nina simone - search and destroy

also, the double-disc set "Sugar in my Bowl 1967-1972" may be a collection, but it's not a typical "Best Of" and is one of my favorites. Some great outtakes, dialogs, covers, beautifully recorded, and really showcasing her odd (in context) and wonderful piano style.

Not even she can save a Jonathan King song.

Seconded. And the album is comes from (Baltimore) is mainly great.

Mmmmm, and longer versions of loads of the RCA material, which is my favourite period.

Destroy? Nina's Back!. Keep trying, keep hating.

Search? Little Girl Blue, Mr Bojangles, Four Women, To Be Young, Gifted And Black, In The Morning, Do What You Gotta Do, My Sweet Lord/Isn't It A Pity?, Just Like A Woman, Angel Of The Morning, Let It Be Me, Mood Indigo, The Other Woman, I Get Along Without You Very Well, The Desperate Ones, Be My Husband, End Of The Line, Suzanne, Tell It Like It Is, Cotton-Eyed Joe, To Love Somebody, Feelin' Good (incl. the Joe Clausell remix), Sinnerman (incl. the Felix Da Housecat remix), Wild Is The Wind, I Put A Spell On You, the *fantastic* funky Save Me from the reissue of ...And Piano! ...and, of course, Funkier Than A Mosquito's Tweeter.

No argument here.

Bad argument here (worst thing I've read on music for weeks): "It's impossible for anyone to sing Strange Fruit without sounding like an agitprop fanatic."

I remain agnostic. Nina Simone is not consigned to the flames.

"I read an interview once where someone asked Nina how she felt about being compared to Billie. She said she hated it because she thought Billie had an ugly voice."

see, that's funny, cuz nina simone had one of the ugliest voices i've ever heard. the one good thing i can say about her is that she is totally forgotten in the u.s, so i never have to hear her (unless i listen to democracy now or pacifica or something. which i never do.). a tougher taking sides would have been billie vs dinah or something (and dinah could have taken nina out with one hand tied behind her back if we are talking tough broads. nina was just a cry-baby.) maybe abby lincoln -vs- nina would be more fair. two third-tier failed pop stars turned semi-revolutionary priestess. (i'd take abby.)

-- scott seward (skotro...), March 19th, 2005 9:51 PM. (scott seward) (link)

sorry for going off like that. i really try to be positive on ilm. it's just some people...i can't even honestly think of a singer that i dislike more! it's something visceral when i hear that voice. that croak. it's just rubs me in so many wrong ways i don't know where to begin. i mean, i would rather listen to billy corgan! (not that i would, but hypothetically if i HAD to listen to someone i can't stand.) i shoulda just said: "as a singer she was one helluva piano player!"

-- scott seward (skotro...), March 19th, 2005 10:51 PM. (scott seward) (link)

I've always liked her voice a lot, but I like very unusual voices a lot, especially in women.

I do too!

(but you were too easy on that silly NY Times/freakfolk article)

The first time I ever heard the name Nina Simone was in the movie Point of No Return, but that was 1993. The only other thing I can think of was the ending of Before Sunset where Ethan Hawke puts on "Just In Time" (version off The Tomato Collection I believe) in Julie Delpy's apartment and they have a short discussion of her.

well... she died a couple of years ago!!!

Just picked this one up in pristine condition at the record store:

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B0001ZXMCM.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

It is stunningly good. Nina sounds utterly exhausted (and mentions that she is during one of her monologues) and world-weary to point of slurring and mumbling her words. She also sounds wasted or just totally out of it. But the music is completely striking and gorgeous. I've been feeling a bit exhausted myself lately so maybe it's just matching my mood, but the point remains.

'Who knows where the time goes' out from that Black Gold album is one of my favorite Nina Simone performances, she almost bleeds the song out.

How's this one: Protest Anthology?

I like that Black Gold album, but the recording quality on it is pretty bad (even for a live album), especially with high sounds.

