"'86" also the only song I love, though the three-song stretch from it to "Break of Dawn" is the only part where listening to this album doesn't make me feel antsy.
― Public Brooding Closet (cryptosicko), Friday, 8 March 2013 15:03 (eleven years ago) link
I don't mean this question to be as loaded as it probably seems, but does anybody here like this album more than Armor On?
― Evan R, Friday, 8 March 2013 15:12 (eleven years ago) link
me, maybe
― some dude, Friday, 8 March 2013 15:16 (eleven years ago) link
i do, by a damn sight.basically i can do the intro up to ode to you anytime and i've pretty much blocked 86/in your eyes/break of dawn/300the gabriel cover is particularly :/ for me
― the 'dirty sprite' is implied (forksclovetofu), Friday, 8 March 2013 15:21 (eleven years ago) link
I don't even prefer this to Whiteout tbh.
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 15:32 (eleven years ago) link
― Evan R, Friday, March 8, 2013 10:12 AM (33 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
yeah me too
― k3vin k., Friday, 8 March 2013 15:51 (eleven years ago) link
armor on = tell tale heart > goldenheart >>>>> whiteout
― r|t|c, Friday, 8 March 2013 16:15 (eleven years ago) link
but whiteout was just a lil whatever thing anyway so v unfair to even rank in company
― r|t|c, Friday, 8 March 2013 16:16 (eleven years ago) link
I get the feeling I'm the only one here who likes Whiteout as much as I do.
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 16:18 (eleven years ago) link
Tell Tale Heart was pretty minor imo -- i'm still a little amazed by the enthusiasm it inspired in this thread's genesis
― some dude, Friday, 8 March 2013 16:18 (eleven years ago) link
I repped for whiteout too rev!
― 乒乓, Friday, 8 March 2013 16:19 (eleven years ago) link
tell tale heart, you dont even know
tell tale heart was magnificent
tbh though the issue of appreciation that concerns me really is not where u rank goldenheart in dawn's oeuvre but in r&b and whatnot today generally
ie even if its tremendous reach may exceed its grasp there still aint no reason for brattish mewling
― r|t|c, Friday, 8 March 2013 16:28 (eleven years ago) link
i totally forgot about that ldn gig last month, lex did u attend
also teedra last week :/
i should really get out the house sometime
― r|t|c, Friday, March 8, 2013 2:14 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
having been out of the house all day today let me reassure you there is literally no earthly reason right now to leave it, ever. fucking disgusting out there
i did attend, anyway (and i also missed teedra) - it was just a lil 4-song showcase and we had to sit through a million TERRRRIBLE wannabes before dawn because no one could tell me what time she was on. she's coming back in april for proper full gigs i believe. also when she came over she was really ill (i interviewed her earlier that day and she couldn't even get through that without throat sweets) - huge trooper kudos for getting through just 4 songs
― r&b morcilla (lex pretend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:12 (eleven years ago) link
lol "throat sweets" http://i.imgur.com/6L9JtP2.gif?1
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:15 (eleven years ago) link
lmao
― 乒乓, Friday, 8 March 2013 17:15 (eleven years ago) link
- ranking within dawn's oeuvre seems nitpicky to me. each of her mixtapes/EPs/albums to date have been exactly what they needed to be in the context of each other. i like them all, some days some better than others. as rtc says, the remarkable thing, the thing i am in awe of, is where she stands vis-a-vis the rest of r&b/pop/everything. in that wider context, she's killing everyone and it isn't even a question.- acknowledging that whiteout was just a tossed-off thing that probably wouldn't exist if she hadn't got a physical distro deal isn't to say it's bad or overlook it, but it's just how it is. (fwiw they weren't songs she already had lying around, she wrote and made them between the original goldenheart release date and december - so they're actually the most recent songs she's done)- i really don't understand the "86"-only crew. "86" took time to grow on me in much the same way that "tug of war", "ode to you" and "break of dawn" did - the hooks aren't immediate and the beats aren't mindspinning so you have to feel your way into them. but both sound-wise and quality-wise it seems v much of a piece with those other midtempos in the back half of the album- i love "warfaire" and don't get the hate; i love that the most (directly, specifically) confrontational lyrics on the album are paired with the gentlest music- "return of a queen" is way underrated
― r&b morcilla (lex pretend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:19 (eleven years ago) link
you are all unhealthily obsessed with people being british
― r&b morcilla (lex pretend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:20 (eleven years ago) link
http://gs1.wac.edgecastcdn.net/8019B6/data.tumblr.com/tumblr_lwaugmoeb11qcseq1o1_500.gif
― r|t|c, Friday, 8 March 2013 17:20 (eleven years ago) link
nicki gets it
― r&b morcilla (lex pretend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:23 (eleven years ago) link
(fwiw they weren't songs she already had lying around, she wrote and made them between the original goldenheart release date and december - so they're actually the most recent songs she's done)
I'd wondered about/had kinda assumed this.
re: "86" I'd already fallen in love with it and played the hell out of it months before the album came out. I still don't even really think about it in the context of the album, it's its own thing to me.
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:24 (eleven years ago) link
as rtc says, the remarkable thing, the thing i am in awe of, is where she stands vis-a-vis the rest of r&b/pop/everything. in that wider context, she's killing everyone and it isn't even a question.
