Mad Men on AMC • Fifth Season Thread

As far as the timing thing: Jaguar guy had a wife so I assumed they were going it out of the way in the evening and then he had to get back home to his wife.

Very interesting to see Weiner play so much of that same scene twice. I was wondering how long he was going to do it, and ending it on Joan's realization that Don didn't cosign was perfect.

btw cheouggggh offered peggy $19,000 in 1967 money. what would that be today?

Not sure, but it's $7500 more than what Joan was making pre-Jaguar.

$122674.91
according to http://www.westegg.com/inflation/infl.cgi

that's a nice sum huh.

Go Peggy!

for someone who hasn't hit 30, in particular. damn.

xpoat, actually $6500 more.

i smell spinoff! diary of a mad adwoman amirite.

I've been saying for at least a couple seasons that the focus will shift to Peggy and away from Don by the end of the show's run. This could either be the beginning or debunk my theory altogether.

What cost $12500 in 1967 would cost $80707.18 in 2010.

joan was doing aight, though NYC cost of living makes it tougher

NYC still had rent control in 1967, though. I would imagine it was comparatively cheaper to live there even as the 70s were approaching.

Egads, according to that same site, the 50 large they offered Joan comes out to $332190.

That's still no "indecent proposal".

xp to Gukbe: makes sense. I thought dude was about to doze off but coulda been post coital sleepiness.

Who has done more for Peggy, Don or Feddy Rumsen?

*Freddy I mean

Freddy peed on his floor so Peggy got his office, kind of a big deal

I liked the chemistry between those two. I like Freddy Rumsen.

I can understand why Joan did what she did in the same way I can understand why people commit suicide. Her career is basically over now, she will never go any farther or be able to accomplish anything else - she grabbed the brass ring for her kid and fell on her sword, more or less.

I really hope Peggy's leaving of SCDP sticks, and I imagine if it does they'll devote a significant amount of screen time to her at the new place. Could make for some great stories. It makes me wonder if Wiener has been planning it from the very start.

I don't know if Joan's career is over or not. As this ep made clear, she only had so much respect to begin with. I don't think that what she's done has diminished her cred in the eyes of at least a few of the partners, and meanwhile she has a stake in decisions now, which she can roll into a fair amount if she pleases.

Yeah, I'd like to see her take charge in a really awesome way. and by "really awesome way" somehow make Pete lose his job and have him die a horrible death homeless and alone.

I don't think that what she's done has diminished her cred in the eyes of at least a few of the partners, and meanwhile she has a stake in decisions now, which she can roll into a fair amount if she pleases.

Roger certainly is gonna think less of her. Don isn't going to respect her anymore. Pete never respected her to begin with. Lane is now completely compromised and increasingly a liability, his respect is going to be largely worthless. Cooper is the hardest to read.

These are all men who are both going to be grateful for her decision and resentful of her price. She will be a junior partner with limited room to maneuver and few resources - with Peggy gone, she has no allies in the office (apart from Lane, with whom there is going to be some kind of showdown/reckoning anyway).

Don isn't going to respect her anymore

Dunno if I'd go that far. Their bond is pretty deep.

I think Don will have an understanding of the reasons. I think he's more upset with the company and himself than he is with Joan.

damn, the stuff with Joan was really depressing. Not sure what to think of it really. Hamm was amazing in Peggy's resignation scene (as was she, but him especially), going from kind of a blase reaction to bewildered anger to sadness

I think the biggest thing that happened on this episode was the revelation that Dale works at SCDP. Dude is on this show maybe once a season, and I'm always surprised he still works there.

wasn't he there as a freelancer?

Yeah, maybe. But I got the impression he was an account guy in season 1. Then he popped up once or twice in subsequent seasons.

"She will be a junior partner with limited room to maneuver and few resources"

We'll see. I strongly suspect Joan will outlast Lane and Pete at the very least.

Joan has a juicy tell-all to pen in the '70s, and bad Mr. Rory will "accidentally" shoot Pete with his own gun soonish.

I kinda think we won't be seeing much of Peggy anymore, actually. When these characters leave SDCP we don't see much of them any longer. I mean, a bit, sure. But I doubt there will be much Peggy unless she comes back.

Pete is worse than Duck.

seems weird tho. after Don she was the most important character.

xpoast

although icing main characters seems to be a theme in my fav shows right now.

like i said, sitcom spinoff!

well this was ugly, but in its ugliness it had some life and forward motion which i'm realizing was kind of missing from this season so far.

i think all the angles and justifications and reasons for the joan thing were laid out pretty well. plus all of the ironies of who knows what about it. i don't really know what to think about it but worrying about 'respect' can be spun out in a bunch of different ways. nobody can doubt she's a trooper.

plus all of the ironies of who knows what about it: pete tells don "it was her idea" (but it wasn't, it was lane's) (and she only agreed thinking don was in favor) etc etc

the partnership stake being lane's idea is p interesting.

peggy and don's scene was out of sight.

though honestly lane's money trouble is one of those hanging problems that strains my credulity. are we supposed to think that being hard up is shameful enough that he can't find a solution openly? i don't think having the government come after your money would be to this group, esp. cooper the randian.

I'm not so sure that Joan is going to lose out from this - she is the person who keeps the entire business running, basically. Don figured out from day 1 not to cross her. I don't see how it changes a lot except that she'll presumably make more money.

freddy in the diner was fun. he's the only everyman type on the show who'll enjoy sitting in a normal diner, working his way through coffee and pie around normal people. anyone else on the show would be like "oh i suppose i will deign to sit amongst these plebeians, just this once."

i found this to be a heartbreaking episode not just for joan, but also for don. when don registered that joan had gone through with the deal, i thought i saw something in him die a little.

Hamm was amazing in Peggy's resignation scene (as was she, but him especially), going from kind of a blase reaction to bewildered anger to sadness

quoted for truth.

I feel like Joan fucking that Jaguar Jagoff was the darkest moment in this whole series. I mean, I don't think you can watch five seasons of this show without being completely in love with her, and you just don't want the woman you love making that decision.

Also, I love Lane, but I really hope he gets caught. It's just fair. Maybe Don'll challenge him to fisticuffs over the forged signature.

"we would have given you the money!"

The Joan-Peggy one-two is probably the hardest hit he's had since Anna died. xpst

Peggy's new job is a happy moment for me though. She wasn't appreciated there. Good for her.

Don's a wimp.

I guess I didn't find this episode all that out-there and not everyone is in love with Joan - she's not terribly kind or supportive to women who aren't deferential toward her. the show is good in that it does make her sympathetic but she's an integral part of the culture at that office that only really allowed one woman to get promoted beyond being a secretary & then had to quit this same episode to actually advance in her career.

Joan getting raped by her fiance and then marrying him - that was dark. That was worse.

people keep telling me about this rape. i missed a big episode somewhere

Isn't Peggy now "lead copy" or something high up like that at the new place? Whatever it was that was written on the napkin? I don't think it was the fact that she wasn't appreciated at SCDP - though Don probably didn't show his appreciation enough - but I think she knew she had gone as far as she could go as a protege. Both Freddy and her saying that Don would have done the same thing was otm, and Don couldn't really argue with that. Beautifully done scene.