You won't convince me that pandering to racists and the far right really is a positive electorally.
― man in suit and red tie raising his fist (Tom D.), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:12 (one month ago) link
It was fun how he tried to move the press room at the Elysee so journalists couldn’t see who came and went, surely not something that would ever backfire with fascists in power
― Roman Anthony gets on his horse (gyac), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:14 (one month ago) link
But what's unfathomable to me is not seeing a difference between Trump and Macron
That's not what was said though.
― man in suit and red tie raising his fist (Tom D.), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:14 (one month ago) link
I'm not French nor a close follower though.
― Roman Anthony gets on his horse (gyac), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:15 (one month ago) link
The recently released video clips from 2022 of Macron talking to both Zelenskyy and Putin on the phone have such a weird uncanny valley feeling about them (Putins 'sorry bro I'm at the gym about to play hockey' line?). I feel like I'm being duped by a skit
― anvil, Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:20 (one month ago) link
― man in suit and red tie raising his fist (Tom D.), Thursday, March 14, 2024 10:12 AM (four minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink
Not "pandering", but hard disagree. If there is one thing that European far-right nationalism has taught us in the last 20 years, it's that you cannot let them occupy the security and immigration terrain alone, because that's exactly where you can (and need) to contain their growth. We can discuss how to best manage it and nobody is saying the French immigration bill was the only option.
― Nabozo, Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:21 (one month ago) link
If there is one thing that European far-right nationalism has taught us in the last 20 yearsIf there is one thing that European far-right nationalism has taught us in the last 20 yearsIf there is one thing that European far-right nationalism has taught us in the last 20 yearsIf there is one thing that European far-right nationalism has taught us in the last 20 years
― Roman Anthony gets on his horse (gyac), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:25 (one month ago) link
Here’s an idea: all the fascists’ ideas are bad, and you do not, in fact, need to hand it to them.
― Roman Anthony gets on his horse (gyac), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:26 (one month ago) link
The far right have nothing to say on the subject of security that isn’t “persecute Muslims” and “restrict civil liberties”. Most of them take Russian money and hang out with people who are huge security risks.
― Roman Anthony gets on his horse (gyac), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:27 (one month ago) link
The thing about is it strategic vs is it ideological is that it doesn't matter - playing with anti immigration sentiment still moves the overton window and the idea that you could then somehow keep things to acceptable levels (whatever those would be) is delusional.
― Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:28 (one month ago) link
The only acceptable level to the fascists is none and repatriation of people who’ve been there generations. Let’s just be honest about that.
― Roman Anthony gets on his horse (gyac), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:29 (one month ago) link
Yes. Also pandering, and that is exactly the right word, hasn't worked and will never work.
― man in suit and red tie raising his fist (Tom D.), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:31 (one month ago) link
hey if there's one thing the history of fascists in power has taught us it's that they definitely moderate their demands if you accommodate them a little
― Morris O’Shea Salazar (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:33 (one month ago) link
With the proviso of course that if you actually believe in these policies, it isn't pandering.
― man in suit and red tie raising his fist (Tom D.), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:33 (one month ago) link
the "Is" in this thread title needs moving two places to the right, funnily enough
― Morris O’Shea Salazar (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:38 (one month ago) link
that's not very funny
― Left, Thursday, 14 March 2024 09:47 (one month ago) link
Security and foreign policy have always been the go-to for easy gains in electoral points
Citation needed, this strategy appears to be a failure when it's tried. Even the glorious centrist revolutions in the west of the past decades (Blair, Clinton, 2017 Macron) were riding on an economic message first and foremost.
If you're a reactionary/racist voter and have the choice of a gleefully reactionary/racist candidate and a candidate that's open to a little bit of reaction/racism for a treat - what, exactly, is supposed to be the draw of the latter?
you won't convince me it's ideological.
Being open to a little strategic racism is itself ideological.
― papal hotwife (milo z), Thursday, 14 March 2024 17:35 (one month ago) link
otm
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 14 March 2024 17:37 (one month ago) link
I don’t think Nah, bozo will be responding, somehow.
― Roman Anthony gets on his horse (gyac), Thursday, 14 March 2024 17:38 (one month ago) link
Seriously doesn’t matter whether those enacting racist policy do so out of conviction or cynicism, but also the whole “I know they don’t believe it in their secret heart of hearts” bit is — at best — naive credulity masquerading as realpolitik. At worst, well.
― cozen itt (wins), Thursday, 14 March 2024 18:53 (one month ago) link
Reading this thread with Gustavo Petro's quote from last year on the back of my mind: "Many in Europe have already welcomed Hitler into their homes", something like that
― xyzzzz__, Saturday, 16 March 2024 07:35 (one month ago) link
The West has been experiencing a right wing drift since about 1979.
― Zelda Zonk, Saturday, 16 March 2024 08:08 (one month ago) link