The Posies - Classic or Dud?

Unfortunately the rest of their catalog is spotty. Amazing Disgrace, the follow-up to Frosting, is the most aptly titled album in rock history. There are Dear 23 defenders but I find the whole thing difficult to sit through, the elements are present but everyone's trying too hard to make it sound casual and unforced. The post-Geffen stuff is a case of too much cool whip and not nearly enough pie. Some of it has that unfortunate reedy muppet-like sound reserved for only the hollowest of power-pop pretenders.

If you stopped your Posies collection at one I wouldn't blame you.

keith

frosting on the beater is one of their best albums, but also check out: amazing disgrace, success, in case you didn't feel like plugging in the latter is a live-album recorded during an unplugged tour, just two voices & guitars: brilliant.

i saw them during their acoustic tour and it was truly magnificent: two clear voices growing rusty because of a continuous supply of tequilla by the audience, one member of the audience providing vocals for big star's september gurls, ending the night without guitars (sound cut off), two drunken posies, one drunken audience singing the dutch national anthem... a night to remember!

well, jon managed to sing somewhat like an angel, but ken was no longer able to! also, he could no longer play guitar... hilarious stuff. where did you see them joan? (i saw them in Utrecht, the Netherlands)

Kenny, I don't know if your purchase of the album was out of the blue or if it was inspired by Magnet's new issue on Power Pop, but if you haven't read that issue you may want to flip through it for a bit more data...it's not the most thorough article in the world (and skips over a lot of artists I'd consider fairly important) but it's still a good start and has a bunch of talk about Posies and Big Star, at the very least.

'beater' is their best, but all of the others have plenty to reccommend them. 'amazing disgrace' has some very strong songs on it, but is spoiled slightly by sub-grunge production. but 'song #1', 'the certainty', 'throwaway', 'will you ever ease your mind' and 'terrorized' make for some beautiful, razor edged, soppy hearted guitar pop.

'success', their 'last' album, is very very strong too, highly reccommended. the live albums are fun, the ox set endearing and packed full of gems and covers (abd very listenable, in a way box sets aren't always)... i love the songs on 'dear 23', but the production is too winsome and jangly and watery for me.

they had an ep out last year, 'nice cheekbones and a phd', which included a great cover of the byrds' 'ladyfriend', along with some superb new songs. there's another new posies album due soon, apparently, though details are sketchy.

also, ken stringfellow's solo lps, 'touched' and 'this sounds a bit like goodbye' are amazing, blue-eyed tear-stained pop records, and his Saltiine ep is the sharpest power-pop i've ever heard, betters even the posies...

Ken Stringfellow 'Touched' is worth a listen too.

Big Star haunted beauty grabbed me. The Posies, TO ME didn't have that X factor (apart from solar sister).

Live they were a different proposition cos the Stringfellow fancied himself as a bit of a punk, launching some impressive jumps and catching his own gob. It was beautifully incongruous with the rather tame music his static partner.

Stringfellows last solo outing did have some good songs on it. I copied it off a mate and lost it about 6 months ago. Not heard it since. Perhaps that says something?

and i booked saltine on my venue in mallorca a few years ago. it was a great show, and they had another singer/guitar player besides of ken. he was the shit. anybody knows what he's up to? i can't even remember his name...

one of those bands i am unapologetically devoted to. i would say no one album perfectly sums it up for me, but at least 2/3rds of each is absolutely wonderful. Ken's songs on Success being probably my favorite. Amazing Disgrace is spotty but holds a lot of great memories for me. Frosting is overrated IMO but the combination of their sparkling popsmarts and the Fleming fuzzout production is i think a unique and mostly successful one. D23 is hard to get into but has a handful of their best (ANY OTHER WAY), and Failure is a nice jangly little thing some afternoons. actually, stevie summed up a lot quite well for me.

some truly wonderful and criminally overlooked Posies songs: Sad To Be Aware, Fall Song, Grant Hart, Limitless Expressions, Like Me Too, Compliment?, Friendship of the Future, Open Every Window, Fight It (If You Want), Lights Out, No Consolation, Apology, Every Bitter Drop, god, i could go on and on.

to answer the Saltine question, not sure who played what, but the lineup on the one single they had (their version of "Reveal Love" is incredible) is listed as: John Haslip, Paul Mumaw, Ken Stringfellow, Blake Wescott

in the shower just now a mix of farts and lavender soap made me think of their second album

i have their first album for some reason even though i have no idea who they are

if i remember correctly i like at least half the songs on it

classic

still love the hell out of this band. haven't really listened to them as much lately, though. things have been pretty quiet in their camp since that recent period where they released Posies, Big Star, and Auer and Stringfellow solo albums all in the space of 2 years.

w00t "Definite Door"

"" "Burn & Shine"

"Dream All Day"!

