This movie would have been 10% better if they didn't bother with a bad guy at all and just had our heroes getting mad at each other and beating one another up. Because this bad guy was barely even there. I wasn't even sure if he was a villain from the books? Because he's not the villain of the same name from the comics, right, just some Euro shlub with a grudge?
― Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 8 May 2016 23:47 (eight years ago) link
Daniel Brühl is one hell of a soporific screen presence.
― Acid Hose (Capitaine Jay Vee), Monday, 9 May 2016 00:02 (eight years ago) link
i saw some idiot alleged-adult on the subway w/ a CaptAm shield/backpack and wanted to hulksmash
― we can be heroes just for about 3.6 seconds (Dr Morbius), Monday, 9 May 2016 00:10 (eight years ago) link
Airport scene was cool but felt incongruous, if Cap movies are conspiracy thrillers (see also "hey, Manchurian Candidate").
Only Winter Soldier had aspects of conspiracy thriller. The first CA flick was Joe Johnston finally getting to do a proper WWII-action-with-some-dieselpunk flick that he attemped to do with the Rocketeer.
I enjoyed this a lot. Not sure if it tops CA:WS overall, but I read something a coupla days that I agree with: that the airport sequence was when they really did finally pull off everything that a grand superhero comic book film should be.
Interesting that you deliberately have this film coming out so close after BvS and the contrast between two different views of collateral damage.
Zemo in the comics looks like this:
http://images-cdn.moviepilot.com/images/c_fill,h_540,w_960/t_mp_quality/igodeuuz5oapfau1imjf/could-baron-helmut-zemo-become-marvel-s-smartest-movie-villain-655834.jpg
and we seriously didn't need him in this flick.
Also, we live in a time where the majority of trailers in front of a tentpole superhero films are other superhero films(and Rogue One, in my screening, which was fun to see projected that big. Those klaxons sound GREAT on a theater's sound system).
Most surprising aspect of this film was that there were still great moments not spoilered by trailers or advance hype.
― Darkest Cosmologist junk (kingfish), Monday, 9 May 2016 00:15 (eight years ago) link
I love that the 'punch you in your perfect teeth' line that was so RMDE-worthy in the trailers is totally recontextualized as a friendly jab in the movie and works just fine.
― Peanut Duck (Old Lunch), Monday, 9 May 2016 00:34 (eight years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJvUTFVqwJQ
― Darkest Cosmologist junk (kingfish), Monday, 9 May 2016 00:59 (eight years ago) link
totally. I didn't love this as much as I thought I might - the setup felt a bit forced and the preposterous appearance of some ~incriminating footage~ kinda dulled the edge of what should have been a big moment, but scene by scene it was great. spidey was both hilarious and unexpectedly profound. "can you move your seat up" and attendant schtick a total delight.
― Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 9 May 2016 01:14 (eight years ago) link
yeah one of the best recurring jokes is def the relationship between Bucky and Falcon, like two jealous little bros/BFs
― Nhex, Monday, 9 May 2016 01:25 (eight years ago) link
I really liked this
Set-up felt a little dull-draggy but mostly bcz I'm like a 5 year old I WANNA SEE IRON MAN & CAP FLY AROUND AND PUNCH EACH OTHER
Black Panther, Giant Man, Spidey all A+ ... and I got kinda teary towards the end. Daniel Bruhl great, needed more imo
― Flamenco Drop (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, 9 May 2016 01:54 (eight years ago) link
Yeah hopefully Zemo'll be developed. Nice to have an antagonist survive the movie, tho. Also, thanks to the casting of someone young and dorky I actually liked this Spiderman.
― albvivertine, Monday, 9 May 2016 02:01 (eight years ago) link
Black Panther the only one who abides by a moral high ground was great
― μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 9 May 2016 02:13 (eight years ago) link
Yea he was great
― Neanderthal, Monday, 9 May 2016 02:27 (eight years ago) link
I really appreciated that no one clapped for the Stan Lee cameo. enough already.
― Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 9 May 2016 05:59 (eight years ago) link
i can't be sore at those. i mean, how much longer can that guy possibly live?plus "Tony Stank"
― Nhex, Monday, 9 May 2016 07:07 (eight years ago) link
I don't have a lot of respect for him but I kinda like his cameos, esp this one
― albvivertine, Monday, 9 May 2016 07:21 (eight years ago) link
his best cameo is ant-man, b/c it's a split second and that's about all it needs; no point in dragging it out.
