HBO's adaptation of Game of Thrones - Thread 2. There are a lot of nerds.

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Traveling beyond the Dothraki Sea into a new, post-book era.

Gukbe, Tuesday, 5 April 2016 18:56 (three years ago) link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkP8lVE2_0A

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 5 April 2016 20:14 (three years ago) link

looks like Sansa is doing in the trailer.
tho i don't hold out the same hope as others that Snow is going to come back from the dead.

Mad Piratical (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Friday, 22 April 2016 14:19 (three years ago) link

have been watching the last season again and even though i am already 100% sure jon is coming back in some way, during sam's convo with olly he says "don't worry, jon always comes back" which is just clunky enough in context to be deliberate

Roberto Spiralli, Friday, 22 April 2016 14:36 (three years ago) link

Targareyan reign flashback!

Gukbe, Friday, 22 April 2016 14:48 (three years ago) link

i meant to say, looks like Sansa is doing ok in the trailer.
if she's wearing the direwolf sigil, it probably means she's found her way to someone who's not horrible. either to the fingers, or riverrun, or wherever it was Rickon went to.

Mad Piratical (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Friday, 22 April 2016 16:16 (three years ago) link

Apparently the first ep leaked?

pratt truss it (dan m), Saturday, 23 April 2016 12:56 (three years ago) link

impeach obama

, Saturday, 23 April 2016 13:01 (three years ago) link

He probably burned a DVD for Prince George

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Saturday, 23 April 2016 17:25 (three years ago) link

Was not expecting that last scene.

Mad Piratical (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 25 April 2016 03:58 (three years ago) link

what was up w that

lag∞n, Monday, 25 April 2016 04:09 (three years ago) link

The night is dark and full of terror.

Mad Piratical (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 25 April 2016 04:18 (three years ago) link

The night is dark and full of terror.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 25 April 2016 04:50 (three years ago) link

theory: melisandre is going to inhabit jon snow's corpse

she must have had more gratuitous nude scenes than any other character in this show.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Monday, 25 April 2016 08:13 (three years ago) link

it's funny, that had the feeling of one of those early season check-in episodes where nothing actually happened but there were two pretty major incidents, but they only had about 4 minutes of combined screen time. one of the great houses of westeros was wiped out and we got "remember this guy? stab. what about this kid? stab".

but...it was still good.

Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 25 April 2016 13:18 (three years ago) link

Dorne scenes still plagued by the inescapable feeling that you're watching a community college play

Karl Malone, Monday, 25 April 2016 13:21 (three years ago) link

i thought the scene with brienne and sansa was memorable, but most of the rest just kind of drifted by. do we have to sit through the dothraki doubting daenerys but then slowly growing to respect her over the course of a full season again? will apprentice arya get schooled by her asshole friend for an entire season, again?

Karl Malone, Monday, 25 April 2016 13:26 (three years ago) link

see also burning all the ships in mereen (i think that's the name of the city) which probably pushes east/west confrontation at least a season or two further out

geometry-stabilized craft (art), Monday, 25 April 2016 13:34 (three years ago) link

i thought the scene with brienne and sansa was memorable, but most of the rest just kind of drifted by. do we have to sit through the dothraki doubting daenerys but then slowly growing to respect her over the course of a full season again? will apprentice arya get schooled by her asshole friend for an entire season, again?

― Karl Malone, Monday, April 25, 2016 9:26 AM (39 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Likely scene showing Jon Snow finally being resurrected and opening his eyes will probably be the last scene in the finale.

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 14:08 (three years ago) link

yeah, my prediction is a surprise episode 7 snow revival (instead of the usual 9 or 10).

Karl Malone, Monday, 25 April 2016 14:13 (three years ago) link

wait which house was wiped out

jason waterfalls (gbx), Monday, 25 April 2016 14:21 (three years ago) link

house martell (headed by prince doran, oberyn's grumpy older brother)

Karl Malone, Monday, 25 April 2016 14:23 (three years ago) link

I'm guessing the next episode. They only have til night for a miracle to save them, Melisandre has gone to bed so it'll need to happen quick.

I really thought that king and his guard would get to do more. When I first saw those actors interviewed it seemed like they'd be bigger roles.

I think Jaime's scene might actually represent the biggest change, he seems like he's eager to step up and might help Cersei rule.

I hope Margaery doesn't convert to sparrow.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 25 April 2016 14:31 (three years ago) link

ohhhh for some reason i thought the sand snakes kinda ~were~ martells

jason waterfalls (gbx), Monday, 25 April 2016 14:38 (three years ago) link

Sand Snakes killing the boy on the ship... how did they get to the ship? Where was the ship?

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 14:38 (three years ago) link

they took the outrigger

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 25 April 2016 14:40 (three years ago) link

Jorah would be good to have around is you drop a contact lens

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 25 April 2016 14:43 (three years ago) link

if, that is

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 25 April 2016 14:43 (three years ago) link

TBF it made sense that he'd check the un-trampled grass in the center of the field.

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 14:46 (three years ago) link

But seriously though WHERE was the ship the boy was on? Why was he still on it?

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 14:47 (three years ago) link

was that a ship? i thought it was just his room.

Likely scene showing Jon Snow finally being resurrected and opening his eyes will probably be the last scene in the finale.

kit harington really earning his wage by closing his eyes and then opening them ten hours later

good question, had to look that up. He was on the same ship as Jaime and Myrcella when they headed to King's Landing. So the eye stone he was painting was for Myrcella, presumably.

Which means that somehow the elder two Sand Snakes must have set sail following them (they couldn't have stowed away) on some other vessel.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 25 April 2016 15:25 (three years ago) link

questions about how characters got from one place to another make me nostalgic for Lost threads

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 25 April 2016 15:33 (three years ago) link

You'd think Jaime would have at least taken him off the boat as a valuable hostage. Overall the scene could have benefited from him asking the snakes how they got there:
"We tailed the ship all the way here to King's Landing"
"When Jaime gets back to the ship he will kill you both for this"
"We're doing you a favor- don't you realize what he'll do to you now that 'someone' in Dorne murdered the princess?"
"It was YOU, wasn't it? You poisoned her! My father will have you executed for this!"
"At this point your father is already dead. Now it's your turn"

Just some similarly terribly written exposition is all I needed.

At the expense of that we instead get this little snarky sassy banter that is trying to get us to like(?) the teenage mutant ninja snakes

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 15:58 (three years ago) link

always down for some casual sassiness and snark in a scene that involves a teenage boy getting speared through the face

You'd think Jaime would have at least taken him off the boat as a valuable hostage.

why do you bother quibbling about shit like this at this point

the very first shot, i was like, the bad guy watchmen just leave snow's body there? for his friends to find? why? if they're willing to kill snow wouldn't they just kill his friends right then too? what kind of halfassed conspiracy is this

yes i watched this, and i probably will continue to do so, and complain about it!

goole, Monday, 25 April 2016 16:19 (three years ago) link

I'm just saying it is something that springs to mind and becomes distracting because I don't understand the scene. I want things to make sense in the universe of the show and the narrative so I remain immersed. That one doesn't seem too picky in my opinion! Why would he still be on the ship? "Well because it makes killing off his character really convenient" Boooo

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 16:23 (three years ago) link

the very first shot, i was like, the bad guy watchmen just leave snow's body there? for his friends to find? why? if they're willing to kill snow wouldn't they just kill his friends right then too? what kind of halfassed conspiracy is this

I guess now they know exactly who were the most loyal to Jon?.

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 16:27 (three years ago) link

honestly i didn't even read the design of that scene as being on a ship so idk

xp wow they're so smart

goole, Monday, 25 April 2016 16:27 (three years ago) link

"Well because it makes killing off his character really convenient"

gotta kills some characters somehow

Οὖτις, Monday, 25 April 2016 16:27 (three years ago) link

xxpost Killing Jon is being spun as an act of loyalty to the Watch. Killing Jon's friends as well would have been a harder sell.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 25 April 2016 16:30 (three years ago) link

xp wow they're so smart

― goole, Monday, April 25, 2016 12:27 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 16:31 (three years ago) link

Yeah but they've established that Jon's friends will likely be ambushed and killed if they leave the room, too.

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 16:33 (three years ago) link

dothraki doing the spanish inquisition sketch re what's better than seeing a beautiful woman naked was kinda funny, but other than that i rly hope we don't have to listen to too much of their goofy fantasy machismo this season

#notalldothraki

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 25 April 2016 17:13 (three years ago) link

didn't realise it was the ships that were burning in Mereen. thanks for the tip ILX.

Van Horn Street, Monday, 25 April 2016 18:41 (three years ago) link

i caught it from the dialogue but my goodness that was some lousy CG

call all destroyer, Monday, 25 April 2016 18:47 (three years ago) link

it seems so late in the game to be setting up this Tyrion as emergency city manager plot. Maybe he'll do such a good job that after Dani conquers the world she decides to hand the throne him before turning into white flames and melting the north

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 25 April 2016 19:20 (three years ago) link

I don't really have any guesses as to where they're taking that plotline...

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 19:25 (three years ago) link

i think it's just a way for tyrion to regain his power while stalling that whole storyline for another 2 years until martin publishes another book the burned ships are repaired

Karl Malone, Monday, 25 April 2016 19:38 (three years ago) link

i mean it seems inevitable that when daenerys FINALLY goes west for the final showdown, tyrion will be at her side with a bunch of power and influence and it'll set up interesting conflicts with his family and westeros in general

Karl Malone, Monday, 25 April 2016 19:39 (three years ago) link

this is so sad

https://twitter.com/Cosmopolitan/status/724693841182384128

Ted Cruz's viral female doppelgänger is set to star in porn: http://cosm.ag/6014BmDh6

goole, Monday, 25 April 2016 20:33 (three years ago) link

going way off the books with this twist

nomar, Monday, 25 April 2016 20:35 (three years ago) link

lol oh shit

goole, Monday, 25 April 2016 20:35 (three years ago) link

ah well it all fits together somehow *thinkpieces*

goole, Monday, 25 April 2016 20:35 (three years ago) link

doing porn is a route to getting a job on GoT sometimes

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 25 April 2016 20:36 (three years ago) link

miss u rickon

Van Horn Street, Monday, 25 April 2016 21:01 (three years ago) link

and his direwolf, shaggydog

Van Horn Street, Monday, 25 April 2016 21:05 (three years ago) link

Candidates do very well in Westeros when they're intensely unlikeable.

Evan, Monday, 25 April 2016 21:08 (three years ago) link

Candidates do very well in Westeros when they're intensely unlikeable. unkillable

― Evan, Monday, April 25, 2016 5:08 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Van Horn Street, Monday, 25 April 2016 21:13 (three years ago) link

Seen Bran in preview for next episode, have a feeling he'll connect with Jon. Hope something is revealed about that bird man's place.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 25 April 2016 21:53 (three years ago) link

That almost ecstatic expression of renewed sense of purpose and duty on Brienne of Tarth's face when Sansa formally accepted her service practically screamed that she's going to die soon.

Dan I., Monday, 25 April 2016 22:09 (three years ago) link

Was thinking that. Her and Davos are probably toast.

Mad Piratical (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 25 April 2016 22:23 (three years ago) link

No way, Davos and Brienne are too popular to be killed!

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 25 April 2016 22:29 (three years ago) link

The end of the show is going to be all the popular characters hugging

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 25 April 2016 22:30 (three years ago) link

I'm guessing Varys gets fucked up at some point. Nobody close to Tyrion makes it out of a season in one piece.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 25 April 2016 22:34 (three years ago) link

Check that, except Bronn. Where he at? Wasn't he on that boat too?

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 25 April 2016 22:35 (three years ago) link

we need some congressional hearings on who was or wasn't on that boat and how fast it was going. #bronngazi

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 01:11 (three years ago) link

maybe the killing of the son already happened a while ago?

Van Horn Street, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 01:13 (three years ago) link

loooool goole

, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 01:33 (three years ago) link

my gf points out that the kid who killed ygritte went thru puberty before filming this season

, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 01:33 (three years ago) link

he wouldn't have killed ygritte after puberty

Van Horn Street, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 02:01 (three years ago) link

The last scene was pure room 237

calstars, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 02:28 (three years ago) link

the whole Brienne & Pod vs. a half-dozen Bolton suckers was really hard to figure out for a while until I rewound it about a dozen times and I realized the guy in charge of the dogs? That motherfucker took off the second trouble showed up. That's what they only had to murder 5 out of 6 in the party, and no dogs. Mr. Hound done R-U-N-N-O-F-T as soon as he heard steel on steel, probably before that, actually.

Watch it again. K9 handlers stay the fuck away when a hostage situation gets violent. That's SOP going way back, apparently.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 03:56 (three years ago) link

This has basically become a series of unconnected vignettes of varying quality and tone, from genuinely tense and atmospheric (Sansa and Theon) to comedy skits (Dorne and the boob snakes).

I'm vaguely optimistic they'll pull out some proper exhilarating shit as they always have in the past, but for now it's lost a good deal of weight and momentum.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 07:31 (three years ago) link

both dorne and the dothraki are basically new adventures of hercules. also can't believe the extent to which they've stalled the daenerys storyline, as mentioned by others itt.

last season was p crappy and rambling too. they seem a bit afraid of actually allowing the characters to do the things they want to do. a lot of stasis. like it is almost funny that they've found a new way for daenerys to be stuck somewhere for good. no doubt in the finale when she finally escapes the dothraki, she'll break her ankle or something.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 08:03 (three years ago) link

I think the house of widows thing seems interesting. She'll probably meet new recruits there.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 08:49 (three years ago) link

The house of widows is one of those things that could be great in theory but probably won't be in practice. The Dorne stuff at least got rid of a load of deadwood characters and might actually lead to a war.

If John Snow is really did then Davos is effectively our eyes and ears around the Wall now, if anything he's likely to be more prominent this year. John Snow probably isn't dead though.

I can't remember how Arya went blind but marooning her hundreds of miles away from everyone else was a terrible narrative decision.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 09:08 (three years ago) link

'You'll just have to sit here and wait' seems to be the M.O. for so many character arcs right now. WTF is going on in this show? Those white walkers had better pull their fingers out.

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 10:50 (three years ago) link

it's one thing isolating main characters, but they give them this one basic simple goal and then have them frustrated in every attempt to achieve it, it's like they've found that having one character trying to bounce the same ball off the wall for three seasons is the easiest way to deal with so many storylines at once, cos you just see them and instantly know nothing in their plotline has changed.

they've had a whole season of dorne being annoyed, arya getting beaten up and failing tests, a few seasons of daenerys going from triumph to setback. are there no ideas in the writers room or something?