So, assuming I haven't heard any Nina Simone before, where do I start? Sings the Blues?

Tomato Collection. Double CD. Its all live but this is where she is at her most astonishing. Don't know if this is hard to find or anything. I've had it for years and love it to death. I think she might be the only person i know where I prefer her live stuff to her recorded stuff. I'm sure somebody will correct me or provide a better studio alternative.

I'm on a major discovery of hers. I recommend the remaster of Live at the Village Gate. "You'll Never Walk Alone" on there is...indescribable.

Is there a Nina Simone POX thread? I'll have to put a list together.

i'm partial to "pastel blues" and "wild is the wind"--two of her philips albums.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gAgP-LG0cQ

if you have never heard this... well, turn off the lights and prepare yourself.

it's a slow song, but she takes it so. fucking. slow. sort of like jimmy scott. love it.

^^^^ Seconded. In fact that was how I first heard it (well, the Colpix version of it), in the dark on headphones, and it was just one of those moments where you realise that there's music out there in the world that you need to get into your life.

The one-disc Colpix Years cd is a tremendous introduction to Nina; genius throughout, and not too much of it to be intimidating.

If you buy CDs, this two-fer is a pretty nice start (at least it was for me). Looks like you can get it used for $3:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41BN6NNCJ1L._SL500_AA300_.jpg

IMO, comps are not the way to go with Nina. Many of the albums are patchy, but she is the type of artist where the bad/weird choices give insight into what she was about. To appreciate her work as a whole, you have to accept its complexity.

the one good thing i can say about her is that she is totally forgotten in the u.s, so i never have to hear her (unless i listen to democracy now or pacifica or something. which i never do.).

Love the self-hating leftism of this.

she gets me on a purely visceral level first and intellectually/musically secondarily

That classical sensibility is what turns me off, I've realized. I'm never gonna be a fan.

the doc also made me realize what a totally unbelievable guitarist alan schackman is

Yes! Knew nothing about him before watching this.

Ban al

Loved this documentary. Is there a full live concert recording available to watch? Her live take of Hollis Brown on YouTube is one of my favorite performances from anyone ever. So powerful.

There's a full version of Stars on YouTube that's worth watching

The first couple minutes of that Montreux appearance are riveting.

I don't think the documentary was even aiming to be any kind of in-depth analysis of Simone's music, or what made it special... I think the long concert clips kinda served that purpose; if you didn't know her music before, they should be enough to make it clear what an unique artist she was. If you still don't like the music after seeing all the clips, I don't think any amount of talking heads analyzing the tunes is gonna change your opinion.

I think starting with the 1976 Montreux clip and then returning to it towards the end of the film was a very clever move from the director. Even if you're not familiar with Simone or her life story, the clip in the beginning should be enough to illustrate that she was not your typical performing artist, that she was kinda out there and abrasive, but also quite delicate. And, then, after hearing her life story, all the social and personal and psychological troubles she went through, when the doc returns to the Montreux clip, you can almost read all that personal history into her performance, and what may at first glance seem like superfluous artistic eccentrities (like Simone angrily commanding some woman in the audience to "sit down!") become illuminated. Of course it's partly just projection, if you hadn't heard all those stories before seeing the clip again, you proabably couldn't read all that into it... But it's still very effective, very moving.

Its a very sad movie, and doesn't offer any kind of in-depth analysis of Simone's music other than to tell you about her classical and church gospel training.

Like the Mavis Staples doc, it doesn't offer anyone discussing their albums, how they chose songs, how they were produced, and how they were received by the public and critics alike. That biography of her doesn't necessarily do this either. It does document the countless live shows she did at various points in her life, but in a numbing way without enough analysis.

According to the doc, if you're a fan, no explanations are necessary. I would gladly have sat through a two-hour doc. The concert clips showing how radicalism transformed her shows whetted my appetite for more. What was going on in the studio? How were she and her band and producers assembling material? How did her choice of covers reflect the radicalism?

