Serial - the podcast *spoilers*

For example, there isn't a single call to Jays house, not a one. So how did Adnan get Jay to meet outside his grandmas?

This isn't really that hard to explain though, e.g. he might have known that Jay was likely to be at his grandma's at that time, because he usually was, or because they had discussed it earlier. It was where he was living and where he ran his dealing operation out of.

Also why would there be a call to Jay's (grandmother's) house from the cell phone arranging for Adnan to meet Jay there if Jay was the one who had the cell phone at the time, or am I misunderstanding your point?

Well, it's what Jay says. Jay says Adnan called him at home, and asked him to come outside. But there is no call like that. It was just an example. There are a myriad ways how it doesn't fit with the timeline.

The thing supposedly took place between Cathy's and Leakin Park, which is a 45 min window with a few other calls being made in a completely different place.

Has the 6:24 incoming call been clearly identified? Maybe, just for example, the 6:24 call is Jay calling Adnan's cell from Jay's (grandma's) house when Adnan has the phone -- it's a 4+ min call, maybe they're talking for a bit on the phone, then when Adnan gets close by he says "come outside.'

But the problem with that kind of analysis is that it hinges on someone's memory, 15 years later, of the more minor details of a story that anyone could get wrong, let alone someone stoned.

Which is why I don't put too much stock in the mere fact that there are "inconsistencies" in his testimony.

I thought that there are two outgoing calls, one to Jenn and one to Yaser immediately prior to the two Leakin Park incoming pings. I guess it's "possible" that Jay took the phone and ran off with it to Leakin Park and then gave it back to Adnan before 9pm, but I'd say it's pretty strong evidence that the phone was with both of them.

The 6:24 call pings at Cathy's. Don't think Adnan can get to Jay from Cathy in four minutes. And yeah, there are two outgoing calls right before Leakin Park, as in, only ten minutes before, but problem is they don't ping from Leakin Park, but from the mosque. So they hardly prove that Adnan called anyone from Leakin Park.

Btw, this: http://viewfromll2.com/2014/12/13/serial-why-the-nisha-call-shows-that-hae-was-murdered-at-332-p-m/ Apparanlty, buttdials ocures with some frequency during violent attacks... The writer is a bit disengenous, as he claims he isn't making a statement on WHO had the phone, just that the guy with the phone probably murdered Hae during the Nisha call. Seeing as the phone called Jenn ten minutes before, though, it's a pretty speculative attack on Jay.

Which tower is the mosque? I don't see it on the map
http://serialpodcast.org/maps/cell-tower-map

"So they hardly prove that Adnan called anyone from Leakin Park."

They indicate he had the phone 10 minutes prior and that Jay was likely with the phone as well 10 minutes prior.

Btw, this: http://viewfromll2.com/2014/12/13/serial-why-the-nisha-call-shows-that-hae-was-murdered-at-332-p-m/ Apparanlty, buttdials ocures with some frequency during violent attacks... The writer is a bit disengenous, as he claims he isn't making a statement on WHO had the phone, just that the guy with the phone probably murdered Hae during the Nisha call. Seeing as the phone called Jenn ten minutes before, though, it's a pretty speculative attack on Jay.

― Frederik B, Wednesday, January 7, 2015 5:08 PM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this makes a lot of pretty big leaps

It definitely does. But something weird happened with that call.

The mosque as apparantly L651, same as Adnan, Best Buy and Woodlawn.

The 6:24 call pings at Cathy's. Don't think Adnan can get to Jay from Cathy in four minutes. And yeah, there are two outgoing calls right before Leakin Park, as in, only ten minutes before, but problem is they don't ping from Leakin Park, but from the mosque. So they hardly prove that Adnan called anyone from Leakin Park.

― Frederik B, Wednesday, January 7, 2015 5:05 PM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

BTW not sure this is right either, the 6:24 call doesn't ping from the tower closest to Cathy's on the map, nor does the 6:09 call, only the 6:07 call does.

But something weird happened with that call.

But even proving that the call was a butt dial wouldn't be proof of anything else, it would just take away the "Nisha call" theory.

