Why is classic rock radio the way it is?

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oh, I forgot to mention where I am -- Chicago.

ok, next song comes on and it's .. "Horse With No Name" by America. Ugh.

Ok I'm putting my Beach Boys cd back on now. But that was fun for two songs at least; the ELO sounded great!

Broheems (diamond), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:22 (twenty years ago) link

Also, passive listeners are way easier to please than music geeks (re. all those threads where ILM tries and invariably fails to agree on a good/bad song/album/artist) and they outnumber us 50-to-1. So, hell, who do you think radio, classic rock or otherwise, is going to try to attract??

Patrick (Patrick), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:28 (twenty years ago) link

the only 2 roxy music songs i ever heard on classic rock radio stations were "love is the drug" and "jealous guy" (the latter more b/c it was a lennon cover). the local "alternative" station also played "more than this" and (very) occasionally "virginia plain," as well as the other two that classic rock stations would play.

Eisbär (llamasfur), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:32 (twenty years ago) link

i have never heard a roxy music song on the radio. my first exposure to them came from "love is a drug"'s appearance in the epic film "Super Mario Brothers." nothing quite brings back my crush on samantha mathis like that song.

Felcher (Felcher), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:34 (twenty years ago) link

I'm in St. Paul and the local classic rock station is on some sort of "OUR RADIO LIBRARY BONER IS COLLOSSAL IN GIRTHITUDE" wankfest by playing all their songs A-Z in succession by title.

You'd think this would skew things, but the first thing they played after I turned it on was the Stones' "Satisfaction".

nate detritus (natedetritus), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:36 (twenty years ago) link

anyway, it isn't as if classic rock stations are the only ones with severely constipated play lists. just check out yer local rap/r&b station, yer local "alternative" station, even yer local classical station (fat chance hearing much after schoenberg went polytonal on that).

Eisbär (llamasfur), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:36 (twenty years ago) link

At least Top 40 rap/R&B/pop stations and on a lesser note "alternative" stations introduce new things as a necessity.

nate detritus (natedetritus), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:38 (twenty years ago) link

but that's what the "best new rock" is fer classic rock stations -- even if it's just the latest from some old farty buttrock act!

Eisbär (llamasfur), Friday, 5 December 2003 21:39 (twenty years ago) link

Haha, Nate, that just means that they'll play THOSE FUCKING 60 SONGS in ABC order!

but that's what the "best new rock" is fer classic rock stations -- even if it's just the latest from some old farty buttrock act!

Like the New Allman Bros. tune? Or that John Hiatt "Almost Fed Up With the Blues" dungheap which might be the worst thing ever to enter my ear canal.

Clarke B., Friday, 5 December 2003 21:44 (twenty years ago) link

My station (in phoenix) is playing something I'm not familiar with, that sounds like the Grateful Dead and the lyrics are about "sunshine daydream" or something.

Now it's Steely Dan's "Rikki don't lose that number" hahah

I used to listen to it in the car when I didn't have a tape player, and every day they would play these songs: "Layla", "Land of Confusion" and one of those godawful sappy Billy Joel songs that I have attempted to block from my memory. And the same Fleetwood Mac songs over and over, but I didn't mind that part.

Blood and sparkles (bloodandsparkles), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:04 (twenty years ago) link

Everyone tunes in and it's..."Don't Stop Believin'"! Everywhere!
-- Ned Raggett (ne...) (webmail), December 5th, 2003 1:13 PM. (Ned) (later) (link)

That sounds like the end of some sci fi movie where humanity has been delivered into Utopia.

amateur!st (amateurist), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:15 (twenty years ago) link

Broheems, were you listening to 97.1 the Drive? That station has a great playlist, plays lots of deep cuts and singles-only artists, and also airs "The Rock n' Roll Roots Radio Show" on Sunday mornings, which is great. Much better than any NYC classic rock station.

hstencil, Friday, 5 December 2003 22:22 (twenty years ago) link

the drive is nice and unlike the other classic rock stations their inclusion of black artists doesn't reek of tokenism. they presume an audience that loves pink floyd and marvin gaye in more or less equal amounts.

