HBO's adaptation of Game of Thrones - Thread 2. There are a lot of nerds.

What was Tyrion's plan again? and how did it differ from killing them all?

Dany's plan was to kill them all and then send a message by burning several other cities. Tyrion's plan involved killing just enough of the attackers to send the rest running screaming.

Totally called it on Ramsay's death but I suppose it was heavily telegraphed.

Now that Sansa is basically turning into Catelyn Stark I suppose that gives her some sort of power over Littlefinger, who really hasn't had much to do this season.

this was an artfully done episode meant to satisfy a lot of viewer wishes imo more than it was meant to be surprising or interesting. i did think as a battle scene that this was pretty tight, i actually thought this episode might end up as jon snow's little big horn.

― nomar, Monday, June 20, 2016 1:30 AM (6 hours ago) Bookmark

yeah i turned to my gf after the ep was over and whispered 'fan service'

did somebody on this board make the point that prior to this season GoT didn't give any of the characters a 'hero's death'. but i feel like that's happened a few times this season. the giant, holdor - these melodramatic flourishes

They did it in season 5 with Barristan Selmy.

secondary characters sacrificing themselves for the survival of main characters happens throughout the series

yeah i turned to my gf after the ep was over and whispered 'fan service'

― 龜, Monday, 20 June 2016 13:29

I read girlfriend as grandfather, must have been all those beards clouding my mind.

I liked how Grey Worm slashed those guys throats.

it's a minor triumph, given where the respective stark kids started from as characters, that sansa is now the most interesting and well realized among them by some miles, and has been so convincingly developed. presumably the relentless and immutable one dimensional stupidity of jon is intended to emphasize that in contrast. meanwhile, how could have foreseen that rickon was being carefully crafted into a meaningless cipher?

felt for sure that either davos or tormund was done for after that sweet little chat they had about shitting. the battle was v well done, pleasing after so much sloppy and undercooked stuff this season.

since we technically didn't see ramsay die i'm going to come up with some theory for him returning.

Someone might think to ask where Bran is at some point soon.

Also am I right in thinking that the Lannisters now have no major allies left with the exception of the Tyrrells (half arsed at best) and maybe Edmure Tully as a puppet government?

Presumably there no reason for Winterfell and Dorne to care much about each other and that would be quite a strong anti Lannister alliance if the Starks didn't manifestly have better things to do than attacking Kings Landing.

the potential conflict in the north is between what sansa wants to do with the very limited resources at her disposal and what littlefinger wants her to do with them, with a lot hanging obv on the crepey move he is going to make on her per the preview. jon is totally sidelined now, which makes the next episode a good time for the Reveal some ppl are expecting.

Good interview with the episode director:

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/19/game-thrones-battle-director

I watched every pitch field battle I could find (footage of real ones too), looking for patterns — for what works, what doesn’t, what takes you out of the moment, what keeps you locked in. The big reference was Akira Kurosawa’s RAN. Interestingly one of the things I noticed is that staging of these battles through the years has changed dramatically. Back in the day you’d see these huge aerial shots of horse charges and there were two big differences. First, it was all real — no CGI or digital replication. And second, often when the horses would go down, you can kind of tell they got really hurt. Nowadays you’d never get away with that, and nor would you want to.

Also, the more I watched these scenes the more I felt like those aerial shots that are now so synonymous with a final charge they kind of take you out of the moment. That is to say, you experience this moment as an objective observer in all its glory with no sense of danger from the inevitable impact of hundreds of these huge stampeding animals. I was interested in what it must feel like to be on the ground when that sh— happens. Absolute terror? A moment of clarity? What goes through your head when you are right in the thick of it?

Is Sansa basically Warden of the North now? I'm assuming at this point she knows enough not to make it a hattrick of betrothals to terrible sociopaths.

littlefinger gonna try to put her in a jackpot tho

davos lookin to kill that red witch

Seems like they're setting up to have a female leadership in some of the most important figurehead positions.

it was kinda cheesy when jon snow was ALL SET to face the STAMPEDING HORDE all by HIMSELF but then his horses arrived too AT THE VERY LAST SECOND

How was that cheesy? He would have been cut down in a second otherwise. The end. How exciting.

