sam smith: another adele/emeli sandé or something more interesting?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pB-5XG-DbAA

he's been hyped as the next big thing since the disclosure and naughty boy records hit uk airwaves over the past couple of years, and this year he has perhaps predictably smashed in the uk with two #1 singles and his debut lp currently sitting at #1 in its second week on the albums chart. meanwhile, following "la la la" and "latch" both belatedly becoming top 20 hits in the us in recent months (with the latter still rising) and "stay with me" fast-tracking its way up radio playlists into the top 10 (partly aided by clear channel's payola "on the verge" promotion), it appears he's slated for big things on this side of the pond too. the album releases stateside in a few days and hits sez it'll probably come in at #2 behind lana del rey's.

so obviously his commercial prospects are bright, but is he any good? or is he just yet another artist initially straddling dance and r&b before being revealed as the next iteration in 'new boring'? i don't love "stay with me" but i don't hate it either, and the track of his that was posted in the summer jams thread is actually pretty nice. for now i put him in a similar category to mnek in that despite having done some compelling stuff, often with other artists, his potential as a solo act remains mysterious to me.

but what say you?

The amount of leeway ILM gives not to pop (which is a good thing) but music which is nakedly designed to make a few people very rich (which only incidentally crosses over with pop) is somewhat depressing. This is obviously a load of horseshit (I'm listening to it, stifling hara-kiri) and not even interesting as a mass-cultural phenomenon. Just say no, ILM, find something else to listen to.

I'll say that it was momentarily catchy - I'm listening to something else, so have forgotten it - but while it was playing, it mined an incredibly simple chord-progression (that we wouldn't need goon tie to expose), used incredibly hackneyed (and annoying) gospel chorus tricks to add a bit of whoa-ohh, and generally did all it could to appease a short attention span and a cloyingly generalised sentiment. A song for all those who want a lover to stay with them, without nuance, complexity or ambiguity - just the words 'stay with me', on a sad chord progression, on a human face, forever! Buy my singles that so thuddingly compartmentalise your lives into easy-to-access emotional boxes!

Fuck all art like this.

"music which is nakedly designed to make a few people very rich"

the line here probably does not fall where you think it does

I mean, I know I have tendencies towards dismissing entire swathes of music as chum for hordes of idiots but I like to flatter myself into thinking that I express these opinions in a manner that doesn't make me come across like a total jackass who is less interested in music and more interested in being a smart tastemaker

sam smith: another adele/emeli sandé or something more interesting?

the first one

but is he any good? or is he just yet another artist initially straddling dance and r&b before being revealed as the next iteration in 'new boring'?

the second one

this guy suuuuuuuuuuuuuucks. "Latch" has been p much my least favorite track to hear out clubbing and I figured out how the chorus of "Stay With Me" went before I even heard it

just putting this here without comment:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1134509/City-banker-sacked-spending-company-time-sons-pop-dream.html

haha wait, what

(re: Sam Smith, I think he's got a great voice and I hope that one day he finds a song more interesting than the ones he's currently singing)

lol xps

wow no way

I'll admit I like some of his songs, like maybe a third of his album is good. Both "La La La" and "Money On My Mind" are obnoxious as hell though.

lmao

thank u katherine

it's the daily mail so I am sure certain aspects of this are exaggerated, but still. there was even a video for one of his early songs but it has dropped off the internet, maybe the last copy. also I didn't find this

sam smith is terrible (in a very boring way, in a that-mail-story-makes-total-sense way) but those lj posts are worse

lol ok the first post is vmic but i stand by the second one

Latch is great but it's goodness doesn't have much to do with Sam Smith.

I think Sande could write better and more exciting songs than the ones she chooses to sing, I don't think this guy has "Next To Me" in him never mind a "Heaven". Also if he doesn't have "money on his mind" and "does it for the love" then all his music should be free.

The UK has artists like Jessie Ware, MNEK, Katy B, Disclosure but they keep trying to send and promote to the US stuff like Jessie J, Ed Sheeran, Emeli Sande and now this dude.

yeah my beef is entirely with the artless pricks in the latter group, not the artists in the former. surely a defensible position?