― wizzz! (amateurist), Monday, 9 May 2016 08:09 (eight years ago) link
the preposterous appearance of some ~incriminating footage~ kinda dulled the edge of what should have been a big moment
I thought this was great, the slow burn of what happened back in 1991, what could possibly be so important, and then when it appears it's what flips the switch from "We have become grudging allies because I, maverick millionaire Tony Stark, have fucked up yet again" to "I am going to take your head off".
― Andrew Farrell, Monday, 9 May 2016 11:03 (eight years ago) link
pretty much the only plot element in the movie to make me sympathetic to Tony
btw how damn weird is that youngening tech they used in Ant-Man and this, like crazy uncanny valley stuff, but it's actually working? it helps that they have plenty of film reference for both Douglas and Downey but still kinda surreal
― Nhex, Monday, 9 May 2016 12:01 (eight years ago) link
That was the "uncanny valley moment" I referred to upthread -- at first I was like, "OK, this is weird and kind of unreal, we all know what RDJ looked like in 1991 and this looks like an RDJ Realdoll or something." Then it's revealed as some kind of sophisticated VR/hologram thing that Tony Stank is demo-ing for MIT students and was like, "Oh, well that makes sense then."
I can't believe Roger Slattery and Hope Davis are the same age. He must have gone gray Steve Martin-style.
― a 47-year-old chainsaw artist from South Carolina (Phil D.), Monday, 9 May 2016 12:25 (eight years ago) link
I'd kinda wondered if/how they were going to do Redwing and I guess that was an elegant solution to a character that would probably not work in this universe.
I'd told my gf before that they were making a Black Panther movie, which meant nothing to her at the time (she's watched all of the MCU stuff but knows nothing about the comics), but she was definitely excited about the prospect after seeing him in action. Between that and her similar excitement at seeing the trailer for the previously "who is that?" Doctor Strange (which looked fantastic on a big screen), it's clear these folks are doing their jobs well.
― Peanut Duck (Old Lunch), Monday, 9 May 2016 12:34 (eight years ago) link
they gave us a 3-D trailer for Dr Strange. at a 2D showing.
― Neanderthal, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:02 (eight years ago) link
Because Dr. Strange operates on, like, a higher dimension, man. It's a metaphor, do u see?
― Peanut Duck (Old Lunch), Monday, 9 May 2016 14:13 (eight years ago) link
After the Dr. Strange trailer my daughter turned to me and said "wait, I thought he was a doctor?"
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:30 (eight years ago) link
can we have a week of her posting to ilx for you? I like her style
― μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 9 May 2016 16:24 (eight years ago) link
yeah, one of the things I liked most about this was the reveal of the team of dead winter soldiers followed by zemo's playing the video. after the huge battles at the end of the avengers movies and the previous cap movie it was cool that they swerved an earth-shattering threat in favour of something more character-based. compare and contrast w/ the stupid sudden appearance of doomsday at the end of batman vs superman
― i do not sense the entity ted (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 9 May 2016 16:46 (eight years ago) link
I've got to admit, I was totally expecting a rote face off between our heroes and a team of Winter Soldiers.
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:54 (eight years ago) link
exactly! it was a nice bit of misdirection
― i do not sense the entity ted (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 9 May 2016 17:01 (eight years ago) link
slow burn? they basically imply what happened about twenty times!
― μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 9 May 2016 17:04 (eight years ago) link
well, I guess the "how will this play out when Tony finds out" is the slow burn
If they implied it, it was lost on me. I guess I can see it in retrospect, but I'd say it counts as a slow burn.
― Peanut Duck (Old Lunch), Monday, 9 May 2016 17:08 (eight years ago) link
winter soldier kills someone in a car in 1991tony stank replays the memory of his parents dying in a car accidentzemo repeatedly asks for an incident report of that date in 1991
― μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 9 May 2016 17:15 (eight years ago) link
I could be wrong, but I don't think that we're told it's a car accident, or what year it is - there's stuff in Iron Man / The Winter Soldier that says the date, but not (I think) here.
