DRUMMERS: Advice for a beginner

john blackwell's solution playing left hand lead on a righty kit is to only cross over when he hits the snare with his left hand:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxmbuVC5z_4

or not, if he wants to save his right hand for the toms (and then go right hand lead when he's playing the ride):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xiLGFYJfEC4

so yeah, you can do whatever you want, as long as you can play what you want to play. and if you want to play some form of western pop music, then it's likely that there will be one hand 'riding'/keeping time and the other hand playing backbeats/accents.

i wonder if ergonomics people would make good drum teachers

The number of times I apologized today is so astronomical that there's no point even trying to count that high. I was a mess! My eyes started leaking. By the end everything was ok but it only took 2 lessons for a minor meltdown (I didn't require a trip to the bathroom).
I don't even know where the bathroom is.

Anyway, I learned the right way to play the song I was practicing and will keep at it. This is part of the process, at least it is for me :-/

If you got upset, then it matters, keep at it. I never had lessons for bass or guitar, I self taught by playing along to songs I liked. I found out what pressure was when I played my first gig and couldn't really hear myself that well, it was awful, it was like every school exam at once. The comfort of playing along to records in my bedrooms was shattered. Having the pressure literally scares the song into you.
I'm on the right playing bass here. I never did forgive the girl for standing in front of the camera.
http://youtu.be/fIFqWoNIFoI

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/fIFqWoNIFoI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I give up, can't even link a youtube video.

LL I'm sorry about your lesson! I mean, I'm glad that you came out of it learning something and ready for the next one, but I'm sorry that the experience was painful! I totally understand if you don't want to share, but what was it that got you down? Was it just getting out of time and having to stop and start?

(sorry, not trying to pretend like I know exactly what you're going through and have the answer, I just want you to know that it's really, REALLY normal - even expected - to be messing up a bunch with timing for a long time).

I'll explain in more detail when I'm not on my phone but you're both right -- I got upset because this matters to me and also I'm v hard on myself and also prone to emotional outbursts, both positive and negative. Mostly I'm embarrassed to have lost it. More later.

The great thing about getting upset about playing drums, imo, is you can beat the shit out of the drums to take out your frustrations.

well mostly i wanted to crawl into a corner and disappear, but it's good to know that the option of bashing is also there

here's what i think happened -- 1) my dogs and i were attacked by a neighbor dog earlier this week. my nerves, in general, are a mess! 2) i was hungry and that compromised my emotional response and 3) i was put on the spot and i froze and that embarrassed me. i'm really more interested in figuring out new ways to react than i am in dissecting why this happened, so now that i've eaten dinner, i can say that i am going to honestly try to funnel my energies back into trying harder rather than fearing another freakout.

also my teacher emailed me and said he was sorry if he pushed me too far in one direction or another and i appreciated that.

i'm not going to try to spin this incident positively or negatively, just accept that it happened and move on. that's really all a person can do.

Beat the shit out of your drums for half an hour. It doesn't matter at all if you play well, just that you make them pay.

<3 not_goodwin's video. I wonder what that girl is doing now?

I blame the camera operator! Shoulda tapped her and pointed ----> this way. You don't seem nervous at all!!

xxpost, probably ruining some other video somewhere.

xpost, that wasn't the gig I was nervous at, that was the one where we'd decided we'd had enough of each other and split up. That was the last gig with that band.

Why did she keep bending down? You were there, you can tell us.

For her drink I think, I was a little busy. She was a friend of the singer, cherida or sherida i think she was called.
All the footage and photo's from the gigs were lost, I basically have nothing from this band. :(

Sorry to hear about the eye leakage! not_goodwin OTM re: upset=it matters.

i wonder if ergonomics people would make good drum teachers

― Philip Nunez, Friday, August 2, 2013 2:32 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

They totally would; probably better than most drum teachers.

can i just

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qghrsBfSbgk

i would say something about my lesson today and how it went better but it was cancelled/rescheduled ;_;
this wouldn't be a big deal normally but i've been super looking forward to it all week
oh well

there was a lot of discussion of that clip recently, like on the Do the Math blog and in an interview related to that documentary about Ginger Baker being an asshole.

