The Doors are a PROGRESSIVE BAND, one of the best ones and they are American

I don't mean to give the Doors any short shrift, by the way - just sticking up for the Music Machine. The Doors' accomplishments were sometimes super massive. I'm still a big time believer in the literary adventure of the pop musician, whatever my feelings might be about particulars in this Doors lyric or that. The spirit of the thing, literary seriousness - I am still a believer.

music machine were cool as hell
gloves!

1 It's funny that you brought up Spirit, because I think they are 1) great and 2) arguably, the first American prog band (or maybe the first American jazz-rock band....def an underrated giant step forward!)

2 Association had a keyboard player, but it's true that keyboard is not up high in the mix, and not present on all songs either.

3 I enjoyed Sean B's rant against folkies that was reproduced on the Rhino Best of the Music Machine....and also the teen tv show where they lip synch Talk Talk at a zoo

people who think jim was a hippie need to buy a clue.

easily top 10 american rock band.

2 Association had a keyboard player, but it's true that keyboard is not up high in the mix, and not present on all songs either.

Not in the 60s they didn't.

who thinks doors were hippie? they were way sleazy drunk death vibes

Manzarek sure talked a lot of hippie crap at times though

... but after Jimbo died, I don't know if that's significant or not.

no keyboards in the Association?.....well, very pleasant organ solo closing out "Never My Love." It's even on TV from 1968.

Also, the first notes on "Along Comes Mary" - that's an electric keyboard, right? On the Smothers Brothers appearance it's pretty clear that none of them standing there are playing those opening notes, then they get going.

There's a keyboard on the studio version of "Windy" too I think.

Hey, Spanky and Our Gang. Great hits, creepily calculated TV hippie appearance (see great song "Sunday Will Never Be the Same" as TV appearance for the awful truth). The other guys in the Doors would have looked like they were in one of those other hip/square bands. Kind of ironic that rock "star power" was in short supply in the (non-punk) Los Angeles bands in the 60s, they all look like they are uncomfortably inhabiting their clothes. Jim Morrison stands out as a huge exception of course.

I said no keyboard player, I didn't say no keyboards. It's almost as if bands didn't always play the instruments on their records or something crazy like that.

Dudes no one has ever gone as deep on the topic of whether or not the Association had a keyboard player

which association keyboard player you talking about, they had two iirc

The keyboards played themselves, tongues wagged - the explanation on the Smothers Brothers about being an "association" rather than a band had been taken as a joke - so later one guy had to sit there and pretend to play. The keyboards were the first to split when the hits dried up, emerging in Munich a few years later, and the rest is history.

50 FOOT HOSE, the SILVER APPLES, and SUICIDE were solid american progressive bands of the DOORS school

Just bought the two Yezda Urfa albums. There's also a new wave-ish followup called Crafty Hands.

I always hated The Doors and now I know why: I hate fucking prog.

lots of overlap between the two yezda urfa albums. i think 'boris' is a lot of demos for 'sacred baboon'?

NYCNative, you even hate CAPTAIN BEYOND?

The reason I like "Hyacinth House," for one example, is not because it's progressive. It would be interesting for me to hear people who like to think of the Doors as progressive to identify particular songs from the repertoire that fit that designation so we could see the extent to which they fit and maybe look particularly at why. I would say I kind of get it with The Soft Parade or side four of Absolutely Live, but not sure I get it elsewhere.

Even with The Soft Parade, I start wondering how many other psychedelic music albums I would also have to consider to be progressive.

Reggie, I'm not sure why the Silver Apples or 50 Ft. Hose are singled out as particular examples. Silver Apples' first album has nine tracks, eight of which are 4:11 or under. The second album does have four tracks that are 5:11 or longer, but the longest one is 6:26.

organ dominated non-pop jams, a la ray manzarek, the first keyboard wizard, is why they're singled out, in a continuum from the DOORS to SUICIDE

There is no organ in Silver Apples. I kind of get maybe looking at Simeon as a wizard in a "progressive" sense, though. Not sure I get it with Martin Rev.

50 Ft. Hose had someone making noise with electronics but "If Not This Time" sounds like the Peanut Butter Conspiracy, too.

the Doors were a death vibe, black leather and shit, Suicide is a clear descedent

tim u are looking for Doors facts u need to embrace Doors feelings

#ridethesnake
#strangedaysmono

You're right that it makes sense to say that Suicide has a vibe that maybe comes at least partly from a Doors lineage. But I don't associate that lineage with Yes or Genesis or King Crimson.

My bigger argument is that, musically, the Doors were as much a psychedelic band, a pop band, and a roots rock band (ca. last two albums) as they were a progressive band. Maybe in some cases more.

The chord progression heard on the keyboards at the beginning of "Light My Fire" with the cycle of fourths - I don't see that as progressive. It wasn't outside of any general psychedelic music practice. The keyboard solo in that song is modal over two repeating chords.

I don't see that as progressive

I mean I don't see it as "progressive" as in "progressive rock." It's reasonably innovative for 1967 for sure.

I always use "prog". Even as a big fan of the genre the whole idea of progress in music is far too subjective to attach as a genre definition.

Absolutely and I think that's exactly what we're discussing given that the first post in this thread uses the term "prog" specifically.

organ dominated non-pop jams

but most of their songs were total pop!

i.e. with the skeezed out ~dark~ undertone that upper miss describes

i.e.

I think that's exactly what we're discussing given that the first post in this thread uses the term "prog" specifically.

I thought we were discussing whether or not the Association had a keyboard player in the 60s.

simeon making his own synth rig / keybs and then naming it after himself is pretty damn proggy. not even mike ratledge, keith emerson, tony banks, or rick wakeman did that shit

xpost

Throbbing Gristle did though, con't get progger than them.

*can't

mm, con't works..

The virtuoso violin playing of MR

(cont.) The virtuoso violin playing of Mr. Genesis P-Orridge has long been admired.

http://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsde...12&IdCompany=8

woops make that

http://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16312&IdCompany=8

Watching the Doors movie right now

love that film

"hey is that Arthur Lee? he's cool"

It's maybe the best bad film of all time

I don't even like the Doors but as a big dumb movie about a rock band it is really entertaining in a way that 99% of biopics are not

I love the Doors, but yeah in Oliver Stone they got a director that believed his own bullshit as much as they believed theirs

I never noticed how well Kevin Dillon learned how to play drums, he really sells it

it's the little throwaway details that make it for me - Billy Idol rhapsodizing about "the leather, the beard, the odor of the tribe", the Ed Sullivan show censor's suggestion of "girl, we can't get much better", "let's get some tacos!", Paul Williams and Crispin Glover at the Factory, Kyle MacLachlan's wig... also maybe the only movie in which I enjoy the presence of Meg Ryan

plus the editing and film stock tricks and visual trickery are just reaaallly evocative of psychedelia, Stone employing his tricks well

TRICKS I say!

kilmer's morrison is pretty great