There should be a thread for discussing the site formerly known as Rap Genius now called Genius.
Used to be a rap lyrics site somewhat similar to songmeanings.com but instead of commenting web 2.0 users could annotate the lyrics (with text, video, memes etc.).
These days I hear Sasha Frere-Jones is an editor and Michael Chabon "famously" annotated a Kendrick's "The Blacker the Berry" single. Site has expanded quite a bit in the last year, now features annotations on all musical genres, literature and apparently also study material. Nothing new about annotations, but this seems to be a very well functioning 2.0 concept.
Something that interests me about Genius is how it's related to rap lyrics as a genre. I've read plenty of annotated literary/philosophical works, so I realize annotations aren't reserved for rap lyrics. Still, I've been wondering if maybe there's something about rap lyrics that make annotating them especially rewarding - specifically I've been thinking that the way rap lyrics rely on "slang" and in-the-know references tend to make them allegorical, in the sense that they - unlike symbols - can be "translated" more or less 1:1. Reading annotations for "C.R.E.A.M." explained a lot of stuff to me, whereas reading the annotated "Like a Rolling Stone" is primarily fun.
Anyway, this isn't a perfect theory or anything, just thinking out loud, would like to hear your thoughts on the site's concept, popularity and relation to genres.
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 12:40 (eight years ago) link
ban niels
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 12:57 (eight years ago) link
o_O
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 13:01 (eight years ago) link
[Whiney is using internet shorthand to say he would like to see poster "niels" banned from ILX.]
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 13:37 (eight years ago) link
An even better annotation would explain what was so offensive about my post
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:00 (eight years ago) link
[ILX poster niels starts a new thread to posit a revisionist appreciation of a website that anyone with a working brain can plainly see is, at worst, a place for two white internet carpetbaggers to make untold millions exploiting, stealing and ridiculing African-American art; and, at best, a meeting ground for dickbeating racist white teenagers. He continues to post and refuses to "get on our level," rap slang for having the same understanding of something as others in a group.]
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:06 (eight years ago) link
Is that really the consensus?
― ... (Eazy), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:08 (eight years ago) link
...rap lyrics rely on "slang" and in-the-know references tend to make them allegorical, in the sense that they - unlike symbols - can be "translated" more or less 1:1.
niels i think it would be fun if you explained this further
― dylannn, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:15 (eight years ago) link
http://www.newyorker.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/150518_a19065-690-690-07205820.jpg
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:15 (eight years ago) link
I don't think my post is that appreciative, but I appreciate your input Whiney. Had a feeling it might be a controversial site, haven't experienced the racism you describe and even though I suspect the user demographics to be predominantly white males I don't have any numbers to support this. There are a lot of lyrics by white artists on the site as well obviously.
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:23 (eight years ago) link
well, obviously
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:25 (eight years ago) link
Hi dylannn in literary theory it is not uncommon to juxtapose allegory and symbol as tropes: symbolical texts have multiple layers and cannot necessarily be fully ''explained'' while the medieval allegories have more or less fixed interpretations that rely on the readers translation of standard tropes. This view favors symbols over tropes, and without being an expert on the subject I believe it's a romantic tradition that was criticised with some success by walter benjamin. The way the users on rap genius engage with rap lyrics indicate, to me, that they interpret them allegorically. Not sure why this is funny.
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:28 (eight years ago) link
*over allegories* that should read
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:29 (eight years ago) link
I can add that in a Danish context this is not an uncommon way of analysing Danish rap lyrics either, so not totally irrelevant in the reception of rap lyrics as genre. Will say that Dylan is maybe not a good juxtaposition since his lyrics were, I believe, actually scrutinised in an attempt to ''translate'' every symbol/character to something from ''real life''. Like, who is Mr Jones, what is Hard Rain?
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:34 (eight years ago) link
Recently had the weird experience of reading the lyrics to a song by an upcoming danish rapper who had annotated his own lyrics on genius.com - seemed to me he saw his own annotations as a pretty final analysis/interpretation.
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:37 (eight years ago) link
The way the users on rap genius engage with rap lyrics indicate, to me, that they interpret them allegorically. Not sure why this is funny.
She will give him fellatio until he ejaculates, which could take some time. This shows her willingness to please Biggie without giving herself any physical pleasure; she just simply loves sex.When he does ejaculate, she spits it out and then licks it back up, generally a practice of a “hoe.”This girl is also willing to do anal sex, which is many times seen as painful and unenjoyable for women.