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 11:07 (three years ago) link

I didn't see a "next week on" but given how this show cycles character scenes I expect next week to be catching up with Littlefinger, Bran and Sam.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 11:10 (three years ago) link

This has basically become a series of unconnected vignettes of varying quality and tone

in other words, a faithful interpretation of the books

, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 12:15 (three years ago) link

I liked this episode. Kind of disappointed that they killed off the one potentially interesting character in the Dorne storyline, but maybe that just means that they are going to speed through the end of that story (sand snakes arrive in king's landing, get killed by Zombie Mountain or something, the end).

silverfish, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 14:39 (three years ago) link

The complaining about stalling is pretty funny, when in a way the show has speeded up immensely how fast it takes for characters to go somewhere. Arya spent 3 seasons (?) wandering around Westeros before she got on the ship, it took Jamie a season to get with Brienne to Kings Landing. But it only took Tyrion half a season to get to Meereen, and in this premiere Jamie goes Dorne-Kings Landing between episodes, and Daenerys gets to the dothraki camps as well. And I complained about Melisandre getting to Castle Black from Winterfell in the last thread.

So they're getting rid of the sense of scale of the place. But they're not really replacing it with any propulsion or action.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 14:53 (three years ago) link

yeah but once you discover locations you can fast travel between them

i know the state of affairs is a little dismal because i caught myself thinking "i wonder what bran is up to?"

Karl Malone, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 14:56 (three years ago) link

It's not so much about how long it takes to get to places, but what happens on that journey and when they get there. Arya and the Hound was great. Arya having to complete endless gnomic tasks week in week out, with no clear end point or reason in mind is just boring. I'm sure something'll happen to her next week. I don't remember how she got blinded either though.

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 15:11 (three years ago) link

i liked the arya storyline, and the performance of her sadistic mentor, but they are dragging it out for sure.

i know the state of affairs is a little dismal because i caught myself thinking "i wonder what bran is up to?"

have even wondered about rickon.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 15:26 (three years ago) link

It was a magical punishment for using the face swapping to get personal revenge on the evil kingsguard guy that was visiting. And yeah I REALLY hope she isn't just going to slowly learn how to deal with being a blind face swapper in training for the course of the entire season...

xp

Evan, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 15:31 (three years ago) link

current game of throne storylines, ranked (i'm limiting myself to ~2 seconds of brain activity for each decision so this is from the heart)

sansa & theon & brienne & podrick
cersei and jaime destroy everyone else
jon snow for the love of the old gods and the new wake up and make this show more interesting
davos and a team of extras wait for someone to save the day
ramsay
sam working on getting tenure
bronn? i'm assuming he's doing something. whatever it is it's better than most of the rest of the show
margaery tries to ignore constant pleas to purchase a Lexus
bran and the 3 eyed raven
tyrion and varys have some decent conversations while stalling for another season
melisandre finally does something cool (?) and revives jon snow?
jorah and daario on the trail
arya's neverending bad day
daenerys kills some more time
direct to video dorne

Karl Malone, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 15:44 (three years ago) link

i forgot some stuff (like baelish) but whatever. i guess i'd put ">>" after cersei/jaime and another ">>>>>>>" after ramsay

Karl Malone, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 15:46 (three years ago) link

oh god baelish. i never liked him or his scenes for some reason. lots of people seem to enjoy him though.

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 15:53 (three years ago) link

you'd think he'd be more in the mix since he literally kicked off the events that got ned killed

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 16:31 (three years ago) link

The showrunners really hate Dorne, is my feeling.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 16:34 (three years ago) link

wasn't one of the problems w/ the Dorne production that they only had permission to shoot on that location for a few days?

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 16:36 (three years ago) link

the location is a vacation house in palm springs iirc

nomar, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 16:55 (three years ago) link

ha ha it's in Andalusia

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 17:34 (three years ago) link

Oh, it's not the lobby of a Hyatt?

Evan, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 17:35 (three years ago) link

seville isn't it? the executive hilton seville.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 17:36 (three years ago) link

I usually go with the garden view room so I can get the breakfast package. Just my luck that I witness some murders as a result.

Evan, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 17:38 (three years ago) link

current game of throne storylines, ranked (i'm limiting myself to ~2 seconds of brain activity for each decision so this is from the heart)

sansa & theon & brienne & podrick
cersei and jaime destroy everyone else
jon snow for the love of the old gods and the new wake up and make this show more interesting
davos and a team of extras wait for someone to save the day
ramsay
sam working on getting tenure
bronn? i'm assuming he's doing something. whatever it is it's better than most of the rest of the show
margaery tries to ignore constant pleas to purchase a Lexus
bran and the 3 eyed raven
tyrion and varys have some decent conversations while stalling for another season
melisandre finally does something cool (?) and revives jon snow?
jorah and daario on the trail
arya's neverending bad day
daenerys kills some more time
direct to video dorne

Imagine Zombie Mountain will feature soon.

Is Littlefinger still in the Vale? I really can't remember

groovypanda, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 18:12 (three years ago) link

last we saw littlefinger he was leaving sansa with the boltons, right?

i'm expecting some big crazy metal underdog army of wildlings and vengeful greyjoys and undead jon snow coming together before the end of the season.

nomar, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 18:15 (three years ago) link

littlefinger was summoned by Cersei right?

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 18:15 (three years ago) link

I don't think wondering what Bran is up to is odd, it seems like whatever mystery he's involved in is crucial.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 18:51 (three years ago) link

Bran crew was one my favorite storyline because it was respite from politics and went on his very own trope. Not to say that I dislike the politics intensive narrative arcs (on the contrary!) but that was quite different.

Van Horn Street, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 19:03 (three years ago) link

At this point we know that the existential threat is even more looming than ever, and somebody is going to have to bring dragons to that party. Those are the two key ingredients of the finale. We have two more years to get there after this season (hopefully we won't get treated to more than 1 episode worth of post-white-walker epilogue).

The only person that really has any "plot armor" in the endgame scenario are Daenaerys, because dragons, and probably Bran, because warging into a dragon seems like a thing that needs to happen.
Everybody else is completely expendable really and I think that's what makes all the other disparate storylines seem a little dull. Like, we really cared about the consequences of stuff like the Red Wedding way back when, but that taught us not to get heavily invested in the characters, and then Hardhome taught us that there are not many problems in this made-up world, there is exactly one problem, and it is going to kill everyone.

We'll see how much the showrunners acknowledge this problem and try to give us something worth chewing on in the meantime. At the same time I totally see why GRRM can't finish writing any of it. He needs to tie up about 200 dumb side quests he made up for fun, get to the dragons vs. zombies fight and end it. I'd hate to sit down every day to that.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 19:20 (three years ago) link

assuming the show sticks to its stated timeline, i'm hopeful that this season will take us to the end of Act II with all the pieces finally shuffled into their places and some downhill momentum at last

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 19:36 (three years ago) link

I didn't realise they had changed their minds about stubbornly sticking to 7 seasons. I'm a little disappointed that they couldn't just make season 7 a bit longer. Is 13 episodes really too much to ask of one season?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 21:35 (three years ago) link

Speaking of Branquest, what's the last we knew of the Reeds? Jojen was killed by a skeleton, but Meera is still alive?

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 22:02 (three years ago) link

And yeah I REALLY hope she isn't just going to slowly learn how to deal with being a blind face swapper in training for the course of the entire season...
wasn't this addressed in one of the trailers with jaqar or wtf his name is saying she was getting one
more chance to prove herself? I didn't dream that did I.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 22:04 (three years ago) link

Meera's still alive

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 22:46 (three years ago) link

I'm terrible with faces in a lot of these complex plot shows. With S5 having been so long ago, I was confusing all the middle aged men with grey beards. I keep mixing up Stannis, Davos, Jorah (to a lesser ext), and Alliser.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 22:57 (three years ago) link

i wasn't sure if the ppl in jon snow's rooms were wildlings or nightwatch

, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 23:15 (three years ago) link

watch men

, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 23:15 (three years ago) link

i've read all the books and watched all the eps but honestly idk if i care how the story concludes anymore

, Tuesday, 26 April 2016 23:18 (three years ago) link

Yeah I'm starting to find the whole thing a bit of a mess to follow. Someone upthread mentioned burning ships... hein!? Wasnt that burning buildings?

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 00:07 (three years ago) link

Nah it was the harbor

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 00:38 (three years ago) link

Dead @ Karl Malone ranking post

Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 01:42 (three years ago) link

maybe I need 2 b less drunk when watching this show lol

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 02:16 (three years ago) link

No I think you're on the right track.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 02:34 (three years ago) link

Finally caught up with this (the episode, not the thread). I'm glad to see that it's gotten back to being a bit self consciously campy again - the Dothraki Spanish Inquisition skit throwback was cute, and so was the negotiating through the door scene - but as I was reminding my wife who everyone was and why we (in theory) care, it was pretty rough going. "Oh, she is sworn to her because her master was killed by a mysterious vagina ghost assassin." "That guy, he used magic to ..." etc.

One thing I couldn't answer/remember is what happened to the dragons. The best I could come up with is that she flew one of them to Scotland with a broken engine and then crash-landed it in a field before she was captured by Dothraki?

BTW, if this ends with dragons vs. zombies - or zombies riding dragons? or zombie dragons? - I will be highly entertained and also drunk.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 03:21 (three years ago) link

the others she locked in a cave because the one who is actually loose was behaving badly..

I think tyrion is gonna go check on them in the next ep due to the preview.

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 03:43 (three years ago) link

Are we mayb all struggling cos its been too long since the last season? I should have rewatched at least S5 again.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 03:58 (three years ago) link

those sandworm girls are so annoying, dorne is stupid & looks like a myst add-on

i am nostalgc for the days of a mere 3 storylines

Flamenco Drop (VegemiteGrrl), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 04:09 (three years ago) link

also did everyone always swear so modernly and casually in this

Flamenco Drop (VegemiteGrrl), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 04:10 (three years ago) link

Yeah, there was a flurry of "fucks" in one bit that really stood out for me!

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 04:15 (three years ago) link

this wasn't very good was it

ulysses, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 04:38 (three years ago) link

whenever I see the sandsnakes I regret watching the TMNT parody video last year because thats all I hear in my head

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 05:46 (three years ago) link

I didn't really see much similarity between them and Ninja Turtles. They have weapons and they're young.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 05:57 (three years ago) link

have even wondered about rickon.

― japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, April 26, 2016 8:26 AM (14 hours ago)

I think Rickon might be back this season!!! He's like my favorite character after Dolorous Ed and the hippie red priest

sarahell, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 06:12 (three years ago) link

this wasn't very good was it

― ulysses, Tuesday, April 26, 2016 11:38 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

oh cmon its flawed af but its not *bad*

Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 06:38 (three years ago) link

whenever I see the sandsnakes I regret watching the TMNT parody video last year because thats all I hear in my head

OTM, I actually catch myself chuckling at it all the time.

And yeah, this was pretty silly, i.e. bad enough. We are at the point in the story where it is dangerously close to totally teetering over with the weight of all its not-terribly-compelling contrivances. Like, this far along and I still don't give a fuck about the Red Witch, and neither do I ever remotely understand her powers/role. Dorn stuff is stupid and cheap-looking, massive perils like Ice Zombies and dragons constantly vanish or get sidelined/ignored, 5/6 seasons in and magic powers present since the start have still not been explained/outlined, and so on. I don't get how shows, especially shows with huge budgets and huger audiences like this and Walking Dead (RIP to me) just can't manage 10 or 13 totally good episodes in a row. Better Call Saul did it. Hell, Veep has done it. And neither of these has the literally unlimited resources of imagination at their service.

And as far as the show's momentum goes, strictly as an entertainment and not as, like, a fake history of an ancient pretend land, it's just constantly hitting the reset button, like playing some maddening kids game that sends you back to the beginning when you're almost at the end. Makes it all feel padded, which maybe it is!

Show/story/Martin made a strategic narrative error by first) systematically killing off (temporarily or no) its most compelling characters and second) scattering the rest across the sidetrack gulag. I presume this season is already on track to remedying the latter problem; for once we have a whole bunch of related characters in the same place(s), talking to one another. As for the former, I think we'll have to wait and see, but it's happened so often now that it's tough to get totally invested in anyone's specific plight, and even when you do, expectations subvert drama, i.e. no one thinks Jon Snow is dead, no one thinks the Mother of Dragons is in any real danger.

Well, I guess she could be, and I guess they could all be killed at any moment, but that would be pretty shitty storytelling. This ep alone seemed largely about aggressively tying up a few loose ends lest they become more dead ends.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 13:23 (three years ago) link

Khaleesi Widows Spa Retreat just felt like Bad TV Writing

so did the melisandre reveal

, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 13:29 (three years ago) link

http://i.imgur.com/WEl2uHD.jpg

r|t|c, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 13:36 (three years ago) link

Lol

I giggled at it as an intentional subversion of boobs. OK, we made it to the episode of the season premiere with no nudity, so here is this person disrobing, just for you, and ... ha, now her boobs are old! Fooled you!

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 13:36 (three years ago) link

Are people out there really stoked for another dose of Bran and his loser mates? It's like looking forward to a Lost episode about Rose and Bernard.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 13:53 (three years ago) link

the problem the show faces right here:

Are people out there really stoked for another dose of Bran and his loser mates?

magic powers present since the start have still not been explained/outlined

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 13:57 (three years ago) link

there was a ton of explicit two person dialogue exposition and a desperate need to make sure we hit every storyline for about four minutes... basically the two sins they've been good at avoiding until now

ulysses, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 13:57 (three years ago) link

want at least two seasons of tmns and splintelaria biding their time in the sewers of kings landing

robberies mysteriously foiled, angry pizza maesters etc

after defeating mutant mountain, a stray canister of wildfire leads to a final showdown with super cersei. go snakey go snakey go

r|t|c, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 13:59 (three years ago) link

maybe the police from monty python + holy grail will show up and arrest dorne

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 14:05 (three years ago) link

This episode was basically the same as every season opener for the last couple of seasons, basically just the show going "remember this dude? Also these two are pretty important also, and don't forget about what's happening over here! There's also this happening even though nobody cares about this storyline, but maybe we'll make it work this season, etc."

