Stairway To Heaven

This sounded unusually sad this morning. [I just found a good vinyl copy of <IV - it sounds great on vinyl.] All the layered guitars on it are really remarkable. I really noticed how, well, suspended and somewhat sadly unresolved that inverted suspended chord thing that shows up in the "makes me wonder" part sounds. It's pretty ingenious how he used the open D (the fourth!) as a bass for that (to go IIRC from Em/D to D to C/D back to D in a song in Am). If he'd used either Em or C as the stepping stone back to Am like a normal writer, there would have been more of a sense of resolution. It sounds so unsatisfied this way, amplified by the fact that he actually goes back to Am7 (with the m7 suspended right at the top), a beautifully unresolved-sounding chord. Also, that the intro is built on a chromatically descending bass - such a simple principle but such a weird one at the same time. But of course, this is precisely like climbing down a stairway. I also like how when the electric is overdubbed into the mix, it sounds like it's just slightly delayed from the 12-string.

I hear the sadness a little differently from how Michael does. At least I remember that when I listened to it in middle school, it felt like the sadness had to do with a frustrating glimpse of but inability to fully grasp or be part of a utopian vision - "my spirit is crying for leaving".

I´m still not tired of this song,

Me neither, even after hearing it hundreds of times. And when I listen to it on headphones and concentrate on the great keyboard work going on in the background the singing seems to fade into the background slightly, which seems to make it even more enjoyable.

And I'm looking forward to hearing Dolly's version

I was slightly disappointed with Dolly's version. Someone on some board somewhere complained that it was a "banjo clusterfuck" but to me it's not enough of one.

...wait, hold on:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/music_blog/2010/02/mary-j-blige-steve-vai-travis-barker-and-more-take-on-stairway-to-heaven.html

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c630a53ef0128775e02b1970c-600wi

#89 pop hit, 1986:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svJURxdetwA

Ah, there's Orianthi! I'd been waiting for her to show up on ILM.

i'm kind of amazed how much i sincerely actually love this song.

probably helps that i never listen to classic rock radio.

I rarely hear it on classic rock radio tbh, maybe once a year. On the other hand, I hear "D'yer Maker" all the time.

i could never get sick of this song

I only ever listen to it in album context, so to me it's permanently associated with "Battle of Evermore"; that pairing is one of the best moments in rock, imo

this song cured my hiccups a few weeks ago.

Singing it?

no, i was listening to the classic rock station and hiccuping through all the songs for about 20 minutes -- then "stairway" came on and the hiccups immediately stopped.

Hiccups = bustle in your hedge row?

Zep played this a few times at their concerts before their fourth album was issued, and I've heard one of those performances on a boot. No shreaks from the audience in recognition when Jimmy plays the opening chords of this ultimate crowd-pleaser, and only mild applause at the end. It's an interesting snapshot from the brief era when "Stairway to Heaven" was a song even their fans had never heard of.

John Paul Jones was asked if there was a magical feeling in the crowd when they played "Stairway" pre-release. He said, "God, no. People were bored."

Joe Posnanski dug up something interesting:

Al Michael's famous 1980 Olympics hockey call: 6 words.
What Crash Davis believes in: 86 words
"Freebird": 172 words.
I Got You (I Feel Good)": 220 words
Gettysburg Address: 278 words (depending on version)
"Stairway to Heaven": 341 words*
Hamlet's Soliloquy: 341 words*
Howard Beale's "Mad as Hell" speech: 446 words
Entire creation story in bible: 655 words.
Bill of Rights (original form): 678 words
The rule to determine if a pitcher wins or loses: 711 words.
"Coffee is for closers" monologue: 782 words.
"Rapper's Delight": 2,879 words.

*Coincidence? I think not.

I'm a little skeptical about that last one.

"hamlet's soliloquy"

xp: I c&p'd a version of it into microsoft word and got 2,977 words.

It was a Spirit song first.
― A Nairn, Wednesday, July 17, 2002 8:00 PM (11 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

namely "taurus".
― mike (ro)bott, Wednesday, July 17, 2002 8:00 PM

http://time.com/105016/led-zeppelin-is-getting-sued-over-stairway-to-heaven/

Deja vu

If someone would rather listen to Spirit, they're free to do so.

Stairway is a lot more than just the bit from Taurus ( the descending chromatic figure). It's the lyric, the gradual increase in tempo, the mellotron arrangement, the solo, the crescendo, and so on.

I'll be amazed if he wins this. You can't copyright a chord progression (or a chromatic ground bass). My guess is that it's a bid for publicity.

Is it the chord progression that Spirit is arguing Page ripped off, or the melody of the opening (fingerpicked) section?

My guess is that it's a bid for publicity.

Or to pay his mortgage.

Is it the chord progression that Spirit is arguing Page ripped off, or the melody of the opening (fingerpicked) section?

I don't see a very strong case for the latter. If anything, Page added a melody line to what is a bunch of arpeggios over a chromatically descending 'ground bass' figure in the Spirit song.

From a purely aural standpoint, it sounds like the same notes in the same sequence in the same key, and even at the same tempo -- in other words, the composition. Page obviously only used a few seconds of it, and just as a springboard to something huge. But it's still there.

("the composition" meaning "Taurus")

My guess is that it's a bid for publicity.

Or to pay his mortgage.

― Johnny Fever, Tuesday, May 20, 2014 10:06 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

it's his estate, the guy is dead iirc

Stairway is a lot more than just the bit from Taurus ( the descending chromatic figure). It's the lyric, the gradual increase in tempo, the mellotron arrangement, the solo, the crescendo, and so on.

