Van Morrison's Astral Weeks: Classic or Dud

So Dud, if only for me.

I always get this slightly uneasy feeling that the drums aren't in sync with the rest of the band during Madame George.

Great article about Astral Weeks, one of the best pieces of music writing I've read in a while and the best description of this record I've ever seen:

http://www.nwanews.com/adg/Style/242565/

He mentions that Morrison's performing Astral Weeks live in LA tonight and tomorrow with Richard Davis and Jay Berliner. How could they possibly recreate an experience this singular? I sure wish I was going to be there to find out. Anyone going?

"enigmatic Irish wizard"

"Slow Slim Rider"

Anyone who can't even get the fucking song titles right shouldn't be trusted.

Lester Bangs' piece pisses all over this and all other non-factual/documentary writings on the same topic.

enigmatic Irish wizard = permanently grumpy Ulsterman

interview (via email?) with van the man about the performance this weekend ... http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/music_blog/2008/10/van-morrisons-f.html
VAN USES EMOTICONS? wow. :D
anyhoo, one of my top 10 records for sure. Not a bad moment on it. Risky, beautiful and nothing else in the world sounds like it.

The author on the link (xpost) seems amazed somewhat that the musicians had no chord sheets to follow. Aside from Young Lovers, pretty much everything on AW is a 2 or 3 chord jam. The kind of thing most jazzers could follow in their sleep.

As for his take on Madam George, well, I'd always imagined that was about a teenage boy's visit to a prostitute. It makes sense to me like that, anyway.

I can't get excited about Van performing AW live today. His voice is nothing like it used to be, and I really doubt he could do it justice.
I WOULD get excited if they came out with a remastered deluxe version of the original, with all the extra jamming.

I read in Mojo years ago that there was a whole 25 minutes of extreme free improv chopped off the end of "Slim Slow Slider." You can maybe see why it was edited out but it would be interesting to have the full take as a bonus track.

yeah, i can't imagine that the live re-creation of the record will be that amazing. i actually think van is enjoyable in his latter-day period (though i certainly haven't heard all of his recent albums), but he's not anywhere near the adventurous vocalist he was in 68. might be a pleasant concert, but nothing incredible.
but yeah, for real, i would love a deluxe treatment of astral weeks, just to eavesdrop on those sessions.

yeah i read that too -- that the "free" thing that closes out the album briefly just went on and on in the studio. would be verrrrry interesting to hear. it's perfect on the record, but i'd still just like more Astral Weeks music ...

I was tempted to read that piece but there's some bad undergrad poetry going on there:

"It is a festival of anguish, a wild and lonely ritual conducted on a dirt crossroads at midnight under a baleful bone-faced moon."

I hope Laura Barton sues.

I hate this album and I've been exposed to it way too often by people who just presume, because I'm "Into" music that I'll become all dewey-eyed and joyful upon hearing it. T be honest, I'm not a big Van Morrison fan although I like Them and that thing with The Chieftains was decent enough.

I read in Mojo years ago that there was a whole 25 minutes of extreme free improv chopped off the end of "Slim Slow Slider."
Yup, but where is it? Did they keep it or was the tape destroyed? If it really exists, it's hard to believe it's not available somewhere in the blogosphere. Damned if I can find it.

John Payne to thread...

I'm going to the la show tomorrow

I'll post about it

Great review:)
Astral Weeks (1968)
- With the chance to make his own record, Morrison came up with this, basically soft rock recorded with jazz musicians (including the Modern Jazz Quartet's Connie Kay on drums). Which might sound not too different from what Simon & Garfunkel were doing at the time, but where Simon's work is carefully composed, arranged and produced, Morrison relies on sponaneity. The liner notes brag that Morrison cut the album in two days, and you know, it sounds like it: the lyrics are stream of consciousness, and usually the tunes seesaw endlessly between two or three chords. The musicians sound like they don't know what he's getting at, and the fact that most of the songs have no clear melody doesn't help. Morrison's fans often cite this as their favorite album, because there aren't a lot of distractions from his distinctive, half-spoken vocals. But if you're just getting into him, you're probably better off with Moondance -- unless you're a fan of New Age music. (DBW)
http://www.warr.org/vanmorrison.html#AstralWeeks

i love this album so much.

