Early Music: RFI

They don't.

he is a genuine musicologist as well as a composer

oddly enough the music sounds quite like menswe@r

I am aware of the supposed connection between Coptic liturgical music and Ancient Aegyptian Musick, something I'd like to investigate more at some point. (Also want to check out Ethiopian liturgical music.)

Anyways, I bring this up because I advise all to search records by David Munrow's Early Music Consort of London. (All of them from the 1970s.) Notably Monteverdi's Contemporaries and The Art of Courtly Love. The Deller Consort has some wonderful discs as well.

Let's make this an Early Music S/D thread shall we?

Machaut, BTW, is also spotlighted on The Art of Courtly Love along with numerous of his less-famous contemporaries.

appears to be correct; at any rate most of the musicians who in my homeland practise what's oft referred to as 'early music' seem to prefer the term 'pre-Baroque' (though i gather they'd obviously like it much more if the reference were even more specific: late medieval, early polyphony, gregorian, etc - as may be the case ;-) )

David Munrow's Early Music Consort of London. (All of them from the 1970s.)

If I like this, what else would I like? In particular I like the plodding marches and dance songs. Please recommend early music to me.

Do you prefer a more stripped-down sound or something fuller and more choral? All-male or coed? A cappella or with instruments?

I like mostly instrumental -- choral is ok, but today I am looking for instrumental stuff. Stripped down is ok, but I like a loud band. My interest is inspired in large part by Munrow's EMC arrangements on Shirley/Dolly Collins' Anthems in Eden.

Ah okay, I'm not all that versed in early/renaissance/whatever instrumental music. Cantica Symphonia has a solid and great-sounding instrumental section but their interpretations can be kind of patchy. Diabolus in Musica also uses a backing band on the La Doce Acordance song collection.

How weird you should mention Diabolus -- this morning I was looking for pictures of the crumhorn and I found their website.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4b/Crumhorns.png

ps thank you for recommending some early music to me! i am going to look for these things now.

No problem, enjoy.

look at this video! i esp like the crumhorn part and also when he's going nuts on the little trumpet thingie in the beginning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKxdCSbAtOE

that is wonderful. actually just ordered myself 'art of courtly love' last week and it's just total fun and it shouldn't be surprising that on video munrow is just a total rocker

ordered the munrow after a conversation with a conversation with an early music professor who was raving about it when I brought up the machaut CD I've been unable to stop playing this last month:

http://www.amazon.com/Mirror-Narcissus-Secular-Guillaume-Machaut/dp/B000002ZGV

it's just crazy beautiful, but these are 100% choral arrangements -- no horns, drums, no stompers. but this is not your typical glacially reverbed choral production, they completely attack these songs, I knew I loved this album ten seconds into the first track. it's still kind of a plainchant drone in some ways, but the harmonies push at the edge of what you'd think was even possible

god! I was interrupted from typing by four phone calls as always but I should know by now to read it over before posting

first track of that gothic voices CD of machaut music

http://www.sendspace.com/file/zkhqpe

haha i just looked for this thread to find that i asked the same question right after my birthday going on 2 years ago.

there's a difference though -- last time I was looking for instrumental music and this time I came here to ask for choral music. i'm listening to "music of the gothic era" and the singer's name is paul elliott.

what else sounds like this?! it's so beautiful and simple. little chimes or bells of some kind are the only instrument i can hear outside of the voices. "Gaude Maria Virgo" was the tune that made me look this up btw. I don't know much about choral music, so i have no idea if this is a common style or song or what.

This is not the same performance obvs but this is the same song in a different arrangement
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFwn-C0niVk

bump
this is what i was listening to btw
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/515NC5FSYAL._SL500_AA300_.jpg

Perotin is an obvious place to start. The Hilliard Ensemble's album "Perotin and the Ars Antiqua" is available on Spotify.

Thank you very much! Added to playlist.