― calstars, Monday, May 19, 2014 10:37 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Too bad Taurus is completely unmemorable then

From a purely aural standpoint, it sounds like the same notes in the same sequence in the same key, and even at the same tempo -- in other words, the composition. Page obviously only used a few seconds of it, and just as a springboard to something huge. But it's still there.

Applying a standard picking pattern to a chord progression is not generally seen as writing a top-level melody line, which is usually what determines writing credits (along with lyrics). It's the same reason Stewart Copeland won't get a writing credit for "Every Breath You Take".

The line in "Taurus" starts A-C-E-C --G#-C-E-C--G-C-E-C iirc.
"Stairway begins A-C-E-(A*)--(B*)/G#-E-C-(B*)--(C*)/G-E-C-C* where * indicates notes in the higher octave and slashes indicate notes that are played at the same time. Brackets indicate the melody line that Page added.

I'm not denying that Page was probably influenced by Spirit, btw, just saying that I don't think there's much of a case for songwriting credit here.

Didn't click on the link yesterday, so I didn't realize the Spirit story was new--even showed up on the news on the way home. Twelve Dreams being one of my key high-school albums, I found it quite funny hearing Spirit show up on the news in 2014.

They played the two back-to-back. They didn't sound at all similar to me. I'm not a musician.

Im not a musician but it sounds like a total rip-off to me. Tarfumes OTM.

Stairway is a lot more than just the bit from Taurus ( the descending chromatic figure). It's the lyric, the gradual increase in tempo, the mellotron arrangement, the solo, the crescendo, and so on.

― calstars, Monday, May 19, 2014 10:37 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Too bad Taurus is completely unmemorable then

― Doritos Loco Parentis (Hurting 2), Tuesday, May 20, 2014 12:14 PM (5 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Right, like this disqualifies you from asserting a copyright claim. Try again Wapner.

"total"

I just realized that I was misreading calstars post and what I said was not really responding to him.

Bill, I'm a musician and a lawyer btw. And ultimately these things are up to juries, if they get that far, and juries are unpredictable. They might agree it's a "total rip-off" and they might not. I really don't give a fuck though, they made it a hot line, Zep made it a hot song imo.

I've discovered that comparing songs on a car radio is not a good test. Looked up "Taurus" on YouTube, found the part in question, and yes, the similarity is obvious.

People steal little bits all the time, no? No idea if there's a legal claim there or not. If somebody was going to take action, I find it bizarre that they'd wait until now.

amen

correct

Stupidest infringement case ever

but wait!
https://www.sfgate.com/entertainment/article/Led-Zeppelin-to-face-retrial-over-Stairway-13266011.php

this is dumb as shit

While allowing a new jury to hear a recording of "Taurus" may put Led Zeppelin at a disadvantage, the context in which the recording can now be considered by jurors will be limited. The plaintiffs can play it for Page in open court to ask him if he'd ever heard the song before writing "Stairway."

Allowing "the jury to observe Page listening to the recordings would have enabled them to evaluate his demeanor while listening to the recordings as well as when answering questions," the three-judge appeals panel said. That line of questioning would be meant to establish whether Page had "access" to the song, an element of copyright infringement.

At the same time, the jury will still be instructed only to consider the sheet music when assessing whether the two songs are "substantially similar," the other element of infringement, the appeals court said.

observe Page listening to the recordings would have enabled them to evaluate his demeanor

Like his eyes are gonna comically bug out and steam will start shooting out of his ears.

Wtf

Of all the potential copyright infringements, this one is the dumbest.

our shadows = taller than our souls

Like his eyes are gonna comically bug out and steam will start shooting out of his ears.

LOL, seriously. Or he starts tugging at his collar nervously as beads of sweat begin pouring down his brow...

https://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.GhCH-McVawkZkBuQ4DEuxAHaEL&pid=Api

Guilty!

Btw — the RIAA is urging for this case not to be opened back up, saying that a ruling against Zep would throw the music copyright field into chaos (...even more than the “Blurred Lines” decision has, I add editorially).

Sorry, I didn’t state it very well — it’s the ruling by the three-judge panel, vacating the earlier verdict and saying that LZ must face a new trial, that the RIAA and a music publishers’ group are pushing back on:

On Monday, the RIAA and the NMPA warned that the panel decision would allow infringement claims over the use of "basic musical elements that have long been seen as unprotectable."

"Nearly every time a composer chooses to include a sequence of a few notes, an arpeggio or a chromatic scale in a composition, some other composer will have most likely 'selected' the same elements at some level of generality," the groups said.

george harrison got what he deserved.

Still can’t get used to that extra beat at 5:35 after all these years

It's not an extra beat. The "one" just isn't where you think it is.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhlLtd19szw

Frank Zappa's cover helps emphasize this (starting at 6:03 in this version):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOADUlfh2qY

[/rhythmic pedantry]

One of the weirder things that happen in Jimmy's solo towards the end of the 3rd bar (~6:08), when he's playing in the 5th position, he releases his barre and plays a single open G string, semi-palm muted.

Maybe a flub?

Do you mean the G at the beginning of m. 6 here?: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/3e/a7/34/3ea734fe981150735f350e6288b7ae89.jpg . I've always done that on the 5th fret of the D string. I'm pretty sure it's intentional in any case. That said, tbh, I actually do find this solo challenging to do cleanly at tempo.

I just checked the live clips from the Song Remains the Same version and the 75 Earls Court version and that passage is completely different from the studio version both times, although everything in the solo prior to that point is v close. Maybe he found it challenging too?

(although tbh that's actually one of the easy parts imo, at least if you do it all in fifth position)

A student brought in "Samba Triste" and I wonder if maybe Baden Powell should have sued Spirit:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znEjrSnwP_4

Brian Hodel's arrangement, from 83, I think, actually uses the identical voicings of the first three chords as they are found in "Stairway":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTpqZlEimtI