Canadian Politics Thread

good thread!

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/08/06/the-press-gallery-making-the-liberal-party-seem-courageous-by-comparison/

That was a good link.

It was only yesterday that I realized that American federal income tax rates are actually more progressive than ours, even after Bush's cuts. Maybe you need to factor in deductions/credits as well as provincial vs state rates to get a true picture though.

I'm not sure who this guy is and some of his links don't work anymore but he looks at the deficit/debt question in a fairly detailed way.

This 2008 opinion piece from the Calgary Herald credits Mulroney for policies that ultimately lowered the deficit.

To partly defend Harper's govt, it does make some sense to run a deficit during a recession and to plan to lower it afterwards. Some of their spending/cutting choices do still seem questionable though.

Ontario govt ultimately shows no backbone on sex ed reforms.

This sounds good though.

So Omar Khadr's trial began yesterday. The government's refusal to bring him back to Canada despite his treatment at Guantanamo is truly shameful and inexcusable IMO.

The discussion on the US politics thread made me think it might be worth it to bring up Afghanistan here. I sometimes feel a bit alone in generally agreeing with Jack Layton's position on this and agreeing more strongly as the war drags on. Am I naive for wondering what anyone thinks the Canadian military can accomplish there in a combat role if the US military hasn't won the war by this point? I can see a valid role in humanitarian aid/rebuilding. Collaborating with a government (governments!) that tortures its detainees seems to undermine the whole principle of trying to establish human rights and democracy. The government's attitude towards the detainee issue has been appaling IMO.

More on the census:
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/08/11/census-rae-liberals.html
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/08/11/census-mandatory-long-form-fight.html

oh hiii forgotten thread.

So, Ed Stelmach won't be running in the next Alberta election. Should make for a very interesting 12-18 months of politics there, with the conservative stronghold waning somewhat and the Wildrose Alliance threatening to split the right vote in the next election.

There's not actually any way that could lead to a Liberal or NDP government though, right? Are we looking at some sort of probable PC (minority?) government with Wildrose opposition?

Kind of loving the Bloc's latest stunt: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/cough-up-arena-cash-or-kiss-quebec-votes-goodbye-bloc-tells-tories/article1882526/

Ignatieff appears to be following the time-tested Liberal strategy of campaigning from the left: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/michael-ignatieff-works-liberals-into-a-lather/article1882597/

Interestingly, the recent Conservative attack ads seem to be portraying Ignatieff the same way, as a "tax and spend Liberal", which is something I never thought about him. (Tbh, the ads are actually the first things to make me warm to Ignatieff!)

Ibbitson evaluates Harper's record, making some reasonable points: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/john-ibbitson/the-five-year-shadow-of-stephen-harper/article1878067/

I really highly doubt we'll see a Lib govt, let alone an NDP one, in AB anytime soon. At least there's potential for things to be shaken up a bit... only a bit, though, I would guess. It'll probably be one of those cases where people get really excited at the potential for change but in the end the conservatives will still get in with a decent majority. I'll be surprised if they don't lose at least a few seats in the process, though. And I'm very curious to see who comes forward for the Tory leadership.

not sure how Libs poll provincially in Alb compared to the NDP - but right now the only federal seat there not held by a Con belongs to the NDP. an NDP gov't would surprise me less than Lib right now. but seriously - that province is just going to go through the same motions of picking their next empty-suit conservative dictator.

this is a valiant lil' thread.

The AB legislature contains 8 (!) Liberals and 2 NDP members going by this site: http://www.assembly.ab.ca/net/index.aspx?p=mla_home

NDP support is pretty concentrated in Edmonton, I believe.

thank you for being unlazy enough to look that up for me.

looks like the Conservative propaganda has taken a toll on youtube! lookie what i found:

http://i753.photobucket.com/albums/xx177/tupac-chopra/Picture1.png?t=1296103770

i "disliked" the video fwiw.

Apparently the next provincial election in Ontario is going to be fought over the price of beer.

http://www.b12partners.net/mt/Mckenzie_Bros.jpg

Still amazed that it's not legally possible to purchase a six-pack after 5pm on Sunday in Canada's largest city. Toronto, Toronto. Quebec and Alberta are the only good provinces.

