OH MY GOD HE'S OOGLY: nu-Who season 8

Yeah they were good. Efficient storytelling, as sic was saying, without seeming rushed. And certainly no more unbelievable than your standard non-SF drama.

The thing that rang false to me was his reaction to the kid's question and Clara's teasing, mostly due to a conversation I had a few weeks ago with a vet who served in Afghanistan about how off-putting and stupid he finds the "did you ever kill anyone" question. I'm sure there are people out there who would react to Clara's borderline-cruel glibness with concern that the students were telling everyone he cried in class but I didn't buy that he would walk away from the conversation still interested in her.

(Like, it would have made more sense to me for him to have brushed her off after her jibe, her to go through the adventure and get to know and relate to Journey, then come back with an apology that led to a reconciliation and a date.)

Presumably he realises she has no idea what he's upset about because she doesn't know anything about his background except for soldier -> teacher, so there's no hint of cruelness at all, and he's only bringing his own sensitivity and baggage to the fore, and doesn't hold it against her

Though he does against himself

(wait which jibe?)

I do think that it's valid to take issue with a present-day real-life section of an otherwise fantasy text. There are lines where you draw your suspension of disbelief

absolutely, but it's literally the only thing forks cites as example of the "writing and plotting" of the episode being "relentlessly dumb"

oh right: "What, shoot people then cry about it afterwards?" Yes, but I think this is deliberately telling us about his character that he takes this so internalised, both in the moment and the aftermath, instead of coldly but politely putting her down, or lashing out at her unthinkingness. She's a dick, but doesn't mean to be; he'd be justifed in writing her off, but it tells us about his personal sensitivity and his empathy that he doesn't.

I think it's closer to "she's a dick without thinking about it" because I really don't think as an adult that you can say something like that without even entertaining the possibility that someone might find it incredibly dickish; possibly this is going to be something that the 12/Clara interaction is going to expose in her personality as something to work on/through?

I didn't think it was a huge problem, but I didn't quite buy it: (previous) DJP post otm, basically - I wasn't really convinced by how quickly he gathers himself to spot that Clara's comment was glib bantz rather than cruel, informed mockery.

she immediately realises she's said something over the line and upset him, which is important to his forgiving/accepting the accidental/unthinking nature of it.

but also notable that she realises this from reading his reaction, she still doesn't process her actual words and work out the degree of the offence, or possibly *why* it caused that reaction

fair point

honestly I thought this was well-acted, I just didn't buy the baseline sequence of events given an rather illuminating IRL conversation I had a couple of weeks ago

(it's kind of sad that I am having problems remembering that Danny's name is Danny)

Maybe if his surname started with a P...

hee hee

yeah, I like Danny, like the actor, but was just a bit unpersuaded by the rapidity of movement from mock-my-tears to go-for-a-drink.

I thought this was alright. Not as good as a second episode should have been though; the premise seemed a bit cheesy. Actors all comporting themselves well though

Apparently Dalek: Fantastic Voyage hadn't been done yet. Liked this episode a lot and agreed - big improvement on the pilot. I like the axis of imperial grumpy Doctors so Capaldi is A+. I'll even sit through the customary medieval times episode next week.

There's never been a Medieval episode in nu-Who, though, or has there? They've been to the Shakespeare/Elizabeth I era, and Ancient Rome, but nowhere in between.

Personally, I've always loved odd revisionist interpretations of the Robin Hood legend, so I can't wait for this one. I even liked the Star Trek TNG episode where Q turned the Enterprise crew members into Robin Hood' Merry Men.

last time they went inside the Doctor's own head to cure a virus:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-bYKTq2_CkHg/UiBcMmI318I/AAAAAAAABWk/wZSKI1yyLU8/s1600/vlcsnap-2013-08-30-17h25m05s38.jpg

(next week's is by Gatiss and has had appalling reviews btw)

Second episode in the series is usually some tossed off formulaic romp so actually this was quite a step up.

xp These appalling Gatiss reviews? Most I've seen suggest this one's actually really funny and really good.

gatiss has pretty much always been A+ for me

Blimey, does Ben Miller look like Anthony Ainley in that trailer or what?

i spect this has been observed before… caecilius-face choice - the dad in the family he saved from vesuvius. when Donna had pleaded and he'd initially said no way, he couldn't go back and save the timelords, so he couldn't save vesuvians (?). but he did, he saved caecilius. and later he discovers the time lords were merely lost, and then after a millennium long siege they manage to grant him a new face, and he takes this one. this is all leading back to gallifrey innit :-(

I was wondering what the story was on Gallifrey I thought he was coming aboard as the Doctor had an existing task of finding the hidden world after the anniversary episode.