It's my favorite and probably most-listened to album.

Followed by Pet Sounds and Corky's Debt to His Father.

Ha, I was just pondering whether to download "Corky's Debt to His Father" or not, and Dan's just persuaded me to do so!

It's fantastic.

more like asstral squeaks (farts)

lock thread

Astral Weeks (1968)
- With the chance to make his own record, Morrison came up with this, basically soft rock recorded with jazz musicians (including the Modern Jazz Quartet's Connie Kay on drums). Which might sound not too different from what Simon & Garfunkel were doing at the time, but where Simon's work is carefully composed, arranged and produced, Morrison relies on sponaneity. The liner notes brag that Morrison cut the album in two days, and you know, it sounds like it: the lyrics are stream of consciousness, and usually the tunes seesaw endlessly between two or three chords. The musicians sound like they don't know what he's getting at, and the fact that most of the songs have no clear melody doesn't help. Morrison's fans often cite this as their favorite album, because there aren't a lot of distractions from his distinctive, half-spoken vocals. But if you're just getting into him, you're probably better off with Moondance -- unless you're a fan of New Age music. (DBW)
http://www.warr.org/vanmorrison.html#AstralWeeks

― Jazzbo, Thursday, November 6, 2008 5:01 PM (6 years ago)

lol, i remember reading this review at that site back when i was in high school. didn't quite appreciate its tone-deafness back then.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Be3OkvBZaIY

xp driving at night to Astral Weeks while family sleeps = sorta perverse, but I can see the appeal

btw has anyone mentioned the Dexy's "Jackie Wilson Said" as a great VM cover??

.... I see now that they have #playingcatchup

I guess reading the Greil Marcus book on Van Morrison depends on how much you like or can deal with Marcus's methods

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/01/books/review/Gerstenzang-t.html?_r=0

“When That Rough God Goes Riding” is more a series of nonfiction short stories than a straightforward analysis. Marcus devotes virtually every chapter to a wide-ranging discussion of a Morrison album, song or live performance. Fittingly, just as the singer peppers his songs with eclectic allusions to Muddy Waters and William Blake, Marcus, too, brings in endless cultural signifiers, the better for us to understand the music. This means comparing Morrison’s version of Bob Dylan’s “It’s All Over Now, Baby Blue” to Raymond Chandler’s writing: “It begins like the first page of a detective novel, with three clipped, odd bass patterns, like a knock on the door, but with an odd fatalism.” Throughout the book, Marcus also makes reference to artists as disparate as the comic Robert Klein, the director Neil Jordan and the novelist Jonathan Lethem, so that we might get a sense of Morrison’s complex appeal. Mostly, these comparisons feel strangely accurate. Sometimes, as when Marcus compares the music to Bob Beamon’s astonishing long jump, he’s, uh, stretching things a bit.

This is a pretty nice one. Not as great as a '67 soul cover of a Van tune might have been, but I'll take it. Oddly drops the "jellyroll" line. Too dirty?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQbc_f8ACc4

That's one of my favorite Van songs -- for me, it's up there with most of Astral Weeks -- and I've always loved Scott's "Are You Lonely For Me Baby?"

This is tremendous. Thank you for posting.

Yeah, I actually stumbled on this cover trying to track down a 45 of "Are You Lonely For Me Baby" - such a great tune.

The Van cover is on the b-side of Scott's "Run Joe" 45 on Shout.

Another good early solo Van I should have mentioned: His Band and Street Choir, though he's already working toward a relatively more mainstream approach, more like what he was going for on the Bang Masters sessions, and more like what we now know will coalesce into Moondance and Tupelo Honey.
But if you're looking for more of something like the Astral Weeks vibe, especially "Madame George," I'd suggest Kevin Coyne. His mutant folk-blues-rock isn't all that jazzy, but some say he improvised all or much of his outsider verses on the spot in the studio, and certainly they can have that effect, the most unsettling aspect of such encounters being that you (or I) actually get what he's talking about (a former circuit-riding social worker with his own problems, who took good notes).
His Case History and Peel Sessions are good places to start; ditto Marjory Razor Blade, Matching Head and Feet, In Living Black and White, The Adventures of Crazy Frank, Sugar Candy Taxi, and maybe the set with Jon Langford, One Day In Chicago, though I haven't heard it. Of course he's got his own thread.
The cryptic contemplations and sunny Gothic landscapes of John Cale's Vintage Violence seem not too far fromAstral Weeks, as the crow flies, anyway.

vintage violence and astral weeks do share a producer - lewis merenstein

The new Uncut has him on the cover and a run through of some of his best lps. Snippets on them by various people who played on them.

