tipping

When I was young, someone sent a letter to Dear Abby (I'm pretty sure it was Abby, not Ann Landers, whose near-identical column also appeared in my local newspaper) complaining that person X always hung the roll of toilet paper with the loose end hanging off the back, not the front.

This one letter ignited more letters of response, over a longer period of time, than any subject ever raised in her column. It was a raging controversy that lasted for months. Proponents of front-hanging and back-hanging harangued one another ceaselessly, exhibiting a passion for this subject far in excess of anything one could have imagined.

Reading this thread reminded me of the Great Toilet Paper Controversy, for some reason.

There must be something appealing about tipping as a micro-drama - the way money, class, ethics, principles congeal into something that everyone has a take on. There are now over 1,000 comments for that NY Times blog linked to upthread...

mission accomplished for one dickhead blogger, sadly

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/02/26/hey-waiter-just-how-much-extra-do-you-really-expect/?hp&apage=43#comment-627205

^^^^^ <3 people who've just taken Macro 101

Hahaha, it comes w/a reading list.

Of course, for really bad service, it's preferable to leave a miniscule tip (like $0.05 or so) rather than nothing at all, so the server won't miss the point and assume you merely forgot.

"who figures he can pay you the minimum wage of $4.65 for servers"

still $2.35 in these parts iirc

$2.13/hour is the federal minimum wage for tipped employees. It is higher in some states, but if the employee's tips do not result in the employee earning the regular minimum wage for that state, the employer is supposed to make up the difference and bring the employee up to minimum wage.

oops yeah i think i meant $2.13

which hasn't changed since min wage for non-tipped employees was still sitting at $4.25. or before?

This is potentially interesting: http://www.dol.gov/whd/state/tipped.htm

Yeah, the fed min wage for tipped employees has not changed in a long ass time.

why are we responsible for paying waiters instead of the companies ;_;

first thing Imma do when Im president is toss waitstaff in with the rest of the workforce. NO MORE SPECIAL TREATMENT

SAN DIEGO — Charge a service fee on your restaurant menu, go to jail?

A year in custody is the maximum penalty North Park restaurateur Jay Porter could face in the wake of legal action the San Diego City Attorney’s Office is planning against his popular Linkery restaurant for allegedly violating the state’s unfair-competition laws.

Porter was something of a renegade when he introduced his no-tipping policy four years ago, but his mandatory 18 percent service charge on all dining bills is now heating up in the blogosphere and among fellow restaurant owners as word spreads about the pending city action.

While one University Heights pub owner said legal enforcement is well-deserved, many other restaurateurs say they’re mystified by the city’s decision to pursue a seemingly innocuous, albeit unusual, practice. Porter, who roused interest in the issue by posting it on his blog this week, has vowed to fight the City Attorney’s Office, which has offered to meet with him before taking action.

“We’re not going to change our business because the city attorney has an emotional problem with it,” said Porter, who opened The Linkery in 2005 and instituted the service-charge policy a year later. The surcharge, he noted, is clearly stated on a sign at the entrance and on the menu.

“What we’re doing is clearly honest, and we’re not defrauding anyone,” Porter said. “My plan is to keep being transparent so people can see what the city attorney is doing, because they’re certainly not acting in the interest of consumers. Let people make up their own minds.”

Assistant City Attorney Tricia Pummill stated that her office is strictly looking out for the consumer, who she said is increasingly being burdened with added charges during the economic downturn.

While there are no specific statutes governing tipping and service fees, Pummill said the state Business and Professions Code is clear about prohibiting retailers from misleading the public about pricing. In a letter to Porter, she cited a code section stating that a retailer cannot charge a price “greater than that advertised.”

Her office’s decision to pursue the service-charge issue was prompted by complaints from the public, Pummill said.

“In this recession, we’re seeing that businesses, rather than increase their prices, are indicating one price and adding extra charges,” said Pummill, who acknowledged that her office is seeing this practice beyond The Linkery. “We’re reacting to what the public is telling us, that ‘we’re tired of this and we want to be told the price we’re paying.’ What is the price if it doesn’t include the cost of bringing the food to your table or cooking your food?”

A blanket surcharge also violates state code provisions that ban businesses from making untrue or misleading statements about goods and services provided, Pummill said.