(I could have been just distracted by how uncanny valley retro-aged RDJ was, followed by the realisation that his dickery is of such an advanced degree that he'll wank around with his dead parents telling him they're proud of him in front of the MIT graduating class)
― Andrew Farrell, Monday, 9 May 2016 17:40 (eight years ago) link
incredibly self-indulgent, but very telling in that the memory he wishes he could change the most (even after all that post-traumatic alien wormhole crap) is the time he was a dick to his parents when they were leaving for a trip because they died on the way
― μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 9 May 2016 17:42 (eight years ago) link
From IMDb trivia:
Originally Iron Man was only going to have a small role in this movie. However, Robert Downey Jr. asked for more screentime and a higher paycheck. Marvel CEO Ike Perlmutter planned to have Iron Man written out of the film completely, in which case the Russos had backup plans to adapt another story in the event that happened. However, Kevin Feige persuaded Marvel Pictures/Disney that Robert was fundamental to the film and this in turn led to Ike Perlmutter no longer being involved in the feature film side of Marvel Pictures..
So I'm wondering how much Zemo & Siberia was just left over from before, which is sorta why we get two movies here
― Darkest Cosmologist junk (kingfish), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:02 (eight years ago) link
I'd enjoy a version with less RDJ and fewer ALL THE HEROES battle scenes, but it turned out reasonably well for all the shoehorning
― μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:06 (eight years ago) link
Civil War: Less Iron Man, More Black Panther Special Edition
that cgi young RDJ was so weird...esp because he looked super-healthy & not strung out lol
― Flamenco Drop (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:23 (eight years ago) link
Haaaaa, I had not heard that about Perlmutter.
― Peanut Duck (Old Lunch), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:23 (eight years ago) link
very much appreciated ant man revealing what he'd been trying with his suit
― μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:25 (eight years ago) link
never liked iron man
i find it funny how casual science-inclined people tend to favour him and are slightly surprised to hear me hating on him
(probably just around me though)
― F♯ A♯ (∞), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:30 (eight years ago) link
I enjoy the movies but he's a jerk, that's his deal
― μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:41 (eight years ago) link
shouldn't it be tory stank?
― da vinci beaver testicles (contenderizer), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:43 (eight years ago) link
i guess i don't really like tony/IM either, but agree that he's not really supposed to be likable. more just entertaining. RDJ seems to be having such a good time in the part that it's hard not to get swept along.
― da vinci beaver testicles (contenderizer), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:47 (eight years ago) link
However, Robert Downey Jr. asked for more screentime and a higher paycheck.
dude is already the world's highest-paid actor, he must be trying to put together his own moon colony or something.
― wizzz! (amateurist), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:28 (eight years ago) link
I thought he looked a lot like Weird Science RDJ:http://assets.rollingstone.com/assets/images/story/robert-downey-jr-s-weird-science-of-acting-19880519/20130319-rdj-x624-1363720997.jpg
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 9 May 2016 19:37 (eight years ago) link
^^ bingo. kinda figured it was intentional
― Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 9 May 2016 21:08 (eight years ago) link
Marvel CEO Ike Perlmutter planned to have Iron Man written out of the film completely, in which case the Russos had backup plans to adapt another story in the event that happened
i hope it was capwolf
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-RS6aELT1uKw/VFK9ymbrPSI/AAAAAAAA1BA/fUKYOC4OSUk/s1600/wolf4.PNG
― i do not sense the entity ted (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 9 May 2016 21:21 (eight years ago) link
I seem to remember them talking about doing something with the insane '50s Captain America right after Winter Soldier came out
― Number None, Monday, 9 May 2016 21:46 (eight years ago) link
Wat. I don't know which is more insane, the '50s Captain America manque or the idea of making a movie featuring that character. That's something you save for maybe like the nineteenth Captain America movie.
But I support Captain America IV: Capwolf.
― Peanut Duck (Old Lunch), Monday, 9 May 2016 22:15 (eight years ago) link
Well I normally liveblog these things in comic strip form for the benefit of my brother, but tonight I am too tired and too drunk and too old and I tapped out after one scribbly attempt at an early scene:http://i.imgur.com/21LtQKn.jpgbut yeah, this was entertaining, everyone involved is clearly having a lot of fun, even RDJ counting his monies...
― Jonathan Hellion Mumble, Monday, 9 May 2016 22:25 (eight years ago) link