medical school

Some more ?progressive med schools are light on the need for pre-reqs and MCAT, and tend to favor older applicants with good communication skills and experience/education in care-related fields. In Canada, McMaster University (the place that introduced PBL to med ed) has this approach; there may be others in the same vein south of the border.

It is Match Day 2011! Which means one thing for the class of 2012...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqMiigy92qU

http://img225.imageshack.us/i/20644180536215564524110.jpg

http://img225.imageshack.us/i/20644180536215564524110.jpg/

hahaha

lol I'm paranoid that I have schizoid personality disorder

i actually know a kid in pharm school who is a lot like that haha

what is the right answer? b?

Yeah it is OCPD.

The stereotype personality disorder of med students is OCPD (since we are mostly all ridiculous perfectionists), although I had a Psych resident who said the inflexibility associated with OCPD made it really really difficult to actually be a successful functioning med student if that were the case. Like, you could probably do OK 1st and 2nd year, but then 3rd year rolls around and constantly being all "No it is cool, residents and attendings, I am going to do it my way" without getting pulled aside.

She did mention that Narcissistic Personality Disorder does show up in medicine occasionally, though.

you don't say.

I am sure I felt this way about second year also, but finishing third year (which I did today!) feels like such an enormous thing. Like, today I know what I want to do, and I know that I will be at least basically competent at doing it. It is a delightful feeling.

"what you want to do" = a specialty?

congrats btw! i'm 4/6 thru pharm school

i saw this in my google reader about md/phds btw. not read it but maybe of interest.

http://sciencecareers.sciencemag.org/career_magazine/previous_issues/articles/2011_06_17/caredit.a0900127

C-L: what are you going into?

Neurology.

Great choice :)

Hey, I should ask a real neurologist: so are there any particular programs you'd recommend? I basically at this point have a list of places (most of the Western U.S., Minnesota/Wisconsin/Iowa, Virginia/DC, and some varying amount of Texas and North Carolina) I'm gonna apply to for no better reason than "I could live in that place, and I heard someone say a nice thing about their program once". It is an inexact science, although I figure I'll not actually know what the actual best place is until I interview.

I'm Canadian; I only know the American programs by reputation.

Famous places especially for neuro in those areas: Mayo, Iowa, WUSTL, Baylor. There must be others, thats just off the top of my head. I'm sure any decent sized school will have a fairly solid neuro program. Applying to places where you actually want to live is a good idea. Also recommend you choose a program in large part because their residents seem happy or at least sane. That's what I did and it worked out OK.

Minnesota is nice, and the residents seemed pleased with the program, by all accounts.

btw i'm on the five-year program, so residency isn't a "thing" for me until next year, but i'm leaning a lot more towards general practice right now

I will try to keep track of the match-stravaganza on this thread.

oh please do!

http://thinkprogress.org/yglesias/2011/07/13/267427/health-care-professional-earnings/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+matthewyglesias+%28Matthew+Yglesias%29

173k a year...is not enough?

to pay back your student loans before your own kids are in college? no, not really

"In 2010, the median debt at graduation was $150,000 at public institutions, $180,000 at private, and $160,000 combined." Yes, $173k a year is enough to pay off that debt in 10ish years, gimme a break.

someone who lives semi-frugally could do it in less than 10

so I mean unless you have a genius kid who goes to college at age 9, I'm pretty sure 173k a year is 'enough'

you can practice in fairbanks, alaska

Yeah, less than 10 is doable too. At 10 years, 6.5% interest, $180k loan, you're looking at $2k loan payments a month. Say your gross pay on $173k is $90k; you're still looking at $7500 a month. Paying $2k a month is totally doable.

it would be sooooo good for the USA's educational system & financial outlook if we'd get doctor salaries & teacher salaries at about the same level, as they are in France.

I have family friends who are doctors near paris.

they have nice houses.

so do teachers there!

it would be sooooo good for the USA's educational system & financial outlook if we'd get doctor salaries & teacher salaries at about the same level, as they are in France.

― Euler, Wednesday, July 13, 2011 4:34 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark

i can't see this ever happening

well, i can see doctor salaries coming down, but i can't see teacher salaries going up significantly

Teacher salaries in the USA aren't *that* bad, so I'd be happy enough with doctor salaries coming down to closer to that level. Of course we have to fix malpractice costs & medical school costs to make that happen.

yeah med school being subsidized is something that really needs to happen. it would attract better candidates imo

in France med school is essentially free

Teacher salaries in the USA aren't *that* bad

teacher salaries in urban schools are too low for the work required imo.

in France they kiss on Main Street

xp yes you're right & this is always the catch with doctor salaries in the USA, because they work such long hours & are on call...we also could use a lot more doctors to make up for letting doctors work less, but the AMA keeps the supply artificially low by limiting the number of accredited med schools, for the purpose of keeping doctor salaries high.

everything in the US is really expensive

AMA keeps the supply artificially low by limiting the number of accredited med schools, for the purpose of keeping doctor salaries high.

yeah this is basically what it all sits on

everything in the US is really expensive

not gas and cheap pieces of plastic

parking too

wellll my point was more that doctors graduate w/ higher relative debt burdens, not that they actually need 20 yrs to pay back their student loans

but arguments about what is 'enough' are going to be p pointless, i suppose, particularly w/iatee

i think the problem is less with how much doctors make then how theyre paid tbh

also i wonder what patient outcomes are like in france. also salaries overall are a lot lower in france arent they? im skeptical of the 'best candidates' argument but i think theres some validity to it as well...

yeah, maybe i'm wrong.

everything in the US is really expensive

not gas and cheap pieces of plastic

or corn...

it's just a thought i have in irritation sometimes when my mom complains about the shitty doctors she knows; clearly these people only got into this profession for the money.

Salaries are lower in France, though French salaries are usually quoted net meaning tax, health care, pension, university don't need to be paid for.

A full professor in France makes about 3k-4k euros per month, net.

patient outcomes are great! french people are healthier than americans. the only complaints I've heard have been about sorta upper-income people, I think there's an income gap of sorts.

(and...anecdotal but the healthcare I received when I lived in france was basically out of this world compared to what I deal w/ here.)

some of my *thoughts* about doctor salaries come from the gap in pay between doctors and other health workers, which definitely breeds resentment. (i know some shitty radiologists who basically just rubber-stamp the readings performed by their techs...who must hate them! i always figured this could only be justified by how expensive medical school is.)

i thought certain programs were fee-paying in france?

my bf & i are renting an apt in paris over december again this year & im always amazed at what rent for a large-ish one bedroom in central paris goes for compared to the places in the us ive lived (bay area/nyc/conn) but i was looking at housing costs as a % of income and that was still p high. i guess this doesnt really have anything to w/ anything but we just booked the apt today so i was thinking abt it...

anyways i think lowering doctors salaries in isolation is probably kinda pointless but w/e