I guess it's ok to complain about it, but it seems like most people would be completely lost if they didn't do it.

silverfish, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 14:14 (three years ago) link

New Dothraki guy reminds me of Hari Kunzru

Robert Adam Gilmour, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 14:37 (three years ago) link

remind me, what happened to the dothraki when daenerys first met the unsullied? did they just ride away somewhere? do some of them still think that daenerys is the unburned mother of dragons etc etc etc etc etc etc? or was that a different band of dothraki that's unconnected to the new crew?

i can't fucking BELIEVE the dothraki are involved again, btw

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:35 (three years ago) link

i went from hating the whole S1 dothraki storyline to being sort of ok with it, but when they disappeared i assumed that we would never see them again and i was totally fine with that

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:36 (three years ago) link

"magic powers present since the start have still not been explained/outlined"

That's a feature, not a bug.

a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:39 (three years ago) link

For sure. But when you start bringing characters back from the dead (like the Mountain), it'd be nice to know how or why they can't do that for everyone. See also: Red Witch's vagina shadow demon assassin, creation of wildfire, going full-wart (and why), etc. It would be helpful, this far along, to know why some people can do stuff and some people can't, and why those that can usually don't, and so on. And that's just stuff in the abstract. More specifically missing among many characters: motive. Or at least motive beyond merely generic "power." What does the Red Witch want and why? The asshole in charge of the Night's Watch now, what does he want?

Man, I just remembered all the other shit going on that we haven't even got a reminder of. Sam studying to be a book ninja, Littlefinger farting around in Cloudymountainland. Wyldling Stallions off somewhere (or were they all killed?). Vast army of unkillable Ice Zombies just ... chilling somewhere.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:56 (three years ago) link

i think there are a bunch of dothraki clans or tribes or whatever that luv 2 fight each other

Also, the show's CGI crowd budget seems to have waned precipitously. Every scene is like huge establishing shot followed by 5 people hanging in the corner of a room/small set. Maybe they're saving their cash for dragons and zombies?

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:58 (three years ago) link

i want to see a comparison of the direwolves throughout the series

, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:00 (three years ago) link

You mean the quality of CGI?

How many are left alive? A couple?

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:07 (three years ago) link

The asshole in charge of the Night's Watch now, what does he want?

most burning question of all imo

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:09 (three years ago) link

i think there are a bunch of dothraki clans or tribes or whatever that luv 2 fight each other

so like they married her off to a chieftain of one particular clan w/ the idea that would somehow gain the targaryans an army of dothrakis? feel like maybe they didn't think this one through.

Mordy, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:10 (three years ago) link

i thought the night watch head's motivations were the most obvious -- he's the old guard who resented jon snow and resents his decisions and he wants to be in charge and rid the guard of its progressive elements.

Mordy, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:11 (three years ago) link

All I really want at this point is

a) awesome extended dialogue like Littlefinger & Varys that one time, Cersei & Oberyn that one time, excerpts from Brienne's old diary etc.
b) an entire episode from the white walkers pov, mostly working on dragonglass immunity spells and playing jenga with human remains
c) kill off a third of the remaining characters by season end

The whole myth-arc of John Snow is the most tedious bullshit.

nashwan, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:17 (three years ago) link

xpost i know lol. I had no idea anyone was having trouble with that dude's motives

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:18 (three years ago) link

was trystane killed before doran tho we see it the other way around?

conrad, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:20 (three years ago) link

Oh, I mean, I get it re: Night Watch guy. But I thought the whole point of the Night's Watch was to protect everyone south of the wall from bad things. So this dude Jon Snow comes to lead the Night Watch with a special vantage into what exactly they need protecting from - the White Walkers and not the Wildlings - aaaand they kill him. Like "OK, now that we've killed the guy who knows just what we're up against, let's get back to the business of protecting everyone from this mysterious threat."

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:23 (three years ago) link

It's part and parcel I suppose with so many characters refusing to see the long view. Re: White Walkers, dragons, magic, etc.

The flip side of this is characters playing such a long game I have no idea what it is (Red Witch, Littlefinger, even Aria - is she still training for revenge? I can't even remember if everyone she wanted to kill is still alive or not). At least Mother of Dragons has a clear goal, even if it's slow going.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:26 (three years ago) link

Not sure Arya knows who's died by other hands recently so think her list is something like:

Joffrey
Cersei
Walder Frey
Tywin
Melisandre
Those Bannerless Brodudes
Ilyn Payne (not coming back presumably)
Artist Formerley Known As The Mountain
The Boltons (if she's done the math)

nashwan, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:39 (three years ago) link

You mean the quality of CGI?

How many are left alive? A couple?

They seem to vary in size too

, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:40 (three years ago) link

Trystane/Sand Snake dialogue was abrupt to me because even if I had ruthless murderer cousins, if they came in and I said "I told you I'm not hungry" and they joked "We're not here to feed you, we're here to kill you" I'd instinctively say "lol oh hey cousins, I'm glad you're here cause I'm really upset my girlfriend suddenly died. Did you hear about that?"

Him immediately taking them seriously implies he already knew they were involved in her death. So if that's to be implied then I would have had him at least say "How did you get here? Are you serious? So it WAS you, then!"

Just more picky daily grievances about Dorne related scenes from Evan

Evan, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:43 (three years ago) link

i thought the night watch head's motivations were the most obvious -- he's the old guard who resented jon snow and resents his decisions and he wants to be in charge and rid the guard of its progressive elements.

― Mordy, Wednesday, April 27, 2016 4:11 PM (34 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I hear you on this but the knights watch status quo was pretty fucking dire before jon showed up.

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:49 (three years ago) link

What does the Red Witch want and why?

She's a religious zealot on a mission of evangelism and prophecy fulfillment, and her religion has a good deal of in-world evidence to support its authenticity.

But I thought the whole point of the Night's Watch was to protect everyone south of the wall from bad things. So this dude Jon Snow comes to lead the Night Watch with a special vantage into what exactly they need protecting from - the White Walkers and not the Wildlings - aaaand they kill him.

The whole point of it is that very few people are taking the White Walker threat seriously. The majority of those South of the wall see Wildings as the main danger beyond it. To give a real world analogy, to the Westerosi hoi polloi the White Walkers are climate change and the Wildlings are ISIS.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:52 (three years ago) link

so like they married her off to a chieftain of one particular clan w/ the idea that would somehow gain the targaryans an army of dothrakis? feel like maybe they didn't think this one through.

Well yes, as there are many armies of Dothraki controlled by many warlords.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:55 (three years ago) link

What does the Red Witch want and why?

She's a religious zealot on a mission of evangelism and prophecy fulfillment, and her religion has a good deal of in-world evidence to support its authenticity.

I also think the last scene and her dazed ass 'wtf' look on her face when she got to castle black was to illustrate that her stannis prophecy was so so wrong and she has to figure out what to do now..

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 16:55 (three years ago) link

Well yes, as there are many armies of Dothraki controlled by many warlords.

right so presumably marrying only one of those warlords would not recruit all those armies

Mordy, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 17:06 (three years ago) link

I think the choice is not Isis vs climate change but Isis vs more powerful and unkillable zombie Isis.

At a certain point they have to move beyond this fiddling while rome burns mode right? because for a bunch of Master strategist and self-preservationists, everyone behaves very stupidly and recklessly. And shortsightedly.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 17:08 (three years ago) link

xp - he was the most powerful warlord with the largest army at the time.

sarahell, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 17:11 (three years ago) link

everyone behaves very stupidly and recklessly. And shortsightedly

The whole point of this show seems to be about pointing out that people in charge always do this.

I think it's going to take something like the white walkers taking Winterfell before the people in King's Landing start to actually think about what they can do about them.

silverfish, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 17:15 (three years ago) link

I think the choice is not Isis vs climate change but Isis vs more powerful and unkillable zombie Isis.

Nah it's climate change.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 18:36 (three years ago) link

everyone behaves very stupidly and recklessly. And shortsightedly

The whole point of this show seems to be about pointing out that people in charge always do this.

who, martin?

goole, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 19:12 (three years ago) link

xpost yeah, the thing is Jon and his buddies are the ones who have seen the White Walkers in action, while most of the Night's Watchmen have only battled Wildlings. So they choose to believe Jon was making shit up.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 19:38 (three years ago) link

yeah the fact that most people believe the white walkers and all non-wildling awful monsters from the land beyond the wall are just stories told to scare children is restated over and over and over again

pratt truss it (dan m), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 19:44 (three years ago) link

While most of the Night's Watchmen have only battled Wildlings

They had some interesting adventures at Castle Black too! Giants, mammoths, wights...

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 19:54 (three years ago) link

weren't the giants fighting for the Wildlings?

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 19:56 (three years ago) link

Yes, but early in the show people talked about giants as if they weren't real, only from the tales.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 19:57 (three years ago) link

I might conclude then, if legendary beasts appeared fighting alongside the Wildlings, that the guy who wants to let the Wildlings through the wall was a bit of a problem.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:03 (three years ago) link

a giant white walker seems like a huge problem to deal with, also. unless they are immune?

Van Horn Street, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:05 (three years ago) link

Getting back to this Climate Change analogy. CC is something that many/most predict will do bad things, but those bad things are as yet subtle, or abstract. But an unstoppable army of the undead? Dragons, which may be scarce but certainly existed and wreaked havoc within a generation or so? You'd think they'd be good rallying points.

Also, per predictions: with all these prophecies and religious nuts and people with magic, you'd think at least someone would be touting the/a looming apocalypse, which is what charismatic religious leaders basically live for. Even the people with magic powers seem weirdly blind and short-sighted.

"With my witchcraft and spells, I will seat you on the iron throne!"

"Yes, but what about the dragons and ice zombies?"

"What? That's stupid, they don't exist. What are you, a child? Now, back to the matter at hand! The throne! The throne that seemingly does nobody any good, let alone those closest to it! That should be your goal, not defending the realm from a looming magic apocalypse."

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:06 (three years ago) link

I'm pretty sure that Melisandre takes the white walkers seriously, or at least knows they exist. She's the one who said something like "the real war has not even started" when they got that crow message from the night watch a bunch of seasons ago.

She does not appear to have any kind of plan though.

silverfish, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:14 (three years ago) link

the nitpicking is intense

Van Horn Street, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:15 (three years ago) link

seems like getting a guy onto the Iron Throne who was in debt to her gods was pretty much the plan. Then her gods would have a lot of soldiers.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:16 (three years ago) link

it seems rather obvious to me that not many people know about the white walkers, which was the big 'oh no' of Jon Snow dying (for me at least), who is going to relay that information now? xpost also yeah Melisandre seems to see a solution in Jon Snow which is why the resurrection idea makes sense to many.

Van Horn Street, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:16 (three years ago) link

to be honest one of my favorite parts of the show is how people are failing to take the white walker threat seriously, it's almost an in-joke from the very first scene of the series, with this stammering night's watch dude muttering about having fled white walkers and ned going on about duty or whatever right before he cuts his head off.

nomar, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:21 (three years ago) link

yeah, it makes all the king's landing stuff, especially now with the dude from Brazil/Martin Luther, so efficiently frustrating!

Van Horn Street, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:23 (three years ago) link

How many years have passed in the story? Several, right? Get with it, TV dummies! These people are so conniving, and so Machiavellian, and so stupid. Want this to end all the ice zombies, and dragons, and witches and armies amassed, ready to decimate one another, and then ... some other army from a different part of the (I assume) globe rolls up and just conquers them all.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:40 (three years ago) link

ends with Tommy Westphall shaking up a snowglobe and yelling "it's winter!"

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 20:42 (three years ago) link

How many years have passed in the story? Several, right? Get with it, TV dummies! These people are so conniving, and so Machiavellian, and so stupid. Want this to end all the ice zombies, and dragons, and witches and armies amassed, ready to decimate one another, and then ... some other army from a different part of the (I assume) globe rolls up and just conquers them all.

― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, April 27, 2016 9:40 PM (38 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I was trying to think about time passed when the daughter was poisoned. That's the same girl who was conceived at the begining of the first season wasn't it? The reason the kid got knocked out of a window and wound up apparently paralysed from the waist down.
Or am I remembering that wrong? Would help if I remembered taht character's name
Would mean that there was a good 16 years between the beginning and the current season, unless there was a flashback to that at the beginning, which would mean less time passed.
Maybe I just need to rewatch the early series again.

Stevolende, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 21:25 (three years ago) link

That's not true: "Myrcella is eating breakfast with Cersei, Jaime and Tommen when her uncle Tyrion joins them. Myrcella asks whether Bran will die and Tyrion replies that he is expected to live, delighting Myrcella and horrifying Cersei."

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 21:28 (three years ago) link

yeah myrcella is like 10 in the first season, she just doesn't do much. Cersei has neither conceived nor been pregnant nor given birth since the narrative began.

Clay, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 21:45 (three years ago) link

Here's a question for those who take said questions seriously: the White Walkers, what's up with them? They have seemingly unlimited powers of regeneration, cannot be easily killed and can apparently multiply at will. So what's the hold-up? What are they up to? Where are they hanging? Do they think? Are they basically people, but ice zombies, or are they driven by something other than revenge/quest for the throne? Clearly they have a king, so they must be into that sort of thing, too.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:11 (three years ago) link

The answer to all those questions is bad plotting.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:14 (three years ago) link

the final season can have every individual story strand wind up by having grr martin appear and go '¯\_(ツ)_/¯'

The walkers are waiting for winter, I'd wager

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:22 (three years ago) link

Ah, good answer!

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:24 (three years ago) link

But what are they doing now? Playing cards? Catching up on summer reading?

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:25 (three years ago) link

I've wondered whether they think

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:26 (three years ago) link

they're watching a boring protracted drama about a mythical land called "medievel Europe"

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:33 (three years ago) link

"Why does everyone in this stupid show think the world is flat?!"

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:34 (three years ago) link

They bring winter with them! It is known!

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:35 (three years ago) link

"When is this Jesus guy gonna finally show up and murder everybody?"

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:36 (three years ago) link

I believe perhaps they can only travel with the weather? For instance, "winter is coming" and once it finally does they will be able to reach as far as it does. That was how I interpreted it.

However it all made more sense when they were like this elemental humanoid force of evil that was on its way to sweep in and overtake everything just like an actual blizzard, but in that episode last season where they were suddenly wearing clothes and showing facial expressions and emotions... that just kind of turned them into merely another competing clan looking to overthrow everything.

I said this last thread in case of deja vu.

