the little featurettes with the interviews with Benioff and Dan Weiss are the worst things on film - wish they'd just do the interviews with the actors
― these are not all of the possible side effects (Karl Malone), Monday, April 29, 2019 1:30 PM (six minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
very very otm
― mourning joe (voodoo chili), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:37 (five years ago) link
Sansa didn't get to use her dragonglass dagger, right? So unless the writers are admiringly inept (always a possibility), that's a Chekhov's dagger waiting to be used.
― Perfect Leee Cromulent (Leee), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:38 (five years ago) link
but agreed with whoever said upthread (maybe fgti) that the moments when she was unsuccessfully trying to cast the spell were some of the most captivating of the series.
― these are not all of the possible side effects (Karl Malone), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:38 (five years ago) link
I liked that they killed the Night King in this one, and it was what I was hoping for. IMO the whole point of the Night King and the White Walkers was not some LotR kind of battle against good and evil, so he didn't need a personality or a motivation any more complex than simply wiping out humankind. He was mostly just a force of nature (literally created by accident by nature spirits), and the main point of this plot was not the fight against White Walkers, but how the various characters would react to their threat.And IMO that worked fine, a lot of character development came to a nice climax: Beric's resurrections, Melisandre's prophesies, Theon atoning for his sins, Arya's entire character arc and training leading to the moment of killing the Night King. It's true that you had too many scenes of named characters surviving impossible odds, but again, this isn't a series about good vs. evil, this all about the character relations and power plays, so killing most of them in a final battle wouldn't have been in the spirit of the series. I'm most definitely interested in what the various folks we've followed for so many seasons will do in the aftermath. For example, Jon's entire arc has been about taking the threat of the White Walkers seriously when almost no one else did, so now that the threat is over, will he happily step aside, or will he try to pursue his newly discovered family legacy after all?And yeah, thematically it makes more sense if the final conflict will be with Cersei. The power struggle for the throne have the main driving force in the series after all, not the zombie fight. And Cersei has proven to be the best at playing it, by being both pragmatic and incredibly ruthless. If a whole bunch of her enemies are gathered in one place waiting for her, why not burn them all with fire, regardless of collateral damage? And if the rest of her enemies wanna fight zombies, why not let them, and then deal with the survivors? Sure, she was lucky the living won, but with the Dany's army in shambles and her dragons wounded, Cersei seems to have the upper hand again. So that, to me, makes a more interesting conflict than if the Night King had been spared until the very end.
― Tuomas, Monday, 29 April 2019 18:40 (five years ago) link
The power struggle for the throne have the main driving force in the series after all, not the zombie fight.
totally agree with this and i've argued it in the past, but it's often seem like the show has been torn between these two impulses. season 6 was all about the political machinations, and season 7 was all supernatural preparing for war against the night king--so now i guess this season is literally divided in two between machinations and apocalypse. and since the apocalypse is inherently more dramatic and spectacular, i'm worried these next three eps will feel like the last 45 minutes of return of the king (the movie)
― mourning joe (voodoo chili), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:43 (five years ago) link
Lyanna Mormont's death was the only big moment that got to me. Badass to the end.
I'm annoyed we never got to find out what the hell Bran and Tyrion talked about in the last episode.
also fuck you Jon, watching Sam getting mauled by wights and just strolling by (kinda just want Jon to die now lol).
― Roz, Monday, 29 April 2019 18:44 (five years ago) link
one of the many "but why did THAT happen?" moments of the episode was wondering how they intended to set the trenches aflame. were they just counting on melisandre to cast Wall of Fire and roll a 20?
― Tuomas, Monday, 29 April 2019 18:47 (five years ago) link
oh, that's right, thanks!
― these are not all of the possible side effects (Karl Malone), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:47 (five years ago) link
and not only that, but a bunch of foot-soldiers also attempted to reach the trench to set it on fire, but were taken down by zombies.
― these are not all of the possible side effects (Karl Malone), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:48 (five years ago) link
Their original plan as stated above was to have the dragons light the trenches on fire, but the snowstorm killed the visibility. And unless the trenches were drenched in pitch, arrows were very unlikely to start them burning.
― Perfect Leee Cromulent (Leee), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:50 (five years ago) link
xposts lol: No it was the dragons! The arrows were the back up plan.
― ryan, Monday, 29 April 2019 18:51 (five years ago) link
i thought dragonfire was supposed to be stone-meltingly hot, wouldn't it just reduce the wooden trench to cinders?
