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FUCK EDITORS

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i've once written for 20$ a review, but five???? WTF??? Get your ass outta there! the 20$ mag didn't even fuck up my reviews.

― Jay K (Jay K), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 07:51 (twenty years ago) link

write for spizzazz

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 07:53 (twenty years ago) link

Something else to add to Trife's list: don't edit a 1000 word article tracing an artist's last 10 years of work down to 500 by removing the last 500 words. Cos then it looks as if the artist hasn't done anything since 1997. Plus, the new record they're actually promoting doesn't even get mentioned.

Unbelievable.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 09:39 (twenty years ago) link

they always do this... one particular piece of advice to editors: NEVER FUCKING INTRODUCE WORDS LIKE "SUFFERATION" INTO MY WORK EVER!!!

― Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 10:06 (twenty years ago) link

I *did* 'fuck an editor' once. I never called her again though, and I also didn't get any more assignments.

― dave q, Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:31 (twenty years ago) link

I *did* 'fuck an editor' once. I never called her again though, and I also didn't get any more assignments.
Sounds like you've got a legitimate sexual harrassment claim there.

I am currently (also constantly) at war with my, uh, superior here. He's not my editor, but sort of thinks he is, as he is the chief music writer or whatever. But he doesn't do any editing, and he never sees my copy until he reads it in print (the actual editor, I like, he's a nice guy).
But my, uh, supervisor just asked me when the hell am I going to write reviews again, since I've done only two or three since May. I said that I don't get anything to review. Because all the promos get sent to him and all he passes on to me are Klezmer reissues and sub-indie folk releases. And I've reviewed those, and whatever other releases he deems "NEED" to be reviewed the same week that he's reviewing something else that "NEEDS" to be reviewed. I've essentially been his bitch for two years now, and fuckit. I'm three times the writer he'll ever be (and that's not saying much, but, y'know, I AM competent, I've been doing this for 6 years) and I deserve at least the pretense of respect.

Howev, he is in tight with The Brass 'round here, so there isn't even anyone I could talk to about this and sort of say "hey, this guy is being a fuckwad. I still want to write for your paper [=I like the way your cheques clear], but this guy is making it impossible."

― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:19 (twenty years ago) link

dude, "sufferation" is a GREAT word

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:25 (twenty years ago) link

also, since you're a freelancer remind them of that Supreme Court decision stating they can't put your shit up on the website after six months (???)

Tasini v. New York Times.

― Larcole (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:33 (twenty years ago) link

This is where I say I'm glad Matos is one of my editors. Every change he runs by me by pointing out how something is weak or poorly phrased and can be improved -- in otherwards, he's actually constructive! -- and then trusts in me to make those changes before adding a small finishing touch here and there as needed. So yay him!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:36 (twenty years ago) link

Best editors I have ever worked with: Melissa Maerz, Ira Robbins, Heather Willis

Editors that I haven't worked with enough, but who have treated me very well: Matos, Chuck Eddy

― Yanc3y (ystrickler), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:40 (twenty years ago) link

sigh

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:47 (twenty years ago) link

sufferation is a great word when used by jamaicans w/ dreads, not pseudo-intellectual white-boy dancehall enthusiasts... plus it was used in a piece about the wild bunch who didn't do a lot of suffering...

― Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:48 (twenty years ago) link

It sounds like it could be used in "Eve of Destruction"

― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:52 (twenty years ago) link

Gregory Hines could say it when he's chasing her!

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 16:20 (twenty years ago) link

so, um, where can we see this review in its altered state?

― M Matos (M Matos), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 16:50 (twenty years ago) link

Eth, you can always ask your editor to run any changes by you first - if you respond to emails quickly, some editors won't mind this, and when there's a "change this to this"/"OK I'll change it but try my revision instead of yours" exchange it often solves what the editor sees as a problem without you having to see your name on a piece of shit. NB it sounds like your editor is one of those who changes things just so he/she can feel like an editor, though, in which case this approach is pointless

― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 16:53 (twenty years ago) link

I used to have to deal with this with one of my old editors, who was then new and in the shadow of the guy who had built up the mag from nothing and obviously feeling like he had to prove himself to the stable of snarly writers he had inherited.
He had put one of his jokes into one of my things, and since I like to think that I'm pretty good at putting jokes into things, I was quite distraught by the insertion of non-HM humour into my piece. So I threatened to quit, and he said, "okay. do you know how many people are willing to suck my dick to do what you do?"

― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 16:59 (twenty years ago) link

if any editors are reading this i love you all and you should give me work

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:08 (twenty years ago) link

Yes! Editors should always run the final by you for approval.

I'd also like to throw a "Yay" at Keith Harris. That is all.

― Kate Silver (Kate Silver), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:20 (twenty years ago) link

you could always finish up that stranded piece on reanimation for stylus, trife. not that we need something for next week or anything.

― toddlburns, Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:28 (twenty years ago) link

J0hn - the "could ya maybe run things by me first" gambit has been attempted many times, to no avail

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:34 (twenty years ago) link

and really trife if you're not looking for money you really should write for stylus, spizzazz, freaky trigger, whatever - the readership's gonna be bigger and smarter (potentially deffer even).

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:37 (twenty years ago) link

Chuck is grate, every fudge word is a sonar pulse that he has special receptors for. I already write differently, taking out stuff like "seems like to me" and "pretty much" &tc.

The only trouble I had was realizing I actually had a specific assignment :(

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:38 (twenty years ago) link

That is pretty cool but what if you're honestly ambivalent about something?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:43 (twenty years ago) link

ride the snake

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:43 (twenty years ago) link

Ned, it seems to me that's pretty much a different case. :)

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:44 (twenty years ago) link

Astounding!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:44 (twenty years ago) link

writing for the voice makes the stuff i wrote prior to writing for the voice read like a different person

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:47 (twenty years ago) link

You still write the same around here, though, don't you? Or not?

trife I really hope "rat-faced leprechaun" was referring to Jermaine Dupri.

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:48 (twenty years ago) link

ha tracer check out twee emoticon using jess from august 2001! to everything, turn turn turn

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:51 (twenty years ago) link

tracer: yup!

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:53 (twenty years ago) link

An editor once inserted the phrase, "But who cares, 'cuz it rocks!" at then end of a Korn review I wrote.

― Sam J. (samjeff), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:53 (twenty years ago) link

(at THE end, of course. [...who cares, 'cuz that post rocked!])

― Sam J. (samjeff), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:55 (twenty years ago) link

An editor once inserted the phrase, "But who cares, 'cuz it rocks!" at the end of a Korn review I wrote.

Whoa. Was it a negative review?

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:59 (twenty years ago) link

I hesitate linking the other review cuz it was really fuckt with, it's a bit old hat for ilx, and it might stir up a nest of corny indie fuxxx (which is the point - this is for an alt-weakly in athens, where hipster record stores pride themselves on not stocking rap - but outta that context and into this I hesitate). (not hard to find following that other link though).

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 18:00 (twenty years ago) link

If I remember, I was trying to make the slightly complex point that even though the album would be pretty irritating to most ears, it would still please the kids who scrawl "Korn rocks!" in the AOL chat rooms (i.e., it was a success on the terms of the band and its fans). (This was before Korn got huge; they were still kind of a niche skater freak-rock band.) But all that got removed, in favor of "Who cares, 'cuz it rocks!"

The guy was a really poor editor.

― Sam J. (samjeff), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 18:04 (twenty years ago) link

the review really does read like trife's flow has been fucked -- like standerd alt-write dropped inna middle of his bing-bam idea-rattle.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 18:06 (twenty years ago) link

trife you might wanna play the "listen you amateur fuck - I wrote for pitchfork! thas right - PITCHFORK!", it might work (in athens)

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 18:11 (twenty years ago) link

Most editors here tell you what changes they want and let you get on with making them, so at least you learn how to do it. It's assumed that you will develop the skill of editing yourself as you go along.

I am very, very lucky in that 1) 95 per cent of the time, my first draft is what runs and 2) I'm rarely at odds with editors because of anything I write, or changes they want me to make. But British magazines are a bit more free-rein than American ones as a whole and it would be interesting to have to deal with one of those Vogue by jury rewrites.

