HBO adaptation of Game of Thrones - will this be just for nerds? (NO SPOILERS PLEASE)

yeah good ep but the notion of ironborn hightailing it over a couple of dogs and shirtless ramsay bolton was just weird. also the notion that he could go toe to toe with anyone who wasn't already tied to a cross.

was i missing something there?

I heard something that Yara (Theon's sister, can't remember if that's right) going after Theon was a deviation from the novels and if that's how they're going to deviate then ugh it's so pointless.

you are correct, in the books she doesn't really give much of a shit about him. I was irritated by the way they changed it.

I guess it was just to show how completely in thrall 'Reek' is to Ramsay Snow, but it was a clumsy way of doing that.

Other than that, absolutely top notch episode.

Well, she didn't have a lot of men with her. I was hoping she gave up on saving Theon after seeing him but is now ready for war?

i would guess kings guard, so jaimie?
--sitting on a claud all day gotta make your butt numb (forksclovetofu)

From earlier seasons - can't he ask for a volunteer to stand in his place? Or is this case different in some way?

Surely it's the guy who has been traiing jamie and is the only one that knows he can't fight?

When Oberyn said 'I have an ear for accents' I really wanted Littlefinger to show up.

re shae's acting ability - i found it impossible to read any subtlety or nuance into her testimony in this last ep. was she angry that tyrion harry and the hendersoned her? was she being threatened? bribed for her testimony? who knows! everything she says she delivers w/ the same monotone.

Yeah I was expecting to detect some emotion underneath her testimony, too. I'm saving any disappointment with her performance until I learn what her motivation was. In case that matters.

Surely it's the guy who has been traiing jamie and is the only one that knows he can't fight?

― Popture, Monday, May 12, 2014 10:08 AM (25 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Bronn. Not sure if he'll do that for him AGAIN

Fight for him that is. I initially misread your post

xxp I read the monotone awkwardness of Shae's testimony as her reciting a story someone else fed to her. But then again, that actress has given a lot of awkward monotone line reads.

Why does Varys testify against Tyrion? What's his motivation there? All the other witnesses had some kind of grudge, but I can't recall that Varys does.

My guess for what's next is that Tyrion will again choose Jaime as his champion in combat because there's no way Tywin would let Jaime get killed.

Whatever happened to Gendry? Is he just row-boating in circles?

"I read the monotone awkwardness of Shae's testimony as her reciting a story someone else fed to her."

Yeah but she also threw in a lot of personal digs

I get if Varys is just trying to get points, but he didn't have to mention that he thought maybe Tyrion was sympathetic to the northern cause...

oh boy now we get TWO trials

until I learn what her motivation was.

If someone was making her say it, you'd expect her to show some pain delivering the testimony. If her primary motivation was that she is pissed at Tyrion anyway to the point that maybe she volunteered to be a witness (maybe! she was devastated so she hates him now possibly) than it's more understandable that the delivery was totally cold and detached.

So that's why I'm saving the criticism until I learn which or if it's a combination of both etc

what? why would she show pain? who would possibly care? the people who are forcing her and who are controlling whether she lives or dies, given the whole thing is blatantly rigged?

she threw in some between her and Tyrion personal digs, too. She was extremely dedicated to him despite the danger of it that she acknowledged, so you would think there'd be some difficulty just completely fucking him over that you would of heard in her voice.

why would there be difficulty when the choice between supporting someone who's been set up to lose and refusing means her death? It's not like anyone there doubted how much Tyrion's own family wanted him dead, so where would be the benefit in testifying for him? she's been positioned as someone interested in her own survival since the beginning.

I'm only saying she'd show some remorse underneath what she is forced to say. That's what I mean by difficult. I'm not saying she would say anything different (except maybe she wouldn't have humiliated him during it as much)

I wasn't advocating she would support him instead or something. So I'll judge the acting once I learn how the Shae character actually feels about Tyrion.

I think you missed the scene in a previous episode where he called her a useless whore in an attempt to drive her from Kings' Landing and she lost her shit.

I remember that, she'd be heart-broken and betrayed but maybe still conflicted? Their dedication to each other wouldn't necessarily be totally wiped away. Her delivery was so cold in the testimony but you'd expect a little remorse to show through, no?

Did you miss all of the rage episodes leading up to that where she'd demand that he acknowledge her and he'd deflect because it would be too dangerous for her and she took it as him not valuing her as woman?

True! So yeah maybe she's completely over him. But right before he broke up with her, in that same scene, she was pretty crazy about him still. That's all.