Evan, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:39 (three years ago) link

The internet says there are wards in/near the wall (craster's keep, for example) that help keep the walkers away.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 22:43 (three years ago) link

There are plenty of actual flaws in the show and then there are flaws in this thread

Like who tf wants the magic explained? That's dumb as hell. It's part of the chaotic unknowable atmosphere that makes this show compelling at all & lets you forgive contrivance

Smh feel like you guys have never read fantasy before 🤓

Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 23:05 (three years ago) link

what do the zombies in walking dead do when they aren't attacking ppl? white walkers are just like medieval versions of them. they probably meander aimlessly in the snow and stare at bright shiny things and think, "ugghrhrhg?"

sarahell, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 23:16 (three years ago) link

they do charity work to give something back

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 23:16 (three years ago) link

can we get back to being excited about Rickon reappearing?

sarahell, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 23:19 (three years ago) link

are there any good recaps of this show anymore? ask the maester is on hiatus i guess, and max doesn't do em anymore

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 23:25 (three years ago) link

"josh in chicago" is a good DN for these posts, as in "now we've got Josh in Chicago with a question about this week's Game of Thrones, Josh you're on the line."

nomar, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 23:29 (three years ago) link

i think the established character i'd be happiest to never see again is ramsay bolton, dude is like the r-rated version of a saturday morning tv cartoon villain, coasting along for seasons on end without establishing any character traits beyond 'is evil'

it seems rather obvious to me that not many people know about the white walkers, which was the big 'oh no' of Jon Snow dying (for me at least), who is going to relay that information now?

Well Sam, obviously.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 23:50 (three years ago) link

I have a feeling he's due for a bigger (lol sorry) role in the plot.

Also, any bets on what character Richard E Grant will be playing? I'm hoping Sam's father, but I'm prob wrong.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 23:51 (three years ago) link

What's a DN? Is it something bad?

I only harp on the magic stuff because it seems so random, unexplained and, worst of all, sort of ignored. Like, there is magic shit happening all over the place, so it doesn't take much of a leap to believe in ice zombies or dragons, especially since magic or no, the latter clearly existed and terrorized the land, like, 50, 100 years before this takes place. Right? However long ago, they're fucking dragons. And of course there are giants and other creatures, too, and plenty of people have seen the dire wolves, which are of course nbd, except they are a big deal. And then there are warg people, but does anyone know about the warg people or are they stuff of legend, too? Are there dozens of warg people? Hundreds? I get that magic slowly coming back is a cool thing, but once that's been happening for years and years ... it's happened, right? It's not coming back, it's back.

Anyway, it's just so much happening at once in every direction at once, and yet the narrative seems permanently stalled in mundane power biz. I want an episode that is first person mock documentary interviews with various plebes and serfs and stuff, just to get out of this weird bubble of pretenders to the throne. Maybe they can save that for season 7.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:06 (three years ago) link

(I don't really want that, btw. But I do wish this far along some of the show's mythology and rules were better explained. Because otherwise anything can just happen, like a giant talking fish could appear and challenge Jaime to a duel, and everyone will be all, well, who needs to explain it, in this world there are giant talking fish, nothing to see here, they're magic.)

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:09 (three years ago) link

Its been ages but I thought the idea was that people *did* believe in dragons and whitewalkers but that they were more the stuff of ancient history.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:13 (three years ago) link

there is magic shit happening all over the place

not really?

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:16 (three years ago) link

The "ask the maester" column is available via the mailing list from theringer.com. it was posted yesterday.

Many xps

silverfish, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:22 (three years ago) link

Cool, love ask the maester, thanks!

post Well, in Kings Landing they brought the Mountain back from the dead. In that other place there were those magic monks who tried to capture the Mother of Dragons. Wasn't Karl Drogo demonized by a demon? Arya Start has been magically blinded by magic people who were mentoring her. Red Witch was doing magic stuff with Stannis, a few people (like Cersai) have heard prophecies. Up north there is all sorts of magic shit, from White Walkers to Wargs to whatever is going on in that ... magic tree? Don't remember that part. And then of course there is the return of dragons, born of fire that did not kill the Mother of Dragons. And so on. More than enough to go around.

I think it's been 150 years since dragons terrorized the land when the first book begins. So it's been some time, but not really that long, especially as far as this world go, when it's even unclear how old people are.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:24 (three years ago) link

Most of that stuff is happening in isolation ... either in secrecy or in faraway places.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:32 (three years ago) link

all of this magic is occurring in far flung locations OR has been witnessed by very few people. The prophecies or whatever, I mean they could be real. I don't know. Melisandre is 2 for 3 with her curse on the prospective rulers. That witch is 2 for 3 with Jaime and cersei's kids.

nomar, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:35 (three years ago) link

What poly said basically yeah

nomar, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:35 (three years ago) link

Wow, Ask the Maester stumped a lot. Fun watch, though.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:38 (three years ago) link

Oh, wait, there's a column, too? I just saw his 10 minute live riff.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:39 (three years ago) link

The old column was in Grantland... it looks like its moved for S6

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:42 (three years ago) link

http://us12.campaign-archive1.com/?u=9a393473748185dce76bf8339&id=00119d1332

(This should be the Ask the Maester column, weird Url aside)

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:43 (three years ago) link

DN is display name, by the way. Your "Josh in Chicago."

nickn, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:43 (three years ago) link

Ha, ok, I get it now. Anyway, this is funny, from the Maester column:

The Dothraki believe that a great khal (hm) will appear at Vaes Dothrak (hmm) to unite the khalasars (hmmm) under his (HMMMM) banner and go on to conquer the world.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:48 (three years ago) link

Cool, love ask the maester, thanks!

post Well, in Kings Landing they brought the Mountain back from the dead. In that other place there were those magic monks who tried to capture the Mother of Dragons. Wasn't Karl Drogo demonized by a demon? Arya Start has been magically blinded by magic people who were mentoring her. Red Witch was doing magic stuff with Stannis, a few people (like Cersai) have heard prophecies. Up north there is all sorts of magic shit, from White Walkers to Wargs to whatever is going on in that ... magic tree? Don't remember that part. And then of course there is the return of dragons, born of fire that did not kill the Mother of Dragons. And so on. More than enough to go around.

I think it's been 150 years since dragons terrorized the land when the first book begins. So it's been some time, but not really that long, especially as far as this world go, when it's even unclear how old people are.

― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, April 27, 2016 7:24 PM (27 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

bro -_-

they dont have twitter

Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Thursday, 28 April 2016 00:53 (three years ago) link

Are all the ravens dead? There seems to be a lack of raven communication.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 02:05 (three years ago) link

I recall someone being handed, and reading, a scroll at one point. Presumably raven-delivered?

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Thursday, 28 April 2016 03:07 (three years ago) link

There was a lot of wholesale raven slaughter last season, iirc. What annoyed me this episode (and which hasn't been mentioned); I really don't get why ice cold Roose Bolton is so into making his unreliable annoying nutjob son his heir. Obv he has no other sons but come on, the dude couldn't be relied on to make coffee and Roose just got his young new wife pregnant, so why not wait? It'd be cold and rational to do so.

albvivertine, Thursday, 28 April 2016 04:07 (three years ago) link

imho it's quite a leap to say roose is "into" making ramsay his heir. but he knows the kid is desperate for legitimacy and willing to do any amount of dirty work to make it happen, so why not dangle it for now and see how things play out?

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Thursday, 28 April 2016 04:17 (three years ago) link

I don't know. Besides letting Sansa escape he's been doing a pretty good job as far as Roose is concerned.

Evan, Thursday, 28 April 2016 04:24 (three years ago) link

Roose invoked his new Frey wife bearing him a son so I assume Ramsey is the only male in the line of succession.

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Thursday, 28 April 2016 04:47 (three years ago) link

Playing crusader kings 2 helps figure out who is in play for these inheritance shenanigans.

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Thursday, 28 April 2016 04:47 (three years ago) link

xp - yeah, he currently has no male heirs outside of Ramsey, which is why he made Ramsey a Bolton in the first place

sarahell, Thursday, 28 April 2016 06:53 (three years ago) link

CC is something that many/most predict will do bad things, but those bad things are as yet subtle, or abstract.

This is a pretty good analogy, in that climate change's effects aren't either of those things, but as long as they're far away and/or deniable...

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 28 April 2016 07:52 (three years ago) link

I think it's been 150 years since dragons terrorized the land when the first book begins. So it's been some time, but not really that long, especially as far as this world go, when it's even unclear how old people are.

No one doesn't believe in dragons! Recieved wisdom is that they are extinct, though it seems like the existence of Dani's dragons is pretty widely accepted in both continents at this stage.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Thursday, 28 April 2016 08:56 (three years ago) link

Somebody has mentioned there being no twitter, I was going to say there was no mass media. Not sure there is any organised media or postal service. So news presumably spreads by word of mouth and is probably not the most reliable or widespreadly known. Probably some degree of chinese whispers through populace too.
In the real world prior to postal service being established letters would be passed along between people going in the general direction. It could take 7 years for one to get to its destination though I think that specific one was Europe to Asia.
I assume they're using specific messengers in this and most things are on one landmass. I need to see a map.

Stevolende, Thursday, 28 April 2016 09:29 (three years ago) link

There's two landmasses.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Thursday, 28 April 2016 09:30 (three years ago) link

Ravens are the postal service. But you don't necessarily believe every Raven you receive, considering that everyone is basically trying to undermine everyone else.

Clay, Thursday, 28 April 2016 09:40 (three years ago) link

xxxp

http://i.imgur.com/zaH5JF1.jpg

groovypanda, Thursday, 28 April 2016 09:58 (three years ago) link

Raven post has several apparent drawbacks doesn't it?
Primarily being that it could only take place along a single route surely. No matter how intelligent a korvid is, trying to get it to go anywhere other than the destination location it already knows would be tricky.

Stevolende, Thursday, 28 April 2016 10:08 (three years ago) link

But maybe these are magic ravens.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 12:08 (three years ago) link

in that climate change's effects aren't either of those things

It's a different/sidetracked debated, but come on, saying the ocean is on track to gain a degree or two every 50 years or that a certain percentage of the permafrost is melting or that weather patterns have shifted to make weather models more erratic and the likelihood of violent or dramatic shifts greater is huge, cataclysmic! But it is indeed pretty subtle and abstract imo - thinking about things that might happen many years down the line, possibly or likely well after we are dead - which is one reason so many seem resistant to the idea of fixing (somehow) a problem that will likely, sometime, be destructive, in any number of some ways. In the battle of concrete threats, even in terms of analogy, a vast unkillable army of ice zombies massing on the north border is pretty hard to argue against.

Unless one is citing them in this make-believe world as a possible effect of Winter-is-Coming climate change - maybe winter is coming, maybe there will be ice zombies - in which case, sure. The people are the north are bellwethers akin to the Maldives or something. I guess it is worth conceding, at least by narrative omission, that the vast majority of unseen masses on GoT world has no idea what is going on at all beyond the next meal. And even as far as Winter is Coming, it's been brought up once or twice as more than just a Stark catchphrase, right? It's been at least mentioned in King's Landing, as the impetus for grain/food stockpiling?

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 12:18 (three years ago) link

But the point is very few people believe the extent of the WW threat! The Night's Watch arseholes clearly think Jon was mistaken, or lying or at least massively exaggerating for his own political agenda, as some climate change deniers think its advocates are.

It's an imperfect analogy cos obviously an army of snow zombies and a gradual but catastrophic change in weather systems are very different things. But the White Walkers are, like climate change, a slow moving but profoundly existential threat, whereas the Wildlings, like Isis, are the enemies du jour perceived as probably a far greater danger than they actually are. Jon Snow's murder is the equivalent of a modern politician being suspended from office for colaborating with Islamic State scientists on sustainable energy strategies.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Thursday, 28 April 2016 12:34 (three years ago) link

Fair enough.

Maybe I don't remember, but I can't recall what's motivating the Wildlings, either. At this point do they just want to be left alone? I assume they're preparing for the White Walkers, too, perhaps more than most. Though I don't know how one prepares for that. Or why the White Walkers haven't already killed and conscripted the entirety of the Wildling population.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 13:13 (three years ago) link

Or why the White Walkers haven't already killed and conscripted the entirety of the Wildling population.

Yeah this is something that hasn't been explained/thought through.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Thursday, 28 April 2016 13:30 (three years ago) link

When Jon Snow prepares to kill Ygritte, she is scared that he wouldn't burn her body afterwards. There were hints that the wildlings had been rising as zombies lately, and that that was what the White Walkers did: Mainly waited for some of them to die, and kill others, and so on and so on. The show has changed that with Hardholme and the mystical Night King and all that, and as with nearly all their changes, it probably wasn't thought through.

Wrt magic, there are two things to remember: 1) Magic mostly happens away from the center of Westeros, so most educated elites dislike it. Essos is much more magical, and the Targaryans also rode their dragons from over there. The other thing, which is probably much more in the book as well, is that 2) Magic is intertwined with power in this world. Melisandre does not just do magic. She does the will of the fire god R'hollor, and was claiming that Stannis was that God's rightful king. The Starks aren't just warging. They're demonstrating their connection to the animal of their vigil, and their power as descendants of 'the first men' (who inhabited Westeros before the southerners came, kinda like the celts in Britain), their connection to the Old Gods, etc. The White Walkers are also intertwined with this myth, and with the Children of the Forrest (whom Bran are now with), so to people in the south, it's a bit suspicious that a Stark bastard keeps talking about them. And of course, there are the Targaryans and their dragons. And basically, for the followers of the Seven, of the New Gods, mainly the Lannister family who has not a single speck of magic connected to them, every admission of magic is an admission that other families are stronger than them, and therefore, by implication, probably more skilled at ruling the kingdom. So it's not just that people don't believe tales of magic, there are powerful vested interests in not believing them.

Frederik B, Thursday, 28 April 2016 14:01 (three years ago) link

The show changed what now?

Evan, Thursday, 28 April 2016 15:00 (three years ago) link

My theory is that the last thing keeping the Whites from full on attack was Craster exposing all those baby boys.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Thursday, 28 April 2016 15:14 (three years ago) link

At this rate, 2200 seems an awful long way away. I'm pretty worried about 2013 or 2014.

― Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 10 January 2013 22:38 (3 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

(from Global Warming's Terrifying New Math which Josh has apparently forgot about - I'll leave it as my last word in the diversion)

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 28 April 2016 15:24 (three years ago) link

I totally agree with ... me. But in the show, the ice zombie army and dragons are 2013 or 2014. It'd be one thing if the grumpy pants characters in Game of Thrones were saying "Winter is Coming ... in 150 Years." Maybe they have been, and we're just sort of watching en medias rex. "Ugh, shut up about the zombies, dude, I'll be dead in 150 years, and besides, people are dropping like flies around me on a daily basis anyway. Now, here's my plan to get free refills of mead even though I only paid for one flagon!"