& had me wondering what the story was on the disappearance of the reissues from around 2005/6. Was there any reason for them only being around for a short while since they don't seem to be around any more.

Would love that series's St Dominic's Preview. Not sure why I didn't get it at the time

Kevin Coyne can sound like Van occasionally (intentionally I would guess), but not that often really, and I'm amazed you didn't mention the album, Blame It On the Night! (xxp)

Not as much the sound as the effect, thinking most specifically of the "Madame George" experience, but that midnight mynd, muttering-forward vibe of other songs too (some Roy Harper, Richard Dawson as well). Not familiar with Blame It On The Night!

ha, yes. was never sure if this was a van homage or piss-take (maybe both)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnIcTvJplts

Man, that is the entry album for Kevin Coyne, not that it's his best, just that it has more or less his entire spectrum from avant-garde stream of consciousness blah to bluesy 70s rock to almost nearly pop.(xp)

Looked up BIOTN, thanks Tom D. Also found this conversation with xpost AW/VV producer Merenstein:

http://darkforcesswing.blogspot.com/2009/03/in-full-lewis-merenstein-producer-of.html

The duet with Bobby Womack (RIP) on Some Peace of Mind is strong. The others I've listened to haven't come up to that level.

Speaking of Van reissues, it'd be nice if the powers that be would get around to reissuing Irish Heartbeat. That was a great one.

had me wondering what the story was on the disappearance of the reissues from around 2005/6. Was there any reason for them only being around for a short while since they don't seem to be around any more.

Also: What's the deal with the rights to his albums anyway? Polydor reissued a number of his albums on CD in the 90s, and then again in the series you mention, but there were odd gaps in what they had; like, iirc Polydor had Tupelo Honey through Veedon Fleece (I have their 90s editions of both), and then they skipped to the last 70s albums, hopping again to the mid '80s, where they finally encompass the whole of the period onward catalogue. Some--but not all--of the missing albums where kept in print by original label Warner Brothers, whom I think issued their holdings on CD back in the late '80s/early '90s CD boom (my copy of St. Dominic's Preview is on WB, and I've seen used copies of a WB Tupelo Honey from time to time).

PS: I was just looking at how ridiculously expensive his old albums are on Amazon--I really should have stocked up for eventual resale when I saw them all for like $10 a disc at Borders in the early 2000s.

Speaking of covers, who's heard this tribute album:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41BBAEC6Z3L.jpg

1. You Make Me Feel So Free - Sinéad O'Connor 2. Queen of the Slipstream - Brian Kennedy 3. Coney Island - Liam Neeson 4. Crazy Love - Cassandra Wilson 5. Bright Side of the Road - Hothouse Flowers 6. Irish Heartbeat - Brian Kennedy/Shana Morrison 7. Full Force Gale - Elvis Costello 8. Tupelo Honey - Phil Coulter Orchestra 9. Madame George - Marianne Faithfull 10. Friday's Child - Lisa Stansfield.

^Marianne Faithfull's cover of Madame George is pretty good.

I guess reading the Greil Marcus book on Van Morrison depends on how much you like or can deal with Marcus's methods

I picked it up last week because it was mucho cheap in Chapters on Parnell St - I would charitably describe it as 'ok' - the best thing about it was it made me go back and listen to some stuff, but yeah some of it went way into Boomer rock crit parody territory.

i like it -- yeah plenty of "where are you going with this" moments, but i sorta enjoy its ramble. and yeah, it gets you going back to the music.

