AMC zombie series from Frank 'Majestic' Darabont - The Walking Dead

your favorite album otm! but i actually think the show is better for not killing its main characters quite so swiftly

I thought this episode was really, really good, and probably what the show should be like more often, but I understand the tone is not tenable. I also know better than to get my hopes up.

some parts were good, some parts were a little too slow. loved michonne's fever dream/recap flashback and her zombie twin/herd cleanup. mixed opinions on the kid.
really weird to see Gurira all bouncy diva-y on Talking Dead afterward

CARL

Man, I'll take it. Anything to flesh out these thin characters. The best thing about breaking the group up and sending them on the run is there's less standing around talking.

honestly i prefer the hammy haranguing between the group over the awkardly-contexted "monologues". but i agree i'd like to see more character development

I loved the whole bit with Rick and the marauders in the house. At first I thought it might be another crazy hallucination, but it's super tense and well directed. The little bits of dialogue you overhear to demonstrate "Yup, these guys are not good people!" were hilarious.

Smiley Michonne still creepy, but I'm liking it, and her bonding with Carl. That bit with the pink girl's room was also good stuff.

The last few eps have been OK. I like the slower pace, adds to the tension. They've been well directed, too.

So that new dude is basically Woody Harrelson from "Zombieland," right?

Though I've got to admit I find it weird they've introduced these new characters/this plotline so many seasons of the show in. Folks have had plenty of time to read the books and learn where it goes, so unless they do something radically different (which they can't?) it seems like dubious wheel spinning pretty late in the season, especially if they're foolish enough to let it dangle as a cliffhanger.

From the cast/crew interviews this year it sounds like they're sticking pretty close to the book for this angle (though obviously, not 100% given the changed parties). I'm more curious about what they'll do if they still go to Washington, also because that's around the time I stopped reading. It doesn't sound like they're concerned about reusing the book plots.

No spoilers about the comic please!

sorry sorry. that one i'm not worried about though, since they blended in a lot of that arc w/the Governor, i'd be surprised if they really used it in the show

i was super-hungover at the weekend and ended up watching nearly two series' worth of this in one day with the bf (i read this thread until where we reached then skipped the rest). it's a weird show because it's so blatantly terrible in so many ways and yet it's never quite terrible enough to actually abandon? and every so often there's a fantastic scene that keeps you going or opens up a tantalising new possibility. scattered thoughts

- watching the second series in one go while hungover is, i suspect, the best way to do it. (am still three episodes from the end.) partly because only about 2-3 episodes' worth of action or plot points happen in 10 episodes. ludicrous how long they spun out the search for that fucking child, how did anyone survive it watching it weekly? and that farm needs to stop being a safe haven otherwise they'll never get off it.

- i'm not that into zombies qua zombies so i don't mind if this show focuses on human interaction and characters rather than kills and gore. so much beef with the actual character development though. i'm used to hating the lead characters and loving the supporting cast but the three leads in this show are ALL SO SO TERRIBLE. i yelled at the tv every time rick and shane rehashed their absurd machismo arguments. i don't even see them as opposite poles that represent different courses for humanity blah blah blah b/c to me they're both boring macho white cops. rick is irredeemably stupid and obsessed with playing the hero at the most inappropriate and implausible of junctures. (going all out to find wife & child...immediately abandoning them again to try to rescue a racist redneck he doesn't even know? risking his own safety for the sake of some random kid who'd been trying to shoot him a minute ago?) if i fucking hear andrew lincoln's terrible hokey southern accent uttering the words "mah wife...mah son...mah child" again i swear to god i will throw something. shane is a shrill rapey sociopath who seems completely unable to control himself in any regard. bitterly disappointed in dale for not shooting him in the woods. the dialogue in general is diabolical.

- two series in and i have no idea why anyone would fight over that whiney idiot lori. her taking off in the car to go bring back someone who had only left in order to bring someone else back and was unlikely to have stayed away a minute more than necessary was one of the most stupid decisions i have ever seen anyone make in any horror film, ever. and of course she needed a map to find her way down one (1) straight road.

- shockingly retrograde in terms of female/minority character development. weird thing is the show occasionally gives a tantalising glimpse of some self-awareness here - the andrea/lori argument over doing the laundry, token black guy's feverish ramble about race, maggie telling glenn he's not taken seriously by the White Male Heroes even though he'd be a better leader than either, daryl's insecurity along class lines - but never seems to make any moves to solving them or moving these themes forward. dunno whether it's trying to make the point that people default to trad gender roles etc in an apocalyptic event but sticking to Women Clean, Minorities Support, White Men Play Heroes makes for really annoying tv. every so often andrea seems like she might be developing into a strong character and then she veers off-course by doing something really dumb. bf assures me cryptically that this complaint does change? (he also says that the third series, when he got into it, is when it actually takes off.)