(BTW if Matos shows up to collect his props my friend C rang tonight and says yes you do know her you were hanging a bit at Mpls lifter puller shows and sends props as well)

― suzy (suzy), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:05 (twenty years ago) link

"trife you might wanna play the "listen you amateur fuck - I wrote for pitchfork! thas right - PITCHFORK!", it might work (in athens)"
that prompted me to go to pitchfork and check out your reviews trife. and i must say, i shed tears of laughter at your eminem review. thanks.

― Felcher (Felcher), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:10 (twenty years ago) link

(thanks Suzy, tell her hi as well.)

― M Matos (M Matos), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 22:07 (twenty years ago) link

the review looks fine and quite ethanish, you can't always get what you want, live and learn etc.

― M Matos (M Matos), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 22:08 (twenty years ago) link

I have found Maerz to be very helpful and constructive (and I should start pitching stuff to her again, dammit), and Matos has been great so far (though I do sort of wish he'd noticed how many bloody times I used the word 'electro' in a recent DJ Shadow review). I figure you're in pretty good shape if the worst problem you have is "they can't always find space".

― Nate Patrin (Nate Patrin), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 22:48 (twenty years ago) link

new complaint, fresh today. My lead was for shit: "Like his music, So-And-So's current tour reflects a can-do, roll-with-the-punches attidute just like his music."
Okay, I cop to shitty not paying attention, but at least TWO other sets of eyes went over my piece before it hit the page. Fuck fuck fuck. I mean, it's my screw-up, but at least ONE of them should have caught it.
Maybe I've come to rely too much on editors, or maybe they've just come to assume (based on my all-around brilliance) that everything I do is perfect and don't bother with my copy when there are other writers who do need more of what one of my eds calls "massaging."
Anyway, boo to all three of us for being lazy.

― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Thursday, 17 July 2003 14:40 (twenty years ago) link

B-b-but Horace, you still wrote 'can-do, roll-with the punches' and nobody did anything about that, either ;).

― suzy (suzy), Thursday, 17 July 2003 15:09 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah, but I was being jocular there.

― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Thursday, 17 July 2003 15:13 (twenty years ago) link

I'm still embarrassed about calling Wake Up on Fire (local B-more crust-metal band) "firey" in a review. Somehow that one got in.

― Tom Breihan (Tom Breihan), Thursday, 17 July 2003 15:42 (twenty years ago) link

That said, Bret McCabe (B-more City Paper) is a really decent editor. But none of youse should write for him because I'm from Baltimore and you're (probably) not. It bothers me when I lose writing jobs to freelancers from other cities, and it's what's kept me from looking for work at alt-weeklies in other cities. Is there any sort of etiquette on this? Does everyone else write for papers in other cities? (I haven't been doing it for very long; this sort of thing is probably common knowledge, but humor me.)

― Tom Breihan (Tom Breihan), Thursday, 17 July 2003 15:46 (twenty years ago) link

I AM NOT MONTEL WILLIAMS!

― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Thursday, 17 July 2003 15:47 (twenty years ago) link

Seriously tho, I think that sucks too. Weeklies, you'd think, would have an imperative to be as local as possible.
I don't know. The worst thing is when they hire an out-of-towner and he/she blows, but is a friend of the ed or something. This happened.

― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Thursday, 17 July 2003 15:49 (twenty years ago) link

Skipping 214 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

send the freelance pitch at 5:15 pm Wednesday on the East Coast or wait till Thursday morning?

― alpine static, Wednesday, 30 March 2022 21:16 (two years ago) link

Thursday morning is my instinct

― politics is about vibes and the vibes are off (stevie), Wednesday, 30 March 2022 21:22 (two years ago) link

mine too. the pitch is probably too long and has taken too much time, which has landed me here!

― alpine static, Wednesday, 30 March 2022 21:28 (two years ago) link

a good pitch is sent at 2am and explains why it was sent at 2am

― Karl Malone, Wednesday, 30 March 2022 21:35 (two years ago) link

i thought this thread was about the band editors

― in places all over the world, real stuff be happening (voodoo chili), Wednesday, 30 March 2022 21:37 (two years ago) link

probably should've revived a different, less aggressively titled thread

― alpine static, Wednesday, 30 March 2022 21:43 (two years ago) link


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