But anyway, yeah, I liked FB's bit on willful ignorance as a different sort of power.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 15:43 (three years ago) link

I should also stress that I'm not totally obtuse, I get that "Winter" (et al.) is like global warming. I guess my take is just that it is not something that is predicted to happen in the future, but something (in the show) that is actually happening now, a prediction come to pass. But you (all) are right, not a lot of people seem to know about the White Walkers or even the return of dragons, at least not outside (some) of the elites the show focuses on. As of yet in the show I still have no idea what the population of these lands actually is.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 15:57 (three years ago) link

Nobody but those who have seen them believe white walkers/zombies exist or still exist. They do however know that winter is coming. They don't realize that winter will bring the white walkers with it.

Evan, Thursday, 28 April 2016 15:59 (three years ago) link

As of yet in the show I still have no idea what the population of these lands actually is.

yeah i've generally found it odd that winterfell seems to have maybe 100 people living in it, and not even the metropolitan centres seem particularly sprawling

iirc there have been many Winters since the last time the Whites were a threat

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Thursday, 28 April 2016 16:24 (three years ago) link

I'm pretty sure that way back in season 1, Ned mentions that Arya was born during the last winter. He also mentions that since it's been a longer than usual time since the last winter, the next winter is likely to be much worse than usual.

silverfish, Thursday, 28 April 2016 16:56 (three years ago) link

can i just mention yet again that i will never understand why they don't release the episodes in the late fall/winter so that they can use "WINTER IS COMING" in the ad campaigns? i should be an advertising bigwig, these ideas are solid gold!!

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Thursday, 28 April 2016 16:59 (three years ago) link

maybe HBO Australia uses "WINTER IS COMING" in its ad campaigns?

silverfish, Thursday, 28 April 2016 17:11 (three years ago) link

(I don't know if HBO Australia exists)

silverfish, Thursday, 28 April 2016 17:11 (three years ago) link

See, that's another thing not clear to me. Obviously people believe in dragons, they just don't know they're back. But Winter (writ large) is a real thing, too, that people have experienced and planned for and dealt with, so it's not like some fiction. And is the same true for the White Walkers? Stuff of fairy tales, or ancient history?

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 17:30 (three years ago) link

white walkers hadn't been around for thousands of years, and they possibly were the stuff of legends and not real.

nomar, Thursday, 28 April 2016 17:37 (three years ago) link

I totally agree with ... me. But in the show, the ice zombie army and dragons are 2013 or 2014.

Andrew's point is that climate change is 2013 (or in fact most of the 2000s). That is, the effects of climate change are already here -- it's not some purely notional consequence anymore.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Thursday, 28 April 2016 17:39 (three years ago) link

There are legends about the Whites but they much more distant than dragons

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Thursday, 28 April 2016 17:40 (three years ago) link

Are

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Thursday, 28 April 2016 17:40 (three years ago) link

Fair enough.

Maybe I don't remember, but I can't recall what's motivating the Wildlings, either. At this point do they just want to be left alone? I assume they're preparing for the White Walkers, too, perhaps more than most. Though I don't know how one prepares for that. Or why the White Walkers haven't already killed and conscripted the entirety of the Wildling population.

― Josh in Chicago, Thursday, April 28, 2016 1:13 PM (4 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

isnt the entire hardhome episode the white walkers coming to fucking kill all the wildlings (or at least sack their capital)? and they all ran off on boats to escape.

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Thursday, 28 April 2016 18:06 (three years ago) link

Maybe they'll bump into this guy:
https://31.media.tumblr.com/3676e4ba7ff8b2291d53ee67e2931f63/tumblr_n7fcf4dBkJ1qbqzawo1_250.gif

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 18:13 (three years ago) link

But Winter (writ large) is a real thing, too, that people have experienced and planned for and dealt with, so it's not like some fiction.

It's been almost 15 years since the last winter at this point.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Thursday, 28 April 2016 18:35 (three years ago) link

I'm not sure what's being debated here.

Evan, Thursday, 28 April 2016 18:49 (three years ago) link

I think the original problem statement was "People who are supposedly rational and intelligent are worried about dumb local politics instead of the obvious existential threat (or threats, depending on how they feel about a Targaryen with dragons)"

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Thursday, 28 April 2016 19:39 (three years ago) link

and an ancillary problem statement to that was "magic is goddamn all over the place, why do people seem to keep acting like it isn't"

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Thursday, 28 April 2016 19:41 (three years ago) link

and I thought these were RIDICULOUS questions a la Deej's response but the discussion that followed was worth it

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Thursday, 28 April 2016 19:42 (three years ago) link

Ok well then to that, yes, nobody in Westeros believes the white walkers exist (anymore or at all). So it indeed resembles climate change debates but in an exaggerated sense.

Evan, Thursday, 28 April 2016 19:42 (three years ago) link

I think in a ridiculous make-believe world like this one there is no such thing as a ridiculous question, especially because any such questions with answers will no doubt be answered by something equally ridiculous. "Well of course no one can ride dragons, because the Anti Dragon Rule of the Land of Erp decreed that no one shall ride a dragon before their 18th birthday, and all children were killed before they turned 18, so yes there were no dragon riders but the entire population of the Land of Erp got old and died and took with them the secrets of the ancient dragon-taming scrolls, written in the dead Oompa tongue, which no one could translate, anyway, since it can only be seen under the Red Moon of 5th Autumn, and we have not seen one of them in 300 years."

Which is to say, afaic, it's all good.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 20:12 (three years ago) link

The Oompa tongue died after Willy Wonka took all the Loompas as slaves, I take it.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Thursday, 28 April 2016 20:19 (three years ago) link

well we got all the parts of every line up to "...dee daa" or sometimes it's "...dee dee" but the rest of the words, no clue

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Thursday, 28 April 2016 20:23 (three years ago) link

They took their confectioner secrets to the grave.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 20:39 (three years ago) link

i think we talked about this quite a bit on the other thread but the approach to magic in Martin's universe is really cool imo--it's a genuinely strange and (often) unnerving thing to most people. it remains mysterious and subject to the whims of the gods or whatever--just like it should in a pre-modern context.

ryan, Thursday, 28 April 2016 21:34 (three years ago) link

tolkien is mostly good at this too. dreary magic systems are a plague upon fantasy literature.

ryan, Thursday, 28 April 2016 21:36 (three years ago) link

I think in a ridiculous make-believe world like this one there is no such thing as a ridiculous question, especially because any such questions with answers will no doubt be answered by something equally ridiculous. "Well of course no one can ride dragons, because the Anti Dragon Rule of the Land of Erp decreed that no one shall ride a dragon before their 18th birthday, and all children were killed before they turned 18, so yes there were no dragon riders but the entire population of the Land of Erp got old and died and took with them the secrets of the ancient dragon-taming scrolls, written in the dead Oompa tongue, which no one could translate, anyway, since it can only be seen under the Red Moon of 5th Autumn, and we have not seen one of them in 300 years."

yeah man let those fuckin' nerds have it. so good

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Thursday, 28 April 2016 21:39 (three years ago) link

as it was told in the book of custos

nomar, Thursday, 28 April 2016 21:39 (three years ago) link

Got no problem with the nerds! I've read two of the books and watch the show. Both are really easy to avoid, if I wanted to, but at least with the show I totally admit I am engaged. I'm just frustrated that six seasons in and so much remains nebulous, at least to me. Just from a craft standpoint, it's getting harder to believe they can tie up so much satisfactorily, but maybe I will be really surprised, in which case, I doff my Valerian helmet.

Also, tbh, I can sense my wife's interest waning a bit, and if she goes, usually that means I go as well. So I'm rooting for the nerds!

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:10 (three years ago) link

shit is not going to be tied up satisfactorily

Οὖτις, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:12 (three years ago) link

That's probably true enough. But at least as long as it holds to some sort of logic I'm prolly OK. Like, if there is a literal deus ex machina intervention - which is totally possible in this world - I'd be bummed.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:14 (three years ago) link

GRRM has specifically said he's not going to pull a Lost. I really hope he pulls it off.

schwantz, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:16 (three years ago) link

Dude has said a lot. But it's possible he'll pull it off in his way and the show will fail in its way. Or vice versa, both seem equally likely at this point, though there is a much greater chance of Martin dying before completing the story than the show getting cancelled before it reaches its own end.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:18 (three years ago) link

oh they're not gonna get cancelled, hasn't HBO already ordered the final seasons (w the show runners wanting to split the last season in half or something?)

Οὖτις, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:19 (three years ago) link

I hope this show ends with a ripping Edgar Winter guitar solo fwiw

Οὖτις, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:19 (three years ago) link

Oh, it won't get cancelled. What I mean is there is a good (or not small) chance the show will end its run (well or poorly) and GRRM won't.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:24 (three years ago) link

yeah I think that's entirely likely

Οὖτις, Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:26 (three years ago) link

GRRM might be spooked by what went down with Robert Jordan, worried DBW and Benioff are his Brandon Sanderson, and get his ass in gear. would be excellent if the concluding book dropped the day the final season premiered

reggie (qualmsley), Thursday, 28 April 2016 22:40 (three years ago) link

I feel a very tiny amount of bad that Shakey made a perfectly serviceable St. Elsewhere joke yesterday and then had to come back today and be like "they will not tie this up satisfactorily"

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Thursday, 28 April 2016 23:00 (three years ago) link

i sort of feel bad too there's zero gay of thrones discussion on this thread

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQT7qDKcGDc

reggie (qualmsley), Thursday, 28 April 2016 23:16 (three years ago) link

pretty sure the show ends with dany and jon sharing an incestuous kiss as they ride a dragon while it napalms an army of white walkers

fin

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Thursday, 28 April 2016 23:57 (three years ago) link

oh btw there was a partial explanation to the buning question of where prince whothefuck was when the Sandsnakes killed him. The letter from Jaime his dad got said that the prince was being sent back to Dorne on a boat, so I assume the SS intercepted the boat after seeing the letter.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Friday, 29 April 2016 00:27 (three years ago) link

You know what they say about ASSuming. It makes an ASSassin out of you and me.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 29 April 2016 00:42 (three years ago) link

ASS i always say, what, jaime betrayed cersei, and his whole "fuck the world, fuck everyone but us" speech was bullshit? why would that jaime write a letter to dr. bashir and not say boo to his sister/lover? where are my dragons? and where is bronn? did he deliver that letter? is he captive to the sandsnakes? where is theon's sister? where is beric dondarrion? loose threads everywhere

reggie (qualmsley), Friday, 29 April 2016 01:10 (three years ago) link

Text of the letter:
"The Princess Myrcella died by poison on our return journey. I suspect Ellaria Sand, not you, but my sister will demand war. I doubt Ellaria’s head will appease her, but it is a start, along with your nieces. Your son cannot stay in King’s Landing. I am sending him back on the same ship."

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Friday, 29 April 2016 01:16 (three years ago) link

xp Theon's sister will return along with Theon's uncle according to imdb

sarahell, Friday, 29 April 2016 06:20 (three years ago) link

yeah they're back this season they've just been thinking for a while.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Friday, 29 April 2016 07:18 (three years ago) link

Plenty of big moves in this episode. I like the Greyjoy home a lot. Surely it wouldn't be hard to kill off the sparrows now. Tyrion's risk with the dragons was unconvincing.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 11:27 (three years ago) link

jon snow revive was too early

, Monday, 2 May 2016 12:58 (three years ago) link

Why? I'm glad they didn't drag that one out.

Who is the cousin Jaime said he killed?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 13:04 (three years ago) link

big moves, bad dialogue, felt forced

ulysses, Monday, 2 May 2016 13:18 (three years ago) link

When he was in a cell being held by the Starks.

dan selzer, Monday, 2 May 2016 13:18 (three years ago) link

Alton Lannister. Jaime killed him to get out of his captivity in season 2.

A funny mention, since there definitely is a bunch of kin-slaying going on this season.

Frederik B, Monday, 2 May 2016 13:19 (three years ago) link

I kinda like watching this show again after it caught up to the books. It's pretty clear that George RR Martin is much more concerned with the rules of his word than the Benioff and Weiss. Which is okay, of course, but I do scratch my head a bit if Ramsay Bolton can get away with killing his father, brother and (step)mother, without his men rebelling.

Frederik B, Monday, 2 May 2016 13:21 (three years ago) link

But I still liked the episode more than I liked the last few I watched.

Frederik B, Monday, 2 May 2016 13:22 (three years ago) link

So Melisandre was able to reanimate Jon because she had lost her faith, right? There was something in that Brotherhood w/o Banners storyline about how a priest lost his faith and then somehow woke the dead iirc

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 16:14 (three years ago) link

i think she was able to reanimate jon because kit harrington is pretty popular

ulysses, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:17 (three years ago) link

Yeah. I'm not sure if they intended any sort of connection between corpse-revival-powers and loss-of-faith. I'm assuming a coincidence unless they reiterate it somehow. For instance, the Brothers priest guy was still able to revive their guy even after his faith was restored the first time it worked.

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:21 (three years ago) link

I don't think the power gets revoked if your returns

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 16:24 (three years ago) link

Thoros then confesses how he had always had a large lack of faith in the Lord of Light and never took his duties seriously because of them, until the day that Gregor Clegane killed Beric, his friend, and Thoros was called upon him to revive him. When he saw that it worked, Thoros's faith was restored.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 16:26 (three years ago) link

So you're saying there's a trial membership to get you hooked?

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:27 (three years ago) link

i was thinking there would be some focus on "king's blood" as being special and as a foreshadowing of future revelations but other than showing her sponging him down for a weird amount of time that didnt happen.

ryan, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:28 (three years ago) link

Yeah it would have been a little stronger if the "king's blood" had been a more significant element in the scene. I agree it certainly seemed that way with all of the sponging.

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:31 (three years ago) link

p funny how the show ppl were so adamant abt saying he was dead and not coming back and no one believed them and then he only stayed dead for less than two eps

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:35 (three years ago) link

real quality cliffhanger they pulled off there

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:35 (three years ago) link

alliser thorne's no good very bad day is about to get worse

nomar, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:35 (three years ago) link

stoked for jamie to kill the sparrows

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:37 (three years ago) link

they probably shouldn't have said anything. i think the fact that melisandre was there at the end of the season was the problem, like if she'd shown up at the beginning of this episode that would have been better for a cliffhanger. they should have kept him dead and brought back robb stark, complete with dire wolf head. that would freak out the squares even more.

nomar, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:37 (three years ago) link

i have real beef with the idea that whatshername the kennel sadist girl falls off the castle wall and is hella dead but sansa and reek leap off a 60 foot embankment and are taking off on foot unharmed

ulysses, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:42 (three years ago) link

didn't she land on dry ground and they jumped into a snow pile?

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 16:45 (three years ago) link

i was thinking there would be some focus on "king's blood" as being special and as a foreshadowing of future revelations but other than showing her sponging him down for a weird amount of time that didnt happen.

