Thicke: Slicke or Dicke?

i mean fuck dj shadow

as mentioned up thread, chic threatened to sue the sugarhill gang way back when

yeah but that's different than the Bomb Squad/Dre/Dust Brothers/whoever else you wanna throw in there, who were more than likely all thinking they could make a credible legal defense based on *how* they were using the samples (ie not just lifting an entire song outright). I haven't really read anything authoritative on this subject but once sampling started to become central to rap I'd be curious to know if any of the producers were genuinely surprised with what they managed to get away with, however briefly.

i mean fuck dj shadow

amen

my understanding is that there was this window in rap between old school guys figuring out that they couldn't get away with just rapping over/re-creating existing records, which led, in part to stuff like Run DMC and more drum machine+synth heavy compositions, but then shortly after that with samplers becoming cheaper and more powerful DJs were like "fuck it, I'm sampling that break Bambaataa used to play" and then it snowballed from there until enough old dudes smelled money and lawyered up. And then after that that heavy-duty bricolage-style became less frequent and more of a game of hide-and-seek between the producers and the sampled dudes (ie, you could get away with it as long as you could evade detection or made some deal up-front)

yeah i just think it's weird to think bricolage was going to be the fore-front of hip-hop as it got more and more pop, on some level it was always going to lead to girl talk. the court case just confirmed you couldn't make a mint off other people's records without paying them.

and this court case at worst confirms that "feel" vs notes-on-the-page is an issue, and if you push that issue, don't put jackasses in front of a jury

Old Dolph ‏@alshipley 2h2 hours ago

Pharrell issues statement: "Haven't they heard me sing? I'm clearly ripping off Curtis Mayfield, it's his family that...uh don't print this"
3 retweets 10 favorites

I think the thing about all these panic-type Matos/Wolk "chilling precedent" pieces that rubs me the wrong way is that, taken to their logical conclusion, they seem to suggest that musicians don't actually own what they create. I love sampling and homage as much as the next listener. And as a musician myself, I love it even more as I would venture to say every interesting thing I've ever done has its roots in me massacring an imitation of something else.

But at the same time, I find it kind of odd to be arguing that this stuff is essentially in the public domain. It's not. "Rappers' Delight" is one example of a song that, quite simply, wouldn't exist without what Chic did. Same for "Blurred Lines," however much a departure the actual song is from the inspiration. And the Bomb Squad/ Dust Bros. ethos. The idea that the creators should owe something more than "a debt of gratitude" doesn't seem far fetched to me.

One thing worth noting that I didn't know until a few years ago is that advertising regularly addresses the issue of feel and style. If you want to do a car ad in the style of Randy Newman or Leon Redbone, you pay a fee. It isn't as much as using an actual song, but it is something.

None of this is to say that there shouldn't be some updating for the 21st-century. But I would also argue that the Dre examples upthread demonstrate once again how limitations really do breed creativity. And at the end of the day, when you think about how awful the industry has been to the actual creators of music product, rules that require artists to be paid for the commercial usage of their appropriation isn't something I think we want to be backing away from.

If you want to do a car ad in the style of Randy Newman or Leon Redbone, you pay a fee. It isn't as much as using an actual song, but it is something.

iirc, Carlos Santana's lawsuit in 1990 set the precedent/terms for this:
http://www.apnewsarchive.com/1990/Guitarist-Carlos-Santana-Sues-Miller-Beer-Over-Commercial/id-d2d871dcb18ffed5fe6403a1d2e7cb3c

tom waits sued frito-lay for the same thing, right? that was in '88

But advertising is different because a sound-a-like tricks people into thinking they're hearing the original artist, and therefore that the artist endorses ad syncs and that product in particular. No artist name is attached. Waits sued Frito-Lay for "voice misappropriation and false endorsement". Neither claim applies in the Blurred Lines case.

but people might think Marvin Gaye had questionable ideas about sex!

Objection sustained

Old Dolph ‏@alshipley 2h2 hours ago

Pharrell issues statement: "Haven't they heard me sing? I'm clearly ripping off Curtis Mayfield, it's his family that...uh don't print this"
3 retweets 10 favorites

― dow, Friday, March 13, 2015 7:25 PM (3 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol this was retweeted yesterday by Kirk Mayfield, son of Curtis ;_;

Their's only one Curtis Mayfield funny how someone will try to be him and want to make a living off his hard wrk! #Fupayme #Mayfieldforever

Funny.

is ILM talking about this anywhere else:

http://defamer.gawker.com/kelly-clarksons-new-song-sounds-just-like-jimmy-eat-wor-1679262619

this is hilarious

its insane

it was definitely brought up in a kelly clarkson thread

There’s a thing that Marcel Proust referred to as supersaturation. When the past, present, and future all become very clear and high-definition and surround-sound in one moment. My supersaturation came right after I performed on the BET Awards [in June 2014]. I dedicated the performance [of the song “Forever Love”] to my ex. And I came home, and my best friend of 20 years, Craig Crawford, said, “I saw your BET performance.” And I said: “Oh yeah! What did you think?” You know — excited. And he goes: “I gotta be honest with you, buddy. You’re kind of playing yourself. You look like a sucker.” And it hit me that I’d lost my perspective. What I thought was romantic was just embarrassing. And he said, “You should just go away for a while.” So I shut everything down. I took some time off to be with my son, and to be with my family and close friends. And the more time I took off, the more everything became clear.

Going Thicke

so...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CWksoNpXsU

Genericke but fine.

nicki verse lmao

but this song is a jam

Incredible longread about how cursed this song was

There was a lengthy discussion in the “Pfork sux” thread

really good article, one interestingly enough that seems to have mirrored the discussion of the song itself on ILX as it progressed over time (though conversation on it dried it after the trial mostly)