I can think of some potential good results of this (some people need to be truncated, two 750-word pieces will earn me a lot more than one 1,500 word piece, maybe fewer writers will mean fewer bad writers, maybe the trimming of the Voice will finally get people to realize that if they want good criticism, they will have to start a magazine that prints actual criticism), and I'm willing to keep going to see what will happen, but I assume that the bad will far outweigh the good. With Frank Kogan, more is more, and truncating me is never a good idea. Also, this may ruin some of my pieces that work short, as well, since, being so tightly formatted, a 200-word piece might have to be lengthened to 300, or 600 to 750.
The Voice format was appallingly narrow already (can think of good writers who fell flat on the Voice's page, or whom I couldn't even imagine writing for them), and their truncating of me wasn't so much a matter of space as of whole aspects of my personality rarely getting in there (and this is not Chuck's fault, obviously, and I got more in there than most could). And maybe the magazine is old and tired (reading online, I don't browse it much). But this is one of those "solutions" that doesn't solve anything, like term limits and mandatory sentencing. If the problem is that the content bores the readers, then changing the format doesn't address the problem. But actually the people who mandated this (who are "they," as Tim McGraw might ask) want to get new readers at the expense of the old or want to retain some readers at the expense of others; really, what they want the articles reduced to little consumer niblets for the reader to glance while going to the listings and personals and classifieds. And the official rationale that I've heard is that they think young people raised on MTV and video games want the text equivalent of soundbites, and won't turn the page or read long. This is bullshit; reminds me of all the morons who claimed in the '60s that young people wanted instant gratification. What the Voice ownership wants is stupider readers with bigger pockets. But really, you know, they've lost circulation to Time Out, and this isn't going to get it back, I don't think.
But this is really bad. Think of what it means. For all its faults, and its decline, the Voice was one of the few national publications to encourage thought and to assume that to gain your interest meant challenging and ruffling you. Not that we still can't try, but you can see which direction things are going.
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:10 (twenty years ago) link
― scaredy cat, Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:15 (twenty years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:18 (twenty years ago) link
This move actually seems kind of smart. I think the publishers may have realized how many people just remove the listings section and toss the rest.
― o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:20 (twenty years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:22 (twenty years ago) link
― chuck, Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:25 (twenty years ago) link
― David Allen, Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:27 (twenty years ago) link
― scott seward, Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:28 (twenty years ago) link
― chuck, Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:30 (twenty years ago) link
The New York Review Of Books? Harper's? The Atlantic? The Believer? or you mean music. um, nobody?
― scott seward, Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:33 (twenty years ago) link
― o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:34 (twenty years ago) link
But speaking of surfboards, if we were all required to write everything in limerick form, I might develop new and hitherto unknown talents, but overall you wouldn't be getting the best out of me.
There once was an album named CaesarsThat nary had mention of skeezersWhat should I say next?I can't even flextYou see! this sucks! jeepers! or jeezers.
So, it has to be the right form.
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:49 (twenty years ago) link
So? I think The Village Voice looks fat in those jeans.
― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:51 (twenty years ago) link
― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:52 (twenty years ago) link
* and yeah, sotc, but that's more 'live reviews + news'.
― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:54 (twenty years ago) link
― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 20:55 (twenty years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 21:01 (twenty years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 21:23 (twenty years ago) link
― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 21:30 (twenty years ago) link
― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 21:31 (twenty years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 6 August 2003 21:45 (twenty years ago) link
― Paul (scifisoul), Thursday, 7 August 2003 00:29 (twenty years ago) link
― Chris P, Thursday, 7 August 2003 02:13 (twenty years ago) link
i bitched about this elsewhere, but i can't honestly, in 2003, in america's current uh cultural climate, think that word counts dropping anywhere, anymore, are a good thing.
also, it was a really nice feeling the two times i basically had the frontpage of the voice section to myself. < /selfish>
― jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:21 (twenty years ago) link
― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:22 (twenty years ago) link
― jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:23 (twenty years ago) link
― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:27 (twenty years ago) link
kogan's contortions review: priceless.
and so on.
― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:29 (twenty years ago) link
― s1utsky (slutsky), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:30 (twenty years ago) link
― s1utsky (slutsky), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:31 (twenty years ago) link
― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:32 (twenty years ago) link
― s1utsky (slutsky), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:34 (twenty years ago) link
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:41 (twenty years ago) link
― Phantroll, Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:45 (twenty years ago) link
(i wrote an equally long screed elsewhere, but it never showed up)
― Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:46 (twenty years ago) link
― Phantroll, Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:47 (twenty years ago) link
― s1utsky (slutsky), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:50 (twenty years ago) link
― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 7 August 2003 03:53 (twenty years ago) link
― kelly denison-cole (dustjacket), Thursday, 7 August 2003 04:33 (twenty years ago) link
― kelly denison-cole (dustjacket), Thursday, 7 August 2003 04:34 (twenty years ago) link
― kelly denison-cole (dustjacket), Thursday, 7 August 2003 04:35 (twenty years ago) link
― kelly denison-cole (dustjacket), Thursday, 7 August 2003 04:38 (twenty years ago) link
On another note, I'm sad to see that paycuts for the Giddins and the Xgaus is even on the table. Shows, to me anyway, how impossible this goddamn Dubya economy is right now ... art, talent and the advancement of culture don't mean shit when only a few people get all the perks and there's no incentive for the powers-that-be to give a shit about the contributions of their workers. Keep fighting the good fight, VV folks. Hi Chuck and Chris P.!
― Chris O'Connor, Thursday, 7 August 2003 06:45 (twenty years ago) link
Frank, People have to buy Time Out NY right, while the Voice is free and available online? Will these changes bring in more Time Out NY readers or advertisers???
― Steve Kiviat (Steve K), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:36 (twenty years ago) link
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:41 (twenty years ago) link
― Bob Shaw (Bob Shaw), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:45 (twenty years ago) link
To bring Simon Reynolds into this(Oh No! not again!) I see he's been raving on his blog about all the blogs he reads, and how he doesn't have time to read music features in newspapers and magazines (even if he could find music magazines he'd like)...
― Steve Kiviat (Steve K), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:40 (twenty years ago) link
― Jamie Smith, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:55 (twenty years ago) link
― David. (Cozen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:19 (twenty years ago) link
― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:33 (twenty years ago) link
― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 August 2004 15:53 (nineteen years ago) link
― cinniblount (James Blount), Thursday, 12 August 2004 15:54 (nineteen years ago) link
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 12 August 2004 15:56 (nineteen years ago) link
― fact checking cuz (fcc), Thursday, 12 August 2004 16:01 (nineteen years ago) link
All the other stuff hapeening at the Voice is also sad, even tho it has very little connection with my life now - I still feel attached to the paper - sadly, no longer the place I fell in love with.
― H (Heruy), Friday, 13 August 2004 00:41 (nineteen years ago) link
― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Friday, 13 August 2004 00:49 (nineteen years ago) link
― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Friday, 13 August 2004 00:55 (nineteen years ago) link
― gershy, Sunday, 11 March 2007 20:08 (seventeen years ago) link
― Mark Rich@rdson, Sunday, 11 March 2007 20:15 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jiminy Krokus, Sunday, 11 March 2007 21:22 (seventeen years ago) link
― m coleman, Sunday, 11 March 2007 21:23 (seventeen years ago) link
― m coleman, Sunday, 11 March 2007 21:26 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jiminy Krokus, Sunday, 11 March 2007 21:30 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jiminy Krokus, Sunday, 11 March 2007 21:32 (seventeen years ago) link
― xhuxk, Sunday, 11 March 2007 22:49 (seventeen years ago) link
― m coleman, Sunday, 11 March 2007 22:56 (seventeen years ago) link
― Beatrix Kiddo, Monday, 12 March 2007 21:58 (seventeen years ago) link
Much much much smaller tabloid format on the way.
― forksclovetofu, Wednesday, 23 April 2008 20:36 (sixteen years ago) link
"kevin" still seems like a total douchebag!
― omar little, Wednesday, 23 April 2008 20:42 (sixteen years ago) link
just wading thru rss from over new years -- hentoff is out? wow
― goole, Friday, 2 January 2009 22:20 (fifteen years ago) link
!!
― HOOSytime steenman (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Friday, 2 January 2009 22:46 (fifteen years ago) link
Wow. Trica Romano wrote the following:
http://www.popandpolitics.com/2008/12/30/village-voice-fires-three-in-editorial-including-nat-hentoff/
This just in: Adding to the media meltdown, my former alma mater, the Village Voice, just laid off three more in editorial. [Full disclosure, I was laid off myself for "matters of taste" in 2007]. Among those laid off is Nat Hentoff, who’s been at the paper since 1958, writing about jazz, and later, civil liberties in his weekly long-running column. Fashion writer Lynn Yaeger, who has worked with the paper over 15 30 years, starting in classifieds, before moving into editorial, was laid off, along with staff writer Chloe Hilliard, who was hired under the current editor, Tony Ortega in 2007. We know, we keep saying this, but we continue to be amazed that there is anyone left to lay off.