- i'm trying to work out why, in the face of all this, i actually kept watching it and overall got into it. i think the supporting characters are quite strong - i like glenn and maggie and daryl - though a lot of the best scenes seem to come from unexpected and very minor ones - scientist guy's scenes at the end of the first series, and the random suicidal farm girl trying to persuade her sister into a suicide pact were riveting. i think the zombies themselves are judiciously used, and i really like that they're only dangerous when they're really dangerous, and otherwise are just these sad slow shambling creatures that anyone can take out. i'm fine with them as a background rather than constant threat.

- i also like the way the show's set itself up as not just open-ended but with the dawning realisation that there is no end - there is no goal, there is no real sanctuary - and that it's not afraid to alter its entire tenor depending on the situation. i like that a couple of the very first characters we were introduced to have basically dropped out for two full seasons but you do think they're not completely gone - i like the feeling that you're in this for the long haul. (for ages i assumed sophia would be one of these.) at any rate this gives you hope that newer, better characters might materialise (and some of the more annoying ones die).

i guess i don't have any questions as such, i think i'm gonna keep watching and presumably not really follow this thread if you're all up to date, i just needed to type out my thoughts and it's weirdly hard to do that in non-real-time on the internet

oh god, also, though, the pregnancy storyline is The Worst. why is no one yelling at this stupid woman that there is no way she can be pregnant in this environment??? why did she vomit up the abortion pills? please god can this show not introduce an actual baby they have to take care of. had really hoped her moronic car crash was a device to induce a miscarriage but so far it appears not.

it's a weird show because it's so blatantly terrible in so many ways and yet it's never quite terrible enough to actually abandon

OTM. For the record, season 2 is the worst, and the show eventually makes strides when it comes to female and black characters.

Also, while "because they're stupid" remains a prime character motivation, to an extent, this fades a bit, too.

agreed

hey, Mountain Goats :D

The good:

I like breaking up the group and sending them exploring, even if they do just seem to walk in circles
Mountain Goats

The bad:

Is this the second time someone's put themselves in danger to get a drink? Third? Fourth?
Still really lame the way the zombies make a ton of noise, but apparently only when they're a couple of feet away.
How is it that the tiny girl who had never had a drink before doesn't get floored or sick by moonshine, but the hillbilly son of a 'shiner couldn't hold his liquor?
Sort of gross way they kept hinting that the girl was going to make a move on the older guy.

Etc.

I can buy the idea of just wanting a drink in a zombie world. But I was given a bottle of moonshine from a coworker a few years ago and after drinking half a glass I felt like I had drunk a fifth. And I'm somewhat of a heavy drinker.

Yeahhh they subtly hinted at the Daryl/Beth ship in the season premiere. The actress tried to deflect the insinuation in Talking Dead, We'll see if they have the guts to go there. (I hope there's a clip of J.B. Smoove bringing attention to this out there)

It was completely ridiculous that she could handle her liquor so well, but I'll handwave it; Hershel was an alcoholic in his youth, maybe she's got the genes. Or maybe that was really shitty moonshine. Either way, Daryl's a dick drunk lol

Getting a drink was clearly a MacGuffin, they straight-up lampshade it in the episode by the end

tbf, this whole show is a MacGuffin. It's not like they're going to wrap it up in the end with a miracle cure, and even if they survive, there's nothing left. Final scene will be Rick sitting down, dying, then eventually reanimating and shuffling off into the sunset.

I like to think Carl would have the decency to shoot his dad in the face by then

Rick will eat Carl.

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRzoG4Pob1X-hKwj9YeZXU0xNxsf00xlHF2eFgfVUilWrC5sCiG

tbf, this whole show is a MacGuffin. It's not like they're going to wrap it up in the end with a miracle cure, and even if they survive, there's nothing left

This very otm. The comic version has repeatedly said there'll never be an explanation for the zombie virus, which means no cure, which means no "end"

pretty scattered pacing wise tonight, but good. didn't expect that stuff to happen with Beth and Daryl, good bonding heartwarming stuff w/Bob, Sasha and Maggie

on another note though LORD HAVE MERCY Soniqua and Lauren so ridiculously hot on Talking Dead afterwards, jesus

also i loled when Jeff Kober came back, should've known he wouldn't have gotten cast for only a 30 second spot in that episode with Rick

finished season 3 now. much improved from season 2 albeit fundamentally still an incredibly frustrating show. for the first half of the series the governor was so much preferable to have on screen than rick, whose conveniently on/off craziness was absolutely the worst (and most overacted) aspect of the season (my irl groan when i realised that lori's death still wouldn't prevent tedious rick/lori heart-to-hearts). then they turned him into a cartoon villain who survived less because of his own cunning and more because of blind luck/others' stupidity.

characters' stupidity remains a huge issue with virtually every episode containing multiple "but why didn't they do x" moments that would have saved them a lot of bother later. obviously epitomised in andrea, ugh, but basically everyone seems to absolutely love withholding vital information.

funny how they're all sharp shooters when it comes to zombies but in the final shoot-out scored zero (0) hits on actual humans.