I like Hilliard's recording of Perotin but it is very, very typically ECM glacial. If you don't have a good instant response to it, try out some other recordings as well. I like the Perotin / Leonin

Have you heard Brumel's Earthquake Mass?

original recording: http://www.amazon.com/Brumel-terrae-Sequentia-Huelgas-Ensemble/dp/B00006GO7C/ref=sr_1_11?ie=UTF8&qid=1329166072&sr=8-11
tallis scholars good too, higher register less reverb: http://www.amazon.com/Antoine-Brumel-Missa-terrae-Earthquake/dp/B000QZVBL6/ref=sr_1_2?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1329166027&sr=1-2

left a sentence unfinished in my unedited post

>I like the Perotin / Leonin

...disc on Naxos: http://www.amazon.com/Leonin-Perotin-Sacred-Notre-Dame-Cathedral/dp/B0009SQC8W/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1329166793&sr=1-1

god I love Amazon classical music reviews. seriously maniacial reviews on there to read while you're listening to the clips.

& one last borderline 15th century rec

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4hNdw_IZr8

http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=191672

So basically you want a blend of voices and instruments, right?

No one sounds like Munrow, unfortunately (except maybe Musica Reservata). But I would recommend you look for discs of ars nova and ars subtilior repertoire by the Ferrara Ensemble and Ensemble Mala Punica. Also Ensemble P.A.N.

xpost Huelgas Ensemble's disc of Dufay Motets is also a great example of voices + instruments

didn't know Huelgas did Dufay. thanks, just bought that -- the Huelgas Brumel is all-time for me.

Another great Huelgas record in the voices + ensemble vein: Febus Avant!

(the title actually includes the exclamation point...)

I like it so far, but I need to listen a little more closely. The glacial pace is part of what I find appealing tbh.
Thanks for the recommendations -- I will report back once I've had a chance to hear a little more.

Febus Avant!

I officially love Perotin. Disappointed about this though -- No one sounds like Munrow, unfortunately (except maybe Musica Reservata). I have a couple of the Musica Reservata medieval troubadour albums queued up but it's sad to think that there's such a limited amount of material like that out there to digest. He was not on this earth for long enough imo.

Speaking of, though, does anyone know if the soundtrack to The Devils is available anywhere? I haven't looked all that hard, but I have looked and am coming up empty.

As far as I know, no it isn't.

Know what else Munrow was involved with? The score to Zardoz! Also unfindable according to my efforts.

I should have said no one sounds QUITE like Munrow & company... I mean he was super influential on later EM bands but I feel like no one has that wildness plus unpredictability of how a given piece will be arranged. Scholarship comes first now.

BTW there's a track off the Dark Crystal score album which is very Munrow-y-- the folk dance for the Pod People. Shredding recorder solo.

ooh is this it?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPbfk6Vbqls

it's awesome!!

yeah right?

I think the soloist is the guy from Gryphon.

Most of Trevor Jones' film scores on 'ancient times' or fantasy subjects have a track or two like this.

It's always a good time to watch this beauty again (although the pan flute (?) and harp are not my favorite part, and i could live without them)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bG1m3KTR5G0

Thomas Binkley is another maniac - one that doesn't get quite as much attention as Munrow these days due to the fact that his group, Studio Der Fruhen Musik, doesn't have any insane live-action YouTubes.

This double album (Makoto Kawabata's favourite record of all time... take from that what you will) is a great intro to early music, and is IMHO a superior statement to any single title of Munrow's (much as I love his work):

http://www.amazon.com/Troubadours-Touveres-Minstreles-Binkley/dp/B00171TE8A

well, then i must have it

lol @ insane live action --> munrow's playing is truly insane and maniacal!!

I wish I could get into the instrumental side of this stuff but I just can't.

This is rly good and well sequenced so far.

I have always wanted to hear Sequentia's speculative renditions of ancient Norse music.