(i skip to the blakey parts, but whatever. his 6/8 beat right in the middle is nice.)

while you're waiting for your next lesson, LL, can you provide a critical update on your progress playing at home on your own? it's just fun to hear about. :)

WHY SURE! Thank you for asking.

1) I am having little to no trouble adjusting to new hand assignments. I don't think I was ever very strong with the left hand anyway, so it hasn't been bothering me at all to practice the other way.

2) Of the few things I know, I'm TOTALLY getting better at them. Endurance is up to 5:45/6 min -- goal is 10 min right now, but I don't think it's far off. My counting is also getting much better and in addition to recording some things for posterity, I'm trying to write them down too because I'm basically useless unless I write stuff down.

3) That song I thought I had practiced and knew how to play for my last lesson but actually did not know? Totally got that now.

4) Getting a little tired of practicing the small # of things I can do, would like some more challenge (even if it's a complete failure) so I have a new idea that occurred to me while listening to a Roy Montgomery song. It's probably sacrilege, but what if I just made up my own drum parts and played along? I listened to the song a bunch more times while walking to/from the market this morning, and I think I have some ideas. Going to try it this afternoon after cleaning up the insane weeds in my backyard.

This is the song, it's beautiful. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DAVNZMx-Lk

oh, know what else i can do now that i couldn't do before? count down 1-2-3-4 in my head and start with all three limbs doing the thing i want them to do. i can't do it every time, but i can do it.

have not added 4th limb yet, not ready for that i don't think

I like the idea of making up drum parts for drumless songs!

It was really fun!! I can't say it was the best possible rhythm section that song could have had, but I was grateful not to feel all alone down there. I'm not sure I'm ready for irl people yet, but I'm for sure getting there.

3rd lesson update:
I'M OK. Wasn't feeling nervous, but wanted to at least feel natural and normal walking in there, which I did, and everything went well. He finally listened to a very short recording I sent and confirmed that I was doing the right thing. He has been v good about giving feedback in a way that doesn't make me feel like he is lying to me (ie too much praise or praise before i have done anything worth praising) We have some observations:

1) I have asked myself for years whether or not being the sort of dancer who could pretty much shake it to anything (with the exception of songs I refuse to dance to on principle alone) comfortably and with zeal would help a person be a drummer. The answer, based on experiential evidence, is yes. He said that I have a good ear and that I catch on really quickly. I also believe that this is true, and I appreciated hearing it.

2) He also said that it's important that I learn how to count more effectively if I am ever going to play a song, so he is making me do really boring things until I can demonstrate that I have incorporated that skill. I appreciate this, and in an effort to do less boring things, I am going to learn how to play a stupid song of his choice and learn to count so I can graduate to doing more fun things. This approach speaks to my "learn how to do this so you can get out of here" instinct, which is pretty strong. Good pedagogical approach for me!

3) I left feeling both challenged and confident -- definitely a new combination for me. Yay drumming!

4) He said that playing along to drumless songs was a good and fun idea but I can tell that he definitely wants me to improve my skills before i demand to go berserk in public or even around other people

5) Thank you ilx for allowing me to put these thoughts somewhere. I really don't want to turn this into my diary but I appreciate that no one has told me to stop. If you want me to take it elsewhere, I can easily, happily, and peacefully do that.

the end

christ that was long
sorry

oh god
i did it
clearly i have a long way to go

also he tried to tell me about this record label out of new york called fania and you can only imagine what happened after that
that was funny

5) Thank you ilx for allowing me to put these thoughts somewhere. I really don't want to turn this into my diary but I appreciate that no one has told me to stop. If you want me to take it elsewhere, I can easily, happily, and peacefully do that.

yeah we want you to take it elsewhere - TO THE NEXT LEVEL!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gi27ZhdiCc

glad your lessons are going well! he seems like a good fit for your learning style.