what this season actually did well was dialogue when the cast was pared down to a couple of characters (and they ignored the woodbury vs prison plot that was based on nonsense). i loved the episode with rick/michonne/carl/morgan. like, see what happens when you stop yelling/glowering at each other and actually talk normally! (and as badass as michonne is, when they let her start speaking her character went up to another level.) merle had some great scenes with other characters too, and his "get drunk and roll a car blasting music into the clearing" zombie-luring tactic was a) very him b) one of the few actually clever plans any of these characters have ever had.

the finale was absolutely laughable. the governor slaughters his own people why??? it makes no sense and isn't even satisfying plot-wise.

although for every positive-ish character development (carol has a personality and the occasional decent line now!) there's a regression. how did glenn go from one of the few reasons to carry on watching to this emo b-grade rick? he's succumbed to the inarticulate machismo disease.

also i know we're meant to think carl's turning into this scary child psycho but even though he's (quite understandably) ice cold i trust his instincts way more than, for example, his dad's. he saved tyreese and sasha and brought them into the group; he responded to michonne helping him; the kid he shot wasn't laying down his own weapon; and he even gave rick a few doses of much-needed real talk about what a terrible fucking leader he was.

It's such a weird show, the way it's demonstrably terrible yet oddly compelling at the same time, and not in a "LOL, this show sucks" sort of way. It's never so terrible that you want to walk away, and there are just enough dangling threads of potential, glimmers of hope, that you want to stick around and see if it gets better. Which it inevitably does, before invariably taking a nosedive again. It's like watching the water cycle.

haha yes

goddamn, most fucked up episode yet. really powerful.

Yeah WTF! I thought that little girl had problems, but I never saw that coming. This one was the first to make me feel dread and that they are living in the end of the world.

Yeah, without a doubt, one of the darkest things I ever watched on television.

Yeah, kids never make a show better, but that was pretty hardcore, for TV, for anything. Like a more nightmarish Of Mice and Men moment. Not sure it earned it, but it still rattled.

Gotta say, I don't like a lot of this show, but this season has been really well directed and acted.

1) If they weren't two of the more compelling characters on the show, I would have predicted a murder/suicide ending.

2) Who the hell names an end of the world sanctuary "Terminus?"

Yeah, even the kids gave good performances this ep. They were even beginning to flesh out Myra as a character, of course, far too late. Carol and Tyreese were really exceptional, especially that final scene at the table. So happy Chad Coleman finally got a chance to bust out his chops, like Michonne late this season.

I'm gonna guess it actually is the railroad terminus trainyard, we're gonna see a gigantic, bloody/half-burned down sign and a bunch of bombed out cars

A note: I'm surprised to be saying this, but I've really gone completely 180 degrees on The Talking Dead. I used to think it was just a hollow cheer-leading segment to fill time between reruns, but getting production insight from the actors and even some of the guest analysis has really improved my enjoyment of the show for the last two seasons.

someone tell me what the insane brutal thing that happened was, on this show i stopped watchign

You are crazy, the last 4 ep's have been really good, just watch em.

Yeah, once they broke everyone up into small groups/pairs, sent them on the move/run, it's been one pretty solid standalone episode after the other, no doubt on the way to something massively disappointing at the end of the season.

Last episode was amazing. Best episode of the whole four seasons, I thought.

the breaking of the fellowship has been a v good thing for the narrative, indeed.

The irony being that less is happening even though more is happening. In a zombie apocalypse where children are eating their parents and people are putting their former loved ones down while they're not dealing with rampaging/shambling evildoers, every episode should be as heart-wrenching and hard to watch as the last one. But of course that would be the most depressing show ever.

http://www.avclub.com/tvclub/walking-dead-grove-202256

I agree with some of the points in this, actually, it just felt to me like they were pushing past dark to ludicrously dark.

Also so, so sick of zombies popping up whenever they can't end a damn scene.

Yeah, it goes back to the problem of the zombies being quiet until they're RIGHT BEHIND YOU! BOO!

I thought the write-up was *way* off point. Ludicrously dark is the lame governor lopping off a hero's head with a samurai sword. This dark turn, on the other hand, has been building up for a long while, and the pay-off on all fronts was perfectly in line with the set-up.

kind of an anticlimactic season ender. also want to know where Beth is.

the gang scene gave the episode bit of an early climax, but overall pretty good. i notice i keep getting a sentiment on this show that if they nail one really good scene I'll forgive anything else; super intense. (man, did not think they would go so far as to having Carl almost raped) i'll miss you, evil Jeff Kober

also a lot more satisfying than last year's season ender w/the gov. driving away. this season, especially the second half, was pretty damn good IMO. probably the best season of the show yet in retrospect, even w/the awkward adventures of One-Eye Bri

as soon as Beth was "disappeared" i knew we weren't gonna see her again until next season. maybe not even until the second half, depending how long this Terminus arc goes

actually looking forward to to see Rick and Co. go nuts on these hippie/hipster psycho cannibals (my guess?) next season. never trust a Tasha Yar, man

oh shit was that her?

yeah I loved the cage full of human ribcages and the sizzling meat that rick didn't allow anyone to eat