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:39 (eight years ago) link
anyway, stormfront forum is thataway, niels
reporting your racist trolling to the mods
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:40 (eight years ago) link
Haha okay point taken
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:43 (eight years ago) link
don't appreciate your reporting me though, but fingers crossed mods will give me benefit of doubt
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:45 (eight years ago) link
White critic (often rap critic) in virulent small-differences assault upon supposedly-white rapcrit site shocker
― an absolute feast of hardcore fanboy LOLs surrounding (imago), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:50 (eight years ago) link
white internet carpetbaggers to make untold millions exploiting, stealing and ridiculing African-American art
You're talking about music journalism here, right?
― p:s nerds know (dog latin), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:51 (eight years ago) link
xpost $40 million dollars in venture capitol isn't a "small difference" there, 50 Dyson
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:52 (eight years ago) link
xp and, like, music
― example (crüt), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:52 (eight years ago) link
I mean, I don't know the site (blood sausage) and it's probably a load of tryhard shit but so is your posturing m8
― an absolute feast of hardcore fanboy LOLs surrounding (imago), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:52 (eight years ago) link
Wait, what?
― an absolute feast of hardcore fanboy LOLs surrounding (imago), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:53 (eight years ago) link
Btw the annotation quoted is pretty weird, but (and maybe this is because it's out of context) it's not crystal clear to me whether it mocks biggie, african american culture or the implicit reader, who is a stranger to every concept used by biggie because of his/her distance from the rapper's perspective. Like, isn't it a bit naive to not see this as ironically mocking over-explanation?
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:54 (eight years ago) link
90% of this site is pretty ironic then!
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:58 (eight years ago) link
two Yalies "ironically" diving into a pile of money like scrooge mcduck
― dadbod moghadam (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 14:59 (eight years ago) link
*a dad walks in and says 'did you know that 90% of statistics are made up on the spot?' then leaves*
― Karl Malone, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:00 (eight years ago) link
Whiney you're possibly on the side of right here but either bomb this thread to fuck or post a good exposé for us noobs
― an absolute feast of hardcore fanboy LOLs surrounding (imago), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:01 (eight years ago) link
Fine then, lock the damn thread. But say this site blows up and takes over the annotation/appropriation industry - wouldn't it be nice to have a thread where we can criticise and complain about it? or is a thread of it's own too great an honour?
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:03 (eight years ago) link
i will annotate this thread with the fact that there's already a thread on rap genius with 279 posts, but it's on 77
― Karl Malone, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:06 (eight years ago) link
I think that part of the problem is that one of the threads about this website is (inexplicably?) on 77 and the other is titled RapGenius (all one word, no idea). So there has been a lot of discussion on the topic already, just not in a thread that could be easily found for non-77 users who don't ram words together when they're searching for things.
― how's life, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:08 (eight years ago) link
ah ok sozzles whiney
― an absolute feast of hardcore fanboy LOLs surrounding (imago), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:09 (eight years ago) link
I'm just glad to have a go-to lyrics website that isn't full of malware.
― ... (Eazy), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:13 (eight years ago) link
^
― p:s nerds know (dog latin), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:15 (eight years ago) link
http://ohniels.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/ohniels1-300x238.png
― salthigh, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:19 (eight years ago) link
Well, I kindly request access to 77 so this won't happen again.
― niels, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:33 (eight years ago) link
(never been in on it either)
― ... (Eazy), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:37 (eight years ago) link
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Q0W41K7xYd4/TaJ8IEpE1zI/AAAAAAAABow/Joq0j-YfLSo/s1600/E900_01.jpg
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:56 (eight years ago) link
tbf those guys were very very serious
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 15:57 (eight years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV4o_gF-Gb4
dear god, no
― DJP, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 16:00 (eight years ago) link
Executive Producer Brett Ratner
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 16:01 (eight years ago) link
and nile rodgers?
― how's life, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 16:02 (eight years ago) link
http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1988/2/5/students-cut-new-rap-record-ph-a-r-v-a-r-d/
Brett Ratner, a sophomore at New York University, is the group's manager and executive producer. "I heard a demo of the group, I thought they were great and I thought the Harvard image was great," he said. "So I got $10,000, finished the record, and got a five-record deal with Sire."Sire Records, the label under which the single was released, is a part of Warner Brothers.
