max, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:28 (fourteen years ago) link
max = does not notice and appreciate miracles.
― I Smell Xasthur Williams (Jon Lewis), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:29 (fourteen years ago) link
i just want to know how magnets work
― max, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:31 (fourteen years ago) link
At the risk of sounding like a judgmental, classist jerk, I definitely take issue with the whole "Scientists are liars! Miracles are the real explanation!" element of the song. I don't care if underneath the make-up, Shaggy is a physicist and Violent J is a neurobiologist; encouraging people to discard actual facts about the world in which we live in favor of attributing things to "miracles" is not good. Encouraging skepticism? Definitely. Encouraging people to explore and question? Absolutely. But just straight up insisting that scientists are liars and everything is really just due to MIRACLES OMG is troubling as a world view.
If their encouragement to disbelieve scientists and instead attribute all "unexplained"* phenomena to God is all a part of their crypto-Christian agenda, well, I think that's pretty deplorable, too. I'm not even saying that I begrudge them their religious views. I don't. I'm saying that encouraging people to regress back to some dark age as far as their knowledge of the world is concerned is a bad idea and absolutely worth mockery, regardless of whether these Clowns actually mean it or are actually smart or whatever.
*Unknown to them, I mean. Most of what they are singing about is actually pretty well explained, ie magnets and how the fuck they work - regardless of how many people on ILX know how magnets work, the point is that it is known and pretty easy to look up should one be so inclined. Actually, the first Google search result for "how magnets work" - http://www.coolmagnetman.com/maghow.htm - consists of information presented in 1952. So humans have had a pretty good understanding of magnets for some time now.
― she is writing about love (Jenny), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:32 (fourteen years ago) link
no one itt has stepped up to describe how magnets work
― dipster purpies (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:33 (fourteen years ago) link
And I'm not sure how one is supposed to earn straight As in school if one insists that science is a lie and instead believes that commonly understood natural phenomenon, such as rainbows, magnets, the phenotype of human offspring, and crows are in reality nothing more than inexplicable miracles.
― she is writing about love (Jenny), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:35 (fourteen years ago) link
dude we're talking about middle school in MICHIGAN
― GREAT JOB Mushroom head (gbx), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:37 (fourteen years ago) link
anyone that thinks that scholastic achievement in grades 5-8 somehow correlates to actual intellect is....a clown
― GREAT JOB Mushroom head (gbx), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:38 (fourteen years ago) link
MI used to have good schools, though?
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:39 (fourteen years ago) link
the uberhipsters at Slate are now officially all over this story: http://www.slate.com/id/2250217/
― all yoga attacks are fire based (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:40 (fourteen years ago) link
s'late
― nakhchivan, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:41 (fourteen years ago) link
so can I maybe put forward the opinon that you might be taking this a tad too seriously, Jenny, or will you bite my head off
― HI DERE, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:42 (fourteen years ago) link
here is the deepest secret nobody knows(here is the root of the root and the bud of the budand the sky of the sky of a tree called life; which growshigher than the soul can hope or mind can hide)and this is the wonder that's keeping the stars apart
the movement of charged electrons create magnetic fields (these fields exert force on other magnetic objects)
― Lamp, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:42 (fourteen years ago) link
The song is funny—imagine Wordsworth gone rock-rap, dropping f-bombs aplenty in praise of the natural sublime.
i think you are describing this thread, slate dude
― pretty girl, filking a clown (acoleuthic), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:45 (fourteen years ago) link
I'm gonna fess up and say if I ever knew how magnets worked exactly, I don't remember how. I do remember wondering why magnets don't decay over time.(for example, you can rub a paper clip with a magnet which will make it temporarily magnetic as well -- but why doesn't the magnet lose its magnetism [perhaps more slowly] as well?)
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:45 (fourteen years ago) link
Fukkin stock market how does that work?
― I Smell Xasthur Williams (Jon Lewis), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:46 (fourteen years ago) link
did wonder whether the slate person might have read this thread xxp
― nakhchivan, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:47 (fourteen years ago) link
haha I started reading that "how magnets work" link and let me assure you, MN public schools did not go into that level of detail, not even in middle school
― HI DERE, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:48 (fourteen years ago) link
iirc: magnetic force is due to moving electrical charges; a linear magnetic force is produced when electrical charge moves in a circular direction; therefore the electron orbitals of each atom produce tiny magnetic forces as they orbit the atom; magnetic metals are magnetic because in those metals the electron orbitals can easily line up in the same direction, and the billions of atom-sized magnets thus work together to produce a huge force. it's kind of a miracle when u think about it
xposts
― róisin bran (Curt1s Stephens), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:50 (fourteen years ago) link
looooooool earlier today i did quip 'fucking banks.....*pause*....how do they work'
this is the meme of '10 whether we like it or not
― pretty girl, filking a clown (acoleuthic), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:50 (fourteen years ago) link
as someone unfamiliar with any wider icp eschatology 'miracles' just seems shorthand for the sort of 'look at the carpark' strain of weak optimism that's more or less nondenominational, maybe it is more sinister but the song alone is insufficient evidence
― nakhchivan, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:51 (fourteen years ago) link
Since you asked so nicely, I will address your concern without biting your head off.
