Bale at just gone 21 is as good as and possibly better than Cristiano Ronaldo was at just gone 21. Admittedly Ronaldo then shot off into the distance straight after the 2006 World Cup.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 12:44 (thirteen years ago) link
Wilshere is the most interesting of these players, will start a thread about him later if someone else doesn't. Bale may be hyped but he's already proven himself to be at least a very good player.
Cristiano Ronaldo at 21 led Portugal to a world cup semi-final....no comparison there.
― Terminal Boredoms (nakhchivan), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 12:46 (thirteen years ago) link
And you dont teach pace.
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 12:44 (2 minutes ago) Bookmark
First yard is in the head, that's something you can teach.
― Inspector Anthony Slade, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 12:47 (thirteen years ago) link
Yeah but that was sort of the making of him. Obviously Bale isn't anywhere near the quality of post-06 Ronaldo but at this stage of his development he's getting close to pre-WC2006 Ronaldo. And Ronaldo had several more years of regular Premiership football under his belt.
NB I do not actually think Bale will ever be THAT good, given how superhuman Ronaldo's development was after he hit 21.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 12:49 (thirteen years ago) link
not to aaron lennon
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 12:49 (thirteen years ago) link
not usually one to cosign ahh's wild claims but ramsey really is (was, whatever) a terrific footballer and has been ignorantly dismissed here.
― r|t|c, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:08 (thirteen years ago) link
Not as good as Bale though. And not really comparable either.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:22 (thirteen years ago) link
I'm not saying he's not good, just has in no way done enough to be pronounced as better than a first team cl player...
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:26 (thirteen years ago) link
this thread has gone fucking nuts today. yes i obviously believe that it is some conspiracy when people have opinions different to my own ronan. and not because bale has spent most of his career so far (up until about six months ago) looking like a liability who is still often shut out of games by mediocre players (see: rafael at the weekend). woohoo he scored a hatrick against inter when they'd fallen asleep after spurs (incl. bale) were so shiiiit they won the game after like 5 min.
Bale is one of the twenty best left wingers in the world and may one day be the best. But to say he is as good as one of the ten best players of my lifetime like Ronaldo at a similar age is wrong, to live and breathe as Paddy Barcley is even worse.
He still needs to work on his all-round game and being involved for 90 minutes every week. This is where I think Ramsey has the punch on him. Both can defend, both can score beautiful goals and perplex an opposition midfield but Bale relies on VDV or Modric to do the hard graft for a lot of the time while he waits for the opening. Like I said upthread, he reminds me of Pires a lot in this way. (And sure, as he gets more experience and has to spend more time in front of someone like BAE - this will dramatically improve; Pires could get away with it because he had Vieira next to him and Cole behind him). Ramsey has better concentration and better teamwork skills to go with his other abilities.
You are taking it as if I am saying Bale is a bad player or something and I'm really not. I don't believe either are yet World Class but both can get there very quick. Bale is certainly a joy to watch atm and if he keeps improving at this rapid rate then he could be one of the best of his gen.
(Ramsey was a first team CL player! Long before Bale and earlier in life! And then he was Shawcrossed! And I guess Rosicky getting back to full fitness instead of retiring in his recovery didn't help.)
― gazza bale flame (a hoy hoy), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:49 (thirteen years ago) link
'ignorantly dismissed' how? Pointing out that bale was a shadow of himself a year ago hardly counts as that, i hope, and i don't know that anyone else was much harsher.
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:50 (thirteen years ago) link
Also don't know if regular first team CL player means anything considering it wasn't long ago Lucas was one?
― gazza bale flame (a hoy hoy), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:51 (thirteen years ago) link
wasnt any good tho?
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:52 (thirteen years ago) link
I don't even believe you believe yourself tbh.
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 13:59 (thirteen years ago) link
Welsh guys told me Ramsay would be better than Giggs, while Bale was more like a Welsh SWP so but to be honest, I don't think either of them are all that special yet. Still, I've double-winning standards to maintain and am hard to please.
― isn't house rubbish and Pete W mental (Pete W), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:04 (thirteen years ago) link
But to say he is as good as one of the ten best players of my lifetime like Ronaldo at a similar age is wrong
Ronaldo at a similar age (before the 2006 World Cup at any rate) wasn't actually one of the ten best players of your or anyone else's lifetime. He got a lot better very very quickly but he was a classic "needs to work on his end product" player for several years.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:05 (thirteen years ago) link
bale is almost as good as a onefooted ronaldo
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:08 (thirteen years ago) link
Gareth Bale's spectacular performance yesterday was a superb smokescreen for the fact Spurs' other players largely also had superb games
― p neville imo (acoleuthic), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:09 (thirteen years ago) link
Just give bale his moment, he has impressed on the pitch beyond doubt, not just in the inter games but last season too. It's just needless one eyed stuff to insist an injured player who plays in a diff position anyway, is "better". Ramsey may well be world class in his own time.
Oh I just saw the Lucas bit. Lucas is actually prob one of the best young holding midfielders in the world and proof of how underrated Rafa was in the transfer market.
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:09 (thirteen years ago) link
SWP is the most ridiculous name to have come up so far.
I don't even think Bale is the best player in the Spurs squad fwiw.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:10 (thirteen years ago) link
xp Yeah but he doesn't play like a proper Brazilian.