Daniel Conway, a spokesman for the California Restaurant Association, which learned of the service-charge issue yesterday, said it would study the matter for any legal implications for the industry as a whole. Conway said he was unaware of any restaurants that regularly include service charges as part of the diner’s bill.

In European countries, where restaurant gratuities are automatic, service may suffer, some believe.

“Once it becomes part of the guest check, you wonder whether the servers are motivated in the same way,” said San Diego restaurateur David Cohn. “If everyone went that way, it might work out, but I think people have been tip-jarred to death.”

Matt Gordon, another San Diego restaurateur, said that while he prefers the conventional tipping system, he cannot understand why Porter’s decision to tack on a service charge would violate the law. He and others noted that many restaurants automatically add an 18 percent gratuity to bills for large parties.

“I think it’s a little bit of a witch hunt,” said Gordon, owner of Urban Solace in North Park.

George Hauer, of George’s at the Cove in La Jolla, suspects that most restaurants would not follow The Linkery’s lead because consumers have long been accustomed to deciding for themselves how much to spend on the gratuity.

“People tip in our restaurants, in all the different levels, about 19.1 percent. But my guess is if you made it mandatory at 18 percent, people would get antsy and say, ‘I don’t mind tipping voluntarily, but I don’t want to be forced to do it,’ ” Hauer said. “But you wouldn’t hear me saying, ‘Right on — the city attorney needs to get on this.’ I don’t feel that way at all.”

That’s not the case with pub owner Scott Blair, who bluntly condemns Porter’s practice as a detriment to consumers.

“I think it’s third-rate grifting,” said Blair, owner of Hamilton’s Tavern in South Park and Small Bar in University Heights. “You say you don’t accept tips, but then you force an 18 percent tax on every check. I’m not from Cornell, but last time I checked, that’s a gratuity.”

Porter, who formerly worked in the high-tech industry, said he embraced the service-charge model a few years ago after deciding that it was a more equitable way to compensate his staff. Granted, his approach seems riskier during a recession, but he pointed out that one of the country’s most acclaimed restaurants, Chez Panisse in Berkeley, has long charged a 17 percent service fee on its customers’ bills.

Responding to a comment on his blog urging him to take a more “honest” approach, Porter shot back: “Some people, like you and, apparently, the City Attorney, are desperate to live in a world where table service has no cost, it’s just free, and a tip is some little bit extra that your server is just delighted to receive. This is a ridiculous fantasy.”

Sorry, didn't realize that was so goddamned long.

So yesterday I was gonna see if I could work this "buyback" thing but then the bartenders switched shifts after my second beer!! SIGH.

Stoopped reading halfway b/c WTF THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE:

In a letter to Porter, she cited a code section stating that a retailer cannot charge a price “greater than that advertised.”

Retailers advertise things all the damn time without tax included, are you gonna drop the Law Hammer on every store in the local mall?!?!?

“In this recession, we’re seeing that businesses, rather than increase their prices, are indicating one price and adding extra charges,” said Pummill, who acknowledged that her office is seeing this practice beyond The Linkery. “We’re reacting to what the public is telling us, that ‘we’re tired of this and we want to be told the price we’re paying.’ What is the price if it doesn’t include the cost of bringing the food to your table or cooking your food?”

Doesn't that apply to EVERY SINGLE RESTAURANT??!? Also wth where did she get "cooking your food"?

Some people, like you and, apparently, the City Attorney, are desperate to live in a world where table service has no cost, it’s just free, and a tip is some little bit extra that your server is just delighted to receive. This is a ridiculous fantasy.”

This man is OTM.

been in the US for 2 weeks and i still don't understand this.

I tried to observe what others do.. seems that

1) somewhere where drinks are expensive, you tip more.
2) somewhere where drinks are cheaper, tip less.
3) fast food/food to go, no tip
4) restaurant, 20%

is that generally right? 2) doesn't make sense to me still because i'd think those are staff who are in more need of the tip than 1) where they are probably paid better???? or is it just because more cheapskates go to 2) and thus?

I was at a casino bar where they have promotion a hot dog and beer for $3 - i have to pay the lot and then go to collect a hotdog with a voucher elsewhere. Do I tip the bar man AND the hot dog man? That'd make it $5 which would defeat quite a lot of the value involved..

What about when I check in/out of hotels where things were all prepaid? Do I tip the staff anyway??