Seems like the breakup of Them -> release of Astral Weeks would be a good period to cover in one book; would also like a book that's just straight-up storytelling and no extraneous flabby critical analysis

(so basically I want 200 pages of that awesome article)

Seems like the breakup of Them -> release of Astral Weeks would be a good period to cover in one book; would also like a book that's just straight-up storytelling and no extraneous flabby critical analysis

― Brio2, Monday, March 30, 2015 5:54 PM (39 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I don't know if there was a break up of Them. Van left and several members continued for another 3 lps before morphing into a band called Truth

right - I just meant Van leaving Them. I've always been curious about the post-Van Them stuff.

i haven't heard all of those post van them records, but i remember some of it being surprisingly good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVCvi4aNLc8

According to Wikipedia there was a Them, a "The Other Them", and the Belfast Gypsies (with THEM in huge letters on their album cover) all playing at the same time.

and there was more than one Them as early as '65!

confusing.
hadn't seen this before, pretty amazing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKuM5oKk0es

Arizona Jones has posted 1970/71 shows, incl one with a 12-minute version of "Astral Weeks." Haven't had tyme to listen yet, but all the AJ posts I have checked are worth hearing. Here's the one with "Astral Weeks":
http://arizjones.blogspot.com/2015/04/van-morrison-fillmore-west-10-09-1970.html

The AJ posts I've heard are by other artists, no idea yet re his Van shows (some of which have songs I've never heard, unlike this set; gotta check 'em all)

Well actually looks like there's just one other Van show still up, but intriguing (and lengthy) set list:
http://arizjones.blogspot.com/2015/04/van-morrison-san-anselmo-ca-8-08-1971.html

@Dow. More than just one more. Here are a bunch. Enjoy!
http://arizjones.blogspot.com/2015/03/van-morrison-marin-ca-9-05-1971-fm.html
http://arizjones.blogspot.com/2014/12/van-morrison-london-3-21-1982-sbd.html
http://arizjones.blogspot.com/2014/11/van-morrison-montreux-11-07-1990-sbd.html
http://arizjones.blogspot.com/2014/10/van-morrison-glastonbury-festival-6-21.html
http://arizjones.blogspot.com/2014/07/van-morrison-montreux-7-10-1980.html

Wow, thanks so much!

When the reissue of Astral Weeks comes out one of the alternate takes will be an apparently legendary long version of Slim Slow Slider. This guy interviewed John Payne, the soprano sax player on the tune: http://throwingpenniesbridges.blogspot.com/2015/08/it-had-just-blown-them-away.html

OK, I'm so ready to hear this.

wowww

I woke up at 5am today, anyway I've been trying to set up all our household bills on to this online bill pay system so I went down in the basement where the computer is. Threw on the Rhino vinyl reissue from a couple years ago. I was having trouble getting my credit card account to connect to the site, and all of a sudden "Madam George" came on and I just started crying it was so pretty, right at the part where she says my love you forgot your gloves.

The bit that always does it for me is "laughing music dancing music all around the room"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H66PEecCo9g
unedited bonus track of 'slim slow slider' (for some reason shown as being from His Band and the Street Choir)... interesting to say the least...

listened to this for the first time in years the other night. my sister & brother-in-law visited last weekend, we had a fire going in the fireplace, had been smoking a little weed and drinking a little bit, this is like my sister's favorite album so she asked to put it on, the line that got all of us was "for instance me baby" from ballerina

xp editing out that last bit may have been the single best production choice made for that record, damn

Going to see if that new edition is in HMV tomorrow.

I see it gets reviewed in the new Uncut, couldn't check the Mojo since it was sealed in a bag around a book about the Dylan bootleg series. Both had just appeared in the local newsagent when i was in town yesterday.

Still wondering how extensive the physical cd releases on the Legacy material are after reading that Record Collector news last month.

xp yeah, that edit is a stroke of genius, like falling off a cliff or something. still kind of happy to hear that last bit w/ van breaking into a hymn, which would've ended the album on a decidedly different note...

I've now heard both cds and they sound pretty great. B&SC sounds less muddy than I've heard it elsewhere.
AW is fantastic, great to have it on a decent sounding cd at last.

AW remaster sounded crisp and overwhelming as I drove across the GG bridge this morning. In parts it almost becomes chaotic with all the instruments so clearly present.