― The referee was perfect (Chris), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:11 (thirteen years ago) link
Modric >> Bale
― p neville imo (acoleuthic), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:21 (thirteen years ago) link
Modric >>>>> Ramsey
correct
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:23 (thirteen years ago) link
lucas better than them all obviously,
pacheco better than modric tbf
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:28 (thirteen years ago) link
Lucas > Modric > Bale > Ramsey > Wilshere > Malouda (doesn't understand "passion")
― Inspector Anthony Slade, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:29 (thirteen years ago) link
Ivanovic would eat the lot of them.
I quite like Lucas.
― isn't house rubbish and Pete W mental (Pete W), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:32 (thirteen years ago) link
quite like him myself but this 'he's a great player you just dont know football' is bollocks imo. He's doesn't do anything well enough to deserve mention yet, and if he has talent he's not yet shown a sustained ability to prove it at liverpool.
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:38 (thirteen years ago) link
malouda is brilliant, wouldnt compare him with bale- dont think he's a winger, he's the left man in a front three at his best. But he's awesome. If bale can get to his level of effectiveness this past year he'll be a real player
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:40 (thirteen years ago) link
says a lot about malouda that he endured a difficult start after arriving with so much hype and fought his way up to playing at such a high level. good thing liverpool didn't win that transfer battle, rafa prob would have ended his career.
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:47 (thirteen years ago) link
malouda and drogba both, and maybe mikel- he's been much improved this season
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 14:50 (thirteen years ago) link
It's been quite a common feature for Chelsea signings to take a while to get going - I can think of it happening with Drogba, Malouda, Mikel, Essien, Zhirkov, Ivanovic, Ashley Cole, Anelka and perhaps Kalou. Think this will also be the case with Ramires, who has already been written off by fans with shorter memories.
Just about the only player to hit the ground running in the last few years has been Boswinga. Deco started and finished brightly, but was shit in between.
Arsenal players, with the possible exception of Nasri, seem to make a massive initial impact, which makes it all the more noticeable when some of them start to tail off (Vermaelan, Clichy, Arshavin, Eboue, Reyes).
― isn't house rubbish and Pete W mental (Pete W), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 16:27 (thirteen years ago) link
liverpool signings tend to play at a fairly consistent level from the time they join till their transfer to bursapor.
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 16:33 (thirteen years ago) link
AKA Doing A Ballack
― isn't house rubbish and Pete W mental (Pete W), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 16:36 (thirteen years ago) link
Yeah struggling to think of many recent Chelsea players who made an immediate impact... Anelka maybe?
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 16:39 (thirteen years ago) link
Took Anelka a while, was used badly by Grant and possibly Scolari (although he scored under Scolari). Certainly wasn't playing anywhere near as expansively as he has under Hiddink/Ancelloti.
A lot of this is to do with the fact we had two shit managers in a row (Grant/Scolari) who couldn't get the best out of anybody.
Alex and Boswinga are possibly the exceptions.
― isn't house rubbish and Pete W mental (Pete W), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 16:42 (thirteen years ago) link
essien took off very well for a central midfielder, i thought?
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 16:53 (thirteen years ago) link
duff was good quite quickly for chelsea...carvalho?
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 17:00 (thirteen years ago) link
Essien was typical actually, excellent first few games then went off the pace badly (very much tied to his two awful tackles v Bolton and Liverpool). Took him a while to get his mojo back.
Hadn't really counted those that had been and gone, in which case the key evidence against is Robben, who was incredible for the first three months and then never quite hit those heights again, and when he did, Wes Brown would kick him.
― isn't house rubbish and Pete W mental (Pete W), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 17:03 (thirteen years ago) link
Anyway, back to Bale, one thing that people used to talk about a lot was his skill with a dead ball, and I remember a couple of amazing free kicks in his early days but not much since.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 17:05 (thirteen years ago) link
Anyway, back to Lucas - I like him too. It pained me to see them trying to punt him to Stoke in the last window.
― Ismael Klata, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 17:05 (thirteen years ago) link
bale's free kicks are taken by vdv, kranjcar, modric amd bae! These days. Not sure why.
Also we simply dont ever get any in that area, dont ask me why. Game against everton lately case in point.
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 17:10 (thirteen years ago) link
http://twitter.com/landondonovan/status/29521618232#
― mizzell, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:12 (thirteen years ago) link
:DDDDDDD
― acoleuthic, Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:14 (thirteen years ago) link
blue horseshoe love anacott steel
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Wednesday, 3 November 2010 19:26 (thirteen years ago) link
http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/03112010/58/champions-league-bale-orders-taxi-maicon.html
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Thursday, 4 November 2010 03:23 (thirteen years ago) link
102 players have more assists in the Premier League than Gareth Bale this season. He has 0. Alex Song more goals too. Hmm.
― cozen, Thursday, 4 November 2010 07:42 (thirteen years ago) link
unfair. Stats also show he's created more chances than any other players, but our strikers have been terrible.
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Thursday, 4 November 2010 09:43 (thirteen years ago) link
where do you get your stats from? been using thishttp://soccernet.espn.go.com/players/stats?id=77653&cc=5739
― cozen, Thursday, 4 November 2010 10:13 (thirteen years ago) link
football365 had it in one of their geekstats columns a week ago iirc, caught my eye.
He's also scored and set up a few in europe i think no stats to hand tho
― cant believe you sb'd me for that (darraghmac), Thursday, 4 November 2010 10:17 (thirteen years ago) link