― ryan, Monday, May 2, 2016 12:28 PM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark

Waiting For Gendry

, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:46 (three years ago) link

i believe there was a snow pile down there, plus feet first vs head first

nomar, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:47 (three years ago) link

xp i don't think we saw what they jumped into at all and the clear implication was that they'd rather commit suicide than deal with psycho mantis again

ulysses, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:47 (three years ago) link

a john snow pile

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:48 (three years ago) link

the greyjoy/iron islands shit feels a bit removed from the main action but it's awesome doom metal action, polar opposite of the cafe del mar court intrigue poisoning sullen teen BS of dorne.

nomar, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:48 (three years ago) link

ya iron islands r tite

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:52 (three years ago) link

whos the guy who pushed the king off the bridge its his brother? whats the deal

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:53 (three years ago) link

his name is like euchalele or something

, Monday, 2 May 2016 16:54 (three years ago) link

eunuchalele actually

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 16:58 (three years ago) link

euron the crow's eye, he crazy, i like y'all's suggestions better though

if young slothrop don't trust ya i'm gon' rhyme ya (slothroprhymes), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:00 (three years ago) link

eunuch ukulele

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:01 (three years ago) link

idk why the karstarks would prefer to ramsay to roose

dynamicinterface, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:02 (three years ago) link

the show has three key supporting characters who are eunuchs a fourth might be pushing it

nomar, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:02 (three years ago) link

also is max von sydow's name really just 'three eyed crow' ?

dynamicinterface, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:03 (three years ago) link

need to balance it out with a guy who has four dicks imo

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:03 (three years ago) link

well it would make sense because eunuchs come in pairs

, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:03 (three years ago) link

the show has a bunch of Starks but that didn't stop them from bringing in Car-Starks

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:03 (three years ago) link

are car starks just starks who drive cars

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:04 (three years ago) link

really missing concepcion's ask the maester pieces this season

dynamicinterface, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:05 (three years ago) link

karstarks seem deeply unchill, their dead leader killed a couple lannister kids in S3, which seems more a ramsay move than a roose move.

nomar, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:05 (three years ago) link

p sure it's kars in westeros but yes that's the main difference

dynamicinterface, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:06 (three years ago) link

really missing concepcion's ask the maester pieces this season

― dynamicinterface, Monday, May 2, 2016 1:05 PM (10 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

apparently u cn receive them via the ringer newsletter theres a link to one upthread

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:06 (three years ago) link

also is max von sydow's name really just 'three eyed crow' ?

― dynamicinterface, Monday, May 2, 2016 1:03 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the book sez it's brynden rivers, i think, i wouldnt be surprised if they brought it up at some point

if young slothrop don't trust ya i'm gon' rhyme ya (slothroprhymes), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:08 (three years ago) link

books say that Hodor's real name is Walder too, not Willis as in the show

pratt truss it (dan m), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:11 (three years ago) link

whatutalkinabout walder

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:12 (three years ago) link

Karstarks' name is explained as basically some Starks that took control of the Karhold & made a portmanteau

pratt truss it (dan m), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:12 (three years ago) link

idk why the karstarks would prefer to ramsay to roose

I think Ramsay was giving the Karstarks a chance to climb up over the other big Northern houses.

karstarks seem deeply unchill, their dead leader killed a couple lannister kids in S3, which seems more a ramsay move than a roose move.

Jaime killed Rickard Karstark's sons (both of them?), and he was hellbent on avenging the loss of his heirs, it was pretty consistently characterized (perhaps more so in the books).

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:13 (three years ago) link

xpost they already have a Walder tho

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:14 (three years ago) link

subplot of the shit in the north is people who have been pissed at the starks for decades or centuries finding their chance to take revenge

nomar, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:14 (three years ago) link

I find it best not to pay attention to the North stuff too closely

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:15 (three years ago) link

really missing concepcion's ask the maester pieces this season

― dynamicinterface, Monday, May 2, 2016 1:05 PM (10 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

apparently u cn receive them via the ringer newsletter theres a link to one upthread

― lag∞n, Monday, May 2, 2016 1:06 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

The Ringer ‏@ringer 1h1 hour ago
Have questions about 'Game of Thrones' Episode 2? The Maester, @netw3rk, will answer them live on our Facebook page tomorrow at 3 p.m. ET!

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:15 (three years ago) link

xps thx for the tip

dynamicinterface, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:15 (three years ago) link

So in the "next on..." clips this week, they show a guy (pretty sure it's the lord of House Umber, the other big northern house that was mentioned being allied with the Boltons) telling Ramsay "I've brought you a present" - I guarantee it's Rickon Stark.
This means that Ramsay doesn't have to march on Castle Black, he can just send word he's got Rickon hostage and then Jon and Sansa will march on Winterfell. As foretold etc. etc.

Still wondering if/when we'll get to see Littlefinger again, or what role he has left to play.
Melisandre is also totally expendable now, I think? Obviously she might want to stick around to see what happens next but her main plot function has now been satisfied.

Also I like that the dragons were penned up in something like a garage - one little door for people, some other bigger door elsewhere for the dragons?

Lastly for now - I think the Ironborn role has to be to serve as the replacement fleet to get Daenaerys & Co. to Westeros. Possibly a little too neat that we burned her armada in Ep. 1 (why exactly, btw? what do the Sons of the Harpy care about keeping them from leaving? I haven't figured that one out) and then in Ep. 2 we re-introduce a seafaring pirate culture that was almost completely absent for a season & a half.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:18 (three years ago) link

I've heard they've altered book names just because they're too close to existing show characters and it would be confusing. Hence Willis.

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:19 (three years ago) link

The real identity of the three eyed crow is an unsolved mystery in the books as well, so I'm guessing they won't give it away right now. But yeah, Brynden Rivers is the most common guess (who is from the prequels and all. It's complicated, it seems)

Frederik B, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:21 (three years ago) link

Melisandre is also totally expendable now, I think? Obviously she might want to stick around to see what happens next but her main plot function has now been satisfied.

Yeah, she already reached her boob quota in episode 1. xxp

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:22 (three years ago) link

Melisandre presumably will have her faith restored and would fall into some kind of similar role she did with Stannis? Maybe not so manipulative going forward though. Just a guess.

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:22 (three years ago) link

can't wait for legendary mercenary swordsman Willis to show up

https://media.giphy.com/media/gk6r53AIv3wf6/giphy.gif

nomar, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:22 (three years ago) link

Another silly thing about the plot in the north is Ramsay killing Wanda Frey, and pretty openly, when like half his army is Freys. At least in the book it seems that way.

Frederik B, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:24 (three years ago) link

Melisandre is possibly one of the most powerful and useful characters if she is happy to keep resurrecting people. I've always believed that some of the much older characters will be revived.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:28 (three years ago) link

seems like a longshot to redeem melisandre.. she burned a little kid alive!

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Monday, 2 May 2016 17:33 (three years ago) link

davos giving her a peptalk was really funny to me

call all destroyer, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:39 (three years ago) link

having bringing back ppl from the dead be a thing seems bad from a storytelling pov, like time travel

lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:41 (three years ago) link

the whole "jon snow is really dead" stuff makes me thing it's gonna be a semantic thing--he's gonna be "dead" according to some kind of logic--what is dead may never die?

ryan, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:55 (three years ago) link

At this point, what "jon snow is really dead" stuff are you referring to?

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 17:58 (three years ago) link

the logic would be, he entered into contract with Night's Watch, LLC that was binding until death

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 2 May 2016 18:18 (three years ago) link

2x "whatchoo talkin' bout, Willis?" jokes in recaps so far

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 2 May 2016 18:21 (three years ago) link

Oh yes, I believe "his watch has ended".

Found that shaving the 3 eyed raven made his character look less like a mystical tree wizard and more like a senior citizen who fell in a hole and got himself trapped during a stroll through the park.

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:27 (three years ago) link

i am really enjoying hating this even more this season! it's so dumb, everyone in it is dumb.

the trouble with a show full of shocking surprises is that the end effect is that you're never shown anything important. all of the thinking and acting that makes anything happen is all happening off screen. instead of tyrion and the eunuch having another unfunny conversation about castration (does george rr martin know the difference between cock and balls btw), why don't we take a look at whoever it is burned the boats? you know nobody is going to expend any effort to figuring it out. besides saying "we're trying to find who did it"

goole, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:33 (three years ago) link

Perhaps there's a reason, and maybe the reason is that it's not important because it was obviously the Harpy

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:35 (three years ago) link

having bringing back ppl from the dead be a thing seems bad from a storytelling pov, like time travel

― lag∞n, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:41

Not when a story is about those things. I think resurrection was always meant to be a big part of the story, the whole ice/fire concept. There will probably always be some price paid for resurrection though. So far 3 characters have been revived (Jon, Beric, Khal Drogo) and other people have become white walkers. I don't think the witch who revived Drogo fits into the fire thing though.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:45 (three years ago) link

Not when a story is about those things. I think resurrection was always meant to be a big part of the story, the whole ice/fire concept.

I don't understand how this works as a "theme", could you spell it out for me

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:48 (three years ago) link

Resurrection via fire vs resurrection via ice I guess?

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:51 (three years ago) link

Coming back from the dead vs. reanimated as an ice zombie

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:51 (three years ago) link

that's a plot mechanism not a theme

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:55 (three years ago) link

a theme would be what this ostensible conflict in resurrection methods represents

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:55 (three years ago) link

The theme police they come to me in my thread

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 2 May 2016 18:56 (three years ago) link

Yeah I'm not sure how Robert is interpreting a connection between fire/ice and resurrection thematically.

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:57 (three years ago) link

I didn't say "about" as in strictly that sort of theme. Haven't got any solid theories about it but it's just my guess that the story is about the life forces of fire and ice and that includes resurrection.

I've also suspected for some time that the story really is another old fashioned wish fulfilment story about Bran and Arya (similar enough to your typical epic fantasy farm kids) rising to the top, but became about many other things.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 18:58 (three years ago) link

I don't think it's about anything tbh, the show is all machinations about power and that's it. could be set in any time or place, really, the dragons and zombies etc. are just window-dressing. The problem there is that power struggles are p boring in and of themselves, might as well watch nature films about apes bashing each other's brains in or something, same difference.

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:00 (three years ago) link

might as well watch nature films about apes bashing each other's brains in or something, same difference.

― Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 20:00

Do you watch lots of those too?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:04 (three years ago) link

don't forget the Mountain has also been brought back from death. kind of.

akm, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:04 (three years ago) link

So this guy is Balon Greyjoy's younger brother (http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/Euron_Greyjoy), but THIS guy is Balon's YOUNGEST brother (http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/Aeron_Greyjoy)?

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 2 May 2016 19:05 (three years ago) link

it doesn't even have anything particularly coherent to say about the nature of power or the pursuit of it either (ie, "power corrupts" or "power is awesome and revenge is totally worth it!" or similar), it just sets these various wind-up mechanisms into motion and then becomes about ways to keep the wheels spinning

xp

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:05 (three years ago) link

I do watch a lot of nature shows, they're great

xp

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:05 (three years ago) link

Oh yeah. Does anyone know if The Mountain ever actually died?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:07 (three years ago) link

afaik it's never clearly stated. pycelle is gonna give up on him but qyburn steps up and does his thing

pratt truss it (dan m), Monday, 2 May 2016 19:19 (three years ago) link

Euron Greyjoy (fifth son of Quellon Greyjoy) is played by Pilou Asbaek, who was born in 1982. Euron's youngest brother Aeron (eighth son of Quellon) is played by Michael Feast, who was born in 1946.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 2 May 2016 19:24 (three years ago) link

more like a senior citizen who fell in a hole and got himself trapped during a stroll through the park.

speak of ingmar bergman regular max von sydow with more respect you rude man!!!

if young slothrop don't trust ya i'm gon' rhyme ya (slothroprhymes), Monday, 2 May 2016 19:36 (three years ago) link

I'm hoping the story is really about the birth of democracy (end of the GoT) where the little guys get sick of being fucked over and revolt (perhaps with the help of Daenerys), but so far it seems more cynical than that.

schwantz, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:47 (three years ago) link

more like a senior citizen who fell in a hole and got himself trapped during a stroll through the park.

speak of ingmar bergman regular max von sydow with more respect you rude man!!!

― if young slothrop don't trust ya i'm gon' rhyme ya (slothroprhymes), Monday, May 2, 2016 3:36 PM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Wardrobe's fault. Acting is fine!

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:50 (three years ago) link

all the supernatural stuff gives the show some coherency, everyone facing the same epic struggles etc. in a way that wouldn't be possible in a less nonsense setting

ogmor, Monday, 2 May 2016 19:56 (three years ago) link

Is that what old people wear when they go for walks and fall down holes?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 20:08 (three years ago) link

Looked at some images of him from season 4 and he had long hair and a beard.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 2 May 2016 20:12 (three years ago) link

I'm hoping the story is really about the birth of democracy (end of the GoT) where the little guys get sick of being fucked over and revolt (perhaps with the help of Daenerys), but so far it seems more cynical than that.

― schwantz, 2. maj 2016 21:47 (33 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

The scene between Jaime and the Sparrows sorta was the first hint I've seen of that. Jaime turning around and looking at the men standing in front of the church windows was a pretty good visual.

Frederik B, Monday, 2 May 2016 20:24 (three years ago) link

the sparrows as a protestant reformation type thing which initiates a turn towards modernity would be genuinely interesting but im not sure they've laid enough groundwork for that on the show. i guess i could go read the wiki on the sparrows though...

ryan, Monday, 2 May 2016 20:29 (three years ago) link

the high sparrow is bernie.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 2 May 2016 20:30 (three years ago) link

lol, I had just typed out "At this point I can't even see the High Sparrow without automatically thinking «Bernie Sanders»."
I guess that makes Cersei the Hill, flanked by the Mountain.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Monday, 2 May 2016 20:32 (three years ago) link

you just know those hillary as cersei memes are coming, if they arent here already.

ryan, Monday, 2 May 2016 20:40 (three years ago) link

Mountain = Black voters?

schwantz, Monday, 2 May 2016 20:45 (three years ago) link

The Mountain is Goldman Sachs

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 2 May 2016 20:48 (three years ago) link

too big to fail

Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 2 May 2016 20:53 (three years ago) link

Jamie as the troublesome but charming ex she never should have slept with makes sense too tbh

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Monday, 2 May 2016 20:56 (three years ago) link

Reading Jon Snow's fate as a plea for Obama to return for a third term now too. I'm sorry.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Monday, 2 May 2016 21:01 (three years ago) link

so about the preview for the next ep, was bran and the 3ec peeping in on ned et al trying to rescue lyanna? does that mean we finally get to meet howland reed? and/or finally some confirmation or about jon's parents?

dynamicinterface, Monday, 2 May 2016 21:31 (three years ago) link

Most likely!

