Mad Men on AMC • Fifth Season Thread

i might be especially dense, but from what angle could 'way to go, betty!' be a reaction to her, unprovoked, using her 12? yr old daughter to stir up shit w/ her ex husb?

the angle of valuing the truth over convenient lies, I guess

Don't think a fierce commitment to honesty was Betty's angle there dude

It's not really just a convenient lie. Don could go to jail.

Don't think a fierce commitment to honesty was Betty's angle there dude

It def wasn't. didn't mean to imply it was an accurate reading.

If I'm being kind to Betty I'd say that she could have been treated better by Don in the past, so has some right to feel wronged the relationship went bad. But she's not an entirely innocent party, and hurting 3 people – including your daughter – is definitely NAGL.

Don treated her like shit. but the marriage is over, and it doesn't excuse this sort of petty manipulation.

also to the audience "it" meaning "Megan's hot bod"

ha this flew right over my head at the time but it's great.

Betty had a little moment of grace at the end of last season when she and Don were in the kitchen together before they sold the house. I think it felt like it was going to be okay, but I guess Betty's extreme fucked-up-ness crossed with her inability to realise that "having everything" in the narrow way she grew up expecting "everything" to be isn't necessarily awesome or worth aspiring to just made it go bad. Henry seems like a dude though, so I can't tell if she hates him or if he's a disappointment ("the wrong horse") or what.

Henry does seem like a decent guy, but I think he has been a disappointment to Betty because she expected a new marriage to fix all of her problems and make her happy.

I guess he's decent in the sense that he doesn't seem willfully malicious and is reasonably level-headed. otoh WASP Republicans who feel up pregnant married ladies are gross imho.

i might be especially dense, but from what angle could 'way to go, betty!' be a reaction to her, unprovoked, using her 12? yr old daughter to stir up shit w/ her ex husb?

it made for good drama!

He's been kinda prickish to Don on a coupla occasions xpost

it made for good drama!

well, yeah, but that's pretty meta. by that standard, we're rooting for the killer in horror movies.

you're an idiot

If you didn't know a thing about Betty, she is pretty and looks so normal when she smiles. I feel sorry for Henry Francis. He had no idea what he was flirting with.

i dunno, i've liked betty a lot more this season. i feel like she's suffered enough, and don should suffer more?

well thats valid but manipulating ur own daughter in service of that is p not cool

& if it's just 2 ratchet up drama, idk 'way 2 go, mad men writers!' ?

Wonder who Don's talking to in the teaser for next week, 'Maybe you and I should go as a couple.'

Then again, they tend to choose lines that are misleading when out of context.

I think she is more real than Megan. Megan is like a Barbie doll living in a glamorous penthouse, young at a time when it's great to be her age, she gets to follow her childhood dream, has children only on the weekends, her husband doesn't cheat on her. Betty has been through a lot. Her youth and dreams for any sort of modeling or faithful husband, happy family all cut short. Sometimes experiences such as hers can make a person more grateful or empathetic towards those around her. Other times it just makes a person bitter and mean. In Betty you see her struggle with both. I feel sorry for Henry because he does seem to love her very much and could really help her if only she could let go of her resentments.

i like betty as a character (or rather i want to like her because i once found her sympathetic), but over the past couple seasons i've had to like her despite the way she's written, despite the things she's been made to do. this is an odd way for me to relate to the character, to separate my idea of what betty "should be" from the way she's written, because she only exists in the writing and performance, but so be it.

the fact that i want to like betty, however, doesn't make me think her manipulation of sally in this last episode was at all cool. in saying that i feel that i'm judging the bad things the writers are making betty do, not the character who i remain basically fond of.

that was in response to sarahell

you're an idiot

― Mr. Que, Tuesday, May 15, 2012 12:00 PM (32 minutes ago)

this sort of thing really isn't necessary

Betty = Disintegration
Megan = Violator

liking characters is overrated

otm

I think she is more real than Megan. Megan is like a Barbie doll living in a glamorous penthouse,

*tera otm!

"more real," what

Betty: has a failed marriage and has mixed feelings about her ex; has body image issues and struggles with her weight; cares about her kids but isn't the perfect mother

Megan: manic pixie dream girl with a sugar daddy

that's pretty stupid

yeah how is Megan manic?

I guess you have to be mundane to be real?

yeah how is Megan manic?

are we watching the same show?

evidently not

unless 'manic' means something else? what mania is she exhibiting

did you all miss the Howard Johnson's episode?

Aside from her abrupt decision to resume acting, everything she's done seems pretty reasoned and deliberate.

answering a question with a question? really?

none of that HJ stuff seemed manic at all. DD was being a dick, so she took off.

Seems a bit ridiculous to say Megan is just a spoiled Manic Pixie Dream Barbie when a lot of this season has been about people seeing her as a spoiled Manic Pixie Dream Barbie and her dealing with that.

xp - the way she got super weepy about leaving a job she disliked? the dance number at his surprise birthday party? the ice cream eating?

I'm not saying she is DSM-IV "manic" - but she does have this "too precious for this world" quality.

Megan has basically been depicted as being inhumanly perfect, a trait I find creepy and disturbing

xp

w/sarahell on this, clinical definitions of "manic" aside

the way she got super weepy about leaving a job she disliked?

this seems totally normal.

the dance number at his surprise birthday party?

she loves don and wanted to surprise him. sure it was misguided, but that's not manic by any definition

the ice cream eating?

it's pronounced sherbert.

and i think she was exasperated with him, it had been building the whole episode

^^wrt the ice cream

The way some people perceive Megan makes me think I'm watching a totally different show. She's one of the only people in the world of Mad Men who seems to have her shit together.

what if we eliminated the word "manic" and just left it at "pixie dream girl"?

Though I do think the weepiness was excessive and the total cluelessness in re the party made me think something was wrong with her.

these characters are the exact same level of real, which is not

in the 'howard johnson's episode' where, as written, the character decided to be confrontational toward the pattern of character don's habitual level of manipulativeness and need for approval of choices he's already made. and then got severely punished for it because he got fed up and walked away. well, drove away.

the approval of everything betty has been shown to do recently and disapproval of megan is... iiinteresting

http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/tv_club/features/2012/mad_men_season_5/week_8/mad_men_recap_megan_and_sally_are_friends_indeed_.html