avant-garde anachronism in old paintings

Bridget Riley and the Old Masters

http://www.taschen.com/media/images/480/default_xl_matisse_covers_0907301203_id_279942.jpg

it's like Flash animation!

I'ma go through the rest of Crary's list here:

http://www.website.com/yourimage.jpeg
Friedrich Overbeck, The Painter Franz Pforr (yowsah!), c. 1810 (reworked 1865?), oil on canvas
Nationalgalerie, Staatliche Museen zu Berlin

http://experimentiv.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/self-portrait-or-desperate-man-gustave-courbet.jpg
Gustave Courbet, The Desperate Man, 1844-1845, Oil on canvas, Private collection

Courbet pumped out a few paintings so naughty I can't post them here lest it turn into a NSFW work. But GIS his Origin of the World (which Lacan owned!).

http://fontdenimes.midiblogs.com/media/01/02/9e8f3ac346b6b0f2bbee5dc3482af206.jpg
Paul Delaroche: La Jeune Martyre (The Young Martyr), 1855

Man, these dudes dug their Ophelia types!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b4/Ernest_Meissonier_-_End_of_the_Game_of_Cards_.jpg
Jean-Louis-Ernest Meissonier, The End of the Game of Cards, oil painting, n.d. (ca. 1870?)

And Whoa! Check THIS out! Here's Meissonier's portrait of Leland Stanford, the bigwig who commissioned Muybridge's photo experiments! (Head spins)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a9/Leland_Stanford_p1070023.jpg
Jean-Louis-Ernest Meissonier, Leland Stanford, 1881 Oil on canvas, Iris & B. Gerald Cantor Center for Visual Arts, Stanford University

http://www.cnoilpainting.com/upimage/201003150827186971_s.jpg
Wilhelm von Kobell, Riders on Lake Tegernsee, 1824 (I think)

http://hereswhatsleft.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/cross_cathedral.jpg
Caspar David Friedrich, Cross and cathedral in the mountains, 1812, oil on canvas

Could image bomb this thread with just Friedrich.

http://www.shafe.co.uk/crystal/images/lshafe/Gerome_Pygmalion_and_Galatea_c1890.jpg

Jean-Léon Gérôme also image bomb-worthy.

http://www.english.emory.edu/classes/Shakespeare_Illustrated/Delacroix.skull.gif

Eugène Delacroix. Hamlet and Horatio in the Graveyard, 1835, Oil on canvas, approximately 39 x 32 inches. Städelsches Kunstinstitut, Franfurt, Germany.

Again with the Hamlet!

http://www.all-art.org/neoclasscism/overbeck01.jpg
Friedrich Overbeck, The Painter Franz Pforr (yowsah!), c. 1810 (reworked 1865?), oil on canvas
Nationalgalerie, Staatliche Museen zu Berlin

good stuff, dude

that cat is fukkin tiny

also

http://hereswhatsleft.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/cross_cathedral.jpg

\m/

inverting influence so that each act becomes anticipatory
Gaddis' last book is partly about this.

disregarding the historical context and creating "weirdness" by mapping contemporary ideas of weirdness onto work which is coded with its own contemporary meaning.
What if its contemporary meaning was "weirdness"?

I think people got this thread right away. they basically understood at least a few of the points you bring up.

I'm not well versed in art history, so can someone explain why all these realistic portraits are supposed to be examples of "avant-garde anachronism"?

http://nedavanovac.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/aubrey_beardsley.png

I don't understand it either, Tuomas. But I'm also not well-versed in art history.

neat thread. totally got what thread-starter was looking for even if the title was ripe for tearing into.

titles just get ppl thru the door

pretty retarded to cavil about it when ppl obv 'got it'

ilx thread and not curated exhibition etc

friedrich is interesting....sometimes seems excessively lurid, sometimes justifiably so

wow this thread is the best, more please!!

more satisfied customers

http://artinvestment.ru/content/download/news/20081219_aubrey_beardsley_the_platonic_lament.jpg

damn, never heard of aubrey beardsley before

thought cozen's post was some manga ish he posted for lols initially but no, ab died of consumption in 1898 at the age 25 ;_;

I really like this thread and do see that people 'get it' as much as they need to get it, but I wouldn't mind those who are posting adding a bit of explanation for each picture, even if it's as facile as "surrealism before surrealism". For instance, I'm not sure how the Ophelias are avant-garde anachronism even in the looser sense - is it just that they come before the pre-Raphaelites or something? Also, there are a few that I get but can't think of the name of the school they influenced, as I'm not an art history buff, so would appreciate those who are more educated in the field to point me towards the answer.

Also, nakh, WAHT? Are you joking about not having heard of Aubrey?

Beardsley drew some quality porn iirc, friend of Wilde and other party guys

yeah well obv it doesn't ~have to~ have anything to do with yr core 20th century avant-garde movements tho obv they predominate in the popular conception of things, i mean if you find a 200 y/o lithograph with a proto-lolcat then even better

i'm not sure what milais' ophelia suggests either....it's an early pre-raphaelite work and obviously influential within that movement....

Also, nakh, WAHT? Are you joking about not having heard of Aubrey?

― emil.y, Thursday, 2 December 2010 12:44 (5 minutes ago)

the name is familiar but nothing beyond that!

