DRUMMERS: Advice for a beginner

ok!
it's on my calendar. we can coordinate via email!!

also woodshed?

Oh, ha, it means practicing a lot.

haha -- i chickened out on dropping that vocab in my lesson today but i do have an announcement. i have been introduced to ghost notes. they seem so cool and fun!

yesss! ghost notes are the key

definitely helps with stick control - has your teacher covered double/triple strokes and stick bounce yet, or are you doing ghost notes prior to that?

What are ghost notes? Are those like grace notes, or something else?

i actually had to look it up! it seems like they are similar -- similar method as the grace note in a flam, but closer to a standard non-accented stroke?

ok now i have discovered the existence of the double and triple flam paradiddle and want to see what i can do with them

grace notes always come just before a louder hit. in a flam it's the quiet hit that comes an instant before the louder stroke. in a drag, similarly, it's the two really quiet notes that lead into the primary, louder stroke.

ghost notes can come at any time in the beat - the distinction is that they're much more quiet than the loud snare hits on the 2's and 4's. "felt more than heard" is the usual description.

i haven't watched all of this so apologies if this guy is a douche or a terrible drummer or something, but listen to the beat at 2:00 in:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciA3Uhn9JuI

my question is whether they are played the same as a grace note -- the video i watched made it seem like they weren't as quiet

the loudness of the ghost note depends on how you want the beat to sound, imo. they're always significantly, noticeably more quiet than the backbeat - if they aren't, then they aren't ghost notes. but you can play them at a barely audible level to create one kind of groove, or you can play them a little louder to create another kind of groove. or, of course, you can play some ghosts louder than other ghosts in the same beat, and that creates another unique groove.

Ah, ok, I'd just never heard "ghost notes" used in a percussion context before. Basically, the quiet strokes in the Purdie Shuffle.

I am drunk, and it seems time that this thread contained the preface to Stick Control which I will excerpt herein:

"It seems that there are too many drummers whose work is of a rough-and-ready variety and whose technical proficiency suffers in comparison with that of players of other instruments.

Of course, technical proficiency can come only through continued, well-directed practise. The more practise one does the more proficiency he acquires.

***

Practise with the metronome is also recommended, and at several different speeds, varying from extremely slow to extremely fast; and again without the metronome in the open and closed style, i.e., starting very slowly, gradually accelerating to top speed, then slowing down again, finally ending at the original tempo.

Practise at all times with relaxed muscles, stopping at the slightest feeling of tension. Remember the rhythms in "STICK CONTROL" are "conditioners." They are designed to give control. Control begins in muscularly relaxed action."

new challenge: apparently my ghost notes are ok, but i'm making them swingy which is not what i was asked to do. i think i have a hard time controlling my swing!

I think I know what you're talking about -- there is definitely a natural tendency for a lot of people to "swing" them in the beginning. Strangely, getting more comfortable playing them "straight" will in the long run make your "swing" better.

ghost notes >>>>>>>>>

There's this thing in the intro to stick control about how you have to include practice at a wide variety of volumes, including very soft and very loud (but still at even tempos and relaxed/non-tense). Doing this definitely helps you get your ghost notes down. You need to develop your control more, which is a slow process.

ghost notes >>>>>>>>>

so otm

one really distinguishing point between beginning drummers and others is if they're playing everything at the same exact volume (usually REALLY LOUD for beginners). i guess that doesn't just apply to ghost notes, but also accents and dynamics in general. still, i <3 ghost notes so much.

i'm definitely working on dynamics and volume right now in addition to all these other things
it's pretty fun! i feel like a spider dancing around in tap shoes.

I'm no drum teacher, but I would be tempted to hold off on ghost notes at first -- seems like too much to think about while getting your basic control, dynamics and coordiation down

smh at your need to express that opinion but w/e dude
i'm going to keep on learning

i just spent an embarrassing amount of time on a video lesson for the drum intro to two princes by the spin doctors. ghost notes everywhere there.

Without ghost notes and splash cymbals, there would be no jam bands.

my gold standard for ghost notes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWVk1TtnY8I

how do you do the intro to 'cannonball' by the breeders? in the video it looks like the drummer is tapping the joint of the cymbal stand (???)

yeah he's playing on the cymbal stand and the drum rim iirc

Without ghost notes and splash cymbals, there would be no jam bands.

― punt cased (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Tuesday, September 24, 2013 1:07 PM (2 hours ago)

no wonder these weren't part of my course of instruction!

i really envy those of you who learned to play as kids. trying to do this as a working adult is hella difficult, energy wise.

In spite of some recent work-related energy sapping frustration, I feel like I'm still coming along. Last night I managed to record something that was 6 min long, semi-planned, and had a beginning/middle/end. There are definitely some flubs, but it was one of a handful of times that I felt like I was actually playing an instrument. Like I was the person in control of playing the instrument. Me! What a feeling!