still there's something dusky and smelly about the whole "classic rock" concept, i'll never cotton to it.

amateur!st (amateurist), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:24 (twenty years ago) link

the only truly weird thing about the Drive is that it's run by Mormons.

hstencil, Friday, 5 December 2003 22:33 (twenty years ago) link

haha that makes total sense though!

the weird beatific tones of the announcers and all...

amateur!st (amateurist), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:41 (twenty years ago) link

and those strangely relaxing station promos, with the sounds of waves crashing on the beach and the first bar of joni mitchell's "you turn me on, i'm a radio"...

amateur!st (amateurist), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:42 (twenty years ago) link

I think the Loop is owned by the Mormons, too. The Angel Moroni's got a classic rock monopoly in the Windy City.

hstencil, Friday, 5 December 2003 22:42 (twenty years ago) link

haha it's revenge for illinois having kicked joseph smith and company out in the 19th century!!

amateur!st (amateurist), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:43 (twenty years ago) link

REMEMBER NAUVOO! and here's another block of Skynyrd!

hstencil, Friday, 5 December 2003 22:45 (twenty years ago) link

i'm sure they're inserting latterday saints propaganda as subliminal messages in between "smoke on the water" and "my old school"

amateur!st (amateurist), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:46 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah, it was the Drive I was listening to. And actually Amateurist reminds me, I have actually heard them play the whole of Joni Mitchell's "You Turn Me On, I'm A Radio", not just the intro. This was late at night one night, like 2 am. But I've never heard her on another classic rock station.

Oh, and also they've been reviving those King Biscuit Flower Hour live things too, on Saturday nights! That's where I heard that Thin Lizzy set I mentioned to you, stence. A few weeks back it was a late 70s Kinks set. So, not too bad.

Broheems (diamond), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:49 (twenty years ago) link

Found station this morning while near asleep by accident. The songlist was like, Peter Case, Ray Charles, Jim Croce covering "Mama Tried", X from MFITNW, Leonard Cohen's First We Take Manhattan, kd lang, some memphis soul I dint recognize, Willie Nelson then Junior Brown.

"Americana" radio hits Denver.

Hunter (Hunter), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:49 (twenty years ago) link

yeah every time i hear that joni song i sort of lean forward excitedly expecting to hear the whole thing and then the sound of crashing waves comes in and i'm very disappointed.

the syndicated shows on these stations are the fucking pits, all those unctious announcers interrupting the songs to spout banalities about how awesome are some terribly overexposed rock band.

amateur!st (amateurist), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:51 (twenty years ago) link

Classic rock channel check reveals "Gimme Shelter", which is canonical.

Hunter (Hunter), Friday, 5 December 2003 22:58 (twenty years ago) link

The classic rock station here in the DC area might be unique. I've heard early grunge and hair metal (!) songs recently while flipping through, so I think on that station any rock older than ten years or so is fair game. I actually assumed all classic rock stations were like that before reading this thread.

Vinnie (vprabhu), Saturday, 6 December 2003 00:40 (twenty years ago) link

It's been proven in market studies that people would rather listen to music that they already know than to hear something new.

this is pretty much it, especially if your local classic rock is Clear Channel. God. Damn. Them.

Luckily, the classic rock station in my town (which is Clear Channel) has started doing these "deep cuts" week-ends. It's still 66% shit, but it's cool hearing stuff like Aerosmith's "Mama Kin" evey once in a while.

Will (will), Saturday, 6 December 2003 01:23 (twenty years ago) link

That's considered a deep cut?

It occurs to me that Clear Channel has this all mapped out for themselves. "Alternative rock" stations for the kiddies, "classic rock" stations for the adults. So then they can easily force-market one type of horseshit to one demographic, then slowly over time let them bleed into the other market, which markets the same exact horseshit to them again, only this time they won't even have to bother pretending it's edgy or rebellious. Beeee-autiful.

Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 6 December 2003 06:06 (twenty years ago) link

See, if I may make a stretch of interpretation, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I think this is why Alex and Clarke B. are so angry at classic rock radio, because they see it as doing that to people now. But I think that may be a bit too much to assume. Granted, classic rock radio is mostly corporate crap in its current form, and Bachman Turner Overdrive was never considered cool music by anyone anywhere, and it's just plain baffling what's "classic" about it now. But at least the format is based in something that once was cool, and may still be by some standards. Any radio station that still plays Hendrix isn't completely top-to-bottom evil. I mean, at least it's playing something that once meant something to somebody, and there are certainly still listeners out there who are old enough to appreciate that music for what it once was. It's calculating on the part of the stations, sure, but it's not all bad.

Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 6 December 2003 06:29 (twenty years ago) link

how many times you reckon you've heard "stairway to heaven," "baba o'reilly," and "hey jude" then? and precisely when did you get sick of any or all of them?

Eisbär (llamasfur), Saturday, 6 December 2003 06:32 (twenty years ago) link

I'm not saying the current situation on the radio dial is all roses. Don't get me wrong.

Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 6 December 2003 06:41 (twenty years ago) link

I don't live in the US, but my impression of US "classic rock" stations is they tend to play a lot of 70s/80s AoR rather than the typical "canon". Which makes me ask when did Boston, Foreigner, Journey or Toto become "classic"?

Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Saturday, 6 December 2003 07:05 (twenty years ago) link

Yes, and then there's that.

Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 6 December 2003 07:44 (twenty years ago) link

Back in high school CR was all i listened to, of course everything on it was new to me, but it soon wore off after about a good year & i had to move on. The biggest problem perhaps is that it's called "classic" if it were just called Semi-contemporary oldies radio or something, that would probably be a lot easier for everyone to swallow. Classic should be a lot more expansive than a roster of 40 or so artists...

And what kills me most is they don't even jibe with the other ol' fogey standard bearer of taste Rolling Stone. For every best of list i've ever seen in that ragazine, there's stuff in the top 20's i've never heard played. That should really be a programmers mainstay shouldn't it?? Even the stuff they do play from those albums, it'll always be the same damn 2-3 songs at best.

While i'm thinking about it, why does the playlist all of a sudden free up overnights and weekends a helluva lot more...like after midnight they could give a F*** about upsetting the boat.

Phil Dokes (sunny), Saturday, 6 December 2003 11:28 (twenty years ago) link

when was boston not classic???

amateur!st (amateurist), Saturday, 6 December 2003 18:02 (twenty years ago) link

From 1977 onwards...

Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Saturday, 6 December 2003 18:05 (twenty years ago) link

haha that's fucking hilarious hongro.

amateur!st (amateurist), Saturday, 6 December 2003 18:07 (twenty years ago) link

That's considered a deep cut?

appparently to Clear Channel- controlled station it is. Someone mentioned upthread that there's about 60 songs in rotation on these "Classic" rock stations. Seems like there's less than that. I'm not saying they have to dig out some long-forgotten B-side; It is *commercial* radio after all. They don't want the masses turning the station because a tune's a bit obscure. But how about a little "Gimme Back My Bullets" interspersed between the "Free Bird/ Sweet Home Alabama/ Two Steps" three-fers???

Will (will), Saturday, 6 December 2003 22:10 (twenty years ago) link

Maybe that's all the classic rock there is.

Aja (aja), Saturday, 6 December 2003 22:12 (twenty years ago) link

that's why you don't hear no steeeeenking foo fighters on classic rock stations!

Eisbär (llamasfur), Saturday, 6 December 2003 22:20 (twenty years ago) link

I don't like classic rock, so I don't listen to those stations, so it's not a problem at all. Why must you mention the Foo Fighters anyway. They have nothing to do with this. I didn't even mention them.

Aja (aja), Saturday, 6 December 2003 22:23 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah, Tad, honor the Foo-re!

nate detritus (natedetritus), Saturday, 6 December 2003 22:38 (twenty years ago) link

actually, it's UNLEASH THE FUCKING FOO-REE!

