Public Enemy: Classic or Dud?

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Is there a good book about them ?

AlXTC from Paris, Monday, 19 November 2018 09:36 (five years ago) link

I’ve read two books and neither came close to the Wax Poetics cover story (#17, 2006) on the Bomb Squad

Bing The Mighty Seat (sic), Monday, 19 November 2018 09:41 (five years ago) link

Thanks, I will check it out !

AlXTC from Paris, Monday, 19 November 2018 09:52 (five years ago) link

The Whiney book about Nation is good.

Josh in Chicago, Monday, 19 November 2018 15:19 (five years ago) link

Yeah, I have just ordered it !

AlXTC from Paris, Monday, 19 November 2018 15:23 (five years ago) link

six months pass...

"Fear of a Black Planet" still rules - relistening right now. I'm not gonna pretend it fully sustains for its hour-plus, but tracks 1-5 remain one of the most thrillingly paced/sequenced runs on any record, and track for track it keeps up the pace at least through the title track.

thewufs, Friday, 31 May 2019 01:14 (four years ago) link

nine months pass...

Talk to me about the future of Public Enemy


https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/public-enemy-flavor-flav-bernie-sanders-960272/

Alba, Monday, 2 March 2020 03:03 (four years ago) link

I'm kind of bummed about this. Like of course Flavor Flav has some weird ass political views that don't line up with the rest of the group. You have to let him be who he is.

Mario Meatwagon (Moodles), Monday, 2 March 2020 05:57 (four years ago) link

future of Public Enemy Radio got a

Fantastic. Great move. Well done (sic), Monday, 2 March 2020 06:36 (four years ago) link

He's left/been fired/not bothered to turn up before, he'll be back

Pinche Cumbion Bien Loco (stevie), Monday, 2 March 2020 10:47 (four years ago) link

"Like of course Flavor Flav has some weird ass political views that don't line up with the rest of the group."

Chuck D's remarks suggest this doesn't have anything to do with Flavor Flav's political zeal, but rather lack thereof.

Melomane, Monday, 2 March 2020 17:14 (four years ago) link

I suppose after all this time and his many antics, they're pretty used to handle him...
He'll be back after the elections !

AlXTC from Paris, Monday, 2 March 2020 17:26 (four years ago) link

Also that Flav’s substance abuse has once again made him a difficult employee.

Fantastic. Great move. Well done (sic), Monday, 2 March 2020 17:28 (four years ago) link

xpost

Fantastic. Great move. Well done (sic), Monday, 2 March 2020 17:29 (four years ago) link

I think Mario’s post “Flavor Flav has some weird ass political views that don't line up with the rest of the group” must have been confusing Flavor Flav with Professor Griff.

Melomane, Monday, 2 March 2020 17:30 (four years ago) link

nah, he said a bunch of pro-Trump nonsense during the 2016 campaign. but it's from being an a) apolitical b) idiot, not ideology.

Fantastic. Great move. Well done (sic), Monday, 2 March 2020 17:47 (four years ago) link

I'll throw my support behind "Muse-Sick-In-Our-Mess-Age" too. It's no groundbreaking landmark, but I have to disagree with anyone putting down the fine and funky production. It's like a B+ album.

birdistheword, Monday, 2 March 2020 20:07 (four years ago) link

I always have a soft spot for Muse-Sick, it came out right as I was starting my freshman year in college and it was one of the few cassettes I had with me for the first few months before I upgraded to a Discman.

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Monday, 2 March 2020 20:10 (four years ago) link

hahaha xxp

lukas, Monday, 2 March 2020 20:10 (four years ago) link

Muse Sick's probably my third favourite after Nation and Black Planet.

Pinche Cumbion Bien Loco (stevie), Monday, 2 March 2020 20:57 (four years ago) link

lmao hate to see politics ruin Public Enemy

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 2 March 2020 21:03 (four years ago) link

ppl underrate Yo! Bum Rush the Show

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 2 March 2020 21:03 (four years ago) link

yeah I ignored it for years

otoh this bangs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYblg4i2HD8

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 March 2020 21:06 (four years ago) link

head and shoulders above the album though, one of their all-time greatest

Fantastic. Great move. Well done (sic), Monday, 2 March 2020 21:42 (four years ago) link

nb Bum Rush is good

Fantastic. Great move. Well done (sic), Monday, 2 March 2020 21:45 (four years ago) link

Muse Sick over Bum Rush and Apocalypse 91 is a pretty good challop

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 2 March 2020 23:57 (four years ago) link

I only listened to Muse Sick maybe once when it came out, and my reaction was that it was such a weak follow-up to Apocalypse 91 (which I love/loved). Wasn't there a big deal made that it cut down on the number of samples and introduced more instruments?