Do you think the beer pricing issue has legs? It's a matter of 6.7 cents per beer. Anyway, it looks like the Liberals have been closing the gap (perhaps the reason Hudak is targeting this populist issue?):
http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/adam-radwanski/polling-numbers-put-spring-in-ontario-liberals-step/article1892571/?service=mobile

Depending on how the NDP is feeling, we might still see a Liberal minority or accord in the next term.

What do you guys think of McGuinty's record? On the whole, I seem to be one of the few people who likes him. I think the Liberals have made major advances with the minimum wage ($10.25/h is quite impressive, compared to virtually any other jurisdiction on this landmass), community health centres (doubled in number), and green energy, as well as banning cosmetic pesticides. They've definitely made their mistakes though and their handling of G20 security was appalling. Hudak scares me tbh.

I'm a mindless, wishy-washy liberal, so McGuinty pretty much automatically has my vote. (My beer-drinking days are pretty much over, too, so they can't get my vote that way.) Shameful, but I pay far more attention to American politics than my own city, province, or country.

I agree with whoever-that-standup-comic was: Promise to bring back the stubby and win a majority!

Dragging cases of beer for blocks in the winter was pretty much a deal breaker for me ever staying in Ontario.

So... government in contempt of Parliament...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2011/03/21/pol-privilege-contempt.html#liveblog

I'll be very happy to go to vote if an election comes soon. Hopefully the NDP or Greens can field a decent candidate in my riding this time. Our MP, 4ndrew Saxt0n, doesn't have a top lip, and according to an insider I know, he wears tighty whiteys and sucks at hockey.

i wish those two parties would just fucking merge or something already.

And leave the Marijuana Party as the one you vote for instead of just spoiling your ballot?

Stalinist party all the way!

i wish those two parties would just fucking merge or something already.

NDP and Green? Why? They're not that similar ideologically and there would be little strategic advantage for the NDP in merging with a party that has never even won a seat in Parliament.

The NDP now has the reputation of the the least progressive of the main parties in sustainability/environmental issues. They could soak up most of the Green Party's support, which one presumably thinks would be more naturally predisposed to vote NDP than any other party, if they adopted some more enlightened policies around the issue. The NDP's union ties will probably ensure that will never happen though. NDP is looking more and more like a done deal every year really.

The NDP now has the reputation of the the least progressive of the main parties in sustainability/environmental issues.

?

Environmental sustainability has been a core issue throughout Layton's whole career, down to the house he lives in. He founded the Green Catalyst environmental consulting business and chaired the Toronto Atmospheric Fund. Of the seven chapters in Layton's Speaking Out, two are devoted entirely to environmental/sustainability issues. Even the NDP's whole economic platform has become focused around sustainability and green energy: http://www.ndp.ca/vision/economy . Their environmental platform has to be the most sweeping of the major parties': http://www.ndp.ca/vision/environment . The recent Climate Change Accountability Act (which died in the Senate) was an NDP initiative. Especially considering the Conservative record on the environment, this statement seems rather strange, sorry.

They differ from the Greens, however, in that the Greens have never been a labour/social democratic party. They have tended to favour raising consumption taxes and lowering personal and corporate income taxes. In fact, many of the founding Greens were old PCs. As such, I am not necessarily convinced that the Green Party's support would "be more naturally predisposed to vote NDP than any other party". (I always tended to believe the Idealistic Pragmatist on this actually: http://idealisticpragmatist.blogspot.com/2006/10/garth-going-green-makes-sense.html )

And again, I'm sure any of the major parties would want to wait for the Greens to actually win a seat (or actually manage to get more than 5% of the popular vote in an election) before they would consider merging with them.

This was the NDP stance on stimulus/bailout measures in 2008 btw: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/article708355.ece

I do not think that the Green Party are taking many votes from the Conservatives. Harper can be openly dismissive of environmental issues rather than having to pay lip service because it barely effects his support. Not so Jack Layton. Whether or not he would ever follow through on these policies is really in the realm of speculative fiction. I personally don't believe he would ever do any of these things if (LOL) he won an election. On a federal level the NDP are pretty much a fringe party. They have little or no influence or power. Provincial NDP parties in Nova Scotia, BC etc who have been placed in a position to actually push for environmental policies always flake out in the end. The way they dealt with the carbon tax here in BC pretty much finished them off as far as getting support from environmental groups. In NS this just happened: http://rabble.ca/columnists/2011/03/bad-forestry-meets-problematic-energy-policy-ns

BTW, the Greens got 6.78% of the vote in the 2008 election according to Wikipedia. The NDP got 18%. It makes as much sense to look at that from the Green perspective - why would they want to hook up with such an unpopular party? Especially one with so much negative baggage as the NDP?