"I'm not at liberty to discuss the details of our contract," said a chuckling Shecter, "but we're going to make more money than most people would wish to make in seven thousand lifetimes."Shecter described the contract with Sire as unusual: "we're a new group and Sire is a big record company."
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 16:03 (eight years ago) link
I hope Haikunym is still lurking so he can give a boots-on-the-ground reaction to this
― DJP, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 16:03 (eight years ago) link
"I'm a Harvard undergrad, a scholarly scholar, and I'm using rap music to make me dollars," Shecter says in "Play That Funk." But off the record, he insists that he's not in rap for the money, but because he loves the music.
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 16:09 (eight years ago) link
Erick & Parrish Doin' It For the Love
― Is It Any Wonder I'm Not the (President Keyes), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 16:35 (eight years ago) link
wow this thread is good now
― ciderpress, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 16:55 (eight years ago) link
3 part series currently in progress, begins here:
https://people.stanford.edu/widner/content/problems-genius-part-one-online-annotations-consensus-and-bias
of course author is Stanford bro so presumably jealous, vulnerable to small-diff counter-critique; West Coast/East Coast beef could also be factor
― Swag Heathen (theStalePrince), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:22 (eight years ago) link
Woah, missed this on first read!
Shecter is also acting in the play Gang's New Threads, a rap musical to be staged in Leverett House February 18, 19, and 20.
found a description on another article (thank you, crimson archive)
http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1988/2/19/f-f-f-f-fashion-huh-pbithe-gangs-new-threadsib/
With a West Side Story plot set in Harvard Square, the two lovers now become the thoroughly hip couple of Jon (John M. Shecter) and Jane (Felicia D. Phillips). In this contemporary setting, the strict hierarchy of the fashion gangs prevents their union. Jon suffers the misfortune of coming from the wrong label family. His J. August sweats look provincial next to the latest Armani and Williwear fashions that the Cambridge gang members sport.
Jane's brother BMD (Ed Young, Jr.), who is a respected member of the gang, won't allow his sister to date a fashion outcast. So Jon, upon the suggestion of his Harvard friend, Darren (Darren A. Thierry) gains membership to the gang by coming up with a riduculous fashion. So wild is this fashion trend that the gang members initially shy away from it. But the trend catches fire when the Somerville gang picks up on the fad, and fashion is turned on its head--literally.
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:29 (eight years ago) link
by the time I got to school, student-written plays had devolved to their natural "flimsy excuse to get uninhibited undergrads to make out naked on stage" level
― DJP, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:39 (eight years ago) link
http://variety.com/1994/legit/reviews/the-gang-s-new-threads-1200439805/
Throw in an outer space character named Fashion Man (Zeno), Hitop's jealous girlfriend Roxanne (Latamra), some gang sidekicks, a backup ensemble and a guy faking a French accent (Scott Presley) and you've got the makings of a quirky, offbeat musical.
Unfortunately, the piece never captures the street origins of rap music or hip-hop. The characterizations are flat and stereotyped, and the tone is as much television as theater, with a slapdash story that is facile in its message.
― how's life, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:39 (eight years ago) link
i'm assuming Fashion Man was added some time in the interim
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:42 (eight years ago) link
ahhhh so apparently Fashion Man was a replacement for Harvard Friend
http://articles.latimes.com/1994-11-17/entertainment/ca-63869_1_music-threads-laughs
The plot is simple. How is John (rap artist Novacain) going to win Jane (singer Trina), the girl of his dreams, when she belongs to the town of Trendsville's "fashion gang," the Phlavors, and he's just a plain T-shirt and jeans kind of guy?
Enter Fashion Man (Zeno), an intergalactic alien in silver lame (Zelda Hacker and Tanya Reid did the colorful, imaginative costumes), who gives John an idea for a hot new trend in apparel--underwear as headgear.
John doesn't know that Fashion Man is teaching the Phlavors a lesson by giving John the stupidest idea he can. When the Trendsville teens make their new fashion statement at the upcoming "International Fashion Expo" in New York, they'll be exposed for the foolish fashion sheep that they are. Or will they?
