In Which Doctor Casino Listens to Classic Rock Classics for the First Time

Listening to the album version, I guess. It's definitely a less grating mix, if obviously not a less stupid song. Still think it's kinda dinkily-recorded but I guess that's just their whole sound. With a less dopey theme I guess it coulda been a passable song, though never a classic.

Youtube comments under this are a hoot, just an endless series of people bringing up the politics and others insisting that because it was inspired by a cartoon it has no meaning.

I looooooooooove that these guys think that's a devastating twist ending, like they've got the next Richard Cory here

oh god did i love that song when i was a kid. it was like the next step after nursery rhymes. a dark, grownup nursery rhyme.

The video is a different performance than the record

ohhh. i had no idea. this thread is all about album versions, or at least whatever version would get played on classic rock radio.

and now, on to our styx twofer.

SONG #41: STYX "TOO MUCH TIME ON MY HANDS"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XcKBmdfpWs

the dennis deyoung hand gestures from 0:09 to 0:15!

Always got a Mark Hamill feeling from Tommy Shaw. Maybe it was the time.

"Is this cable access?"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_6GZME1u5A

Youtube comments under this are a hoot, just an endless series of people bringing up the politics and others insisting that because it was inspired by a cartoon it has no meaning.

I wouldn't say that it has no meaning per se but I don't really see it as a libertarian/Randan allegory. I'm also not sure that he's saying that the hatchets, axes, and saws were wielded by the maples. Def not his best lyrics by any stretch though.

sp: "Randian"

You may be right about who's wielding the hatchets (I guess the maples recruited some people, somehow?) but as to the message... err... well, YMMV but to me it seems pretty straightforward on paper - bit of sarcastic doggerel "sending up" the requests for "equality" from a bunch of whiners when everything was just fine before. Even if it didn't go out of its way to mention "unions," it's at best a little comfort food for the self-important teenage nerd hero-in-his-own-mind, oh yeah, all the norms they just want to tear down my oakish majesty because I'm better than them etc. There are maybe some bits that, in the text, could go either way (i.e. he could be sending up the disinterested oaks as a bunch of Tories wondering what the big deal is about poverty, pip pip), but that's cancelled out by the last verse and the way he mockingly yelps out "oppression!" I guess I can't figure what it would mean if it's not this little underthought political cartoon.

Now, for Styx...

Too Much Time On My Hands: Awesome start. I hope this song is in THX. Digging the little synth thing too, drums seem kinda clunky. It's not quite as rhythmically funky as it'd like to be, but I like this kind of bouncy synth thing and, at least on headphones, it sounds nice and full even if they have the most boring drummer alive. Now that he's singing it's starting to sound naggingly familiar but there's nothing about the backing track that rings a bell.

Would be an interesting comparison with "Eminence Front," which was a big stretch for that band but hangs together amazingly - here these guys don't really seem 100% comfortable until they get to their core thing with the big big chords and the overdubbed vocals. BUT - I'm kinda liking this. At least it keeps changing things up - several cool things have happened while I was typing that last part. I like the abrupt jump to the solo, and the solo itself is all right, not the most exciting one we've encountered here but not exactly boring. It really falls apart for a second after that, coming back from the "haa-aaaands" with the evidently surprised drummer bonking away and hoping somebody will remember to get the song started back up. Yikes.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I don't know this. It's not bad. Good little second-tier single for the drive home. To be honest it actually makes me appreciate "Urgent" more, which is probably a closer comparison than "Eminence Front." Big 70s act trying to grasp New Wave, and, to my ear, trying to use it the way 60s acts started using 50s rock - that is, actually as a back-to-basics approach, "let's get it down to three guys with instruments on a stage, just playing an ordinary song about romance and sexual frustration, like when we first started out!" I gotta say I think Foreigner pull it off better but this isn't embarrassing except for the above post-solo foul-up and the fact that the drummer is apparently so hapless they had to paste in a tick-tock sound effect to try and suggest a tightly-wired, time-passing quality, like nobody felt they could ask the guy to like, try and throw in some hi-hat or something.