How much to tip taxi drivers?? I can probably find all the answers by reading all the threads about tipping, but I'm on holiday!!

i think you're fine tipping 1 dollar (plus any coins) per drink until the drinks start being above $10....if i'm in a place like that i usually just tip 20% on the whole bill.

hotels--leave a tip for the people who clean the rooms--couple bucks/day i think is standard.

taxis--tip 15% or 3-5 bucks for most normal rides, whatever's easiest change-wise.

if you get a friendly taxi driver who you enjoy, wildly overtip them

Don't tip hotel desk clerks. I don't know about concierges, I'm not that uptown.

Tip bellmen if they take your bags to your room, a buck or two.

The hot dog/beer promotion sounds like it's designed to pry a full fiver out of your hand. ¯\(°_o)/¯

#1-4 are generally right. #1 and 2 may sound kind of off, but the tip is based on a percentage of the purchase price of the goods/services, not based on what the service staff makes, unfair as that might sound.

what CAD said about leaving a few bucks for the hotel housekeeper

Tipping hotel desk clerks in Vegas supposedly gets you a free upgrade ~75% of the time.

Ah, I didn't know that part. Haven't been to Vegas yet.

lol but the upgrade is at the shitty imperial palace hotel i think all it means is i'm going to get a mirror on the ceiling and a hot tub lol

http://www.imperialpalace.com/casinos/imperial-palace/casino-misc/luv-tub-room-detail.html

thanks for the info btw! i'm still perplexed about 1) 2) but if that's the way it is then it's all cool

this question isn't about whether i should tip, but how much i should tip.

if there's a delivery charge, do i tip 20 percent of:

subtotal+tax+delivery charge?

or just

subtotal+tax?

i'm going to tip on the tax anyway because i'm a chronic NICE PERSON.

quick question - is the delivery person standing at the door right now as you type?

hell no, i always work this shit out beforehand

I would just tip on the subtotal+tax, but that might be way wrong

that's my impression too.

I would fuck it and go to Olive Garden® instead

does not sound like a plan

http://bestlittlebookshelf.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/malcolmgladwell2.jpg

You tip 20% (subtotal + tax) - minus the delivery charge. The delivery charge comes out of your tip.

delivery charge != tip!!! the delivery charge goes to the restaurant, not the driver.

that's what they want you to think

When I delivered pizza, they charged the customers a $2.50 delivery charge per order. I got $1 per every order I delivered to compensate for gas, and I got minimum wage, and that was all. And actually, people tipped me really poorly more often than not.

Tipping on the delivery charge there would have been an extra $.50, not to much to palliate a nervous conscience. I just hand the pizza guy a $5 every time, and watch their eyebrows go up.

I always think delivery tip should depend on how much of a hassle it is for them to get to your house

yeah, for me working out appropriate tips for delivery vary anywhere from 15-40% depending on order size, distance, weather, time of day, speed, etc.

whether it's an african or european swallow, etc.

i delivered for jimmy john's in college. so many people assumed that the delivery charge went 100% to the driver (all i got was 5% of the total $ of food I delivered to cover fuel cost), that ANY tip was appreciated by me. if you're having angst over exactly what to base your tip on, you're already an A+ customer imo.

http://consumerist.com/2010/08/how-much-would-you-tip-this-dominos-driver.html

"On Sunday, people in sections of Charleston, SC, were up to their knees in flood water. But that didn't deter this driver for Domino's Pizza from making his deliveries.

According to the driver, when confronted with an 18-inch deep river of water between him and his destination, he ditched his shoes and to deliver the order of two medium pies and a 2 liter of soda."

They tipped him $4, what assholes.

I've already started tipping $2/first drink, $1/each additional drink but I'm trying to start tipping $2/each drink. But it's v difficult when you're making a very small amount of money.

Jesus, I wouldn't be ordering pizzas during a serious flooding situation, but if I did, I would feel obligated to tip at least the price of the pie.

It's great with pizza guys in Ireland... they don't expect tips, so if they get them they are pathetically grateful.

"There you are, my man, a shilling for your stout efforts", I say.

How much to Irish delivery guys get paid?

The same as Irish obstetricians, because delivering is delivering, amirite?

somebody was arguing with me about those delivery car services, you know like the black or gray cars in new york with nothing on them, saying the tip is included in the price. it's this far-reaching rumor in new york. i maintain that it is not included. you tip, just like any other service. people get heated about this.