"Something That Isn't On Frosting On The Beater"!

"But That's What I Was Listening To Before I Put On Success, And Somehow Everything Came On"!!!!

The 1st 3 songs on "Frosting" are pretty outstanding. I don't really remember anything else by this band.

Solar Sister - beautiful tune with a T

...saw them this past may 18th in bellingham and had it reaffirmed that "any other way" is still one of the best songs ever.[although i will never understand the, 'don't feed the hand that bites you' lyric]

of note was the fact that no more than 100 people showed up in a bar that holds over 300 to see the 'electric' version of the posies.

Really? That's a shame. I only saw them once, on the Amazing Disgrace tour, but Rick Nielsen and Tom Petersson came out and they did "Surrender" with the Posies for the encore.

seeing that would have been really great.

...has anyone heard anything from ken stringfellow's new band the Disciplines ?

I just re-bought Frosting (for like 70 cents on Amazon!) and was listening to it today...man is that a killer album...I am very pleasantly surprised to see all the love for it here, I'd have thought yall would've written it off as occupying some unnecessary niche between Bandwagonesque and New Miserable Experiences...I still love it...my favourite songs right now are Love Letter Boxes and 20 Questions...but really every track is a winner

...has anyone heard anything from ken stringfellow's new band the Disciplines ?

― drone/a/sore, Monday, June 2, 2008 2:58 AM (7 months ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

apparently their album was released in Norway last year, but I haven't tried yet to see if it's possible to get it shipped to the U.S. anywhere online. didn't love the stuff I heard on their page but I still have way too much faith in KS to not want to hear the album.

HOLY SHIT YOU GUYS

http://theposies.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/18756_278594323075_45675118075_3262328_7732031_n.jpg

1. FROSTING ON THE BEATER. COMPLETE. LIVE.
2. NEW POSIES ALBUM FORTHCOMING.

in the shower just now a mix of farts and lavender soap made me think of their second album

― jergïns

remembrance from things passed

Farting on the Beater...wait.

always thought the posies were a disappointment - frosting was pretty darn good and I truly thought they would follow up with some mind blowing albums - never happened --

Saw Posies do the 'FOTB' full album thing this summer at some miserable street fest in Chicago - it was ragtag at best, I thought. Best shows I've seen of them are Jon and Ken doing the two guys, two acoustic guitar thing or them performing solo (esp. Ken).

How come no one has mentioned the magnificent (if somewhat atypical) "Flood of Sunshine"?

Really enjoying Every Kind Of Light right now, on a sunny afternoon.

new album blood/candy is many shades of excellent

I heard the song on spin.com and it was...different.

“Licenses To Hide” sounds JUST like the piano-driven stuff on Ken’s solo records, which is fine and I’m glad they seem into mixing up the Posies sound and not copying their ‘90s records, I hope it still sounds collaborative and not like solo album outtakes. Totally missed the thread revive in February, though, so the news of the new album caught me off guard the other day and I’m really excited, always hoped Every Kind Of Light wasn’t just a one-off.

Man, how did I never post on this thread? Posies are one of my ATF bands. For as great as Frosting is, Amazing Disgrace is their overlooked masterpiece, as it has all the hooks of the former with none of the Don Fleming. This song from that album is probably my favorite Posies joint. The lyrics and intent feel very Chris Bell-ish to me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDOoQj-kmOY

http://www.mondosalvo.com/blog/?p=396

I actually made a Posies post on mah blarg a couple days ago. Great Bee Gees cover people should grab if they don't already have it.

ATF bands?

Amazing Disgrace is a fantastic album, some days it's my favorite of theirs. i like the Don Fleming sound on Frosting, though, the kind of heavy/seasick guitar tones are an interesting mix with their pop instincts.

just guessing...All Time Favorites?