Digging it more on the second listen tbh, enjoying the details of the songwriting (and glancing upscreen at the, er, adorable video). Highlights: the intro, certain of the unexpected lyrical turns, like where he's drunk watching soap operas in the afternoon, and the really weird phrasing of "Is it any wonder I'm not a criminal? Is it any wonder I'm not in jail?" Lowlight: the conclusion, with the ticking clock sound over NIN-style sotto voce. Maybe it just needed another round of thinking about the concept to decide whether this guy with too much time on his hands is a rich rock star loafer ("Life's Been Good"), a pent-up horny weirdo ("Sometimes A Fantasy"), just a sad drunk going nowhere ("Captain Jack"), a nascent serial killer, or what. Personally, I wouldn't mind a plot - always tough to sell a song that's just "I'm mentally not all that together!" in different words for four minutes, unless you have Michael Jackson to sing the hook.

Definitive sideways thumb - I'm not impressed, but I wouldn't turn it off if I heard it, and I'm gonna toss it in my "corporate rock" playlist to see how it settles in.

Always thought this song was about unemployment?

Ha, I just realized that I always heard "null and void" as "unemployed"! OK, you're probably right.

I always hated what they did live after the "Is it any wonder I'm not the president?" line.

http://youtu.be/pD8mzZun5wo?t=3m16s

Tommy also changes the "I'm not a criminal" line.

I had always assumed that someone taught Tommy Shaw what the phrase "is it any wonder" actually means after the song was already at least half written.

Strong possibility he absorbed it from "Fame" as a cool-sounding thing to use in a rock song.

jumpsuits don't get enough credit for their key role in classic rock.

Always got a Mark Hamill feeling from Tommy Shaw.

absolutely! and the vocal in this song sounds totally wrong coming out of that mark hamill head. i want dennis de young's voice ("come sail away") to come of mark hamill head.

Big 70s act trying to grasp New Wave, and, to my ear, trying to use it the way 60s acts started using 50s rock - that is, actually as a back-to-basics approach, "let's get it down to three guys with instruments on a stage, just playing an ordinary song about romance and sexual frustration, like when we first started out!"

interesting! never heard it that way before, but if that is what they were doing, they definitely lose the plot when the chorus harmonies come in and they suddenly sound like a prog-rock crosby stills and nash.

is it any wonder our styx two-fer will conclude with another styx song? released one year after someone else released a song called "angry young man" with a very long keyboard intro...

SONG #42: STYX "FOOLING YOURSELF (THE ANGRY YOUNG MAN)"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtzIWPeun7c

I admit, I don't have much knowledge of Styx and their history.

But when Tommy Shaw opened his mouth at the beginning of that live version up there, I went "Wait a minute, that don't sound like Chicago to me."

Dude's from Alabama and went to Robert E. Lee High School. He's like an Alternate Universe Tom Petty.

IIRC, deYoung and the Panozzos started out playing Italian wedding songs with deYoung on accordion as teenagers?

"Too Much Time" is OK but I kind of love "Fooling Yourself" in all its florid ridiculousness.

Chicago radio (specifically, WLS-AM) played the shit out of Styx. The Paradise Theatre singles could reliably (and, for non-fans, excruciatingly) be heard multiple times per hour.

(Wisely, though, even Chicago radio didn't play "Music Time": http://youtu.be/OMFlg8AuYlQ)

I'll say this much for ''Too Much Time,'' the chorus does keep popping into my head. Though about half the time it morphs into the verse from ''Working For The Weekend.''

Styx makes me think back to being a kid living in a rural desert area and someone abandoned a Ford Mustang near the ruins of a slaughterhouse where we used to hang out. There was a copy of Paradise Theater in the car's 8-Track player. We would have taken it, but nobody had an 8-Track. The car sat out there for over a year.

(on a short road trip btw, but will return to active duty soon!)

x-post Why didn't you (or someone) take the car itself?

I don't know, we were like 10 years old. We didn't have classes on hotwiring cars until 6th grade.

Fooling Yourself (The Angry Young Man): Well, it should come as no surprise that I'm irrationally fond of that other song with the similar title, despite its inevitably gross and snotty attitude. I don't suppose the parenthetical title here has anything to do with that? Would be very surprising if so. Let's take a listen.

Another THX intro, but going quickly into much more interesting territory - it's a synth-powered Renaissance Faire and Styx shalt commence yon joust! Works for me - always happy to encounter this jauntier, happier kind of keyboard playing, as in Apollo 100's "Joy," and I can buy quasi-medievalism in 70s rock though it feels more natural in the hands of say, Denny Laine or someone else evidently committed to "folk" and learning lots of olden ballads or whatever, before "rocking" as such.