I agree that a little more about her choice of songs would have been very interesting. I think it was one of her strongest attributes.

i do like how she could make any song her own. she was the mark kozelek of her day.

she'd be shaming Pitchfork writers in 2015.

i still hate randy newman though. but i don't hate nina's "baltimore". the baltimore album is the only one i own. i wanted to have "everything must change" on vinyl.

La Simone for sure one of the most legendary song stylists. That's the connecting glue to Sinatra et al, altho she radically and emphatically moved beyond that type of categorization and "jazz vocalist" label in most other respects. If anything, she was more of an interpretive folk singer in the jazz idiom.

i wonder how she felt about roberta flack. roberta took "suzanne" to the bank.

i love chapter two and quiet fire in a way that i have never loved a nina album, but if this thread tells you anything about me, i never say never.

wow, i have impeccable timing. the beatles, gospel, and classical on roberta's hit parade:

http://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/jun/29/roberta-flack-soundtrack-of-my-life-fugees-killing-me-softly

you'll never guess what her favorite hip hop song is...

i just read online somewhere that nina and roberta toured together at one point. so i guess that answers my question.

Roberta Flack I def have time for and noted the similarities.

Roberta and Nina are birds of a feather, altho Roberta def skews more "pop". Lots of invisible quotes when it comes to these two as they epitomize blurred boundaries.

Made a playlist with (almost) all the songs from the doc

https://open.spotify.com/user/shinsuzuki/playlist/2pSd5HTO74qm758slQQu5E

one thing i really like about nina simone is that, at her best, she could transfigure kitsch, through delicate, often austere arrangements and vocal approach

one of my favorite of her albums is "nina simone at carnegie hall": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nina_Simone_at_Carnegie_Hall

..partly because it's the best example of this. she does a number of movie themes whose "original" versions verged on the saccharine , as well as some hoary pseudo-folk songs that had long since been reduced to cliche ("cotton-eyed joe"), but she redeems it all through offbeat, spare renditions

see e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EMjeEFPZlc

in a way her approach anticipates that of jimmy scott (who was actually a contemporary)

actually "black swan" is an out-and-out art song, so it's not the best example of what i'm trying to get at

better example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyUmBFQSY78

If you still don't like the music after seeing all the clips, I don't think any amount of talking heads analyzing the tunes is gonna change your opinion.

i am *so glad there was a minimal amount of talking heads in this, beyond her family and musicians.

As much as I appreciated the archival footage and honesty from the sources, there's no explication of her art.

^^^this. it's weird how incidental her music seemed to the movie (and I was willing to be convinced, not hugely familiar with or a fan of her ouevre)

with Alfred in general re: her music too - there is a studied, overly formal rigor to everything (except her voice, which is remarkably expressive) that leaves me a little cold. I like some songs here and there but idk

see i think i like the tension between the formality/rigor you speak of and the deep wells of emotion in her voice. it works for me!

did she ever do Compared to What (or any Eugene McDaniels?) seems tailor-made for her

don't know!
weird, there is a different doc coming out? http://www.amazingnina.com/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7awW5nrDHk

This is the ultimate, for me.

The anger and triumph and sadness of it. The little chuckle she does after "And you see me lookin' nice/ With a ribbon in my hair". The way her voice is so harsh and chiding all the way through until the last line, when she hits that heart-breakingly pure tone.

And of course...