'artless' as shorthand for 'i deeply suspect their motivations to be corporate'

I figured out how the chorus of "Stay With Me" went before I even heard it

― The Reverend, Friday, June 13, 2014 2:57 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah i got a couple bars into it and went wait, this is just "I Won't Back Down" by Tom Petty

"The UK has artists like Jessie Ware, MNEK, Katy B, Disclosure but they keep trying to send and promote to the US stuff like Jessie J, Ed Sheeran, Emeli Sande and now this dude."

to be fair, in my experience, US audiences (that is, people who do not post on ilx) tend to think the first group is uninspiring to actively awful, even when exposed to them -- except, lately, disclosure, and I wouldn't necessarily have called that.

it's chicken and egg, in other words -- do people really, really like sam smith because that's the guy they're promoting, or are they promoting sam smith because that's the stuff people really, really like?

Pretty obviously the latter IMO

Fair point. The latter certainly do appeal to the sensibilities of adult contemporary listeners more than the former do.

I have a stereotype in my head of who is into Jessie J and it doesn't match my stereotype of adult contemporary listeners. (Granted, this is largely because the biggest Jessie J fan I know is my gay sister-in-law, who now that I think of it is hugely into Cyndi Lauper as well so maybe I need to interrogate my stereotypes a little more closely)

lol i think that further piece of information doesn't exactly throw a wrench into it

poor choice of metaphor tbh

when someone young can pull off a nostalgic old soul vibe that appeals to moms and dads and grandparents, that's a license to print money (Josh Groban, Norah Jones, etc.). if that artist also appeals to some listeners their own age, doubly so (Adele, Alicia Keys, etc.).

I intensely dislike his voice. Dud.

i like "La La La" because the lyrics of the song fit his weird trembly baby voice

that's very insightful re: norah jones, alicia keys, etc. and i'm sure that phenomenon is at play here. at the same time tho i never would have guessed he'd have this amount of appeal among ppl his own age in america since, despite his hip dance track appearances, he's rather unstylish unlike adele and alicia

I intensely dislike his voice. Dud.

gotta say this was a shock

Latch is great but it's goodness doesn't have much to do with Sam Smith.

Not much, maybe, but some. Most everything else I've heard from him gives me major meh if not outright zzzzz, but if his star ascending is what it takes to turn "Latch" (which, again, I find myself on the exact opposite side of the spectrum from Rev when it comes to what I want to hear in clubs) into a surprise, belated hit in the U.S., so be it.

The amount of leeway ILM gives not to pop (which is a good thing) but music which is nakedly designed to make a few people very rich (which only incidentally crosses over with pop)

― Who whom kissed? (imago), Friday, 13 June 2014 19:01 (Yesterday)

this is a fairly serious false binary, also invites speculation as to which luminaries didn't suffer the taint of trade somewhere behind them

sam smith is despicable

I liked some of the stuff he did before the album ("safe with me", the disclosure / naughty boy features), but his sandéfication has been really dismaying and has played out so inevitably and inexorably. idk if that's who he always wanted to be or if the label pushed him that way and he just doesn't care because now he's getting $$.

one ancillary issue that i'm sort of glad has been cleared up to be a non-issue is that he was finally able to have his "coming out" moment in the "lover to lover" video. it seemed like pronouns were being used very carefully and the issue was being tiptoed around in the first couple of singles and videos even though it was this massive elephant in the room. are there any other gay pop stars currently in their prime that are as commercially successful as this guy?

i don't know how much to read into the stuff with his mum. he certainly wouldn't be the first pop star to have a pushy, wealthy parent.

this is a fairly serious false binary, also invites speculation as to which luminaries didn't suffer the taint of trade somewhere behind them

sam smith is despicable

― Little Saint Hugh of Lincoln (nakhchivan), Saturday, June 14, 2014 12:46 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

wasn't meant to be a binary. there's a heavy intersection, as I said, but 'pop' is the artistic process, whereas venal careerist cunts like sam smith who nominally trade in 'pop' are the charmless exploiter-figures who happen to have colonised *part* of pop & i have no idea why ILM pays them any serious attention at all, except as case-studies of stardom-seeking privileged above artistic creation (another phenomenon of our times!)