The main song begins and it's bobbing along decently. Earnest! The synth horns after the strident lyrics lines are keeping the festival alive - this is King's Quest soundtrack music. Ooh, the backup vocals are nice too. GET UP! This is cool because it could feel like a real harangue with a different arrangement but the spriteliness of the proceedings makes it more like a Greek chorus endorsing the actions the hero was already rising to accomplish anyway. Exactly what our hero is up to is escaping me - riding a steed somewhere, I'd guess.

Hmmm, something lumpy about dropping back to just that plodding bass line - but it's rapidly supplemented by more joyous trumpet synth so that's cool.

The one thing about this general "friendly" take on the epic battle call is that it's hard to imagine what role it actually serves in a classic rock landscape. I mean, this is way too woodland and fey to suffice as "anthemic" in the late 20th century - hence perhaps their flip over to the "Blue Collar Man." But it does kinda rock, with these brief flashes of more strident guitars giving it some friction. For some reason this is leading me to the first Toto album - though that rocks a lot harder. But there's something fundamentally stagey and artificial about trying to construct a little "anthem" for some fictitious character, something that involves stepping out of time to approach a song as "I'm writing a short story about some characters" rather than, say, "I'm expressing how I feel" or what have you. Setting yourself up as a bard and teller of tales, so no surprise we find ourselves in the forest court of the wandering king or whatever.

Giving it a second listen, with an eye on the story this time since I realized I sort of missed what was so "angry" about this story. Okay, so he's a sort of callow and churlish youth and Styx is encouraging him not just to stand up on his feet but also to retain his sweetness, cast aside the easy cynicism? That's kinda cool, and if anybody's qualified to deliver this advice, it's the band who brought us a gathering of angels whisking the shut-in listener off to a miraculous starship journey - Styx believes in deliverance for nerds. Some more lyrical specificity would surely help, though.

Boy, that jump to the lumpy drums-and-bass bit doesn't get any less awkward. Synth guy kinda seems to be just winging it too - not exactly the loosest or most comfortable synth solo I've heard. Gets much better in the climax where he's really squeaking and bending all over the place.

Thumbs up! Not something I need to hear every day on the drive home, but a nicely engrossing little fairy tale unto itself.

I believe this song was written as a direct response to punk rock, but that's just my reading of it

also, nice review

Yeah, the Panozzos clearly don't agree on whether there should be a tempo change into the bridge. Ouch.

thread is turning into a list Styx songs I fuck with

The only Styx song I really like is "Lady", because I was quite young when I first heard it and it was on a warm suburban Chicago night with fireflies. It has an abstract and mysterious quality the other songs lack.

BTW I knew about eight people related to someone in Styx when growing up. Six degrees is like only two if you're a south sider.

styx degrees

there's something fundamentally stagey and artificial about trying to construct a little "anthem" for some fictitious character, something that involves stepping out of time to approach a song as "I'm writing a short story about some characters" rather than, say, "I'm expressing how I feel" or what have you. Setting yourself up as a bard and teller of tales, so no surprise we find ourselves in the forest court of the wandering king or whatever.

you could have written the same thing about that other guy who wrote that other song with the same title! except for the forest court of the wandering king thing. (but wait, the hassles and attila, hmm.)

i assume the two titles are coincidental and/or similar reflections of similar times, but either way i'm fascinated how both start minute-plus keyboard fanfares with lots of rapid notes that suddenly give away to strummy acoustic guitar songs. billy could easily have written most of the styx lyric (i mean, c'mon, "you've got it all in the palm of your hand/but your hand's wet with sweat," that lyric belongs somewhere on "the nylon curtain"), but he would never have done the "get up" part. that's where the two path from which they came totally diverge. that's where styx let down their hair while billy realizes he will soon be losing most of his. all in all, i like billy's fanfare better, but i like styx's song better. i've never much cared for that billy tune anyway. it's a good styx song.

as long as we're on the subject of keyboard fanfares, proggish rock and angry young men:

SONG #43: JETHRO TULL "LOCOMOTIVE BREATH"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJkmHQ2q--I

(i mean, i assume the dude in this song is angry. if he isn't, he should be.)

oh god, just realized how badly i've neglected this (thanks, "eminence front" thread, and thanks to you FCC for turning me on to "eminence front" here). comeback tour coming soon, i swear to god!

ha, that "eminence front" thread made me think of this thread too. you are welcome back anytime! you'll find that everything looks exactly like it did the last time you were here. in the spirit of classic-rock, we haven't changed a thing.