This should be in the Inspector Norse thread.

kind of in that vein, sorta gothy folk - The Quaking Bogge

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJS9qCcILMM

have been in a mood for some serious early music dance tunes, a la https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3Tg_NSmXTU

in the event that anyone who reads this thread is thinking "that sounds great, but i wonder how it would sound with more drums..." do i have a link for you! http://bit.ly/1o6vyNl

:D

Rock on!

i could listen to that song like 20x in a row
david munrow really brings the fire

He is so killer
I wish someone would write a juicy biography of him and his scene

You do it!! I'll read it!

But research is boring :(

munrow enthusiast laura cannell doing some really interesting things with early music imo
http://thequietus.com/articles/17067-laura-cannell-interview

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK4ypurd-aE#t=18

wow i did not know about this person! She sounds super interesting. Just read the list of tracks she picked for a mixtape on some other site.

kind of getting heavily into the david munrow stuff these days

oh yay that's awesome tyler! Which records you digging?

http://cdn.discogs.com/kBCYvuMTnIaCpIsSYIMfqcnldsk=/fit-in/600x598/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(96)/discogs-images/R-2899397-1339286855-2282.jpeg.jpg
this one! got the LP w/ the giant book -- just so much to dig through...

Jealous!! I recently found another ECM/Munrow lp but I never have stumbled on that one. Get the Art of the Netherlands box if you ever see it. Really great.

I've been super into Jordi Savall recordings lately. I see someone bigupped him upthread.

xp i got the renaissance box for pretty cheap ($15-ish?) on discogs, looks like they've got sweet deals on the munrow/early consort stuff... need to get more, though i can only listen when i'm alone in the house... rest of the family thinks i'm about to start going to renn faires. AND MAYBE I AM.

Highly rec munrows:

Music of the Crusades
Machaut and his Contemporaries
The Fourteenth Century Avant Garde
The Court of Burgundy
Ecco la Primavera

cool, thanks -- yeah i want to get 'em all. amazing how much munrow accomplished musically in a pretty short life...

Way too soon

But he was clearly one of those ppl who burned brightly -- that wears on a person. RIP.

the photography in the renaissance book is incredible too
http://scontent-b.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xpf1/t51.2885-15/10724738_586121424827944_474405121_n.jpg

Omg love

was listening to laura cannell just this morning - so good!

have had good luck picking up a bunch of munrows in charity shops of late but haven't really had the chance to digest tehm properly

I'm dying dying dying for a substantial bio of munrow. I really hope someone has been chipping away at it as his fellow emclers are starting to die (rip hogwood)

friend sent me this early music mix if anyone is interested! looks good. https://soundcloud.com/gabecelestino/sunne-under-wode-part-1
Sunne Under Wode Part 1 or 3.

1.Allemaingne (Tielman Susato) performed by Rene Clemencic
2.Polorum regina (Llibre Vermell) performed by Hesperion XX
3. Veni Sancte Spiritus (John Dunstable) performed by The Hilliard Ensemble
4. Vos que'm semblatz dels corals amadors (Gaucelm Faidit) performed by Hesperion XX
5. O quanta qualia (Peter Abelard) performed by Studio Der Frühen Musik
6. Avendo me falcon (Jacopo Da Bologna) performed by Ensemble Project Ars Nova
7. El rey de Francia tres hijas tenia (anonymous) performed by Hesperion XX
8. Kabinettorgel, um 1670 (Orlando Gibbons) performed by Albert de Klerk

never really listened to the hilliard ensemble outside of that celebrated collab with jan garbarek, which i just did not like whatsoever

they are good, a bit sterile sounding at times.

listened to Huelgas Ensemble - A Secret Labyrinth (music of Agricola) yesterday and it was too unearthly beautiful to listen to at work, I could not get anything done at all

ha, that's the worst/best!

i'd still like more recommendations for istampitta/saltarello type tunes
i haven't found anything i like better than the ones i have, or anything i like as much

for those looking for new vocal music, Cinquecento has been pumping out albums and they have all been good.