Personally, I've always loved odd revisionist interpretations of the Robin Hood legend, so I can't wait for this one. I even liked the Star Trek TNG episode where Q turned the Enterprise crew members into Robin Hood' Merry Men.

― Tuomas, Wednesday, September 3, 2014 7:39 AM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i'm surprised not to see a mention of men in tights here, tuomas!

I must protest. I am NOT a Merry man!

Lol.

rubbish nerdy observation #52,431,113, the main 'medieval' old who story I recall is the Time Warrior (1st Sontaran and Sarah Jane story I think) which included in the cast Jeremy Bulloch, aka the dude who played Boba Fett (originally) but who also happened to be a main recurring character in lovely 80s show Robin of Sherwood (Ed of Whickham)

If the robot from E1 jumped rather than being pushed then that means that so far, the people who've been picked up by Missy aren't just people who died around the Doctor, they're people who've been talked into killing themselves by him.

The soldier in "Into the Dalek" wasn't talked into killing herself by the Doctor, though, or was she? Didn't she herself suggest she would hold off the robot antibodies so the others could get away?

I was wondering what the story was on Gallifrey I thought he was coming aboard as the Doctor had an existing task of finding the hidden world after the anniversary episode.

I've been wondering about this too... The monologue at the end of the 50th anniversary episode made it sound like finding Gallifrey was now the Doctor's number one task, and Smith's final episode confirmed the Time Lords are indeed alive somewhere, but the whole thing hasn't been mentioned since. Are we to assume the regeneration made the Doctor forget about Gallifrey? And that he chose the current face he has so that he would remember it (as per Alan's theory above)?

Didn't she herself suggest she would hold off the robot antibodies

She suggested it but then wanted confirmation it was the right thing to do etc, and the Doctor gave her that confirmation. So maybe not "talked into suicide" but "encouraged to sacrifice".

i recall rustie (not the dalek) saying he had a master plan for bringing back a big old who thing each season. season 1 = daleks, 2 = cybermen, 3 = master, 4 = davros. a sort of slow repressurisation of continuity. moffat's grand plans have (to date) been more about inducing the continuity bends, rebooted universes, backwards-in-time wives, an always-there-all-along guardian angel, Dalek's "Doctor" amnesia. But now maybe he's back on that original plan, bring something back, the one thing rustie took away and seemed never wanted to bring back.

hey maybe Missy is Romana gone mad. (I expect this has been suggested many times already just for LOLs anyway. "Hey maybe she's Leela when she learned to regenerate or suttin")

Lalla Ward got fed up being married to that awful gobshite Richard Dawkins and regenerated into Missy, that's my theory.

Moffat said the Gallifrey thing would just be there in the background. It would be daft to reveal it already... don't forget we had Gallifrey sending regenerations through the crack in the universe in the Christmas episode... that gap's closed now. But there may well be some funny Gallifreyan business going on, forces which will emerge as the season goes on. All speculation of course.

Has Moffat given any indication of how long he plans to stay on as head writer?

He's certainly on board for Season 9 having talked about a cliffhanger, but beyond that, it looks unlikely he'll stay on.

It's an absurdly tough gig and he's not the most thick-skinned guy so I can see him leaving before too long, especially has the success of Sherlock proves he doesn't need Who. I really hate the Moffat-must-go crew though. I don't like everything he does but on balance it's a remarkable achievement under unbelievable pressure and there are only a handful of writers in the world who could handle that show.

Smith's final episode confirmed the Time Lords are indeed alive somewhere, but the whole thing hasn't been mentioned since.

You seem to have missed the entire next episode, in which he found Gallifrey and the Time Lords gifted him an entire new regeneration cycle.

whoops, as Stew says

He's lost it again though, so I'm sure it's something that will come back up at some point.

Smith's final episode confirmed the Time Lords are indeed alive somewhere, but the whole thing hasn't been mentioned since.

You seem to have missed the entire next episode, in which he found Gallifrey and the Time Lords gifted him an entire new regeneration cycle.

Er, that episode was exactly the one I was talking about when I said "Smith's last episode". And he didn't really find Gallifrey, he just got the confirmation that they are alive somewhere (though presumably still within the stasis field the Doctor put them in the previous ep), on the other side of the crack. Presumably he still want to find them and release them of the stasis?

I bloody hope not

Quite funny, rubbish plot.

Oh right you guys have seen this one already (hides from thread for 24 hours)

SPOILERS: The Doctor wins.

goddamn timetravelling euros

*covers eyes & ears, backs out of thread*

Is it shown on Sundays in the former colonies?

saturday night in the US

This is interesting - a certain scene was cut for broadcast (I don't want to spoil anything; the workprints of the first 5 eps have been online for a while in case you'd like to check out what was removed). At some point we can talk about it I suppose

Loved this ep, very funny and Cap is marvelous in it