i'm aware that in saying that i probably strike discord with the majority of you stardom-junkies. something to be said for 'pop' incorporating stardom, performance etc as well - i receive it perhaps on overly musicological terms

he's a boring performer and his stardom is irritating. there, happy?

the bar for being the subject of a moderately well attended ILM thread is pretty damn low. as it should be. the idea that there should be a lofty cred test barrier of entry for being the topic of conversation around here is ludicrous.

eh, I'm kinda happy for this thread to exist so long as it's wall-to-wall abuse tbh, which it basically has been. kiu

yeah but you have lots of threads to abuse us in

how many pop threads do I wade into, all moron guns blazing semi-informedly? that's right - only the ones whose perpetrating artists are rudely emblazoned on every other fucking metro advert i see. and haim. ;)

haim had quite a lot of metro adverts here too, tbf

i'll probably end up kinda liking haim in ten years, yknow. they're a world apart from the horror of sam smith

wasn't meant to be a binary. there's a heavy intersection, as I said, but 'pop' is the artistic process, whereas venal careerist cunts like sam smith who nominally trade in 'pop' are the charmless exploiter-figures who happen to have colonised *part* of pop & i have no idea why ILM pays them any serious attention at all, except as case-studies of stardom-seeking privileged above artistic creation (another phenomenon of our times!)

― Who whom kissed? (imago), Saturday, June 14, 2014 12:58 AM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I have limited interest in this guy (though I am intrigued that andy k appears to like his album) but I think the idea that all these pop stars who veer adult-contemporary are just soulless corporate hacks is itself a product of wishful thinking about what our generation (in the broad sense) is "into", as if this sound can only be the product of corporate perversion of artistic intentions.

I fully believe that Smith is making the music he wants to make, and is being "true" to himself in a way that recording a whole album with Disclosure/Naughty Boy etc. would not be.

I'm just not dying with anticipation to hear the result.

venal careerist cunts like sam smith who nominally trade in 'pop' are the charmless exploiter-figures who happen to have colonised *part* of pop

case-studies of stardom-seeking privileged above artistic creation (another phenomenon of our times!)

none of these terms seem to make a lot of structural sense, art vs non art, non venal vs venal pop stars, careerist vs non careerist pop stars, the pop world which is colonized vs that part of it where its autochthons get along really well with one other, sam smith's debilities occur at the level of talent, the rest is implying dark motives and hideous character defects to one dumb looking face

i like your attack but it's too conspiratorial in this instance

florida man is gracious

this kid is very dumb but his music is good!

― J0rdan S., Wednesday, January 28, 2015 11:44 AM (Yesterday)

his music is dumb too, it's very obvious in a lot of ways, but it sort of works. i ain't mad

Even if you overlook the basic misogyny there it's a particularly galling example of unjustified rockism.

― Matt DC, Wednesday, January 28, 2015 8:09 AM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Not really. I mean, he is all of 20. He is exactly the right age for that sort of rockist attitude.

(What would be justified rockism?)

I only just heard/saw this for the first time, but I feel like white pop singers using gospel choirs in their songs should have ended a long time ago, a terrible cliche.

https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/12188945_10153207783877844_6062410356947556230_n.png?oh=9785fcf98e798e53395c9630312e3138&oe=56C9071E

https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/12065951_10153207783867844_3883925442568740776_n.png?oh=5fed85bc9f414fee1b61bf3fe1c7d33d&oe=56C3B11A

https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10562961_10153207783862844_222341386279053576_n.png?oh=8f1f6762197fc3661b8a6b4d0630c033&oe=56B42D8E

https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/l/t1.0-9/10985961_10153207783917844_6593474938330329148_n.png?oh=cf418acf0e9b7e91d607242210542089&oe=56BFC64D

booooo.