I thought of posting Lowry's seascapes here but obviously they're après la lettre. Fascinating exercises in minimalism tho if you've not seen them.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_bFFjCDvr2EY/Sw_jD0DrsxI/AAAAAAAAOg4/1qS6EO2huhI/s400/seascape+lowry.jpg

Not what you'd expect from the guy if you only have a passing knowledge. The one I've seen in real life was much more monotone than this, even.

Some outsider stuff might fit, eg Louis Wain (1860-1939), starts as Edwardian jolly Cat artist (so in fact an important ancestor of the poker-playing dogs school of art), goes mad, gets locked up, the cats become v 60s psych. These pics show the development (tho' there are lots of args abt whether the pictures & his mental state run parallel, I dunno, I'm not up on it).

http://27.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lblgadUUt61qae9wfo1_400.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/ims5f9.jpg

XP yes, also lolcat ancestor

catowl? owlcat?

http://storage.canalblog.com/68/96/119589/36314457.jpg

^ Theodore Gericault ca. 1818. This feels quite modern to me in the whole weird intense blankness of their doll-like faces. That one chunky arm makes me think of Fernand Leger too, and the tubular kind of way that he painted body parts (cubism I guess?).

also the lad on the right appears to be holding a gat

on the left i meant. ow my head.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a9/AlexGraffito.svg/450px-AlexGraffito.svg.png

world's first MSPaint art

kinda cavilling at "it's just the internet, eh, don't get so wound up" tbh - you should know by now that this board will seriousify any attempt at silliness, and the other way round

"lighten up" is just such a disappointing comeback for so many reasons

how about "get a grip"?

there has been a misidentification of the cohort that "gets" what is being discussed on this thread

Robert Lazzarini's sculpture of the anamorphic skull

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/42/124783383_1049751f2d.jpg
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/41/124783486_3f4bcb29a1.jpg

<3

whoa

my brain hates teh way that looks

he's been mentioned already, but: piranesi's carceri - cf. escher, ico:

http://im-possible.info/images/art/classic/piranesi/carceri-xiv.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/29/Piranesi9c.jpg

(of course piranesi was an admitted influence on ico)

I forgot Gleyre from the Crary list.

http://artmight.com/albums/2010-09-11/1001-Orientalist-Art-Paintings/Charles-Gleyre/Charles-Gleyre-Egyptian-Temple.jpg

Marc-Charles-Gabriel Gleyre, Egyptian Temple, 1840, Oil on canvas, 14.17 x 19.29 inches [36 x 49 cm],Musee Cantonal des Beaux-Arts, Lausanne

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_DtsajQefh2s/Rlme93QcrlI/AAAAAAAAEq8/e7G_WRFE4ag/s1600-h/Gleyre_Danse_Bacchantes.jpg
La danse des bacchantes, 1849, Huile sur toile - 147 x 243 cm, Lausanne, Musée cantonal des Beaux-Arts

And yo check this:

"Despite the sensuality of such works as La Danse des Bacchantes (above, from 1849), Gleyre was reportedly celibate his entire life. For him, the flesh painted on the canvas in mythological scenes always remained a myth, an unfelt abstraction. Gleyre earned a reputation for perfectionism that many of his students took away from his atelier. The way that Gleyre returned again and again to the same works can be seen, for example, in Monet’s obsessive series of water lilies, haystacks, cathedrals, etc., etc. Gleyre and Monet differ widely in style, but their commitment to depicting a personal vision is exactly the same."

Also: "Renoir loved Gleyre specifically for the free hand he gave to his students—allowing the young Impressionists to paint outdoors while he preferred working in the studio from memory."

From here

Grrrr.

http://www.latribunedelart.com/IMG/jpg/Gleyre_Danse_Bacchantes.jpg
Marc-Charles-Gabriel Gleyre, La danse des bacchantes, 1849, Huile sur toile - 147 x 243 cm, Lausanne, Musée cantonal des Beaux-Arts

Again, like with the realistic portraits, I don't see what's the "avant-garde anachronism" in that one? Looks pretty much of its time to me.

http://www.sauer-thompson.com/junkforcode/archives/2008/06/10/FriedrichCDmonkbythesea%2Cjpg.jpg
Caspar David Friedrich, Monk by the sea, 1809/10, oil on canvas

Tuomas I'm with you on that in regards to several of the things that have been posted ITT without explanation.

Wonder what Crary would make of Bouguereau (since we already know what Berger made of him):

http://www.sexualfables.com/images/Bouguereau-The-Nymphaeum.jpg

So much gorgeouness in this thread! Couldn't give a whole fig tree what the concept is, keep em coming.

i included those specific felix vallotton examples (the woodcuts now behind pagebreak) with latter-half 20th c. graphic novels & comics in mind.
i found it uncanny that by inherent stringencies in their production that they should take on that weird, relaxed 'fluid realist' style of inking beyond the 1950's mode of production in comix draughtmanship. something about seeing their monochrome rendered on a monitor makes them look totally natural being seen for the first time on like, a computer.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_rC2EkOOmAX8/RsdrkfQBuII/AAAAAAAAAns/Q4GpmTdz3DY/s320/vallotton_le_violon.jpg
http://giam.typepad.com/100_years_of_illustration/images/vef_edgar.gif

that last friedrich is wonderful

does matthias grunewald fit this thread?
http://commandopera.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/Temptation-of-St-Anthony-Matthias-Grunewald.jpg

ha, that's rather less sober than the grunewald i can remember