― mourning joe (voodoo chili), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:52 (five years ago) link
kinda just want Jon to die now lol
he does too, clearly. yet another instance in this ep of him trying to die...presenting himself in front of the dragon-wight.
― ryan, Monday, 29 April 2019 18:52 (five years ago) link
― unashamed and trash (Unctious), Monday, 29 April 2019 18:54 (five years ago) link
(I actually thought for a moment that there was going to be a fake-out and it was actually her and not Bran in the wheelchair).
me too!!!
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 18:59 (five years ago) link
and she can sneak around white walkers easily cause she's small and a freaking FACELESS ASSASSIN.
― Tuomas, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:00 (five years ago) link
the zombie team-building, i mean, bridge-building might have been the best thing about the battle
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:01 (five years ago) link
yeah, not gonna lie i jumped up and did a little whooping sound when arya came out of nowhere
― mourning joe (voodoo chili), Monday, 29 April 2019 19:01 (five years ago) link
i kinda figured she would be the one who did it because of her custom weapon (even though that's not what she ultimately used) ... also she trained for this shit
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:03 (five years ago) link
twitter points out that Jon was standing at the exact spot as the NK in the season premiere when Arya shows up: "how did you sneak up on me?" so... nicely done.
― Roz, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:05 (five years ago) link
I bet some techbros are mulling this over right now.
― Perfect Leee Cromulent (Leee), Monday, 29 April 2019 19:06 (five years ago) link
i wonder how many aircraft controllers liked this episode
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:07 (five years ago) link
crap i mean air traffic controllers --
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:08 (five years ago) link
Yeah it was obvious someone was going to kill him and Arya was the meme-friendly choice
― FernandoHierro, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:08 (five years ago) link
xp - i mean, if bran could like, warg into a bird, maybe he could have done so to uh, guide the dragons and direct them when they were caught in the fog?
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:10 (five years ago) link
the more I think about it, Bran is kinda a selfish dick
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:12 (five years ago) link
like, i'm just gonna chill here by this tree while a lot of PoC die and I coulda done something to prevent it but naahhh
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:14 (five years ago) link
Some stray observations:* Beric got his own "hold the door" moment, didn't he?* Bran was saved with the same weapon the assassin tried to kill him with in season 1.* We never saw the other dragon that was wounded by the zombie dragon actually die, so it's probably still alive? So I guess ballista attack in King's Landing that's been foreshadowed in the opening credits is gonna happen. * In the end, the protagonists' plan worked, didn't it? Using Bran to lure out the Night King so he wouldn't just ride the entire battle on his dragon, then killing him while his attention is on Bran.
― Tuomas, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:16 (five years ago) link
yeah rhaegal is still alive, slight spoilers from the 30-second preview of next week's ep.
they really should've made it clearer that he survived, but whatever.
― mourning joe (voodoo chili), Monday, 29 April 2019 19:17 (five years ago) link
they really should have made everything clearer tbh
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:18 (five years ago) link
where is littlefinger? is that fucker going to show up again?
― akm, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:19 (five years ago) link
Every time I see a medieval-style battle on film I start thinking what they must have really looked like and I get a little more perturbed each time I see the "lone fighter cutting down all comers" cliche but for the most part I thought this was effective (caveat about it being darkly lit to cover for special effects aside), especially early on when the dead seemed like a wave of mass death rather than individual zombies.
― ryan, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:20 (five years ago) link
uh Arya slit his throat? xpost
― Roz, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:21 (five years ago) link
some of you clearly don't pay close attention to this ridiculous show!
― ryan, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:22 (five years ago) link
ha, i forgot Littlefinger was dead too. an no, i really don't anymore.
― circa1916, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:23 (five years ago) link
is Theon's dick gonna come back again? Haven't seen it around for a while
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:24 (five years ago) link
i really do think the dothraki mass coming upon a vague mass of death in the darkness and then cutting to their torches being extinguished was a pretty ill visual, and Arya's moment of triumph owned.
really though, what was Bran doing. Was there any point to it, is it something for a future episode? I'm usually pretty good about following things, I guess it could be he was keeping on eye on the NK but why?