And yeah, I think Frosting is the best sounding Posies album (with a couple of their best songs being on there as well).

liking the demos that come with the latest album. "the glitter prize" is pretty classic

the new album is brilliant. they were electrifying in london a few weeks back.

very sad news. i took time to warm up to him since i was such a huge fan of the 2 drummers the Posies had in the '90s, but the 2 or 3 times i saw them live he did a great job with the old songs and hit some of the other drummers' fills that a lot of replacement drummers would never bother to learn. he's also all over Jon Auer's solo album (where he's credited as Darius "Take One" Minwalla, which seems like one of the most flattering nicknames a drummer could hope to have).

The picture of Ken Stringfellow on Spotify appears to be a pic of Alex Chilton?

Anyway- time for a vinyl reissue of Frosting?

"Help Yourself" from Dear 23 has so many cringey turns of phrase, but I love it anyway. Bless its little heart.

yeah there are really a lot of precious overly clever lines on the first two albums, became more intermittent after that

tbf, when I was 18, I thought it was some of the smartest stuff I'd ever listened to.

New album "Solid States" out next month.

Posies albums this century haven't really been on par with Ken and Jon's amazing solo stuff but this seems promising. First song "Squirrel vs Snake" features the line "I'm a furry, I'm a brony, I'm a breeder."

And here it is: https://soundcloud.com/theposies

I bought the Posies best-of this year, exactly the amount of Posies I wanted.

I once spent a nice evening chatting with Jon Auer, cool guy.

I thought the last Posies LP was their best since Beater tbh.

Watching them now on the 30th anniversary tour in Paton. This is wicked fun.

Great interview with Jon and Ken by Stevie, looking back on the band's history
http://thequietus.com/articles/25476-posies-interview

Mike Musburger is back on drums!?! I didn't know, now I'm a bit pissed off I didn't go see them last week :-/

Tempted to get the Frosting expanded reissue, lots of extras!
http://omnivorerecordings.com/shop/frosting-on-the-beater/

This was the second band I ever saw live. And it was based on them being played so much on 120 Minutes (Dream All Day). Also think back in the day Seventeen magazine did pretty good record reviews (Posies, Jellyfish, Teenage Fanclub, Camper Van B).

I am pissed off that I am missing them in London tomorrow due to work (and also, slightly, that I plumped for the vinyl reissues, which don't have the extra tracks) (but it will be good to own Frosting on vinyl again years after giving my OG copy away for love)

They celebrate 30th anniversary? But "Frosting on the Beater" was yesterday! Additionally they are in Berlin when I am not there! And they play in the nice Kantine am Berghain. Such a small and cosy location.

Horrifying.

https://kuow.org/stories/as-sexual-misconduct-allegations-dog-ken-stringfellow-of-the-posies-the-band-breaks-up

That's a terrible story, I'm glad those women came forward and that Jon Auer joined in their condemnation. It was also disorienting to see Scott Miller alluded to in that article (fortunately not as an abuser).

damn, that comes out of nowhere. never saw the posies, or rem with stringfellow. but definitely never will, that's for sure

It's telling that his band mates, who likely know him as well as anyone, immediately announced a break up when this came out. Which begs the question: what, if anything, were they aware of *before* the story came out? And I suppose the same thing can be asked of the members of R.E.M., with whom Stringfellow spent a lot of high profile time.

given that his exes had to compare notes about their private experiences to put this story together, the idea that any of this was conducted in public seems unlikely to me.

also that's a weird tangent to take this discussion, that IMO detracts from the original story

Are you talking to me? I don't understand.

What the band mates knew or didn't know doesn't seem exactly relevant to the rest of the story at the moment, is what I think sleeve is saying. Breaking up doesn't exactly beg the question either. You're jumping to conclusions a bit.

Coulter got word to the other Posies, including Jon Auer, who co-founded the Posies with Stringfellow. When Auer heard that his friend Kristine Chambers was among the women making an accusation, he called her right away. They spent nine hours talking over several days.

"I left the Posies very quickly after hearing from Kristine about what happened to her,” Auer wrote by email. “What she described to me was super disturbing, and it made my position immediately clear.

Like, this is exactly the right thing to do. And doesn't suggest to me at all that Auer had any indication that it was happening.