Well, true that. But everyone has said there were multiple calls at Cathy's, so it seems more likely that the place is covered by two towers?

x-post, that. And you're of course right on in you're post right above me, man alive.

lord of the pings: the two towers

lol

BTW who were "Phil" and "Patrick" again?

the 3:48 and 3:59 calls

Patrick is a friend of Jays. He claimed it was his weed-dealer. Phil, dunno. Anyone else know?

Starting to go down the rabbit hole now, but is there any way Adnan had the cell at 3:21 and made the "come get me" call to Jay on Jenn's home # at that time?

I guess that would contradict the whole "it was definitely after 3:30" thing though

I've thought about that as well, but then everybodys story is so weird, because why would everyone say Adnan borrowed out his phone? Also, earlier outgoing call at 12:41 is also to Jenn.

wasn't the phil the coworker from the video store?

Well, Jay didn't work there at the time, so that would be weird?

Maybe Phil got him the job at the store. I actually think the guy SK interviewed in ep. 12 though was named Josh.

yeah I think you're right

about it being josh

I don't recall if it was his real name though. Maybe it was a pseudonym for "Phil".

i can't find any info on who phil is.

but josh IS the coworker dude

He has to be a friend of Jays, since everyone agrees that Nisha is the only call to someone only Adnan knew. Could be a friend of both.

I've been pretty critical of Serial, but these Intercept interviews are awful.

And all she had to do is put the tough questions raised in Serial to these guys - the hard work is already done.

haha it says pubic library

I'd say dude caught curating a pubic library prbly did it

This is the case that'll never stop being litigated.

On message boards.

That 80 alibi witnesses who go poof is pretty interesting. Pretty clear why they didn't focus on Adnan's non-alibi in that light. Also odd that it's not brought up by Serial to my recollection.

Well, probably, none of the alibis were bulletproof, and they were all dropped? I think Adnans dad testified that he was at mosque, and one other guy said the same at grand jury trial. Also, honestly I find it really really weird that it's TheIntercept themselves that presents that evidence. Where did they get that from? And if they know that, why don't they know that the cellphonerecords actually doesn't do what Urick says they do?

Also, Urick says that Jay stated that he got a call 'around 2:45', which Jay never did. He always said 3:45, though that is demonstrably untrue, and prosecution ignored it as well.

The Intercept interviewer, Natasha Vargas-Cooper, didn't actually follow Serial, but got offered an interview with Jay through someone who know him. She listened to the podcast over 'a few days' and got involved because she 'saw some really huge… I mean just some stuff that I was like – I mean problems, and I don’t mean that necessarily in the ethical sense but it was like …' I think we know why these interviews are so poorly researched.

http://observer.com/2014/12/heres-how-the-intercept-landed-serials-star-witness-for-his-first-interview/#ixzz3OBRTP490)

"Where did they get that from?"

Well they have a link to the document signed by the attorney so they clearly got it.

"Well, probably, none of the alibis were bulletproof, and they were all dropped?"

More like they were bullshit. Did you read doc? It's basically patently untrue.

It's just weird to me that they did extra research to ask questions that would help Urick attack the defence, when they don't have the basic facts of the case straight. It's a weird priority to me. I'm not insinuating that they got something secret through unholy backchannels.

Also, the document doesn't say what they claim. It says that they've got 80 witnesses at woodlawn, track and mosque or 'would have noted his absence'. Urick misrepresents it, and Intercepts presents that misrepresentation up top.

Basically, Urick says something untrue. And Intercept repeats that untruth.

Now, Urick might simply misremember. But Intercept once again does rubbish journalism, not only not pointing out in the interview that what Urick says isn't true, but repeating it up top to support their argument that the case was alright.

I think you're missing the point (no shock there). There were supposedly "80 witnesses" who would support Adnan's alibi and the defense did not bother to even present that alibi because the cell phone pings/calls basically undermine that entire line of defense. The disclosure doesn't even acknowledge being at Cathy's house at any point. Urick didn't misrepresent anything and pretending and the ENTIRE text of the disclosure is in the article.

"pretending the Intercept is weird when"