Evan, Monday, 2 May 2016 21:33 (three years ago) link

the sparrows as a protestant reformation type thing which initiates a turn towards modernity would be genuinely interesting but im not sure they've laid enough groundwork for that on the show.

there is some talk of the maesters aiming for a world free from magic/dragons/prophecy/white walkers which might also herald the beginning of the early modern era for our intrepid gang
I believe this hot intel comes from a character called Marvyn the Mage whose arrival we all eagerly anticipate

ogmor, Monday, 2 May 2016 21:41 (three years ago) link

I think they're laying a little ground work for shift to the early modern w/ Tyrion learning how to govern a city w/o unduly oppressing its occupants

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 21:50 (three years ago) link

Ramsey seems to represent a more ruthless early medieval or ancient order, where the new king would basically kill all of his relatives to remove legitimacy threats.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 21:52 (three years ago) link

that is a funny reading of history you have there

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 21:54 (three years ago) link

yes it is funny

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 2 May 2016 21:56 (three years ago) link

heh

just referring to the implication that history has been one long march from tyrannical oppression to our current glorious state of liberation

Οὖτις, Monday, 2 May 2016 22:03 (three years ago) link

thought this episode was rlly good, lots of shit happened, idk

Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Monday, 2 May 2016 23:10 (three years ago) link

The title of next week's episode is making me nervous

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 2 May 2016 23:12 (three years ago) link

it doesn't even have anything particularly coherent to say about the nature of power or the pursuit of it either (ie, "power corrupts" or "power is awesome and revenge is totally worth it!" or similar), it just sets these various wind-up mechanisms into motion and then becomes about ways to keep the wheels spinning

tbh i think this itself is a perfectly coherent thing to say about power, i preferred the show when half of it was various obscure schemes grinding together - all those conversations between varys and littlefinger where they dance around each other trying to avoid revealing anything. now that the show's version of power is much more of a blunt object i think it's become less interesting.

the lack of a plot buildup to jon's resurrection was a bit odd, it felt like there were a few directions they could have gone down but instead it was just "it would be good if jon snow wasn't dead, i wonder if that's possible" "eh let's give it a go"

Reading Jon Snow's fate as a plea for Obama to return for a third term now too. I'm sorry.
--human and working on getting beer (longneck)

seems reasonable tbh

if young slothrop don't trust ya i'm gon' rhyme ya (slothroprhymes), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 00:00 (three years ago) link

The theme police they come to me in my thread

very good

mick signals, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 00:04 (three years ago) link

"It" = the show, not power

Xp

Οὖτις, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 01:17 (three years ago) link

i don't remember what is up with the lizard woman but she looks like a doctor who character

Mordy, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 03:12 (three years ago) link

So in the "next on..." clips this week, they show a guy (pretty sure it's the lord of House Umber, the other big northern house that was mentioned being allied with the Boltons) telling Ramsay "I've brought you a present" - I guarantee it's Rickon Stark.

the House Umber dude is a captive of the Freys, iirc -- he's a tall gray-haired dude that's played by one of "those guys that are in lots of things". The present giver could be a relative? Don't think it's Rickon unless they're radically changing things from the books again ... which is possible.

sarahell, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 07:09 (three years ago) link

Did Benioff and Weiss watch the scene in The Force Awakens where a father and son meet at the halfway point of a narrow bridge above a vast chasm, which ends with the father falling to his death, and think, 'damn, don't we have the same scene in our next season?'

painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture (DavidM), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 10:28 (three years ago) link

A similar scene, I should say. Brothers, instead of father and son, in GoT's case.

painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture (DavidM), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 10:30 (three years ago) link

You're right, it's Smalljon Umber, the heir, according to a bunch of GoT wikis. And who is dead in the books, apparently.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 12:03 (three years ago) link

i enjoyed this week's ep p well, but i do think this show has prob slid into being a kind of walking dead "why do i watch this" compulsion. last season was p crap as i recall.

max von sydow was good.

i also liked that they put that little shit who stabbed jon snow in the cells.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 12:21 (three years ago) link

I think it's pretty obvious why you watch this - to see Ramsay get murked

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 12:26 (three years ago) link

don't feel as keen for him to die as i did with joffrey. tbh would prefer sam to die.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 12:33 (three years ago) link

lol who?

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 15:23 (three years ago) link

you had me doubting his name was sam there. he is still alive, right? on the way... somewhere, with tilly.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 19:48 (three years ago) link

there's gonna be some lol-some dysfunctional Tarley family action

sarahell, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 20:14 (three years ago) link

haha yes he's still alive, just hasn't been seen or heard from since Commander Jon sent him to Oldtown to get his PhD

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 20:14 (three years ago) link

he's headed to Maesterville to figure out if there's a way to defeat the ice zombies and will end up dealing with his overbearing dad

sarahell, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 20:15 (three years ago) link

I hope that happens this season, should be pretty cool

sacral intercourse conducive to vegetal luxuriance (askance johnson), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 20:21 (three years ago) link

Since Euron didn't turn out to be played by Ian McShane, he's got to be Old Man Tarly, which is gonna rule.

pratt truss it (dan m), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 21:04 (three years ago) link

nope he's a priest, James Faulkner is Sam's dad

Clay, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 21:06 (three years ago) link

yeah mcshane was in the news a while back dropping spoilers and it is clear from that who he plays. it is only a bit part.

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 21:07 (three years ago) link

FUCK

pratt truss it (dan m), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 21:09 (three years ago) link

McShane is the priest that saves the Hound iirc

sarahell, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 21:18 (three years ago) link

Is Richard e grant coming up in this or did I dream that?

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 21:22 (three years ago) link

I thought McShane was going to be that magic-loving maester that Sam bumps into.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 21:42 (three years ago) link

MARVYN THE MAGE

ogmor, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 21:44 (three years ago) link

Priest that saves the Hound? Spoiler?

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 22:21 (three years ago) link

It's just a book theory. People want the Hound to be saved. Nobody knows.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 22:37 (three years ago) link

The Hound is dead.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 22:39 (three years ago) link

it will be conclusively resolved by the show ala robert strange

ogmor, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 22:43 (three years ago) link

*strong

I'm tired

ogmor, Tuesday, 3 May 2016 22:43 (three years ago) link

Is Richard e grant coming up in this or did I dream that?

He is - hes the one *I* was hoping'd be Sams dad but apparently his is also a bit part, playing the head of some troupe of fucking travelling mummers, wtf.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Tuesday, 3 May 2016 23:14 (three years ago) link

i thought common folk having a good time was forbidden in westeros

Well you can have a good time but a resurrected warmonger of one stripe or another will have your brains in the next scene

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 02:51 (three years ago) link

I did like that peasant guy telling the story about how he got his huge wang out and waved it at Cersei.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 03:19 (three years ago) link

Yeah, oddly enough! It was trivial, vile, and stupid, but the actor's plummy delivery actually kind of saved it. I'll wait and see whether that has some kind of orthogonal plot implication for Ser Strong & the King's Landing commoner uprising situation; it could also just have been included just so we have an idea what Strong is capable of, to set up the kingsguard pantswetting scene that followed.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 03:32 (three years ago) link

One thing about this show that has changed over the years is that I definitely look for the Chekhov's Gun in every scene. I think that's less a testament to my "plot detective" skills as it is their increasing efficiency at covering a truly massive amount of story information within a different medium and in very limited time.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 03:38 (three years ago) link

maybe Thoros of Myr will come across that dude's corpse lying in its own drunken piss and resurrect him, and it'll turn out he really does have the biggest johnson in Westeros, and Azor Ahai, oh my

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 03:41 (three years ago) link

lol

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 04:11 (three years ago) link

that's not "plummy"

conrad, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 06:17 (three years ago) link

that whole scene was p weird, had the feeling of a kind of stereotypical football yob

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 10:14 (three years ago) link

hi thx for great thread! i watched this and it's pretty good, esp if you are a bit confused like me
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bltw7dIO_V8

video2000, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 12:27 (three years ago) link

sorry if this has been asked before but, did anyone find the Zombie Mountain's introduction a bit... abrupt? Last I remember seeing him, he was still pretty much being operated on, now he's just following Cersei around and she's all 'nbd'? Did I miss something?

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 13:08 (three years ago) link

Pycelle introduced him to Cersei when she completed her walk of shame in the final episode of last season.

groovypanda, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 13:10 (three years ago) link

i'm p sure you mean qyburn

dynamicinterface, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 13:20 (three years ago) link

can someone remind me who all the Dorne people were in the last episode and what relation they are to the prancing guy who got his head busted in?

kinder, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 13:29 (three years ago) link

His girlfriend and various daughters of various lovers. The guy who got stabbed was his brother Doran.

Evan, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 13:50 (three years ago) link

Did I miss something?

he picked her up and carried her in the season finale

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 14:03 (three years ago) link

I liked how Tyrion spent all that time confirming that the dragons were cool with Missandei and then decided to go in alone with only a terrified Varys as backup.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 14:35 (three years ago) link

And why did he ask to be punched in the face if he had an idea like that again? It went fine!

I am using your worlds, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 15:23 (three years ago) link

He's so going to get punched in the face.

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 15:29 (three years ago) link

It was a really stupid risk.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Wednesday, 4 May 2016 15:30 (three years ago) link

needed to go down like that to maybe support ~a theory~ i guess?

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 15:41 (three years ago) link

Ah yeah a workmate floated that theory y'day, it hadnt at all occurred to me (but I havent read the books). Makes hella lot of sense tho.

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 23:38 (three years ago) link

Tyrion would make an excellent dragon jockey

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 23:53 (three years ago) link

it would be kinda sweet if daenerys, jon snow, and tyrion all ended up being dragon heroes at the end because it would add some additional mystery and suspense to the ending - would they turn on each other in a last-minute bid for power, or cooperate together in power, or dismantle the power structure together entirely (ie the "breaking the wheel" that daenerys mentioned at some point in season 5)

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 23:57 (three years ago) link

as one of the millions of people who correctly predicted (inside their head, not publicly) that the final shot of the episode featuring jon snow's revival would end with him opening his eyes in terror followed closely by a blackout and the credits, i just want to note at this early point that i hope the last shot of the last episode of game of thrones is a non sequitur cut to the red woman exposing her boobs one last time for no reason

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Wednesday, 4 May 2016 23:59 (three years ago) link

Withered or still in the flush of hottness?

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Thursday, 5 May 2016 00:14 (three years ago) link

imho "breaking the wheel" will involve the end of magic / supernatural stuff, like the elves & wizards leaving Middle Earth at the end of the Third Age

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Thursday, 5 May 2016 00:20 (three years ago) link

xpost doesn't really matter, just one last flash of any sort would be appropriate

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Thursday, 5 May 2016 00:20 (three years ago) link

whats confusing to me that these characters are all children of some seriously fucked up people that we're supposed to like? or something? I guess the key is theyre all breaking with the past and making something new..

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Thursday, 5 May 2016 00:26 (three years ago) link

Jon's parents aren't bad!

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Thursday, 5 May 2016 00:27 (three years ago) link

depends on who you think his parents are!

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Thursday, 5 May 2016 00:34 (three years ago) link

Yeah and the Starks were all decent people werent they?

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Thursday, 5 May 2016 01:44 (three years ago) link

Relatively

Evan, Thursday, 5 May 2016 02:10 (three years ago) link

I miss the Hound now. Would be great if he came back but his last scene was great.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Thursday, 5 May 2016 11:20 (three years ago) link

Thought this episode was a lot better at Getting Things Going, though there is still so much character juggling happening that there is no easy way to fit everything into each episode. You can tell they really need to tie up a lot of loose ends to get everyone facing the right direction for whatever they have in mind, but that's not a bad thing, as long as they keep the pace up.

I thought this and the last one seemed a little more TV-y, in terms of pace, beats and punchlines, which is probably for the best, since it is TV.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 5 May 2016 12:03 (three years ago) link

depends on who you think his parents are!

I was trying to be coy here, but whoever his parents are, none of them were sociopaths or psychopaths on the order or Aerys or Tywin.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Thursday, 5 May 2016 16:47 (three years ago) link

I just recently learned that Theon is Lily Allen's brother.

dan selzer, Thursday, 5 May 2016 20:52 (three years ago) link

they all look years younger than they ever did on the show, did reading the books as preparation rob them of their youthful innocence

Who is the guy on the far right?

tobo73, Friday, 6 May 2016 02:10 (three years ago) link

kit Harrington innit?

Interesting. No, wait, the other thing: tedious. (Trayce), Friday, 6 May 2016 02:16 (three years ago) link

Yeah totally

tobo73, Friday, 6 May 2016 02:27 (three years ago) link

http://youtu.be/Sr2Grfi3lFg

AlanSmithee, Friday, 6 May 2016 09:14 (three years ago) link

That's so weird.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Friday, 6 May 2016 11:53 (three years ago) link

noooooo shaggydog!

Van Horn Street, Monday, 9 May 2016 03:32 (three years ago) link

In the flashbacks, it's sorta come back to bite them that they've aged everyone up. The young man who plays young Ned seems many years off from becoming Sean Bean. Also, way to stop before the good part :(

Frederik B, Monday, 9 May 2016 09:09 (three years ago) link

I'm watching this again, and it's pretty good, but honestly GoT ahead of GRRM feels more zombie-like than Veep without Arnucci. The language is off, the details are off. They're probably better than GRRM on plot, though, so that's why I'm watching. And for a couple of the characters. Which is fine. But I'm also reading A Clash of Kings at the moment, and man, when GRRM is at his best he can make up an anecdote that makes you want to waste hours digging into backhistory.

Frederik B, Monday, 9 May 2016 10:32 (three years ago) link

Wasn't he only writing like an episode a season before anyway?