Michael Stipe is cancelled

I didn't mean to read too much into it or jump to conclusions, just that Stringfellow, according to the article, already had something of a reputation:

"And yet, Stringfellow had a reputation for pursuing women, and for bragging about having sex. Was it just locker room banter? Those who toured with him say now that they didn’t question it at the time."

I just found it surprising that his friends and bandmates in the Posies and REM, with whom he spent several months/years/decades on the road, in the studio, and so on, might have recognized at least some of the aforementioned behavior but not picked up on anything even more unseemly and/or illegal. Auer's first response (to his credit) was to hear out a victim and then break up the band, which shows how seriously he took her accusation, which made me consider that in addition to hearing out the victim maybe he might have already had an inkling, knowing at least some of Stringfellow's predilections. I concede that could be construed as jumping to conclusions, but while I suppose it's possible that somehow Stringfellow kept that side of him secret for decades, I think it's also possible that his fellow Posies or REM guys (and crew, etc.) maybe turned a blind eye, or that it fell under the rock and roll sex n drugs omerta. Or at the least didn't recognize (willfully or not) his behavior as being as bad as it apparently was.

(Heck, it was never fully revealed why Jefferson Holt left the REM team, was it? There were rumors it involved sexual harassment complaints, but they've managed to keep details under wraps.)

FWIW, I could totally imagine Stipe making it through all those years without even knowing Stringfellow's name.

sleeve otm -- speculation about who knew what and when is distracting from what actually did happen, which is clear from the link posted. I'm disappointed, I liked The Posies and at least one KS solo album. Add to the list of things I wish I didn't know bout men who make music I like :-/

Someone posted this on the TFC FB group, from the recent Posies drummer:

"Thanks for your message on TFC post. It wont let me reply. Someone commented that we must have known. I understand the assumption. But just so you know, we did not know. Yes, lots of women we’d see ken with but always appeared consensual. Even upon asking ken, he said he had an arrangement with his wife that allowed for that. As soon as we learned, we all left the band — prior to there being any mention or pursuit of an article. It’s a real shock, and devastating. And I appreciate your support through this. ❤️"

Thanks for that.

As soon as we learned, we all left the band — prior to there being any mention or pursuit of an article.

This was confirmed by Kristi Coulter, who I'm FB friends with and who is quoted near the end of the article, via a comment from her yesterday. As soon as the news hit both Auer and Siragusa were all "Fuck that and fuck him," as per the article, well before it ran.

That's sort of what I meant initially, that it all had to be so bad that they jumped ship and disbanded well before it all became public knowledge, back when I guess the accusations originally got back to *them*, though I wonder why news of the band breaking up waited this long. I saw that the drummer left "earlier this summer," and Auer August 4th. That was over two months ago. I suspect Stringfellow runs the Twitter account, because scanning back from present to August there's mostly announcements of solo gigs but afaict no mention of being, er, a solo act.

This is...involved.

https://www.facebook.com/babsmitchell/posts/10158318573672231

Wow.

Julie Gordon
It does not exonerate him, but it shows another side. This whole me too /cancel culture era of trial by newspaper article or gossip column troubles me. Just as I still am able to enjoy the humor of Woody Allen, I am sure I will continue to enjoy the music of the Posies.

Ugh.

This is...involved.

https://www.facebook.com/babsmitchell/posts/10158318573672231

what is it?

That's nonsensical to me; it's like Barbara Mitchell is saying, "this is the big chance to get public revenge against Ken Stringfellow, so my non-rape grievances should have been aired out in this article also"?

I mean it sounds like the dude was severely abused growing up and he’s probably repeating some of those same actions…when do we start offering help instead of just shaming these people? For me I’d say as soon as he owns up to it as the total denial line isn’t going to work for anyone.

sic:

Barbara J Mitchell:

just because it's karma doesn't make it true.

of all the people in ken's life, there's a good chance i have the biggest ax (ex?) to grind, as someone who has occupied positions ranging from best friend to manager to girlfriend to best friend to persona non grata.