YES
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:24 (eleven years ago) link
ha, it was just an amusing briticism xps
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:25 (eleven years ago) link
I can't rate her records but Goldenheart has been on repeat every time I do some cooking
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:27 (eleven years ago) link
"86" only really opened up to me in album context - the opening chords seem like so much space opening up following "ode to you" mechanistic beat
also, it's the only moment where she makes her debt to imogen heap a bit too obvious
― r&b morcilla (lex pretend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:28 (eleven years ago) link
my fav way of listening to goldenheart is still in one go, all the way through - sometimes i skip "pretty wicked things" just cuz i've heard it so much though
― r&b morcilla (lex pretend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:29 (eleven years ago) link
yeah i was just about to say glomming onto '86' by itself is pretty much a cop out cos you're basically just stranded where you were a few months back like the album never happened and was never engaged with
― r|t|c, Friday, 8 March 2013 17:29 (eleven years ago) link
That's one of her songs that would least make me think of Imogen Heap! It's like the one song of recent vintage I can think of that's totally nailed that late-80s Jam & Lewis ballad sound.
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:30 (eleven years ago) link
I wouldn't say the album does a good job of making me want to engage with it tho.
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:31 (eleven years ago) link
And I'd already glommed onto "86" anyway. I put it in my top 5 of last year before I'd ever heard the album.
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:32 (eleven years ago) link
the vocal treatment on the second "was too closed off" is literally straight out of that imogen heap song
― r&b morcilla (lex pretend), Friday, 8 March 2013 17:32 (eleven years ago) link
"Ode To You" is amazing, if you don't get it you have spurned Dawn's love, that's why I don't fux with you.
― Tim F, Friday, 8 March 2013 21:02 (eleven years ago) link
I agree that A Tell-Tale Heart is up there with her best work.
― Tim F, Friday, 8 March 2013 21:04 (eleven years ago) link
I think my problem with this album ultimately is that so much of it feels heavyhanded.
― radric: the guccining (The Reverend), Friday, 8 March 2013 21:34 (eleven years ago) link
my problem with it is that it is a million years long
― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Friday, 8 March 2013 21:35 (eleven years ago) link
^^^
― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 8 March 2013 21:36 (eleven years ago) link
That is the dumbest criticism one can level at an albumJesusPause it and finish it tomorrow you cretins
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:16 (eleven years ago) link
^
― 乒乓, Friday, 8 March 2013 22:18 (eleven years ago) link
editing is important!
― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:20 (eleven years ago) link
so is having an attention span
― Darth Icky (DJP), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:20 (eleven years ago) link
I get it, some albums overstay their welcome, and I love nice concise statements, but the "some songs could be trimmed" complaint is such bullshit. Trim them yourself, enrich your life, and may god forgive you for ever criticizing an artist for their generosity
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:21 (eleven years ago) link
"too long" is totally a valid criticism for albums, lots of records would work better if edited down a bit. this is an album where i think the sprawl works for it, though, especially since it's only right for it to be 20 minutes longer than her exceptionally long 'EP.'
― some dude, Friday, 8 March 2013 22:22 (eleven years ago) link
the "generosity" argument made a little sense in the '90s when we were paying top dollar for CDs and there was some genuine thrill in getting one that was 79 minutes and a twinge of annoyance when it was 29 minutes. but i feel like one of actual good things about the changes since then is that there's a greater sense that running time should contribute to the listening enjoyment.
― some dude, Friday, 8 March 2013 22:24 (eleven years ago) link
you're otm about the sprawl fitting it but at the same time it makes it hard to approach and concentrate on, which makes me never want to revisit it. guess i should get an attention span lol
― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:28 (eleven years ago) link
xp I disagree and think the reverse is true, since digital media made it easier to trim your albums the way you want it. If an artist is good, and in the full bloom of creativity, I want all the music I can get. If ever I feel like an album is "too long" it probably means I didn't like it to begin with.
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:31 (eleven years ago) link
were you alive in the 90s?
― balls, Friday, 8 March 2013 22:33 (eleven years ago) link
~Was anybody truly alive in the 90s~
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:53 (eleven years ago) link
Sure, I dunno, I felt disappointed on first listen that k.d. lang's "All you can eat" was only 31 minutes long. And I skipped the songs on "Mellon Collie" that I didn't like. But I never thought it was too long, I just wanted to always skip ahead to "Galapagos". And I never got to the end of "Wu Tang Forever" but it's my failing, not theirs.
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:54 (eleven years ago) link
Furthermore-- and I apologize if this is out of my grasp in the explaining-- the digital age has allowed listeners a certain level of interactivity with track listings, creating alternate sequences, or delete songs, or reduce an album to a single track they like, right. The level of engagement that one can have with Track Order is at an all time high. The criticism that a record is "too long" suggests, to me, that this level of interactivity is being taken for granted. "This album is too long" implies-- and forgive me if I'm reaching here-- that the listener knows what's best for an artist, editing-wise-- see Brad saying "editing is important"-- and also suggests that an artist is unaware of the context of the way the album is to be digested. It suggests that the artist presumes that an album must be listened to as a complete statement. But "I'm only going to listen to parts of this album" has always been every listener's right. Claiming an album is "too long" suggests that an artist is unaware or unsympathetic to this.
What is that fucking album where they said "this album should be listened to completely from beginning to end"? Bowie "Outside"? Billy Idol "Cyberpunk"? OH NO it was Moby "Animal Rights" ha.
That said I don't think it's an invalid criticism, but I hear it said about every bloody album longer than 45 minutes. It's like "this food is too tasty" or something.
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 22:57 (eleven years ago) link
I wouldn't say "Goldenheart" is too long but I don't love "Ode to you" and only listen to it in its regular sequence because there are so many stans for it here
― * (flamboyant goon tie included), Friday, 8 March 2013 23:00 (eleven years ago) link