Nine dead in shooting by white gunman at historic black church in Charleston, South Carolina

the emanuel AME church has a donation button on its website:

http://emanuelamechurch.org/

thanks for that

Repeal the 2nd amendment

― Οὖτις, Thursday, June 18, 2015 10:31 AM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i am 100% w/ you and feel desperate, sad, angry, and perhaps most horribly not surprised at yet another instance in the utterly depressing regularity of mass shootings and racist violence in the US but i do know better than to expect any meaningful legislative change from any mass shooting. if 20 children shot at sandy hook fails to result in gun legislation i don't see how this would, there is going be a million pieces of shit, as usual, trying to diminish this horrible incident and ignore 1) its part in the wider pattern of gun violence in the US and 2) its part in the history of white supremacy and terrorism

That Cuomo twit shouldn't be taken out of context. Most of his tweets have been defending reporting this as a hate crime, which just indicates how awful his reader comments must be.

you're right in that he's a twit

http://i.imgur.com/w96wTVx.jpg

better view of the license plate on the front of his car

guy totally has a Reddit account, right?

Yikes, what a sight.

like half of america has a reddit account xp

I'd love to see some soul searching in South Carolina (and elsewhere), with people finally taking off the vanity licence plates and patches.

A major reason I'm estranged from my mother is her Confederate reenactor boyfriend, who besides being a sociopath had all this hateful Confederate paraphenalia about.

That Cuomo twit shouldn't be taken out of context. Most of his tweets have been defending reporting this as a hate crime, which just indicates how awful his reader comments must be.

― We'd like to conduct a wobulator test here (Sanpaku), Thursday, June 18, 2015 2:50 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I thought of that, and that means people doing every kind of mental gymnastics possible to convince themselves that this guy wasn't white.

I'm just so sorry. I'm so sorry this keeps happening. I'm so sorry for my friends. I don't know what to do.

guy totally on facebook i bet

That's kind of making this about me, which is not a thing to do. xp

People like to say the Confederate flag stands for "Heritage Not Hate." So I guess this is a heritage crime.

he is - daily beast did a pretty awful story about his account which i'm not gonna link here xp

re: reevaluating the fetishization of the Confederacy and guns, I actually do know one formerly very pro gun person who, after Sandy Hook, was like you know what fuck it, and got rid of her guns (except a hunting rifle because let's not get ridiculous). But I know a lot more people who, when faced with this kind of situation, just dig in even deeper.

Come on humans. We can do better than this.

from the NYT:

Sylvia Johnson, a cousin of Mr. Pinckney, told NBC News that she had spoken with a survivor of the shooting who told her the gunman reloaded five times. The survivor, she said, told her that the gunman had entered the church and asked for the pastor. Then he sat next to Mr. Pinckney during the Bible study before opening fire.

“I have to do it,” the gunman was quoted as saying. “You rape our women and you’re taking over our country. And you have to go.”

I really hope they bring this asshole in a live and don't give him the pleasure of offing himself.

our country

and this fucking terrorist is a confederacy fetishist. his country died in flames 150 years ago.

I really hope they bring this asshole in a live and don't give him the pleasure of offing himself.

― Johnny Fever, Thursday, June 18, 2015 11:12 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

chances are high as he's white

murderer in dis guys, could he not be wite

Hope he is the only white guy in the courtroom tbh

hearing reports that he's been arrested?

i do know better than to expect any meaningful legislative change from any mass shooting

yeah I don't expect it either, but I feel compelled to reiterate the extremist stance when it comes to the 2nd Amendment because a) nobody says it and b) the NRA has an all-or-nothing agenda (that they are remarkably successful at) and the best way to counter that is for the opposition to adopt an all-or-nothing position as well. The NRA's going to say "liberals want to take away your guns" no matter how weak any proposed regulation is, so we might as well own it imo - after all, repealing the 2nd Amendment would be the optimal outcome, and we shouldn't be ashamed to argue for it.

take away all guns
throw them in a lead lined box and sink it to the bottom of the ocean
put them in a rocket and fire it at the sun

p much

Someone on my FB wall pointed out that the flag patches on Roof's jacket are of South Africa and what was formerly known as Rhodesia.

ok yea that makes sense to me xp outic

Basically fuck anyone solipsistic enough to value their right to own guns over everyone else's right to walk down the street/to school/into a fucking place of worship without fear for their lives.

#BREAKING: Law enforcement source tells News19 Charleston church shooting suspect arrested in Shelby, NC

Yeah, that's upthread, Alfred.

(Yes, two more failures/losers, so much for white supremacy.

like all the "gun control" organizations that I'm familiar with all go out of their way to argue for limited goals - restrictions on sales, on where guns are legal to be carried etc. - but I think this is the wrong approach. Set higher goals, push the debate to be between two genuine poles rather than concede that there is some reason for an inalienable right to gun ownership. Don't concede shit! Specifically call out the NRA as the enemy and argue against their reason for being. Yes this is divisive - but *this is how the NRA won*. Conservatives are great at co-opting liberal tactics, here's a case where we should copy theirs.

xxp

Someone on my FB wall pointed out that the flag patches on Roof's jacket are of South Africa and what was formerly known as Rhodesia.

― The burrito of ennui (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, June 18, 2015 11:22 AM (9 minutes ago) Bookmark

you could read the thread, alfred

As has been pointed out to me already.

Potus addresses incident @ 11:45 https://www.whitehouse.gov/live

jamelle bouie: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2015/06/emanuel_ame_church_has_long_history_of_resistance_to_racism_the_charleston.html

Charles Pierce:

What happened in a Charleston church on Wednesday night is a lot of things, but one thing it's not is "unspeakable." We should speak of it often. We should speak of it loudly. We should speak of it as terrorism, which is what it was. We should speak of it as racial violence, which is what it was.

We should speak of it as an attack on history, which it was. This was the church founded by Denmark Vesey, who planned a slave revolt in 1822. Vesey was convicted in a secret trial in which many of the witnesses testified after being tortured. After they hung him, a mob burned down the church he built. His sons rebuilt it. On Wednesday night, someone turned it into a slaughter pen.

We should speak of it as an assault on the idea of a political commonwealth, which is what it was. And we should speak of it as one more example of all of these, another link in a bloody chain of events that reaches all the way back to African wharves and Southern docks. It is not an isolated incident, not if you consider history as something alive that can live and breathe and bleed. We should speak of all these things. What happened in that church was a lot of things, but unspeakable is not one of them.

Not to think about these things is to betray the dead. Not to speak of these things is to dishonor them. Let Nikki Haley, the governor of South Carolina, look out her window at the flag of treason that is flown proudly at her state capitol and think about these things, and speak of them, before she pronounces herself so puzzled at how something like this could happen in South Carolina, the home office of American sedition.

this whole thing is so disgusting

but yeah with shakey on repealing the 2nd amendment

obviously we'll never fully be able to control internal white terrorism like this but not having the country flooded w/guns would be a start to mitigating its impact

I really hope they bring this asshole in a live and don't give him the pleasure of offing himself.

Never seemed the type for that tbh.

Yup ban guns. Repeal the 2nd amendment. We've never tried it. Let's try it.

I have gone from generally anti-gun to moderate "live and let live" re guns in my lifetime (raised by hunters/gun nuts) but in the past ten years or so I've become pretty radically anti guns. Nobody needs them. You don't need them. They are dangerous. Just stop.

Take a look at this inbred moron btw

http://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/1187A/production/_83720817_ec72579e-1b75-424c-961b-b0adf3d52a62.jpg

p much.

the idea that a "well armed populace" could actually resist the US military also a total fantasy/fallacy at this point

xxp

Potus addresses incident @ 11:45 https://www.whitehouse.gov/live

― rip van wanko, Thursday, June 18, 2015 11:34 AM (40 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Man, every time someone posts a link to the president addressing something, I find myself sitting here half an hour later with one earbud in and nothing playing in it.

The Southern Poverty Law Center has a page of civil rights martyrs: http://www.splcenter.org/civil-rights-memorial/civil-rights-martyrs.

It lists 41 people killed from 1955 to 1968. So the death toll last night is equal to almost a quarter of all people killed during the civil rights movement.

POTUS feed finally showing some activity.

Oh, we've finally gotten to the pre-president paper shuffling and throat clearing portion of the broadcast.

Obama must be tired of doing this by now

joe biden looking like grumpy cat

more on the church fires, of which there were two more yesterday

http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2015/06/26/string-of-nighttime-fires-hit-predominately-black-churches-in-four-southern-states/

Sister of accused Charleston shooter asks for donations to cover canceled wedding

as much as the plea is a little misguided, I think someone who had to cancel their wedding because their brother went on a killing spree deserves some sympathy.

Yeah I mean, I'm not donating but this doesn't really strike me as egregious, particularly when you look at how much money can go into a wedding; trying to recoup $5K from that doesn't strike me as unreasonable at all, particularly from a circumstance that they didn't actually create.

There is an awful lot of "she is his brother so therefore she is a racist right-wing redneck" in the comments (and in the article, starting with that photo, jesus christ)

Er, sister.

The picture is from CMT show My Big Redneck Wedding.

Well, I didn't think it was from the GoFundMe, that was kind of my point.

(Though I'm wrong to say it starts there, the photo is further down than the "The Wedding Klanner" subhead)

Given that the entire narrative around this dude is that he was alienated from his family for being a big fucking racist, this whole thing is extra gross.

yup. why do people write and publish things gratuitously cruel? ugh.

what a gross and horrible article

like, if the sister was fundraising to pay for getting a counter-narrative about her brother out there because we haven't heard the whole story and there's some mythical information out there that would make the racially-motivated murder of nine people make sense, I could understand this article

I could get behind it if her wedding was simply going to the courthouse to get registered and all the donations went to victims instead.

well like I said, I'm not behind it but I don't begrudge it, either

i guess i don't understand why someone's reaction to a horrible event would be to compound the suffering (albeit in a way that's trivial compared to the suffering her brother caused)

it doesn't seem to come from a place of genuine anger and concern, more like trolling

IIRC Wonkette lives on schadenfreude; they just used to be better at picking targets

i honestly cannot tell the million clickbait blog "news" sites apart and i'm not sure i want to expend the time and energy to do so

well Wonkette was "the mean political website everyone on ILX liked because an ILXor was running it"

otoh I wouldn't say that ILX has always given wonkette a free pass for ruining people's marriage plans

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/national/2015/09/12/an-american-void/

photos to this are amazing

jury has sentenced dylann roof to death

Given the current state of the law and the evidence, that was the correct sentence. But the death penalty does nothing for society other than degrade it.

I mostly agree. I gleefully await Dylan Roof's execution.

I've been thinking about this a lot since it was published: https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/07/opinion/dylann-roof-shouldnt-get-the-death-penalty.html Not intended as a comment on anybody's else's position - just something that's stuck with me.