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:44 (eight years ago) link
"GREAT concept guys, but I think if you wanna make this the musical that brings rap to broadway, you need to add a space alien"
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:46 (eight years ago) link
in fairness, "intergalactic alien in dirty pajamas" is a reasonable description of the average Harvard undergrad; they just punched up the wardrobe once they started shopping the play
― DJP, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:47 (eight years ago) link
Rapmaster Shecter, one of the few experienced members of the cast, is a member of the group BMOC. His single, "Guaranteed to Rock," produced by Nile Rogers, has already risen to No. 13 on the British pop chart. Shecter, who has nailed all the gesticulations and the rhyme schemes, has no problems with the rap numbers.
No. 13? Really?
― how's life, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:48 (eight years ago) link
Britain?
― how's life, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:49 (eight years ago) link
i remember nothing
― gong mad (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:49 (eight years ago) link
Shecter, who has nailed all the gesticulations
a pull-quote for the ages
― DJP, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:49 (eight years ago) link
and fashion is turned on its head--literally
― Mr. Murphy in the wine bar. (Sufjan Grafton), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:51 (eight years ago) link
i don't think there's any way this went to number 13 on the singles chart here. some kind of indie chart maybe
― gong mad (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:51 (eight years ago) link
Correction: An article concerning BMOC yesterday misstated the success of their single "Guaranteed To Rock." It reached no. 13 on the British poop chart, not the British pop chart.
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:55 (eight years ago) link
XD
― how's life, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 17:58 (eight years ago) link
IF BRETT RATNER had taken to the first gift he received from pop auteur and family friend Nile Rodgers, we would probably be talking about this 26-year-old Miami native as rhythm guitarist for a major league hip-hop outfit.But Ratner, who was 10 and tagged along with Rodgers when he produced such hits as Sister Sledge's "We Are Family," couldn't commit himself to the guitar Rodgers had given him because "I never thought I would be as good as him."The next time I saw Nile, he asked me where the guitar was and I made up some excuse like, I lost it' or something. So he bought me a movie camera and, like, immediately, I started making films. I'd skip school, come home early and make little movies, my own episodes of Miami Vice' with my friends. I was, like, hooked!" fields of New York University's Film School and more than 60 music videos toward tomorrow's nationwide opening of his first feature, "Money Talks."
But Ratner, who was 10 and tagged along with Rodgers when he produced such hits as Sister Sledge's "We Are Family," couldn't commit himself to the guitar Rodgers had given him because "I never thought I would be as good as him.
"The next time I saw Nile, he asked me where the guitar was and I made up some excuse like, I lost it' or something. So he bought me a movie camera and, like, immediately, I started making films. I'd skip school, come home early and make little movies, my own episodes of Miami Vice' with my friends. I was, like, hooked!" fields of New York University's Film School and more than 60 music videos toward tomorrow's nationwide opening of his first feature, "Money Talks."
― how's life, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 18:02 (eight years ago) link
Huh, last paragraph has a weird splice in it or something. But also just huh.
― how's life, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 18:04 (eight years ago) link
that's cool nile buys the children of family friends guitars and cameras and shit, though
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 18:07 (eight years ago) link
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/madonna-nile-rodgers-le-freak-250255
When Rodgers was still coming into his own as a performer, he looked to one of his Miami party pals, Marsha Ratner, as his “muse.” Writes Rodgers: “Marsha was the leader of a pack of fabulous people in that town’s wild party scene. She was also a single mom who reminded me of my own mother.” In a footnote, Rodgers notes that Brett Ratner “is like my brother, friend and son. Our identities are both formed in the color-blind world of art -- and he’s as comfortable with Mike Tyson and the Wu Tang Clan as I was with the B-52’s or Duran Duran."
― da croupier, Tuesday, 26 May 2015 18:13 (eight years ago) link
well this was an interesting conversation.
― like a giraffe of nah (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 2 June 2015 23:54 (eight years ago) link
maybe my biggest shame is having discovered ilxor through a rapgenius annotation on young money's bedrock (thanks gavin matthews)
― chilli, Wednesday, 3 June 2015 02:04 (eight years ago) link
annotate hen fap
― Allen (etaeoe), Wednesday, 3 June 2015 15:08 (eight years ago) link
http://www.vijithassar.com/2641/how-to-block-genius-annotations
― i believe that (s)he is sincere (forksclovetofu), Monday, 28 March 2016 17:38 (eight years ago) link