― omar little, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:24 (five years ago) link
the NK noticed Bran before when he was warging a bird. I imagine he was trying to get his attention to set up the murking
― We were never Breeting Borting (President Keyes), Monday, 29 April 2019 19:27 (five years ago) link
There's a ridiculous fan theory going on (based on one ambiguous scene, I think) that Littlefinger hired one of the Faceless Men to die in his stead and is gonna show up again this season. But as theories go, that one seems even more pointless than the "Bran is the Night King" one that was proven false by this episode.
― Tuomas, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:27 (five years ago) link
littlefinger was killed with the same knife as the night king
― mizzell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:28 (five years ago) link
i can't keep this show straight from season to season. I totally forgot Littlefinger died.
― akm, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:28 (five years ago) link
I was confused about the dragons too, and thought that ice dragon was already dead/gone somehow and that Jon was facing his own recently dead and resurrected one especially since it had crash-landed and was covered with wights
― joygoat, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:30 (five years ago) link
I enjoyed that but still feel suitably trolled for the third week in a row in all the ways already covered upthread. An astounding waste of the White Walkers who did nothing but die.
― nashwan, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:35 (five years ago) link
ya why is there no wight history month?
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:36 (five years ago) link
― Tuomas, Monday, April 29, 2019 3:27 PM (seven minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
that's stupid...
"I'm hiring you to die for me"
"How much are you offering?"
"Uh, a billion dollars?"
"Make it 2 billion and we have a deal"
"Sure buddy."
"What a sucker! I'm gonna be so rich!"
― Evan, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:40 (five years ago) link
also if it was a faceless man, they would have had the battle training to uh, not be killed?
that is the stupidest theory
― sarahell, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:44 (five years ago) link
Re: Melisandre, yeah, considering that her character to date was little more than a mixture of obtuse repetition of LoL jargonism and flip-flopping between "let's kill Davos actually let's not" "you're the Lord of Light actually you're not", it was very intense for me-- at least, in my own head-- to see just that brief minute of her casting that spell, and reflected on her face was all her fervent belief colliding with self-doubt, righteousness with guilt, futility with triumph, and then the spell works and a battle later she recognizes that her part has been played and she walks off into oblivion, I was amazed at how her denouement justified (for me) hours upon hours of eye-rolling and boredom experienced on the character's behalf
― flamboyant goon tie included, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:51 (five years ago) link
Varys's face when the crypt opened for business was so funny, it seemed like normal-Varys with non-existent eyebrows slightly raised
― flamboyant goon tie included, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:53 (five years ago) link
All things considered this was good not bad and certainly thrilling & terrifying in the moment of watching it.
Apex: the bit where, with the Stark ancestors rampaging around the crypt, Sansa and Tyrion are hiding together - their wordless little drama there was fucking superb.
As pointed out itt Melisandre growing desperate for the first time in her life while furiously spell casting, also excellent (xpost fgti indeed indeed)
ILX otm that there were way too many instances of Brienne, Jaime or Sam being insupportably overwhelmed and definitely going down but then back to semi-successfully holding off their attackers next time we see them. And while I got a vivid sense of how it was for this mass of humans to face this horde of wights, I never got a solid sense of what the close-up hero-vs-half-dozen-wights combat was like except in Arya's spear scene.
Disagree with the disappointment that we are now left with three episodes of mere humanity. Think of the times this show was indisputably awesome - the first three seasons or so - there was only a garnish of the supernatural, all of the best bits were people doing things to people. Definitely support the show closing out in that mode and perhaps making it just as wrenching and awful as the wight invasion. Most of the focal characters are alive, yes, but almost everyone else is dead - now low-hanging fruit for Cersei.
They really do need to give us something more re Bran's raven sortie & what he was about there.
The Lord of Light was all about Arya, wasn't he? Beric gets her out of the hallways alive, dies the true death at last, having served his holy purpose. Melisandre gives Arya a pep talk that sends her after NK, dies the true death at last, having served her holy purpose.
Loved the ice-fire leaking out of the wounds of the wight dragon.
― valet doberman (Jon not Jon), Monday, 29 April 2019 19:54 (five years ago) link
For a moment I thought too that it was strange with how much devastation occurred, the armies destroyed and so forth, that so many main characters survived, it seemed unbalanced and unfair, but then I remembered that it's.. fiction! and the POV is going to follow people-of-importance (i.e. survivors, or people who will die notably) and not trace the glorious childhood and subsequent achievements of, say, a Dothraki who got sent to the front line. Fiction is cruel to those who die meaninglessly
― flamboyant goon tie included, Monday, 29 April 2019 19:57 (five years ago) link