― curmudgeon, Saturday, 3 January 2009 04:01 (fifteen years ago) link
Tricia
― curmudgeon, Saturday, 3 January 2009 04:02 (fifteen years ago) link
Hentoff? Jesus shit.
― If Timi Yuro would be still alive, most other singers could shut up, Saturday, 3 January 2009 05:21 (fifteen years ago) link
With Frank Kogan, more is more, and truncating me is never a good idea.Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 6 August 2003
― the pinefox, Saturday, 3 January 2009 21:41 (fifteen years ago) link
so this is basically a porn site now?
― goole, Saturday, 27 February 2010 16:43 (fourteen years ago) link
i pretty much fritter away 10 minutes of every day clicking on a NSFW photo gallery on the Voice site, i'm not gonna lie
― zsockster (Whiney G. Weingarten), Saturday, 27 February 2010 16:48 (fourteen years ago) link
i have no idea where these parties happen or who gets invited to them
not a huge fan of the new page layout
― ksh, Saturday, 27 February 2010 16:49 (fourteen years ago) link
i havent been by the site in a while but it looks like theyve got like 2-3 good writers left and a whole lot of fifty-photo slideshows of parties where chicks flash the camera?
― max, Saturday, 27 February 2010 17:41 (fourteen years ago) link
so i guess its kind of like vice magazine now?
http://www.80stees.com/images/products/Anchorman_Camp_Kid_Sports-T-link.jpg
― epic board man (history mayne), Saturday, 27 February 2010 17:43 (fourteen years ago) link
hey, village voice, you're right.. i am stupid !
― tramp steamer, Sunday, 28 February 2010 04:20 (fourteen years ago) link
The Village Voice thinks you like tits, is probably right
― dora the explaro (some dude), Sunday, 28 February 2010 06:44 (fourteen years ago) link
So, I guess this is official now. (Fwiw, I've secretly known about Rob leaving for a couple weeks, but didn't know Maura was coming in until three minutes ago.)
http://blogs.villagevoice.com/music/2011/03/please_welcome_10.php
― xhuxk, Monday, 14 March 2011 20:02 (thirteen years ago) link
you got scooped on another voice thread 47 minutes ago chuck!
― scott seward, Monday, 14 March 2011 20:09 (thirteen years ago) link
okay not scooped.
anyhoo, congrats maura!
if congrats are in order. they are, right? probably!
― scott seward, Monday, 14 March 2011 20:10 (thirteen years ago) link
ok this article being published on a VV site, given what they've done to freelancers is pretty. fucking. rich.
http://www.citypages.com/music/can-professional-concert-photography-survive-7446275
― kurt kobaïan (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, 2 July 2015 14:11 (eight years ago) link
(or whatever they call the VV/new times whatever clusterfuck now)
Yep. As for one little aspect of the article, the below is kinda the same issue in my town. Punk and indie rock shows get documented on local media, but go-go, r'n'b, jazz, and myriad international styles exist only in instagram land among friends.
There are so many shows going on in this town where nobody is shooting.
― curmudgeon, Thursday, 2 July 2015 16:03 (eight years ago) link
city pages got sold in mayhttp://www.startribune.com/star-tribune-buys-city-pages/302763201/
― maura, Thursday, 2 July 2015 17:28 (eight years ago) link
Oh yeah well I hope they've stopped stealing local band photos of ppl flickr accounts and running then w/o paying or giving credit
― kurt kobaïan (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, 2 July 2015 17:40 (eight years ago) link
Hilary Hughes who was their 2015 music editor is no longer listed on the masthead. Now they just list a "culture editor"
― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 5 April 2016 13:16 (eight years ago) link
i remember her announcing on twitter that she was leaving VV maybe...a month ago? i didn't see anything about looking for or announcing a new music ed, wouldn't be surprised if that position was being eliminated.
― "Robots are sexy as shit" - Big Sean (some dude), Tuesday, 5 April 2016 14:04 (eight years ago) link
ah, fucki liked Hilary.
― ulysses, Tuesday, 5 April 2016 17:49 (eight years ago) link
x-post - yep now I see it. She tweeted Feb. 17th that it was her last day at the Voice.
― curmudgeon, Wednesday, 6 April 2016 16:18 (eight years ago) link
http://www.capitalnewyork.com/article/media/2016/05/8599589/village-voice-hires-new-publisher-ahead-extensive-relaunch
― ulysses, Friday, 20 May 2016 17:15 (seven years ago) link
well, fuck.https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/22/nyregion/village-voice-to-end-print-publication.html
― Chocolate-covered gummy bears? Not ruling those lil' guys out. (ulysses), Tuesday, 22 August 2017 19:41 (six years ago) link