If there's one thing I think the show has done well, it's the planting of the seeds of discord in the Tyrion/Shae relationship; I don't see how, given the brutality of the rejection he landed on her combined with all of the perceived and real slights on their relationship and her status that have been going on, anyone would expect someone as steely and unbending as Shae to dissolve into a sentimental weepy mess when faced with the opportunity to give back the pain and rejection she's been taking pretty much since they set foot in King's Landing.

re shae's acting ability - i found it impossible to read any subtlety or nuance into her testimony in this last ep. was she angry that tyrion harry and the hendersoned her? was she being threatened? bribed for her testimony? who knows! everything she says she delivers w/ the same monotone.

― Mordy, Monday, May 12, 2014 10:27 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Again, this^ I was looking for nuance to clue me in as well. Despite how obvious it may be to anyone else in here?

sentimental weepy mess would have been overkill. I was looking for some dimension.

The nuance could have been anger, that's fine too.

You say nuance, but complain that she's under-acting?

No I'm saying I don't know if she's underacting until I learn how the character feels for real.

I was hoping some nuance would have clued me in. But I'm not entirely sure, maybe Tyrion is truly dead to her.

DJP otm

And Evan, seriously, at some point you have to acknowledge the difference between what you WANT for a character vs how the character, *as written*, would behave given the circumstances

my only complaint is really about the quality of Sibel Kekilli's acting + particularly her line-readings. i can obviously understand the character's motivations just from the context of the script to date. just bc her motivations are transparent doesn't mean she sold it in the performance.

I don't want anything from the character! I was just looking for some subtle information in her delivery.

I was psyched for Bravos but wasn't happy to see Mark Gattis doing the negotiations. I expected some spice-guild weirdos with crazy hats.

I'm getting the feeling that Varys is playing the long game - stoking the fires on Lannister self-destruction to set the stage for the return of Targaryen rule. Does Varys just want to get rid of Tyrion because he knows lil dude is the only one of the Lannisters who is wise and compassionate and potentially a good leader; by getting rid of Dinklage he's just removing a check on Cersei's potential to be bad and hated, maybe?

I dunno, the "I never forget" thing seemed like it signalled he still had something up his sleeve

I expected some spice-guild weirdos with crazy hats.

― lauded at conferences of deluded psychopaths (Sparkle Motion),

Yeah I'm not a fan of how they tone down some of the more lunatic fashions from the books. Where are all the elaborate winged hairdos in Meereen?

I was psyched for Bravos but wasn't happy to see Mark Gattis doing the negotiations. I expected some spice-guild weirdos with crazy hats.

This! Man, white people are everywhere.

I'm getting the feeling that Varys is playing the long game - stoking the fires on Lannister self-destruction to set the stage for the return of Targaryen rule. Does Varys just want to get rid of Tyrion because he knows lil dude is the only one of the Lannisters who is wise and compassionate and potentially a good leader; by getting rid of Dinklage he's just removing a check on Cersei's potential to be bad and hated, maybe?

Still undecided about the extent to which this in aid of a potential Targaryen return, I hadn't considered that angle so much as just Varys wanting to destabilize the Lannisters more generally for his own ends, whatever they may be - the Targaryen thing is as plausible as anything else I suppose.

But yeah I think this is a very solid reading of Varys's actions here. Dude is clearly a shrewd judge of character and obviously it wasn't a coincidence at all that they chose to remind the viewer of that earlier quote from him about Tyrion's heroism. Also him and Tyrion always seem to have got along well enough, or at least demonstrated a certain mutual respect. The ambiguity "Unfortunately I never forget a thing" - "unfortunately" in this case because he's actually genuinely sorry that he's helped to knobble Tyrion in this ridiculous show-trial, but needs must, greater good etc.

Greater good aka good for Varys despite anyone else.

xpost
Yeah maybe pegging it to Targaryens is premature - just giving him credit for being the dude who would know dragonlady's on the rise.

He could just be getting ahead could be other stuff like Iron Bank coming down on the Lannisters or Littlefinger's own anti-Lannister long game.

Team Varys

whatever the direct motivation, makes sense that Varys would want to take Tyrion out just because T is someone who is perceptive and clued-in enough to be a potential problem to him in the future

I love Shae's accent. She can't act, but I like hearing her try.

Shae is a really tedious character in the book too. It would be nice if Sibel Kekilli had more emotional range, but the part is pretty limited.

I get that Shae is mad at Tyrion and it's been building, but her making up a bunch of shit with the intention of getting him murdered seems a bit much. I think she has to have been coached/threatened/etc.

Man this thread is a pain in the ass to load. Too much to ask to get a new thread for Season 5 when the time is right?

I'm probably repeating myself, but, accepting for different strokes & folks, I wonder why we're focusing so much on Sibel Kekilli's acting when Kit Harrington and Emilia Clarke have much higher profile roles and are outright terrible.