diamonds album is>>>
however i now think the murderbot album is one of those albums thats trying so hard to be FUN that it actually isnt as much fun as it wants to be
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 17:54 (twelve years ago) link
Enjoying the DJ Diamond album, sounds fairly straight down the line Juke, but very well done. Anyone else?
― Neil S, Tuesday, 16 August 2011 16:29 (twelve years ago) link
feel like there's some cool detroit techno sounding synths on "flight muzik" that lift it above the rest imo
machinedrum sort of a simultaneous update on both squarepusher and burial
― moonship journey to baja, Tuesday, 16 August 2011 16:50 (twelve years ago) link
sorry for the redundant "both"
― moonship journey to baja, Tuesday, 16 August 2011 16:51 (twelve years ago) link
love this set, esp the first three tracks and the steve reich sandwich: http://wfmu.org/playlists/shows/41502
― hardcore oatmeal (Jordan), Thursday, 25 August 2011 14:59 (twelve years ago) link
Who, outside of the Chicago DJs, is making footwork music ATM? I can only really think of Africa Hitech and Sully. Must be others? I'm not too up with this kind of stuff, but it interests me.
― Sonny Chevrotain (dog latin), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 13:07 (twelve years ago) link
some uk producers have done stuff influenced by it but im struggling with examples
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 13:12 (twelve years ago) link
I just realised this Sully album I've been caning for the last couple of weeks was actually produced by an old mate I used to hang with a few years ago. Quite rare for the North Herts area...
― Sonny Chevrotain (dog latin), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 13:23 (twelve years ago) link
machinedrum, this guy munchi, nguzunguzu, addison groove, etc
― hardcore oatmeal (Jordan), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 14:00 (twelve years ago) link
addison groove!!
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 14:18 (twelve years ago) link
I like the Sully album but I take it that's not what you're referring to wrt his footwork productions
right...?
― Amazing pic of the universe! - VERY NSFW (DJ Mencap), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 14:36 (twelve years ago) link
hm? There is quite a bit of footwork in the second half of the album. i can't believe it's the same guy i used to know - he used to play guitar in a true black metal band and now he's making this stuff...!
― Sonny Chevrotain (dog latin), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 14:39 (twelve years ago) link
i don't think dudes who are not from chicago can credibly be said to produce footwork tracks
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 14:49 (twelve years ago) link
yeh dude and no one outside of bronx can credibly make hip hop.
― historyyy (prettylikealaindelon), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 14:54 (twelve years ago) link
excellent analogy
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:09 (twelve years ago) link
fake juke (or "footwork-inspired") tracks can be good too.
― hardcore oatmeal (Jordan), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:10 (twelve years ago) link
oh absolutely, machinedrum's "room(s)" is like a daily listen for me right now and if i had to make a top 10 tracks of the last two years there would for sure be at least one if not two or three addison groove tracks (mind you, he has a total of eight tracks released)
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:14 (twelve years ago) link
but i think that to say that addison groove is "making chicago juke" or "making footwork tracks" is not true to either chicago juke or addison groove
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:15 (twelve years ago) link
i don't think it's that untrue https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2e31Cdk1ijk
― fauxmarc, Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:18 (twelve years ago) link
add chrissy murderbot to the encyclopedia of ersatz footwork
― hardcore oatmeal (Jordan), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:27 (twelve years ago) link
See, I understand the OG footwork stuff is pretty righteous and whatnot, but even aficionados will admit that much of the tacky/brutal aspects can get a bit wearisome after a while. I kind of like the more polished takes that are starting to creep into the work of external producers.
― Sonny Chevrotain (dog latin), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:42 (twelve years ago) link
― historyyy (prettylikealaindelon), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 14:54 (50 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:09 (34 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
think the point is more that if this production style starts to get proper global recognition outside of nerd circles (and I'm not saying it will), then if the consensus wants it to get called footwork then that's what it'll get called
― Amazing pic of the universe! - VERY NSFW (DJ Mencap), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:47 (twelve years ago) link
would've thought that was obvious. Saying it ain't footwork if it doesn't come from Chicago is like saying it ain't dubstep unless it's from South London or something.