Or dammit, are you joking? I always do this.

It's not entirely clear why Sansa withheld the information that she asked the Vale for help. It seems more of a way to make their appearance exciting for the audience, since nothing was really stopping her from asking Jon to consider the possibility of them showing up. The conflict she had with asking for Littlefinger's help was more of her thing to grapple with than his or anyone else that might see value in their assistance, therefore once she went ahead and asked there was no reason to keep that a secret. If say, Davos or Jon took it upon himself to ask the Vale for help in secret and knowing Sansa would not be a fan, now that move would make more sense to keep hidden. It being the opposite case doesn't seem to make too much sense to me (yet, because maybe they argue about it in retrospect next episode?).

she kept it a secret cause jon wldve been all THIS MAN HE SOLD U TO RAMSES HOW CLD YOUUU and it wldve been extremely tiresome

Yeah, I didn't get that either - would anyone in snow's camp have counselled against asking little finger for help? Why not tell them - what's little finger to snow?

the guy who sold his sister into sexual slavery, part of the government that beheaded his father etc, have u seen the show

also just a well know crooked bastard u dont want to associate with

for instance now he is the starks boss

But things were already in motion. She sent the message. In the short term he was probably not going to send an emergency raven to tell him "never mind". I mean he would have already been on the road at that point. So given he couldn't do anything about it he would have probably taken that into account during the planning phase of the battle, being desperate to begin with.

I think before a battle he felt he was going to lose he would have taken that help. To lose might mean Sansa back wher she was, or dead. The consequences of the battle at one thing, but you have to win the battle first. If he would turn down littlefinger's help it's hard to see how he could rule.

Refusing to work with people who have wronged his family would be disastrous.

zzzzz

Rude!

hah anyway you might disagree with her reasoning and be a better military strategist than sansa but her motivation was p well spelled out

Sure. It just seems like those motivations at minor compared to the fate of the people, her family etc.

(Which is presumably why she sent the message in he first place. Mao the question becomes 'why not directly tell Jon by he should wait another day'?)

I'm making people work very hard to interpret my posts, atm.

she prob didnt make the most optimal decisions but sometimes ppl do that

this triumphant ep for the good guys is the perfect set up for sansas realization next week that nothing has changed shes just under little fingers thumb now

There's nothing suggesting that she knew LF was actually coming, and there's no clear reason why she wouldn't tell Jon that he might. It being a secret appears to be for the sake of surprise for the audience alone.

oh gosh u guys

wonder if littlefingers thinking abt conquering the 7 kingdoms now or later

Sure, that's okay. It's just that these shows encourage you to trace intention and aims to such an extent that missteps become odd (this is arguably a criticism of all drama).

to the extent that the show has any verisimilitude its that its populated by ppl making bad decisions, but generally its pretty dumb its political machinations are laughable and so forth

in addition to whatever happens with sansa and pete, the iron throne currently has an army on the north's southern border. looked like jamie was hanging out with the freys in the preview, which is en route. for as much as getting to this point was kinda meh, a very interesting situation has been arrived at.

and helping the starks win is pete's first overt move against the iron throne

Right- I don't want to give the idea that it's a big deal. There was a moment where I wondered 'why doesn't Jon know the army is turning up?' Because I did. And someone lose mentioned it. It doesn't affect the story much, and it's not difficult to reconcile. It just struck me as odd, is all.

if littlefinger plays it cool hes still an ally to the iron throne and their appointed warden of the north seems unlikely hell just up and attack jamie, not his style no, i mean i guess if its seen as him helping the starks it wld piss off the lanisters but if he can play it off as just him being a boss its maybe fine

he just helped the enemy stark house kill (successor of) the appointed warden in the north. if he can wiggle out of this one it'll be his finest wiggle to date.

no man cersi gave him the go ahead to kill ramses dont u remember she said he cld be warden if he did it

of course the reason she did it was cause ramses married sansa so ya his association w the starks is a problem

How on earth was this episode "fan service"? They'd obviously set Ramsey up for a brutal demise from the moment he first appeared on screen, and likely Sansa would be there from the moment he first started torturing her.