Locomotive Breath: I discovered recently that this is somehow in one of my Spotify playlists - but I'm pretty sure I haven't ever actually listened to it? We'll see. Going in, the title has always made me think it would be another "Aqualung"-like character sketch, specifically of someone with bad breath, alternately a John Henry figure straining and groaning to beat the machine. Less likely: some kind of demonic "ghost train" type of figure, coals glowing and black smoke churning madly out. Let's see.

Wow, did not expect a gentle piano opener at all. Was thinking hard-driving wheezy locomotive breath. This is pretty cocktail-hour stuff. "Now Locomotive Breath at the bar is a friend of mine..." Now we've got something with the hot but distant guitar in there and the more insistent piano. It's a cool sound but I'm really hoping the drummer shows up to this session soon though.

Okay! Now there's a rock groove happening. "In the shuffling madness of the locomotive breath" is a great opening line. Now that it's picking up energy more it just sounds exactly like "Aqualung" though, put through a kinda basic blues chord progression I think - it's been the ruin of many a poor boy, this locomotive breath.

Hahahah, I know this band has a flautist as part of the permanent lineup but it's still surprising and weird for this pippy little fellow to come desperately puffing and hooting into the mix. Always sounds very "we don't have a whole lot of songs that feature the cowbell!" to me. I'm more interested in the subtler sonic details, like the very faint fuzz on the bass. Huh, that sort of ended before I even noticed what was happening.

Second listen, gonna try and make out the plot more. Already a little bored by the piano intro... I guess this would be fine as part of an album but as a radio staple this would be a real "time for a bathroom break" cue to me even though the song's not actually that long. So basically this is a "slow-motion trainwreck" thing, a man's life headed inexorably towards its doom? That's cool, and nicely sketched if a bit melodramatic, but boy does this band not have the fiery explosions up their sleeve - as far as I can figure, the perky flute noodling is standing in for a catastrophic train disaster, even if it comes at the wrong point in the song. I wonder how much "has him by the balls" contributes to the badass rock cred here?

I dunno, I'd say it's fine for what it is, and I shouldn't judge it versus some other song I'm imagining it being, but it really has the feel of an album track or incomplete jam (especially with just fading out on "no way to slow down" - perhaps a wry commentary on the band not being able to figure out a way to end the song). Not every classic rock standard needs to be a bracing anthem but this gets very close to background music even when it's going for loud and heavy. A marginal thumbs down.

I love this thread so much! I also love "Locomotive Breath," one of the few classic rock cuts I would be inspired to turn up on the car radio these days, and it's really amazing that a song that has been a part of my life since my early teen years is just now getting a first hearing and a review.

btw, doubling back a bit, this is great:

billy could easily have written most of the styx lyric (i mean, c'mon, "you've got it all in the palm of your hand/but your hand's wet with sweat," that lyric belongs somewhere on "the nylon curtain"), but he would never have done the "get up" part. that's where the two path from which they came totally diverge. that's where styx let down their hair while billy realizes he will soon be losing most of his.

welcome back!!!

Already a little bored by the piano intro... I guess this would be fine as part of an album but as a radio staple this would be a real "time for a bathroom break" cue to me even though the song's not actually that long.

for me that intro was always an antici...pation thing, made infinitely better by the fact that you knew what was coming.

beavis: "come on, butt-head. this is folk music. change it."
butt-head: "no way. this song gets cool later."

I know this band has a flautist as part of the permanent lineup but it's still surprising and weird for this pippy little fellow to come desperately puffing and hooting into the mix.

this pippy little fellow is the frontman! the mumford to their sons!

i've always liked the guitar sound on this one, and i think the scratchy one in the left channel does a good job of being the song's locomotive engine.

I could see the anticipation thing... just wasn't happening for me on those listens. I'll leave it in my playlist, see if it starts to feel more like a satisfying familiar moment. As for Mr. Jethro Pips, well, yikes. He should split the band and move on. I hear Firefall is holding auditions.

I know what I'm always anticipating in that song hells yeah!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPCzIt4eXPk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12Aqdjtvp7o

perhaps an "answer song." more my speed really. love the thoroughly uninterested marriott ballroom audience.

that is fantastic!

BTW, another credit to this thread and fcc: grabbed a $3 copy of Fragile a while back and have been totally digging it now that my turntable's back online and I'm finding space again in my lifestyle for not-entirely-instrumental music. Sweet record, across the board it's all the things I liked about "Roundabout." So: thanks! And: assuming I want to get totally yessed out, where should I turn next?

I'm glad you asked.

oh awesome! bookmarked for reading during my next listen. just discovered it came with a pretty sweet booklet so that deserves some attention too, but it's mostly pictures.