― Sonny Chevrotain (dog latin), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 15:56 (twelve years ago) link
it seems like there are only a few options when outsiders get inspired by a regional scene like this:
1) they cop the style really hard and make music that passes as authentic/integrate themselves into the scene
2) they take some of the ideas and do a watered-down, shittier interpretation
3) they take some of the ideas and make something that is different but actually good in its own right
― hardcore oatmeal (Jordan), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 16:09 (twelve years ago) link
has anyone not from chicago done #1
― D-40, Wednesday, 31 August 2011 16:12 (twelve years ago) link
there are ppl from chicago doing # 2 certainly
― D-40, Wednesday, 31 August 2011 16:13 (twelve years ago) link
no, it's not
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 16:15 (twelve years ago) link
not that i know of, but it's certainly happened with other scenes (thinking of new orleans, certain jazz & latin music, etc)
― hardcore oatmeal (Jordan), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 16:16 (twelve years ago) link
yes and that may happen in the future too
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 16:29 (twelve years ago) link
with chicago juke / footwork too
it's a bit like arguing that diplo is making "baile funk". i mean, i guess you can argue that if you want, but there's not really any point in learning anything about favelas or brazil because that's not going to tell you anything about diplo, whereas it will tell you quite a bit about actual funk carioca
same with calling addison groove or machinedrum footwork
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, 31 August 2011 16:52 (twelve years ago) link
footcrab was totally overrated looking back on it now
dumb shit is a bit better
he did a good thing in bringing it to ppl's attention though
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Thursday, 1 September 2011 09:25 (twelve years ago) link
"Dumbshit" is alright, but "Footcrab" (and "Fuk Tha 101") are way more fun. Rly tho the best fake juke track by some distance is
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYFYAa8iOBg
― markers aurelius (The Reverend), Thursday, 1 September 2011 09:57 (twelve years ago) link
Hmmm.... I guess this hinges on whether you consider footwork to be exclusive to Chicago or not. I'd find it hard to parse if a UK producer were said to be making "Chicago Juke", absolutely, but without the geographical signifier footwork has a very specific sound and I don't see why someone from out of Chicago couldn't be said to make it. This is starting to get like a conversation about champagne and sparkling wine.
― Sonny Chevrotain (dog latin), Thursday, 1 September 2011 10:06 (twelve years ago) link
xpost - I agree 'work them' is a fantastic track.
re: champagne and sparkling wine - similar but perhaps there is nothing as tangible as a grape to work with in this discussion.
― historyyy (prettylikealaindelon), Thursday, 1 September 2011 13:27 (twelve years ago) link
I think there's enough of a sonic difference between Chicago Juke dudes and non Chicago Juke dudes to make a distinction that's not strictly geographical. Like, even something like footcrab would stand out from a list of DJ Rashad tracks, or whatever.
i think that to say that addison groove is "making chicago juke" or "making footwork tracks" is not true to either chicago juke or addison groove
― mr peabody (moonship journey to baja), Wednesday, August 31, 2011 10:15 AM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
OTM. Plus, Addison Groove = <3
― qpÓ™ (EDB), Thursday, 1 September 2011 13:55 (twelve years ago) link
I have to step in here with the Champagne / sparkling wine comparison (I do wine for a living)... Champagne is Champagne because of the particularities of soil, climate, luminosity, weather patterns, ambient yeasts, etc, etc; i.e., it's of a specific place, and by definition cannot be made (or replicated) anywhere else on earth. This is the crux of meaningful wine, its "somewhereness"; no amount of technical copying or procedural mimicry can give it a sense of place other than that of where it's grown, unless it's heavily manipulated in the cellar, in which case it doesn't have a sense of place at all but just a sense of heavy-handed authorship/sculpting...
This is obviously different from music and musicians' places of origin in ways I don't think I need to elaborate, but the way I understand it, footwork is (at this point) very much rooted (pun intended) in Chicago, so I don't see why it's wrong to be suspicious of the notion that it can be made elsewhere in lumped right on in with what's happening there. I think we would all agree that music nearly always has a sense of place (and time); it's hard to articulate, but we as sensitive listeners recognize it.
― Clarke B., Thursday, 1 September 2011 14:34 (twelve years ago) link
Also, I hate to be Mr. Hi-Fi Bore yet again, but how many ITT who aren't much impressed with, say, the Machinedrum record or the DJ Diamond record have only heard soundclips from the Planet Mu website, or YouTube videos, or other similarly fidelity-compromised outlets? I mean shit, this music gets so much of its energy and propulsion and vitality from BASS (I feel like Captain Obvious pointing that out)! It just sounds like skittery pitter-patter without that, and definitely not exciting... There are certain styles of music that I feel just cannot be properly evaluated on small systems.
― Clarke B., Thursday, 1 September 2011 14:42 (twelve years ago) link
yeah, juke is compared to grime a lot but juke sounds better on a big system, or makes better use of it at least - the bass is quite big and deep which might surprise some people and a lot of the tracks dont sound complete unless you hear the bass really. a lot of juke is actually based around the bass.
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Thursday, 1 September 2011 14:46 (twelve years ago) link
and it has a lot of naked sub bass, not doubled with mid-range synths or anything
― hardcore oatmeal (Jordan), Thursday, 1 September 2011 14:52 (twelve years ago) link
It's like complaining about a big, brothy, aromatic soup being bland when you're drinking it out of a straw in a closed container.
― Clarke B., Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:01 (twelve years ago) link
Lovin Chrissy Murderbot and Machinedrum so far - although I only bought these yesterday, so.
― It was a Thursday night. I was working late... (dog latin), Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:09 (twelve years ago) link
How does the DJ Diamond record compare with the DJ Roc album, DJ Spinn and the Bangs & Works comp (these are the only proper footwork releases I have along with Man I Do It by DJ Spinn FTR), is it markedly different or a departure from that kind of thing??
― It was a Thursday night. I was working late... (dog latin), Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:11 (twelve years ago) link
diamonds album is the best 'artist' (or producer) album so far
bangs and works is the best prob but thats a comp so...
but in order id say its
diamond, roc, then nate (who i like some of, but who also sometimes sounds like he has little idea of what hes doing exactly). not included the two rashad albums just cos while theyre good they dont really feel substantial enough and i think rashad has better tracks not included on those two.
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:22 (twelve years ago) link
if you like any/all of those I can't see you not liking it - he has most of the same tricks and weird production signifiers as Roc and Nate
I also have a CD of his from I think 2009 that DJ Slugo put out - afaict it's the only other DJ Diamond thing available to buy right now - it's like a 40-track mix, not as batshit rhythm-wise as the stuff on the artist album but still v densely edited/looped/whatever
― Amazing pic of the universe! - VERY NSFW (DJ Mencap), Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:22 (twelve years ago) link
rashad has some other albums too from 2009 or so which are cool but i think mu would do a better job of putting an album out from him
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:24 (twelve years ago) link
I guess I find most proper footwork stuff "interesting" rather than something I could sit and enjoy outside of a dancing context. A lot of it's done in Fruityloops I understand, and you can tell. What it reminds me of mostly were the earliest tracks my friend and I used to make in the mid 90s using tracker modules - uncanny really, down to the pitched and sampled vocals and frantic beats. It's kind of a tacky, underproduced sound, but I'm waiting for someone to come along and polish it up - no doubt to major complaints from OG fans - which I guess is what Machinedrum's done recently.
― It was a Thursday night. I was working late... (dog latin), Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:44 (twelve years ago) link
i wouldnt mind the polishing up, that would be good, but machine drum seems to do that within a totally diff context, one that seems to take out all the ruffness of juke and the hip hop attitude and energy etc. footwork right now seems to be in a kind of mid/late 80s rap phase. im waiting for its version of 90s hip hop come in, when it progresses a bit more and the producers get better. not sure if that will happen though as it doesnt seem like a genre thats really moving forward as such, it just is.
― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:57 (twelve years ago) link
It's kind of a tacky, underproduced sound,
this is a big part of the appeal to me. also a lot of the drums sound unquantized to me.
― hardcore oatmeal (Jordan), Thursday, 1 September 2011 15:59 (twelve years ago) link
I get the rap comparison, but I also hear a lot of parallels with gabba and nosebleed - a lot of ideas that have been abandoned since those days. Agreed - polish shouldn't be about smoothing things down - if someone were to progress the sound it'd need to retain, perhaps amp up, the adrenaline of the circle.
― It was a Thursday night. I was working late... (dog latin), Thursday, 1 September 2011 16:01 (twelve years ago) link