― amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 4 August 2003 05:50 (twenty years ago) link
big big big points. I wish the last two minutes of that lasted for an hour.
― jl (Jon L), Monday, 4 August 2003 05:56 (twenty years ago) link
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Monday, 4 August 2003 06:03 (twenty years ago) link
― amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 4 August 2003 06:09 (twenty years ago) link
― Fabrice (Fabfunk), Monday, 4 August 2003 06:46 (twenty years ago) link
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Monday, 4 August 2003 07:07 (twenty years ago) link
― Orbit (Orbit), Monday, 4 August 2003 22:58 (twenty years ago) link
― derrick (derrick), Tuesday, 5 August 2003 01:24 (twenty years ago) link
― derrick (derrick), Tuesday, 5 August 2003 02:58 (twenty years ago) link
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 10:56 (twenty years ago) link
why can i not find "hissing" in france?
― amateur!st (amateurist), Wednesday, 3 December 2003 23:35 (twenty years ago) link
'Hissing' is more colourful, and more adventurous, but for me it fails more. The songs have more red-bloodedness in them however, so it suits the cut n thrust of everyday life.
Who else could have done those albums one after the other?
― Pete S, Thursday, 4 December 2003 00:00 (twenty years ago) link
― Pete S, Thursday, 4 December 2003 01:13 (twenty years ago) link
― Pete S, Thursday, 4 December 2003 01:18 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderist (Fabfunk), Thursday, 4 December 2003 10:27 (twenty years ago) link
i looked in g-j on st michel but no dice. i'll find it eventually.
― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 4 December 2003 11:53 (twenty years ago) link
― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 4 December 2003 11:54 (twenty years ago) link
― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:00 (twenty years ago) link
― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:02 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderist (Fabfunk), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:07 (twenty years ago) link
― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:07 (twenty years ago) link
― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:08 (twenty years ago) link
If you dig the frosty angular accoustic strumming + the paco electric bass, I'd suggest you check out Pat Metheny's 1st lp 'Bright Size Life' (with Jaco on the bass)
― Baaderist (Fabfunk), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:10 (twenty years ago) link
― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:17 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderist (Fabfunk), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:21 (twenty years ago) link
― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 4 December 2003 16:24 (twenty years ago) link
― Keith Watson (kmw), Thursday, 4 December 2003 23:13 (twenty years ago) link
― Sean (Sean), Friday, 5 December 2003 01:20 (twenty years ago) link
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Friday, 5 December 2003 01:43 (twenty years ago) link
― Sean (Sean), Friday, 5 December 2003 01:55 (twenty years ago) link
She does that, though, she gets you used to being uncomfortable, to the point of gaining a taste for it. The first time I played myself her Mingus album, the group chorus on 'boogeyman' was so howlingly contrived I felt myself trying to draw a line, "no no no, this is objectively bad, I musn't follow her here..." A day later, sure enough, the verse melody had hooked itself in my head... listening to these records can be complicated.
― (Jon L), Friday, 5 December 2003 02:52 (twenty years ago) link
― eddie hurt (ddduncan), Friday, 5 December 2003 05:50 (twenty years ago) link
i am sick of a lot of "Don Juan's .." but that's because i used to be hooked on it and play it all the time. Sprawling and again somewhat formidable at first i suppose. I like what Tim said about it feeling a bit like that beaut. bass-heavy funky stuff that you might have expected given the collision of the open spectrum of "Hissing.." with the bass-led fluid funk of her live outings, about how you wanted it to be another advance/continuation, and so were left maybe a bit dissapointed that the tunes weren't as good. I can relate to Sean's fondness for it, but since it was the first mitchell album i got into, i moved on to those (for me) better tunes.
"court .." has that then-new slick sound and immediate social politics and feeling of being "in on it" that i suppose meant it was lapped up by the public, but "hissing .." shows she was prepared to then push things into those interesting sonic areas. I love its opening of "france kiss mainstreet"/ "jungle line", and even occasionally fantasize as to those songs being a pop-shot at the rolling stones. For me, "hissing .." is the one, even if it's promises have largely been left un-followed-up.
(so i never liked "Heijra" as it seemed too pop and easy and musically obvious, but maybe i should just enjoy the words. Anecdotal evidence from the vinyl second-hand stores of the '80s seems to indicate that it was bought and flicked, lots. "Hissing of Summer Lawns" was much more expensive to obtain. Did people hang onto that one or just not buy it ? and I love the funky "Hissing .." cover cf: the monochromatic "Heijra", yet both those album covers are accurate approximations of contents.)
― george gosset (gegoss), Friday, 5 December 2003 07:02 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderist (Fabfunk), Friday, 5 December 2003 08:28 (twenty years ago) link
i'd pick hissing (again)
"...and any eye for detail caught a little lace around the seams"
― gaz (gaz), Friday, 5 December 2003 08:36 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderist (Fabfunk), Monday, 15 December 2003 10:50 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderist (Fabfunk), Monday, 16 February 2004 16:13 (twenty years ago) link
1. Court and Spark.2. Hissing.3. Héjira.4. For the Roses.5. Don Juan. (Some crap on it, but an album's worth of good stuff also.)6. Blue.7. Mingus.8. Clouds.
I've heard some others but wasn't so struck on them.
― All Bunged Up. (Jake Proudlock), Monday, 16 February 2004 19:42 (twenty years ago) link
― Sean (Sean), Monday, 16 February 2004 20:02 (twenty years ago) link
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Tuesday, 17 February 2004 00:27 (twenty years ago) link
― justin (Justin M), Friday, 27 February 2004 09:26 (twenty years ago) link
I'm listening to it on headphones tonight, just for context.