In my neverending quest to find all of the wildest David Munrow recordings, I picked up three things while on vacation recently --
1) LP box of The Art of Courtly Love (I have the CD but couldn't resist because of the book/notes/lyrics)
2) CD of Music for Ferdinand and Isabella of Spain
3) Henry VIII and his Six Wives film score

So far the highlight (as far as what I'm after, generally speaking) has been the track "Ethiop Masque", which was apparently incidental music in the film (which I haven't seen, but stars Charlotte Rampling!) The whole album is on youtube but a clip of that tune is easier to access here http://www.allmusic.com/album/david-munrow-henry-viii-and-his-six-wives-mw0001382560

I never get sick of this stuff!

yeahhh, i have to get that henry viii soundtrack. i saw some of that series a million years ago on pbs.

oh wait maybe i am thinking of a different henry viii 70s thing? there are so many.

Idk -- I'm not familiar with the film or miniseries but the music is great!! There's another really driving tune called "Street Music" iirc

yeahhh, i have to get that henry viii soundtrack. i saw some of that series a million years ago on pbs.

The new Laura Cannell album Simultaneous Flight Movement is a really stunning collection of one take improvisations, totally beautiful stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFop7BWHjJ0
Her fleet and beautiful double recorder+echo title track is very timeless and ancient sounding, and very moving as well.

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2016/nov/01/from-the-classical-archive-march-1971-david-munrow-profile-not-even-mick-jagger-has-such-versatile-lips

whoa thanks for the heads up on that laura cannell, sounds amazing.

Munrow still RULES

I'm aware it's an unseemly & gratuitous opinion to have of such a niche artist but I kind of hate cannell's relentless melodrama. rarely approve of the word but it comes off as pretentious & it's such a one-note slog, I just want some space, some awareness but it's always fluttering around in its own shadow. it's close to being something I'd love but imo aiming for 'ancient-sounding' v directly, which I think it is, is shooting yourself in the foot. you end up sounding twee

I enjoyed it both in my kitchen at loud volume and wandering through greenbelt with my headphones, so it gets a double thumbs up from me. But I can understand how some will think it twee , but idk it just works for me.

This new Laura Cannell album fits my mood fairly well. (Was not familiar with her.)

I haven't had much of an appetite for this sort of thing in a very long time, but Musica Secreta's Lucrezia Borgia's Daughter is very welcome at the moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNSLNlMmdRw

Music Of The Gothic Era or Music From The Crusades...
I already have these on CD, but would totes buy LPs if I saw them.

― nicest bitch of poster (La Lechera), Wednesday, August 1, 2012 12:37 PM (ten years ago) bookmarkflaglink

I was lucky enough to grab a pristine copy of the Music Of the Gothic Era 3 LP set for $15 a few days ago. I've appreciated this music digitally for years, but studying the liner notes and texts has illuminated it big time, especially with the ars antiqua and ars nova motets.

This is deeply strange music--two (or three) different texts sung simultaneously, alternately harmonizing and hocketing with each other. Sometimes the texts are closely related to each other, and sometimes sung from different/contrasting perspectives. Of course I don't understand Latin or medieval French, but I'd imagine if I did understand the language, listening to these motets would be even more of a head-spinning experience, figuring out which text to follow or attempting to keep track of both at the same time.

So I'm wondering if there are examples of motets or other music with a similar effect in English, from that era or beyond (The Velvet Underground "The Murder Mystery" is what immediately comes to mind for me). It seems like after the gothic era composers tended to base compositions around a single text rather than two or more overlapping texts, but maybe I'm wrong about that...

I just put together a show about pre-historic music, interviewed Simon O'Dwyer of Ancient Music Ireand, he reconstructs bronze age / iron age instruments and figures out how they were played.

https://centuriesofsound.com/2023/09/11/centuries-of-sound-radiopod-prequel-special-1-ancient-sounds-with-simon-odwyer-of-ancient-music-ireland/

They've also just launched a sound library called Paleosonic - https://www.ancientmusicireland.com/sound-library

this is so great!

Thanks, I was surprised at how much was out there, I had the idea that it was just the Hurrian hymn, but could've put together several hours.

Yoooo