People Who Live In Suburbs: Classy, Icky, or Dudes?

the more I think about it, I'm not really sure why "it stretches the metro boundary far enough that you get a result that means something different from what we're talking about" really matters. I'm looking at this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_urban_areas the results feel wrong but I'm not really understanding why. The definition of "urban areas" they use sounds reasonable. And yet the "dense" areas listed there seem to be of a largely suburban character.

also i am wondering if the fact that my life path has been basically been dense urban -> 70s suburb -> 60s suburb -> small town semi-rural -> small college town super-rural -> urban -> dense urban -> 40s/50s suburb is contributing to me being kinda O_O at the various assumptions flying around in this thread re: how other people live

also aero otm about the liberating dream of teenage driving on CA freeways

yeah, that's what I'm getting at. Outside of NY, what cities are truly dense and urban in the US? I guess that's your point too? The vast majority of the US could be considered suburban. Those walkscore maps don't seem very relevant to me. Portland is slightly more walkable than Los Angeles, but way less dense. You look at the map of LA and the vast fields of red are not walkable because they are mountains. So does that count against the overall walkability score? San Francisco is highly walkable but is small and expensive, hence the vast suburban sprawl surrounding it.

the walkscores themselves might not be useful but the maps generally ring true - but also sorta have to be combined w/ the transit options. the vast fields of red in LA are important! might not be sprawl, but they do make walking from the valley to santa monica pretty much out of the question. large parts of LA are incredibly walkable, but if you have a job in the wrong part / have to go long distances / a certain trip, it becomes impossible. that's why you need a transit system - queens is (generally) walkable and the bronx is walkable but I can't really walk to the bronx. I mean I could, but,

you know what else feels great is unprotected sex with strangers while high on heroin

you're joking, but this is also true!

ever slam a quarter of crystal in a bathhouse with a shared needle? it's 1) insane and 2) bracing as fuck

also I learned how to drive in socal on not-crowded freeways fwiw

!!!

LA county or San Diego?

santa barbara

it counts, technically

ps I'm not rich I swear

"feels good" and "i want it" are not reasons for the government to make certain things easy for people to have or do

the vast fields of red in LA are important! might not be sprawl, but they do make walking from the valley to santa monica pretty much out of the question.

but notice they didn't do the same thing for all of the water that surrounds Manhattan and San Francisco

santa barbara

it counts, technically

― iatee, Thursday, September 8, 2011 5:10 AM (28 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ps I'm not rich I swear

― iatee, Thursday, September 8, 2011 5:10 AM (19 seconds ago) Bookmark

I lol'd

iatee this is where you admit that you actually live in missoula btw just to blow our minds

max I'm just explaining feelings & motivations not setting policy

by now I would expect that all my friends from the political threads know that I am probably not the best guy to talk about what would make for good policy

but notice they didn't do the same thing for all of the water that surrounds Manhattan and San Francisco

well it has the same effect! if you live in astoria queens, you are extremely close to manhattan and if there were a magic pedestrian-only bridge, you could be there in 5 minutes. instead you can take an hour walk or take the subway.

"feels good" and "i want it" are not reasons for the government to make certain things easy for people to have or do

― max, Thursday, September 8, 2011 4:10 AM (50 seconds ago)

every time i read a statement this reductive my mind reads it in ron pauls voice nowadays fyi

well it has the same effect! if you live in astoria queens, you are extremely close to manhattan and if there were a magic pedestrian-only bridge, you could be there in 5 minutes. instead you can take an hour walk or take the subway.

but how does that factor into the overall score? you keep talking about those color maps. the LA one has all of this red representing the mountains, which is presumably factored into the score, while NY is all green, totally ignoring the water. I call bullshit on that site.

iatee's first time driving

http://www.capitalcomics.com/covers/2183.jpg

two seven letter names - first name three letters, last name four - both popular with self-sustaining internet communities - max is there something you want to tell the group

lol. santa barbara has the most beautiful gas stations

I'm technically from the unincorporated area between goleta and santa barbara

locals call it 'noleta' cause we refuse to be incorporated w/ goleta

I mean, that place seems really gross in a lot of ways, but I also wish that every city had a planning commission or whatever that was a iron fisted and design conscious as Santa Barbara.

also goleta sounds gross

we had areas like that near where i grew up. they have pretty much all been absorbed into "San Jose"

where was that?

downtown santa barbara is a 98 on walkscore fwiw

maybe so, but good luck finding a gas station if you're driving by on the 101

but if you do, they have beautiful spanish tile on the roof

wk - i grew up in G1lroy.

Coyote = gone

the road that used to just go to the dump now has tract homes and a golf course

goleta *is* gross, there's a small downtown area that was once its own little town, now the street's basically a non-place and the rest of goleta is big box stores. that's why the border-suburbs don't even want to be associated w/ it. that and the name, probably.

nice! I was in almaden. not too far away
xp

so would gilroy be an exurb? kind of a suburb but more rural?

goleta used to get covered in maximum rock & roll, can't remember which seminal early 90s HxCx band was from there

G1lroy was a small town when i grew up; it might as well be a suburb now.

gilroy's a small town that became a de-factor exurb

sup bros

Can't believe I'm going to pop in just for this useless information, but I think there are still a whole lot of unincorporated sections around San Jose! Like areas around and along Bascom and elsewhere.
And the US Census must have a weird way of determining "urban areas" cuz San Jose definitely isn't dense!
From Willow Glen, btw.

otoh, i probably would've been stoked as a teenager if there'd been a Guitar Center cross town.

Baby, don't ya go, don't ya go to Goleta
I've been there and I've seen them drinkin' now
Thinkin' all the time that they're going to school
Well, maybe some day they might learn something
But being fascist rich kids just ain't cool

408 representing itt

aerosmith played in santa barbara a couple months ago and somebody showed up to the show as soon as we were done and was mad she missed it, busted into the "dressing room" (a closet in which there was, hand to God, a live mouse eating the rider food), demanded that we play some more, and when somebody from our opening band coaxed her away screamed at me as she was led off that I/we had "ruined [her] fucking life"

also when I was a kid we used to stay at the Miramar there, family vacation type deal before the family imploded

that's what I know about santa barbara

it has nice architecture, also

lol. willow glen. ANNEXED

I used to go to a comic shop there

I think there was a recent annexation attempt with Campbell too maybe? Pretty much how San Jose was built.

And the US Census must have a weird way of determining "urban areas" cuz San Jose definitely isn't dense!

yeah, on this, ultimately the line you draw is going to be arbitrary and the further out you go, the less dense the metro area is gonna be. so if you include far out rural connecticut in nyc, nyc is less dense. if you don't, it's more dense.

a better way to look at density is weighted density - basically it's the sum of the (density of neighborhood x) (pop of neighborhood x / metro area pop). you don't have to worry about the arbitrary metro area lines so much this way.

http://www.austincontrarian.com/austincontrarian/2008/03/weighted-densit.html

I get Campbell and Willow Glen confused, but they both have comic shops.

a better way to look at density is weighted density - basically it's the sum of the (density of neighborhood x) (pop of neighborhood x / metro area pop). you don't have to worry about the arbitrary metro area lines so much this way.

but that chart is still kind of crazy. so much of it is undeniably suburban.