The federal NDP holds the balance of power! Their pressure was likely a reason the Cons just agreed to renew eco retrofit funding.

I was arguing against a merger anyway.

(I'll read your link soon btw. I do actually generally feel that NDP provincial governments have been only as progressive as the Ontario Liberals tbh.)

i don't think you should blame jack layton for carole james' moronic decisions

No, and as I pointed out, Layton's environmental record does not only apply to the NDP platform. He was heavily involved with environmental issues as a city councillor and businessman.

why would they want to hook up with such an unpopular party?

because a large party like the liberals would swallow them whole and they would be on the fringes. a party that is *only* at 3x the Green's support level, like the NDP, would be way more inclined to adopt green policy/platform and candidates.

So... looks like we'll probably have an election, unless Flaherty actually amends the budget to an NDP budget... Am I crazy if I think the proposed budget actually sounded OK? I liked the tax credit for children who enroll in arts programmes.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2011/03/22/pol-budget-main.html
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2011/03/22/pol-budget-highlights.html

it's a classic "we know an election is coming" budget.

so i guess this leaves Harper with only a matter of days to prorogue parliament.

nah. prorogation is saved for things that would make the gov't look bad - you know, like attempts to defund all political parties besides the government, or hearings on government knowledge of canadian military involvement in torture of afghan teenagers. stuff like that.

They can't lose, anyway. They just rebranded The Government of Canada to "The Harper Government".

ya i know.
i have no idea why the opposition parties aren't making more of the Cons trend of using tax payer money to promote themselves. this "Harper Government" nonsense and having senators use the public purse to pay for Conservatives leaflets, etc etc...
like no wonder they have so much money than the other parties - they don't have to pay for their own promotion anymore!

I'd like to get excited about an election, but we all know that the Tories are getting elected again.

everything OTM about the NDP, they are a joke. Considering their complete lack of comprehension of anything remotely close to investment in science or hi-tech, then I have trouble taking seriously their platform of investing in renewable energies. I'm sure they couldn't care less about making investments in any real next-generation technology, as long as auto workers building gas-powered cars will be able to keep their jobs and build electric cars instead. Also, their foreign policy platform looks like something a first year university student might write on a napkin during coffee break.

this will make you happy, Barry.
since i've moved to Parkdale i'm now in Kennedy's riding and will be voting (ugh) Liberal this time around!

I'll be great to have you join the dark side!

I don't follow Canadian politics (at any level) as closely as I do American, so I may be way off here, but this seems like such a set-up for a PC majority. I'll vote Liberal, as I always do, but the PCs have two huge advantages: the majority of the public doesn't see the election as necessary, and, whether they deserve any credit for it or not, our economy is relatively stable compared to most countries. Canadian federal elections happen fast enough that sometimes something springs up and things get out of hand for one side, but I'd be surprised at any result except a PC majority.

Also, I think Ignatieff is our Kerry or Dukakis. I like certain things about him, chiefly that he's strong on the readin'/writin' stuff, but he doesn't seem to be an especially beloved figure here.

Harper's party is now all "C" with decidedly no "P". not even a little "p".

as for Iggy, i look forward to him getting replaced after another election of accomplishing very little. i always thought of him as a Kerry aswell!

Hasn't one of the knocks on Harper been that he's been moving to the center?

(from conservatives)

that's their knock on everything that's not Glen Beck. and thb i haven't heard that in years - not since he 1st became PM.

what i do hear still on occasion from the Cons that i do know is that Harper and his cronies are still too far right for their liking. you don't hear alot about them but there's still a bunch of old PC'ers lost in the wilderness.

Might've accidentally had the TV on Global news when I heard that. Gotta be careful.

Love the last comment. Global ("communications," not the news department) was the only place that ever fired me! This was 1989...Apparently I wasn't paying proper respect to Major Dad or something like that.

I'm a little puzzled why Gordon Brown couldn't walk around the pack of MPs. There was plenty of open aisle.

imagine being an oppo politician and having to act like you gaf about this

come on trudeau is basically jian gomeshi

The manufactured outrage around this is hard to swallow. And Brosseau acting all Celine Dion, choking back tears about how she was assaulted — by a self-purported feminist, no less! I was expecting something like the guy who elbowed the Trump protester in the face.

I'm a little puzzled why Gordon Brown couldn't walk around the pack of MPs. There was plenty of open aisle.

Was he trying to? My impression was that he and other MPs were sort of dawdling and chatting. I'm not entirely clear on what JT's issue was, whether it was just that for some reason, he wanted them to pick up the pace? If anything concerns me, it is more the way JT accosted Brown, which is Royal Galipeau level. Elbowing Brosseau was definitely unfortunate but almost definitely an accident, although it wouldn't have happened if JT hadn't lost his temper in the first place.

Lol, breakdown: http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/canadian-politics/what-happened-in-the-house-of-commons-a-scene-by-scene-look-at-trudeaus-confrontation

Looking forward to Oliver Stone's three-hour HoC.

Multiple elbowers!

Tom Mulcair:

http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BMjE2ODEyOTU2NV5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwOTA5MjIzOA@@._V1_UY317_CR4,0,214,317_AL_.jpg

why did trudeau want to hurry things along? was brown trying to win over some votes against trudeau's assisted dying bill?

why did trudeau get in a word fight with mulcair? or was this just built-up anger from earlier this year?

i couldn't really give a shit. all this faux outrage is what's pissing me off. a bunch of jackass partisans acting like fucking children. their over reactions are dishonest to the point of being offensive. i think i'm done with the NDP. screw these clowns – when i saw how they were acting, I don't blame Trudeau one bit for losing his patience. i think most Canadians would have reacted way angrier if they were stuck in a room with that fucking behavior.

one dipshit conservative (Alberta) MP likened Trudeau's behaviour to that of a fucking drunk driver. that one had me livid. we just lost some friends of the family (almost an entire family – three very young children and a grandparent) to a drunk driver. i was kind of not-too concerned with what was going on until i saw that and totally lost all. fuck all these faux outrage assholes. i'm so fucking mad a bout that drunk driver comment. Elizabeth Fucking May is the only voice of reason here so far.

it's a step up from proroguing parliament

i think it was about the liberal attempt to make the parliament even more majoritarian...which while not as bad as proroguing, is not great: http://www.thetyee.ca/News/2016/05/19/Parliamentary-Brawl-101/

trudeau would have been so self-righteous if harper ever pulled anything like this

Elizabeth Fucking May is the only voice of reason here so far.

Agree with this btw.

Still working out what I think of the actual assisted dying bill (which seems to have gotten forgotten in all of this).

so the senate, rightly as far as actually complying with the SCC ruling, wants to amend the assisted dying bill so that it is available to people who are not necessarily close to death, and trudeau gov and jody wilson-raybould the justice minister (and mp for my riding) are not too happy.

also electoral reform, what the heck is happening with that?

i am personally a fan of mixed-member proportional representation but that would p much guarantee that neither of the big two parties would ever have a majority government so that will never happen

i haven't followed the assisted dying bill's journey at all. most of my attention when it comes to can pol news has been focused on ridiculousness of vancouver's and toronto's housing market.

I feel like im burned out on the housing market stuff living here in Vancouver as it justs dominates so much airtime and column inches. I know I will never be able to afford to buy here, luckily for me im not from here, nor do I want to live here long-term. I do feel awful for the people that I meet who grew up in Vancouver and can't hope to remain in the city if they want to be a homeowner.

Also obv there's homelessness crisis, which is just getting worse, and the affordability of renting, which isn't exactly great either (tho tbh the rent prices while steep are not as exorbitant/crazy as prices of buying real estate) and these things are not unrelated to the housing market. also the sheer amount of poor people on assistance who have the most abominable housing (rat and bedbug infested SRO rooms for $450 pcm)and pay half their monthly welfare check :/ but no level of government is going to do anything about that, as that would involve building livable social housing (and I guess the crazy real estate prices don't help in securing land for such housing).

I have real misgivings about any policy (including the current status quo) that allows assisted suicide for some people but not others, on the grounds of disability.

STV is probably my preferred voting system but I think people are realising (as we did years ago on this thread) that reforming the electoral system might likely require a constitutional amendment.

Time for a new thread? There are over 2000 posts on this one.

Makes sense. New(ish) government, new thread.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/canada-now-the-second-biggest-arms-exporter-to-middle-east-data-show/article30459788/

utterly disgusted by this

sunny ways

Because It's 2016: Canadian Politics in Sunnier Days