― derrick (derrick), Thursday, 8 April 2004 06:58 (twenty years ago) link
The guitar tone at the opening of Refuge of The Roads is perfect.
― derrick (derrick), Thursday, 8 April 2004 07:13 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderoni (Fabfunk), Thursday, 8 April 2004 12:54 (twenty years ago) link
― mullygrubber (gaz), Thursday, 8 April 2004 13:26 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderoni (Fabfunk), Thursday, 8 April 2004 14:09 (twenty years ago) link
it paints such a vivid worldview, complete with ambivalence, which enables me to...not overlook, but perhaps appreciate the more self-serving parts in context.
what's most impressive is the evident respect joni has for her friend. surprisingly there's not a strong sense that joni is insisting that she took the right path... just her path. but there's just enough contempt in there to make it interesting.
― amateur!st (amateurist), Friday, 7 May 2004 19:52 (twenty years ago) link
― amateur!st (amateurist), Saturday, 8 May 2004 08:30 (twenty years ago) link
― Baaderoni (Fabfunk), Saturday, 8 May 2004 08:35 (twenty years ago) link
it's not too early here, it's 11:30 AM
― amateur!st (amateurist), Saturday, 8 May 2004 08:38 (twenty years ago) link
Interesting how no one has mentioned Shadows and Light -- the live record from this era that features Metheny, Jaco, Don Alias and Michael Brecker, I believe. Is it just that her live performances coudn't match the atmosphere of the originals?
― Naive Teen Idol, Thursday, 31 January 2013 4:20 AM (36 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
This, I think. There's very few stylistic variations on Shadows and Light that I think actually improve the originals.
In general I tend to think that Joni is a much better arranger than improviser, and her efforts to recreate the spontaneity of live jazz don't really win me over (one reason why I find HOSL much better than DJRD). The pristine perfectionism of HOSL and Hejira gets lost a bit on Shadows and Light, I find.
― Tim F, Thursday, 31 January 2013 05:05 (eleven years ago) link
shadows and light to me sounds more like a fusion record, the essence of joni watered down. hejira is an album with a very strong flow which shadow and light obviously isn't as there is a mix of songs from different albums on it. miles of aisles is her best live album i think but that was before hejira. i really like her banter and intros to the songs on that one.
― miesepeter (alex in mainhattan), Thursday, 31 January 2013 05:55 (eleven years ago) link
Hejira is def the way I'm getting into Joni as performer after long being a fan of her as songwriter
― buzza, Thursday, 31 January 2013 06:07 (eleven years ago) link
I spent a lot of this weekend listening to Shadows and Light in the car...and it's started to win me over. The bass n' brushes version of "The Dry Cleaner from Des Moines" in particular is less over-produced than the Mingus version and just as lithe.
In fairness, a big piece of my enjoyment of this is that I'm a Metheny fan -- and Shadows and Light is kind of a dream lineup in some ways (Joni, Metheny, Mays, Jaco, Don Alias, and Michael Brecker). When Metheny breaks out a typically billowy solo on "In France..." it just feels natural. There are moments on this record that just ebb back and forth between Joni's schtick (which admittedly isn't that different than her studio versions) and something off of Metheny's live Travels album.
If anything, it's a little disappointing there isn't more of Metheny on this (Brecker is the dominant soloist, which isn't altogether a bad thing). He only has a handful of solos (tho he has one cut all to himself) and Mays is mixed down really low. More of Metheny accompanying Joni on the Hejira material in particular (which itself sounded like a first- or second-cousin of his debut w Jaco, Bright-Sized Life) would have been interesting to hear. Part of me wonders if he was holding back a bit given that he wasn't the star Joni was in 1979 (tho in jazz and pop circles, he pretty much would be just two years later).
― Naive Teen Idol, Sunday, 3 February 2013 04:19 (eleven years ago) link
been obsessed (again) w/ "boho dance" lately. seems like the kind of song that would just be flattened by a politically-correct hot take (just like a lot of "hissing"), since the worldviews the song explores are not really there to be accepted or dismissed, since what the song best expresses is ambivalence--both that of the narrator and the (male?) hipster she's describing. the delicacy with which joni describes those worldviews is rather astonishing, isn't it? also the way the distinction between the worldviews is explored through subtly gendered metaphors ("The cleaner's press was in my jeans/And any eye for detail/Caught a little lace along the seams"). later the clothing metaphor is inverted to suggest the opposite ("A camera pans the cocktail hour/Behind a blind of potted palms/And finds a lady in a Paris dress/With runs in her nylons"). in other words, she doesn't belong completely in either milieu. this concludes with the "stricken from your uniform" and "not mine, these glamour gowns" phrases.
also, "another hard-time band/with negro affectations" is basically blueshammer, right?
― wizzz! (amateurist), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 01:32 (eight years ago) link
also if you ever want to be reminded what an extraordinary arranger joni was, listen to the demo of "boho dance" (on the "seeding of summer lawns" boot) and compare it to the finish product. it was always a great song, but the full arrangement contributes so much, adds greatly to the sense of wistful ambivalence.
― wizzz! (amateurist), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 01:35 (eight years ago) link
one last thought -- joni mitchell and paul simon seem to be the two late-60s singer-songwriters who quickly outgrew the folk template of their earlier work and sought out, above all, new textural and rhythmic influences. joni wasn't as determinedly eclectic as simon, but i think it's fair to say that her rhythmic sense is even more sophisticated.
― wizzz! (amateurist), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 01:36 (eight years ago) link
I've been carrying the studio version of this tune in my phone for a few weeks. I love this version:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6d2RG2Rl64
― The burrito of ennui (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 02:10 (eight years ago) link