lol i karaoked that song once and it was kinda boring

i karaoked that song once and was told by my disappointed ex-gf that i did not do a good job, and that she was surprised that i didn't know it better because i was always pumping up the jam around the house

dang "you failed at pumping the jam" is a mean thing to say

5) Thank you ilx for allowing me to put these thoughts somewhere. I really don't want to turn this into my diary but I appreciate that no one has told me to stop. If you want me to take it elsewhere, I can easily, happily, and peacefully do that.

keep going!! I love your posts itt.

cosign

1) I have asked myself for years whether or not being the sort of dancer who could pretty much shake it to anything (with the exception of songs I refuse to dance to on principle alone) comfortably and with zeal would help a person be a drummer. The answer, based on experiential evidence, is yes.

I've long thought the opposite is true, too.

<3 yer posts itt

4) He said that playing along to drumless songs was a good and fun idea but I can tell that he definitely wants me to improve my skills before i demand to go berserk in public or even around other people

I like to think of the relationship between drum teacher and student as being like that of yoda and luke skywalker -- luke is always like "c'mon, I wanna go wail on Darth Vader now," and Yoda is always like "you are not ready." And in the end, Yoda knows that Luke is gonna go wail on Darth Vader before he's ready anyway, because it's just too tempting, but he has to try to hold Luke back as long as he can.

but i think stuff like that is important to learning too because it's fun, you're not going to want to learn if you're not having any fun

yeah, he totally encouraged me to keep doing it - he never told me not to do that - but i feel like he is also taking me seriously and i appreciate that.

here is some advice -- in that art blakey ginger baker video, play like art blakey, not ginger baker

talking shit about ginger baker will get you respect in drummer circles*, that's a good tip.

*not to be confused with drum circles

does he have you playing along with the Tony Conrad & Faust record?

that would actually be a good beginners exercise -- you could start playing what the drummer on the record is playing and then add things once you've got the basic rhythm down

ugh! i have all evening to practice and my brain cannot focus on counting this many boring numbers without drifting off and then forgetting to count
i can do the task and play the beats, but i frequently lose track and then i start counting in different ways to amuse myself and it gets away from me.

---> requesting tips for keeping mind focused exclusively on counting because that is obviously a challenge for me. it's such a weird feeling to have to focus so hard on one thing. it's not a feeling i am familiar with, really. also, am i feebleminded or something? did anyone else here ever have trouble learning to count? surely i am not the only one who has experienced such a challenge.

please note -- i am able to count and do it correctly 3x in a row but i have to reaaaaaaaally remain focused and today i just lost my temper and posted this dumb post but i am going right back down there to try again. don't worry.

no, you aren't feebleminded. I've been there. I remember playing a piece where the drums had to play the same part 32 times, and I was like, "Are you fucking shitting me? You expect us to count to 32!" When as a normal human being, not in front of a drum set, counting to 32 is exceptionally simple

or just like maybe point at me when it's time to change it up? dang.

thank you x100, that makes me feel better. it's like this awful switch that goes in my brain as soon as i have to play and count, it's like a self-consciousness button and it used to always self-destruct, but training it to keep going is...weird. attempting to lose one's self-consciousness even in the most minor way is super super weird.

also obvs i did it. i did it right 3x in a row, and i recorded myself the last time. i am not gonna lie, i was super nervous, but when i listened to it, i honestly thought in my head, "this is me?" i'm sure it's not anything special, but it's the first time i have heard myself play anything resembling music (ie not plinking around or noise or whatever) on an instrument since i was in...6th gr? it was alarming but also gave me a little good feel. so, again, thanks drumming. <3 u.

i'm going back down there now. i just had to report the news of my recovery. also it is clearly progress that i understood your story, right? i'm making progress in understanding the whole system of things i need to think about at the same time in order to properly play this instrument, i think. i hope.

So is the issue that your mind is busy monitoring your body playing the parts or is that you zone out and forget to count?

Do you count in your head or out loud?

Counting out loud, ime, was the best way of focusing and not doing the zoning out thing

Practice counting along with recordings, like when you're just listening and not playing. It can even be kind of fun, in an aspie sort of way, to count along with a song and figure out the structure of it.