(booing "We will no longer play the Spectres song", for clarity yeah?)

IDGI. What is it about the other song that gives Smith's label/management team/whoever a legal claim against the station (however tenuous)?

Elvin Smith is Sam Smith's manager (one of three, anyway). I am faintly baffled that they'd be able to make 6 Music stop playing something that seems to fall within the demographic interests of the station. But if these emails are true, it's kind of a fascinating (and scary) look into how massive franchise tie-in bullshit marketing career-engineering works.

why has someone gone through the pretence of obscuring Bob Shennan's name in those emails

I'm with Tim F. Bob should let Elvin's lawyer come at him with all they've got, as I can't see that it'd'be much.

I privately brainstormed and the only thing I could come up with is if Radio 6 had been (jokingly) presenting the Spectres song as the "official new James Bond song" and - assuming consumer protection laws are roughly the same in the UK as in Australia - Sam Smith's management are saying that's misleading conduct. But it would be the presentation of the song rather than playing it that would potentially be actionable.

And if that was the case and it's not even properly identified in Smith's emails then IDK give up now dude.

(soz for being boring)

STAND DOWN!

UPDATE: The BBC has claimed that the emails are a hoax and the band has removed the FB post.

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/music/news/sam-smiths-manager-allegedly-bullies-bbc-into-stopping-playing-unofficial-spectre-theme-in-sickening-a6709091.html

Clearly Elvin has told Bob to say it's a hoax.

Baffled this fooled anybody for even a second.

Basically, this sort of thing goes on, but nobody's dumb enough to put it onto emails.

There's no way the 6Music guy would have said "Radio 6" in an email. And that's just for starters.

The Independent story above has been deleted (suspiciously!), here's a similar article.

Not suspiciously, apart from the UPDATE I posted above it all proved to be wrong.

Anyway, the mirror has it the band did a cover version. Which it wasn't, right?

I love music

— Sam Smith (@samsmithworld) November 6, 2017

lol

haha

New board description, 'As recommended by Sam Smith'.

well that's quite impressive after having to sing Too Good at Goodbyes 1000+ times

lol

just cringed through my initial responses to this thread. should have just called him a worthless hack and been done with it tbh

Less interesting than Adele/Emeli Sandé, amirite?

serious contender for most overrated debut of the decade

also nominating Hozier

did anyone actually rate his debut? or hozier's?

(i know they were both grammybait but that barely counts imo)

i'd like to belatedly apologize for starting this thread 3 years ago

hmm maybe just hype, Smith had an RS cover story and Hozier sold almost a million copies though

Every Sam Smith song sounds like a Kidz Bop cover of "Tears in Heaven."

— Louis Virtel (@louisvirtel) November 7, 2017

All noise dude summertime fun board and pickle bar
— Sam Smith (@samsmithworld) November 6, 2017

ban lj
— Sam Smith (@samsmithworld) September 20, 2017

I hate this guy's voice. It's like a more boring Justin Vernon.

Hozier by some distance better than this polished nothing

Is there a good reason this guy is being given one hours worth of primetime on BBC1 to plug his latest album? Licence Fee anyone?

people are cunts

No, I believe it's called "The Thrill of It All"

https://www.teenvogue.com/story/sam-smith-backlash-r-kelly-t-shirt-snl-afterparty

he's a fucking cunt moron, what do you expect. an insipid parasite

If you had started the thread like that we could all just have gone home.

Was a good read, though.

I thought I liked "Money On My Mind" but have checked it out again and the only good bits are when he isn't singing.

the bits where he whispers that he doesn't have: and that he does it for the love ?

Still, he's appealing to the people that like to sing loud songs about loving Money.

No, the instrumental coda only.

the bits where he whispers that he doesn't have: and that he does it for the love ?

jfc

It was on my top 50 tracks from the year, no idea why now, faintly embarrassing.

Just saw that t-shirt thing. What you said. xpost.

"how do you sleep?" is i think the second single of theirs in a row to have ended up growing on me despite initially leaving me cold