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 00:11 (four years ago) link

Nation of Millions > Fear >>> Bum Rush >>> Apocalypse 91 >>> Greatest Misses >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Muse Sick > ...those guys are still around? Oof.

but also fuck you (unperson), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 00:23 (four years ago) link

That seems right but I’d flip Apocalypse 91 w/ Bum Rush

Webcam Du Bois (Hadrian VIII), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 00:28 (four years ago) link

i would flip fear and nation but yeah pretty otm

Bstep, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 00:32 (four years ago) link

He Got Game is ok

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 00:32 (four years ago) link

I haven't listened to "He Got Game" in a while but yeah, not bad at all. It sounded like PE becoming comfortable with getting old (or at least settling into their role as the wise elders of rap). They even threw in a warbly Stephen Stills for crissakes.

birdistheword, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 03:11 (four years ago) link

Working with Stephen Stills was enough of an aesthetic crime to almost justify retroactive cancellation of their entire body of work. Had it been David Crosby, irrevocable perma-cancellation, zero possibility of parole.

but also fuck you (unperson), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 03:42 (four years ago) link

Had it been Neil Young it woulda been dope

sorry for butt rockin (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 03:44 (four years ago) link

Like I'm sad we didn't get our "Keep on Rappin in the Free World"

sorry for butt rockin (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 03:45 (four years ago) link

Stephen Still's Manassas has some ill jawns

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 03:52 (four years ago) link

Muse Sick over Bum Rush and Apocalypse 91 is a pretty good challop

it the only op i got

Pinche Cumbion Bien Loco (stevie), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 13:07 (four years ago) link

I’ve probably listened to “Give It Up” more than any other single PE track

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 13:16 (four years ago) link

"Hazy Shade of Criminal" is top shelf PE, I rate it as high as Nations.

Joey Corona (Euler), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 14:03 (four years ago) link

I shall listen to it again!

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 14:15 (four years ago) link

Wasn't there a big deal made that it cut down on the number of samples and introduced more instruments?

Apocalypse '91 was actually the turning point (a downturn afaic) in the Bomb Squad's production:

According to Hank Shocklee, around this time, the disks for every track they had been working on for the past four to five years had been stolen. As a result, they had to rush to re-create their music and to put out their album in a timely manner. Shocklee admitted that it was impossible to completely recover what they had lost, saying "once you lose all your data, it's very difficult to get that data back...you may get some of it back, but you'll never get the complete set. You won't even know what the complete set is, because there's data in there you didn't really know you had." In retrospect, he believed the loss "stunted [Public Enemy's] growth. We never really recovered after that. We was on a roll—I was on a roll, and to lose that material set me back so hard." As a result, the sound was a little leaner than the dense production of their previous albums, and live musicians became a prominent element as well.

By '94 and Muse Sick-n-Hour Mess Age they sounded like most every other rap act that was using 8-bar drum loops and single-source samples.

Οὖτις, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:17 (four years ago) link

and like, those albums aren't bad, but they are a pale imitation of the hyperactive density of the first three

Οὖτις, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:18 (four years ago) link

CSN&Y was worthless without Neil Young, Stills and Crosby's solo careers were awful, but the Byrds and Buffalo Springfield were truly great bands, and "For What It's Worth" was Stills's song, so that work has my eternal respect.

Re: the lost disks, I heard that story too. It's heartbreaking, but at the same time, I don't want to exaggerate the negative impact it may have had on PE's work. I actually like the production on "Muse Sick-n-Hour Mess Age," but for me the lyrics and delivery really made it a lesser PE album.

birdistheword, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:36 (four years ago) link

hmmm arguing about Stephen Stills in the Public Enemy thread would be extremely on brand for me but I'm going to resist

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:38 (four years ago) link

Re : the lost disks, wasn't it also a case of the legal context having changed and samples being much more complicated/expensive to use ?

AlXTC from Paris, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:39 (four years ago) link

I don't recall them getting sued specifically, but yeah after the De La and Biz Markie cases their sampling style became legally and financially problematic

Οὖτις, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:47 (four years ago) link

Re: legal context, I've also wondered that myself. A lot of the legal obstacles against sampling were already falling into place, so I'm not even sure if those lost beats could've been used without complication.

BUT look at Beck's masterpiece "Odelay," which came out in 1996 - to be fair, they did have to remove a handful of samples, but the dense production is still astounding.

birdistheword, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:48 (four years ago) link

by "Odelay" Beck was sampling himself/his band as much as other sources. There's some really prominent record samples but also a lot of live instrumentation.

Οὖτις, Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:50 (four years ago) link

yeah but like clearing Van Morrison for ex. could not have been cheap

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 3 March 2020 16:54 (four years ago) link


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