Awesome! Keep this up and you'll become a musician despite yourself.

Woo-hoo!

Well I mean to the extent that any drummer is a musician (high school joeks).

If this never amounts to anything else (no one ever plays with me, I am never in a band, I am never listed as the drummer on a recording, I am alone in my basement forever) I can still honestly say that this is an activity I enjoy and I will continue to do it.

^my 28 years of guitar playing in a nutshell

Lotsa lessons in perseverance this week, but I feel like I came out on top. Only 3 lessons left, then I'm on my own for a while.

I feel so bummed about my lessons being almost over! I'll start saving for more, but in the meantime I need some goals to keep me going. Usually I am absolutely not goal-oriented at all, but I feel all sorts of out-of-character ambition and zeal when it comes to learning how to play the drums. Totally not like me at all, but I'm going with it.

Ideas?

What are some of the things your teacher has had you focusing on in these last few lessons?

Youtube is the new taking lessons!

* Dynamics -- adding accents with quieter notes (this is the stuff with ghost notes)
* I'm currently doing lesson 11 in Syncopation for the Modern Drummer (I LOVE THIS BOOK) so I'm practicing sight reading and combinations of notes, reading/playing patterns of quarter/8th/16th notes
* and also I have been working on a set of beats he wrote in my notebook, not sure if it has a name but it involves the boogaloo?

I'm still having a little trouble not-swinging when I play faster, so that's the only thing currently giving me trouble.

Do you mean watching performances on youtube or using youtube lessons? The latter has not been entirely fruitful for me because I haven't found a teacher I like. The former is obvs fun/enjoyable, but usually leaves me feeling somewhat demoralized.

If I had a bass or guitar I'd come over and awkwardly play it, LL.

I would say definitely keep up with the beats and go further in the book? But also, since one of your goals is to eventually play with others, maybe try playing along to records.

Try to develop a daily routine (although it sounds like you already have...?), like, x minutes on beats, x minutes on Syncopation, end with fun time. My teacher early on said I should be doing at least 30 mins/day on lesson stuff, and the way it worked out was that it was the perfect warmup to playing to records.

Ideas?

I don't play drums, I play bass and guitar. Never had a lessons, I just bought a bass and started playing along to songs, very frustrating at first, but when you learn even the smallest part, the feeling is amazing and pushes you on. It got to the point where I would buy an album and just listen to the bass (kinda ruined general listening to music as I now dissect everything automatically) , I then started learning the album 1 song at a time. I then bought a guitar, started doing the same with that, awful at first, but now I can pretty much work out a song in a few passes. I still get a buzz learning a song and working it out. Playing in a bands is good too, live gigs and recording really put the pressure on for you to get your parts spot on. I wish I had YouTube when I was younger though, Isolated tracks are great, there's tonnes of them out there for every instrument. But after all that, I'm sure you'll find your own way.

i'm thinking of the short youtube lessons where people break down a very specific beat or lick, but yeah, it's hard to find videos where things are explained well and a lot of them are terrible anyway.

I'm still having a little trouble not-swinging when I play faster, so that's the only thing currently giving me trouble.

― Untt (La Lechera), Friday, October 11, 2013 12:24 PM (16 minutes ago)

do you have a metronome or something you use as a metronome?

Re: practice routine -- That's totally what I do already! I'm really good about practicing and why because it's the light of my life atm. I only skip maybe one day a week, and sometimes on that day I just do a few little things to quell the feeling that I should be practicing. I'm not exaggerating! Every time I go into the basement, time just kinda flies away and I always feel better.

I have been playing with recordings a little bit at the end of every practice from the beginning, and I have a playlist for practicing. It's a fun way to leave on a high note! It's a weird playlist too -- mostly songs that I know/like/are at my skill level.

I guess I'm still afraid that if I'm left to my own devices, I'm going to develop some really bad habits (like permaswing) or fossilize in my skills. I'm not ashamed to take lessons -- I really enjoy it! Someone teaches me things and tells me that I'm awesome! -- but they aren't cheap.

Re: metronome -- I have one on my phone but it's really confusing. I need to make a trip to the music store to get a stand and a normal metronome.

re: swing -- as in your playing becomes uneven as you get faster, and that the hand playing the off-beat can't keep up with the beat, and thus it is sounding like "swing" as opposed to straight notes?

i'm not sure, i just know that when i play my assigned beat sequence slowly (or relatively slowly/midtempo) i can do it no prob. because i don't want to sound like that forever and i want to be able to play faster, i speed it up and it always breaks down at some point. i guess i just need more practice!! that's my conclusion at least. just keep doing it over and over and over and over.