I'm not taking this seriously to the point that I'm thinking about the impact of ICP's teachings and philosophy on the Youth of America when I am not actively engaged in this thread. I'm mostly presenting that argument as a counterpoint to your defense (if it even rises to the level of a defense - maybe it's just an opposing point of view? I don't want to ascribe more ICP-related enthusiasm to your posts that you actually intend) that ICP are actually smart dudes. To sum up my response using fewer words: their regressive world view belies any actual intelligence that they may have.
Some of my apparent passion is probably coming from a TED talk I watched last night about pretty much that very subject (regressive thinking re: science, not ICP, although I would probably watch a TED talk by or about ICP, too). It was mostly in the context of anti-GMO food activists and vaccine deniers, but the common thread is this idea that scientists are liars who are not to be trusted.
― she is writing about love (Jenny), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:52 (fourteen years ago) link
In short, I stan for scientists.
TS, which is deeper: ICP "Miracles" vs. Joanna Newsom HOOM.
― I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:53 (fourteen years ago) link
ICP are exactly the kinds of speakers TED invites!Dean Kamen and Violent J tag-team powerpointing on segways.
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:54 (fourteen years ago) link
[btw oops sorry -- searched the thread for "slate" before posting but not "weiner" for obvious reasons]
― all yoga attacks are fire based (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:54 (fourteen years ago) link
Someone needs to take a Joanna Newsom lyric (something from Ys?) and ICP-ify, stat.
ksh... c'mon buddy.
― I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:54 (fourteen years ago) link
no
― Mr. Que, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:55 (fourteen years ago) link
Oh I guess I was also responding to some comments that were kind of in the vein of "making fun of ICP is an elitist thing to do." I'm not making fun of them for their music or their weight or their aesthetic, but I do think there are elements of their schtick that are legitimately worth looking at critically, and the anti-science element is one that stood out the most for me as far as this particular song goes.
― she is writing about love (Jenny), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:55 (fourteen years ago) link
to me, the best thing i've read about the song's "real" pov was the slate article--it's just some dudes, smokin stuff, thinkin' about rainbows. it's not any more complicated than that.
I stan for scientists, too. I also think that ICP use any smarts they have primarily for:
- making money- getting people who would normally be bitter, angry reactionaries to be nice to each other and many of those around them
...so, as such, I kind of don't care if they're particularly regressive in their thinking on questions like magnets because it's wholly secondary to why they exist, namely to get paid.
― don't you steal my Sunstein (HI DERE), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:56 (fourteen years ago) link
oh fuck me, I just used "stan" as a verb
add a d to stan, you're a mod!
― Mr. Que, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:57 (fourteen years ago) link
I really should
― don't you steal my Sunstein (HI DERE), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:57 (fourteen years ago) link
"- getting people who would normally be bitter, angry reactionaries to be nice to each other and many of those around them"
is this true? I do agree ICP's popularity is a mark of Michigan's failure to reach out in terms of jobs/education or whatever where something like ICP scoops them up and fills in the void.
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 17:59 (fourteen years ago) link
is this true?
have you read, like, any of the links or articles posted on this thread or on other threads on ILX, or listened to an extended amount of their music
― don't you steal my Sunstein (HI DERE), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:01 (fourteen years ago) link
Had a 'Miracles' moment while walking the dogs last week tbh. It was really windy and I blurted to my wife 'What IS wind? What is this STUFF which is hitting my hand right now?!?!"
― I Smell Xasthur Williams (Jon Lewis), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:02 (fourteen years ago) link
i've read a fair bit of the articles and threads, haven't listened to the music (or amazingly this video because it sounds amazing!)
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:03 (fourteen years ago) link
why are you here
― GREAT JOB Mushroom head (gbx), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:06 (fourteen years ago) link
it's a miracle!
― don't you steal my Sunstein (HI DERE), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:07 (fourteen years ago) link
... was bashfully hoping for an explanation of magnets...
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:09 (fourteen years ago) link
(the circular electricity explanation is great, don't get me wrong, but I always thought it might have to do with missing valence electrons or something)
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:10 (fourteen years ago) link
y'all motherfuckers lyin, & gettin me pissed
― tylerw, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:13 (fourteen years ago) link
What up, ninja, with facepaint brightIn the Gathering late at nightWhat miracle hand or eyeCould frame thy clownface symmetry?
In what fucking deeps or skiesBurns fire like Faygo when it gets in thine eyes?With what miracle that would shock thine eyelids?Dare not a scientist explain me this fire
When fucking magnets started to work,And fucking rainbows came after it rained,Did he smile to be down with the clown?Did He who made the Juffalo make thee?
― ksb2, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:15 (fourteen years ago) link
d the anti-science element is one that stood out the most for me as far as this particular song goes.
― she is writing about love (Jenny), Tuesday, April 13, 2010
isn't "fukkin magnets / how do they work?" kinda yr Scientific Project in a nutshell?
― all yoga attacks are fire based (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:17 (fourteen years ago) link
atoms with missing electrons are probably more likely to experience an electrical force than a magnetic force due to the charge imbalance
― róisin bran (Curt1s Stephens), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:24 (fourteen years ago) link
the Juffalo! ksb2 <3
― Ponies are horse children (Abbott), Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:25 (fourteen years ago) link
intial qn: fukkin magnets how do they work?observation: fukken magnetshypothesis: its a miracleperform experiment: fuck scientistsanalyze experiment: ur getting me pissedconclusion: juggalo 4 lyfe
― Lamp, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:26 (fourteen years ago) link
I would like Eminem to peer review this.
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 13 April 2010 18:28 (fourteen years ago) link