THAT'LL LEARRRRN YA!

xp I guess a different doc could conceivably focus more on the music itself than What Happened, Miss Simone? did. The Netflix one was exec produced by her daughter, so her portrait of her was probably always going to be more about the person and less about the musician. I'd definitely watch another one that focuses on her music.

http://www.straight.com/movies/727951/amazing-nina-simone-celebrates-skilled-singer

http://pitchfork.com/news/64247-nina-simone-documentary-director-slams-ugly-and-inaccurate-zoe-saldana-biopic/

I want to see this second Nina S doc, The Amazing Nina Simone

from the review of it: The better-known doc, Liz Garbus’s What Happened, Miss Simone?, made with the involvement of Simone’s estate, had access to her diaries and tapes. The Amazing doc, written, shot, and directed by Jeff L. Lieberman, a Vancouverite now based in New York, is far less polished than that Netflix production, although his rough assemblage, even with its notably bad graphic design, does illuminate a lot of what went right for Miss Simone.

There are many performance and audio clips, including very early stuff and key songs the other effort missed. His straightforward chronology allows fans to see how quickly things happened for Eunice Waymon, a North Carolina piano prodigy who attended Juilliard and fell into jazz almost by accident. Pushed by a club owner to sing to her own accompaniment, she took a new name so her church-preaching mother wouldn’t find out.

Lieberman uses two of the singer’s brothers and Vancouver guitarist Henry Young, among many others, to paint clear pictures of the transformation, while ignoring some obvious questions, like if and how the Waymons reacted when Eunice shot up the charts with her definitive version of “I Loves You, Porgy” in 1958.

The film is light on information about the mental disturbances that gradually consumed her career and private life. It misses her own voice, and while Lieberman’s narration isn’t bad, it lacks an authoritative stamp to match his subject’s magnitude. Still, as with Simone herself, there’s more here to celebrate than regret.

Still haven't checked to see whether this 2nd Simone doc, The Amazing Nina Simoneis available via online sites

I like her version of “Feeling Good” better than the one John Legend did tonight at the Biden inauguration tv event

I mean... it’s pretty much set in stone that her version is the essential version of it.

i thought john legend did a great job w it
ninas is undeniable obv

off-topic but I wish John Legend would record the version of MJ's I Can't Help It that he performed on Master Of None a few years ago

also Nina's versions of Bee Gees songs are definitive for me

I think the only cover/interpretation she doesn't totally nail is "Everyone's Gone To The Moon" - not even she can save that one.

This could also go on 'What can't you find on the internet' but let's try here.

Seeing if anyone knows which live compilation album includes the only song released from her 'Meltdown' performance ('See-Line Woman'). It's referred to in Warren Ellis's book in a conversation he had in 2020 with the guy who had been the sound engineer on the night, and recorded the performance on a DAT through the mixing desk. "I know it's my recording as the bongos are so fucking loud".

She was at Meltdown in 1999.

She was at Meltdown in 1999.

This came out in 2000, the back half are live tracks, though no info on if those live tracks are from the 1999 Meltdown (but See Line Woman is one of the live tracks)

https://www.discogs.com/release/446459-Nina-Simone-Nina-The-Essential-Nina-Simone

https://www.discogs.com/release/446459-Nina-Simone-Nina-The-Essential-Nina-Simone

― impostor syndrome to the (expletive) max (stevie), Tuesday, January 16, 2024 11:24 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

thanks stevie! i'll check that one out. according to the book no other tracks from the meltdown performance have been released - the sound engineer said that someone from her entourage came up after the concert and asked for the DAT, that was the only copy. there's no way to be certain that the version of 'see-line woman' referred to is actually from that performance...

i picked this up in oxfam at the weekend which rekindled my interest in finding the particular track. the second CD is also live tracks, with no information on where recorded. the version of 'see-line woman' has some prominent percussion but since i don't know how fucking loud the 'fucking loud' bongos are, i don't know if it's the version i'm looking for (on first listen I think maybe not, doesn't sound raw enough).

https://www.discogs.com/release/5843202-Nina-Simone-The-Essential-Collection

same version on both those CDs

Fantastic article about Nina’s childhood in western North Carolina

https://eu.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2024/03/02/wnc-history-nina-simones-talent-apparent-while-growing-up-in-tryon/72763687007/