Eisbär (llamasfur), Saturday, 6 December 2003 22:42 (twenty years ago) link

What's Foo- ree?

Aja (aja), Saturday, 6 December 2003 22:44 (twenty years ago) link

The classic rock station here (Atlanta) is playing "Paint It Black." I think this is one of the earliest songs on its playlist.

Curt1s St3ph3ns, Saturday, 6 December 2003 22:49 (twenty years ago) link

the classic rock songs played by classic rock radio are not on the playlist strictly because they were once hits...that certainly helps, but the one determining factor for making the playlist is how the songs do on the auditorium test. Here's a good article on how auditorium research works: (scroll all the way to the bottom)

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/showcase/chi-020414radio-station-list,0,4376289.story?coll=chi-news-hed

Here's another reasonably accurate article:
http://www.bankrate.com/brm/news/investing/20001005d.asp?prodtype=grn

teeny (teeny), Saturday, 6 December 2003 23:34 (twenty years ago) link

"But at least the format is based in something that once was cool, and may still be by some standards. Any radio station that still plays Hendrix isn't completely top-to-bottom evil. I mean, at least it's playing something that once meant something to somebody, and there are certainly still listeners out there who are old enough to appreciate that music for what it once was." -Kenan

I disagree Kenan. Free-form Fm radio is/was cool but classic rock has always been just an evil marketing formula. You're never gonna hear Little Richard, Buddy Holly, New York Dolls, Velvet Underground,Stooges, anything from Nuggets, just the stuff that business types decided would be appreciated by boomers. I think it's sad that the artists I've mentioned are not considered "classic" by
way too many Americans. Sure lots of the artists on classic rock radio are worthy, but the format has created a narrow canon that should be wider. Yea, I know it's commercial radio but still. Here in the DC area I don't have a college radio station I can pick up in my car, so if I want to hear old rock I end up listening to "oldies" radio instead.

Steve Kiviat (Steve K), Sunday, 7 December 2003 06:11 (twenty years ago) link

"The classic rock station here in the DC area might be unique. I've heard early grunge and hair metal (!) songs recently while flipping through, so I think on that station any rock older than ten years or so is fair game."-Vinnie

Any rock older than ten years on that station is not fair game, just safe major label album rock. I was a college radio dj in the early '80s, when do I get my music nostalgia--I wanna hear the Replacements and Minutemen and Husker Du. I guess I have to settle for Mtv pop-punkers and the Strokes utilizing early 80s non-"classic" sounds.

Steve Kiviat (Steve K), Sunday, 7 December 2003 06:26 (twenty years ago) link

Someone needs to seriously start spiking the punch at those auditorium testings. They sound nightmarish.

Call me old-fashioned (haha, I'm 23 for chrissakes!), but what ever happened to tastemakers? I work part-time in wine retail, and my girlfriend works in a record store -- believe me, people *want* tastemakers. They *appreciate* being guided (not patronized) helpfully by enthusiastic folks who love what they do and what they know. Radio stations lack balls. I realize that they make a ton of money -- or, rather, they make Clear Channel a ton of money -- but that's a ridiculously conservative way to run a business. How is it in any way scientifically sound to play to people in a room a bunch of shit they've already been force-fed their whole lives -- by RADIO nonetheless! Doesn't that strike anyone as odd and sort of viciously circular?

Clarke B., Sunday, 7 December 2003 06:45 (twenty years ago) link

"People still dig 'Do You Feel Like I Do' -- 0.2 points higher than last years average -- let's spin it eleven times a day rather than the current nine, effective tomorrow morning."

Clarke B., Sunday, 7 December 2003 06:47 (twenty years ago) link

haha- I love "Do You Feel Like We Do"! you reminded me of that song = I think I'm gonna fire it up right now (on mp3 where I have it, not lp, mind you). But yes, in all seriousness, of course I take your point.

Broheems (diamond), Sunday, 7 December 2003 06:51 (twenty years ago) link


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