KUOW reached out to me for this story. i told them the truth.

none of that is reflected in the story that's now published and circulating.

in fact, the reporter i talked to told me last night that i'd never told her that i had been in a romantic relationship with ken - which was one of the FIRST things i told her in clarifying our complicated relationship.

this is interesting, given the fact that the the quote about his charisma - attributed to an ex-girlfriend - came directly from my lips, quoting his ex-wife.

as i texted the reporter this morning, if they wanted to do a character assassination all they would have needed to do is talk to me and kim warnick. as i told ashley in the beginning, i've had a front row seat for some terrible behavior on ken's part - but none of that involved control issues or physical violence.

and admittedly, ken and i were not on speaking terms for a decade and a half. i can only speak to my own experience. so i gave them brian olson's info (as one of ken's close friends and a psychologist) and they never reached out to him.

if you're going to claim you objectively - as journalists - reached out to corroborate stories, why only seek out one side of the story?

and erase the voices of several of ken's partners - those of us who weren't having affairs with him but were in actual and publicly recognized relationships, which puts us in a significantly different category than the women in this story.

on my birthday in 2001, i tried to kill ken with a set of keys to our rental car for a number of reasons that are both hilarious and tragic.

if anyone has wanted him tried in the court of public opinion, it's me.

i think this whole story is shoddy journalism,.i have proof - am proof - and i will never trust the bylines of anyone associated with this story because they didn't follow the actual story.

i was raped by an ex who was also emotionally retarded/abusive. his name was darren, not ken. the reporter knew this - knew i had perspective and wanted justice served.

and yet.

i am friends with all four of ken's other significant exes. i contacted all of them. we all said the same thing - "not his m.o., doesn't seem like him."

did you read that in the article?

i strangely feel the energy that fueled the me too movement - the paralyzing anger that happens when your voice is ignored and/or distorted.

I TOLD THE TRUTH AND NO ONE LISTENED.

if you need reasons to hate ken stringfellow, just ask.

just do your fact-checking before you hit "publish" or "post."

before you react to shoddy journalism.

yes, he's a dick. just not the one portrayed here.

trust me; i KNOW.

Maybe I've lost the plot at some point in here, but it could also be very true that this guy treated casual flings very differently than the women he was in public, long-term relationships with. His exes saying "that doesn't sound like him" doesn't invalidate anything, imho.

That stuff is all ... wow. But none of them dispute the accusations, right? Just that he never acted that way around *them.* Which ... OK. But he clearly had a life separate from any relationship he was in, and his SOs apparently gave him a really long leash, so I don't see why they would be so shocked to learn that the same asshole that treated them like shit might have done worse to any of the many someone elses they pursued.

oof. yeah, her complaints are that she was accurately cited, and that her experiences over fifteen years ago trump other people's recent, specifically dated experiences. hope that she is able to accept that retribution for abuse suffered by other people affects her same abuser, and take some consolation.

A separate perspective:

https://www.onlyfrowns.com/frownings/happy-early-birthday-to-my-somewhat-famous-abuser

Now there's this:

I have made a brief statement about the allegations in the recent @KUOW piece. I know many people are hurting and please know I am deeply affected. pic.twitter.com/xnAfrgj54p

— Ken Stringfellow (@KenStringfellow) October 27, 2021

At least he didn't write "impacted."

barbara mitchell sounds like a nutcase, stringfellow sounds like a piece of shit, I don't like the posies and am glad they have broken up. case closed.

^^^

I loved the Posies, am disgusted by this story, and am glad they've broken up.

Jody Stephens just shared this on the Big Star FB page:

A statement from Jody Stephens:

I have read the NPR story and the accusations made by several women about Ken Stringfellow. I believe them. The hurt and abuse experienced by them is unimaginable. Ken has been removed from any participation in our upcoming performances that involved him.

I hope and pray that those survivors of his both physical and emotional abuse can find their ways to healing.

I hope and pray that Ken truly recognizes and sincerely apologies for the profound harm he has caused them and others. Taking responsibility for this abusive behavior and finding meaningful treatment are his only way forward for me.

- Jody

Apparently Mr. Stringfellow attempted an apology today. Sounds garbagey. Thread in response:

Ken Stringfellow issued an apology today in response to last fall’s multiple and corroborated sexual assault allegations. Specifically, he apologized for:

1) workaholism
2) partying
3) being on a “rock and roll bullet train”

— Kristi Coulter (@KristiCCoulter) June 8, 2022

Kristi speaks further on this via her FB page though that might be private.

I was digitizing CDs tonight and shouted out "are you fucking kidding me?!" when I noticed that The Posies had a track on the Home Alive comp from the 90s.

Sheesh.