I hardly feel like this show's dialogue has fallen off a cliff - you can't fall off a cliff when you're already dying at the bottom of it.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Monday, 9 May 2016 10:39 (three years ago) link

i was curious how they would work in that background material--and i suppose this way is as good as any since all options i can think of seem clumsy--but i have a feeling a lot of viewers are confused about the significance of what/who Bran is seeing.

it almost feel like a limitation of cinematic/tv fantasy since the deepest pleasure of the genre (imo) is finding yourself obsessed with the world-building deep fake-historical stuff and im just not sure how you can pull that off in a satisfying way on tv.

ryan, Monday, 9 May 2016 12:48 (three years ago) link

though i guess at this point we might assume bran touring the past could have been part of martin's plan but eh

ryan, Monday, 9 May 2016 12:49 (three years ago) link

loving max von sydow. he oozes dignity in a show that isn't exactly brimming with it.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Monday, 9 May 2016 12:57 (three years ago) link

he plays the same character in all his films

, Monday, 9 May 2016 12:59 (three years ago) link

young ned stark was really poorly cast imo

, Monday, 9 May 2016 12:59 (three years ago) link

definitely.

fair enough on von sydow, though that's a p common crime with actors. he's still good at it.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Monday, 9 May 2016 13:01 (three years ago) link

we sure learned a lot about howland reed. def worth the wait

dynamicinterface, Monday, 9 May 2016 13:02 (three years ago) link

who were they fighting? what's in the tower? i forgot from hte books

, Monday, 9 May 2016 13:16 (three years ago) link

arthur dayne. lyanna is in the tower giving birth to jon snow presumably

dynamicinterface, Monday, 9 May 2016 13:18 (three years ago) link

baby ned seemed v young to have already fathered rob tho

dynamicinterface, Monday, 9 May 2016 13:29 (three years ago) link

The scene with Samwell and Gilly on the boat was likely the worst single scene I've seen in modern TV

And there was an actual scene where Tyrion Lannister is talking about how nothing is happening and how boring everything is

fgti, Monday, 9 May 2016 13:48 (three years ago) link

What makes it so significantly bad to you / how does it stand out? Isn't it just (arguably) one of many occasional clumsily written and acted scenes?

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:02 (three years ago) link

Baby Ned is supposed to be 20, which: hm. And the scene is supposed to take place just 15 years before the main events of the series.

Frederik B, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:16 (three years ago) link

And there was an actual scene where Tyrion Lannister is talking about how nothing is happening and how boring everything is

otm. the scene was almost admirable in its honesty because it's basically the writers admitting that the characters in the daenerys storyline are one-dimensional and incapable of interesting conversations. they have no interior lives. so tyrion is forced to sit around and wait for another well-developed white actor to show up so that he can relax.

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Monday, 9 May 2016 14:17 (three years ago) link

xpost at this point I'm just glad they aren't recasting all the characters each episode

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 9 May 2016 14:18 (three years ago) link

To be fair I guess it's tough to justify someone like Grey Worm having a ton of personality based on his programmed upbringing as a mindless super-soldier.

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:29 (three years ago) link

i find myself only really engaged in the stark plots as they stand right now, and reintroducing bran and rickon this season means there's more of those. i hope that the flashbacks actually lead to some kind of resolution of some historical question but i could see it easily being dragged out for at least the remainder of the season. some positive motion in aryas plot line was also encouraging. Im really glad we didn't have to go to dorne this week and i hope for many happy returns

geometry-stabilized craft (art), Monday, 9 May 2016 14:32 (three years ago) link

There are so many pointless characters just hanging around at this stage but Grey Worm is easily one of the worst.

Matt DC, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:35 (three years ago) link

the bummer abt snow leaving the night watch is that now they have another way dole out screen time to another cohort of variously developed characters (witch, davos, watch vs snow)

geometry-stabilized craft (art), Monday, 9 May 2016 14:40 (three years ago) link

Im really glad we didn't have to go to dorne this week and i hope for many happy returns

That fight between Ned and Darth Maul took place in Dorne iirc

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 9 May 2016 14:43 (three years ago) link

A technicality, as obviously art was happy we didn't visit the Dorne Hyatt resort courtyard view we're used to visiting.

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:50 (three years ago) link

I am finding both Silicon Valley and Veep's politics and jockeying for power much more interesting than this atm

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:51 (three years ago) link

does anyone here actually like the show? i have no idea why, if everyone thinks it's so terrible, people are still watching and chiming in here only to complain endlessly. it's a seriously sad state of affairs when i have to go to reddit to have an actual, decent conversation about what's going on. i think i'm done with this thread, there's really no point to checking in here.

Mad Piratical (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 9 May 2016 14:52 (three years ago) link

This is the second episode of the season! We're allowed discontent before not watching the show outright!

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:56 (three years ago) link

I am actually enjoying it - I welcome discussion. Though I also find it silly in places, I still watch it with enthusiasm.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Monday, 9 May 2016 14:58 (three years ago) link

it's an extremely addictive, fitfully entertaining, and mostly poorly written and badly plotted show. we cover it all here!

ryan, Monday, 9 May 2016 14:59 (three years ago) link

I like the show more than I used to! I am having trouble discussing it, though, since it's a bit of a mess of book and tv in my head atm.

Frederik B, Monday, 9 May 2016 15:00 (three years ago) link

I can't figure out what to think about the scenes in Kings Landing, for example, since in my head Jamie is in the Riverlands, and nothing makes sense with him there... Why don't Kevan trust him?

Frederik B, Monday, 9 May 2016 15:02 (three years ago) link

I enjoy it. Although I have to agree with what some poster upthread (cant remember who) who pointed out that a lot of these stories are inconsequential (and pretty meaningless) as its likely that its going to be a dragons v white walkers showdown in the end really.

Neptune Bingo (Michael B), Monday, 9 May 2016 15:04 (three years ago) link

xpost I assume blames Jamie and Circe for fucking everything up for the family

From what I've heard there's a plotline involving Kevan in the books that seems pretty unlikely to occur on the show given where a certain character is right now

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 9 May 2016 15:05 (three years ago) link

I do enjoy the show a lot and for me throwing out a lot of dumb theories and jokes is way more fun than going scriptwriters' workshop on every episode as we usually do here

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 9 May 2016 15:07 (three years ago) link

That's the point of the entire show, that the power struggle is a silly inconsequential fixation of the rich houses/names that distracts from the looming threat of "winter" (the white walker zombie armies).

xxp

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 15:10 (three years ago) link

whether i actually like this show is a question i have been grappling w for yrs tbh. i genuinely want to know how the plot is resolved for a handful of characters and would be completely fine with never hearing anything by way of resolution for the rest. i am, to some degree, a sucker for fantasy type action-y shows and this still manages to deliver satisfaction on that front pretty regularly. there's a lot i have found difficult with got though from stuff as basic as fluff plots and too many characters to more fundamental issues with the gratuitous nudity/sexual violence and grrm's portrayals of women in the books and translated to the show. i find it difficult to recommend to ppl who haven't been following for yrs bc i don't know if i believe it's worth the time investment. that having been said, via some combo of gambler's fallacy and aforementioned weakness for the genre/investment in the handful of plots, i find myself returning every week

geometry-stabilized craft (art), Monday, 9 May 2016 15:22 (three years ago) link

That's the point of the entire show, that the power struggle is a silly inconsequential fixation of the rich houses/names that distracts from the looming threat of "winter" (the white walker zombie armies).

speaking of this, here's a simple question - what is jon snow doing right now? it seems likely that he'll head south with the wildlings to winterfell, based off of the scene with ramsey and the guy who says fook a lot earlier in the episode. and then the red woman hinted that he would be the king in her conversation with him about 10 seconds after he came back to life. but what is his goal? to head south, unite everyone in kings landing somehow, and then prepare for the zombie battle?

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Monday, 9 May 2016 15:39 (three years ago) link

Yeah I guess he'll come to realize that his purpose is to rally everyone he can and spread the news about global warming the white walkers now that he isn't restricted to doing so from the nights watch.

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 15:47 (three years ago) link

I thought the actor for young Ned was very good! Instantly recognizable as the character he's supposed to be (although tbf that's mostly because of the haircut), and definitely not too young looking to play 20. I guess we haven't really seen him actually act though, so it's too early to pass judgement.

I do really like that they're going into the backstory from decades past, since GRRM fleshed it out so much already, and using Bran's visions as a framing device is kind of a cool way that.

Dan I., Monday, 9 May 2016 15:48 (three years ago) link

Yeah, and young Ned may not be needed beyond Bran's second trip to the tower of joy, so even if he's not great it won't be a huge issue. However there's nothing really worrying me about it, though.

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 15:50 (three years ago) link

i don't care what young ned looks like as long as he gives us some answers

geometry-stabilized craft (art), Monday, 9 May 2016 15:56 (three years ago) link

stick around thermo, though i feel the same way about this thread sometimes. anyway i like this show a lot and always have, since at its best it's genuinely great and at its worst it's just sort of eye rolling but still fun for the fantasy elements.

RIP Alliser, you were pretty miserable but at least you weren't Olly.

nomar, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:02 (three years ago) link

so do we know what Missandei means by "the Masters speak only one language?" What is Tyrion going to say when he spams every other city in Slaver's Bay?

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 16:02 (three years ago) link

whether i actually like this show is a question i have been grappling w for yrs

I laughed. I don't know if you intended the level of grave seriousness and torment I imagined.

This is my favourite show. It's the only drama I still follow. It's very uneven in all respects but I unashamedly love it and still get excited about the next episode.

I'm guessing a lot of people here watch with friends and family without actually intending to watch it, but I've seen 70% of Big Bang Theory that way and have never went to the thread to complain about how harrowing that was for me.

Some of the dialogue in this episode has been making me worry. Varys just doesn't seem himself.

Was Arya caught with poisons or was that some test she was doing?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:03 (three years ago) link

from the looks of it, a girl passed a test

nomar, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:05 (three years ago) link

a girl can now take AP Chemistry

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:07 (three years ago) link

the poisons stuff was to train acuity in touch, smell etc. to go along with the daredevil sonar fighting

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 16:16 (three years ago) link

I like how the evil maester was able to co-opt varys entire spy network by giving little kids candy

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Monday, 9 May 2016 16:18 (three years ago) link

When you see people constantly show up to a thread for years to pick it apart and/or complain about it, that means we're all fans that are deeply invested in the story and hold it to high standards. When it doesn't meet expectations we get upset at it and we keep watching it.

ILX also has this superiority thing where we all want to remind each other that we don't find the writing or acting satisfactory. However, even reddit can't stomach the sand snakes for instance.

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:38 (three years ago) link

they're bad! Badly acted, badly written and very silly.

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:41 (three years ago) link

I think theres been quite a few people who say it sucks and they don't know why they keep watching.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:44 (three years ago) link

I agree that young Ned was perfectly fine. I was wowed by the guy who played Dayne, though -- double-handed long-sword ninja! Except he's supposed to have a single huge broadsword in the books, but whatevs, the show version is clearly a player.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 9 May 2016 16:44 (three years ago) link

I laughed. I don't know if you intended the level of grave seriousness and torment I imagined.

when u watch the game of thrones, u win or u die

geometry-stabilized craft (art), Monday, 9 May 2016 16:44 (three years ago) link

I think theres been quite a few people who say it sucks and they don't know why they keep watching.

― Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, May 9, 2016 12:44 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Cause they feel guilty about the fact that they're invested?

And yes the sand snakes are objectively terrible I wasn't saying anything contrary to that.

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:46 (three years ago) link

the dialogue is just really exceptionally bad this season. the scene where onion knight was talking to jon and telling him he needs to fight on was terrible. tyrion being bored w/ worm dude. sam having boring chit-chat on stormy boat. brann having boring arguments w/ tree-man. cercei and jaime having boring attempts to join the council. head sparrow giving boring speech about virtue to tommen.

Mordy, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:48 (three years ago) link

Are you going to watch the next episode?

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:52 (three years ago) link

yeah, i've already seen all the other episodes - i'm pot committed at this pt.

Mordy, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:55 (three years ago) link

they could have gotten a lot more mileage out of Jon Snow's return tbh, like more of a reaction from the wildlings and certainly some kind of reaction from Alliser and co. i was looking forward to a moment where they bring them out for execution and their executioner is...whoa Jon Snow omgwtf. or some single moment where his return is more of a big deal. i am totally cool with him coming back but i think they sort of fucked it up a bit. looking forward to the bastard and whoever joins him facing off against the Bolton crew though.

nomar, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:57 (three years ago) link

i'm personally enjoying Bran and the ghost of christmas past and their tour of old timey westeros. i thought the ned casting was good, he had the bean look.

nomar, Monday, 9 May 2016 16:59 (three years ago) link

like more of a reaction from the wildlings

Hey Tormund's pecker zinger was plenty good!

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 9 May 2016 17:02 (three years ago) link

Yeah it was really weird that they didn't react much to the reborn Jon.

I did like how Tormund looked like he was about to fall asleep during the execution.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 9 May 2016 17:11 (three years ago) link

Tormund's Peckerzinger is Finland's #1 Cookie

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 17:13 (three years ago) link

Nothing on this thread is as bad as the S6 season premiere open thread on Balloon Juice: https://www.balloon-juice.com/2016/04/24/winter-is-coming-2/

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 17:19 (three years ago) link

I stopped watching this show around last season and only check this thread to make sure I'm not missing anything lol

Οὖτις, Monday, 9 May 2016 17:22 (three years ago) link

they could have gotten a lot more mileage out of Jon Snow's return tbh, like more of a reaction from the wildlings and certainly some kind of reaction from Alliser and co. i was looking forward to a moment where they bring them out for execution and their executioner is...whoa Jon Snow omgwtf. or some single moment where his return is more of a big deal. i am totally cool with him coming back but i think they sort of fucked it up a bit. looking forward to the bastard and whoever joins him facing off against the Bolton crew though.

― nomar, Monday, May 9, 2016 12:57 PM (41 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Agreed, all a bit rushed and anti-climactic. Not upset with it really, just kind of surprised. Even up until the end when Jon exits the scene more like he needs to take a shit really bad and less like he handed over the responsibility of lord commander over to his very best still living friend (besides Sam). I'm aware they were showing how that execution was the last straw for him but the "I died technically so this is allowed" loop hole should have maybe been a bit more accented?

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 17:47 (three years ago) link

Jaime and Cersei are totally going to have Ser Strong kill everyone on the Small Council. Kevan should have kept his ideas to himself.

Smalljon Umber is totally playing Ramsay with the offer of hostages. Ramsay's dead before the end of the season.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:03 (three years ago) link

What makes it so significantly bad to you / how does it stand out? Isn't it just (arguably) one of many occasional clumsily written and acted scenes?

Oh man, two baby shots? No revelations except that "Old Town Is The Most Beautiful City In Westeros".

I hate this show.

I watched the first season, was transfixed. I read the first three books, and realized in Book 2 that I had no interest in Daenarys or Jon Snow and started skipping their chapters. I read online that Books 4 and 5 were bad, so I didn't read them and decided to let HBO read them for me.

I've gone from "caring about all but one character" to "not caring about any". All of the potential plot seeds that were sown in Book 1 went nowhere. Too many competing mythologies and religions rubbing up against each other.

I privately hold that GRR Martin is a faker, he's Dan Brown without an ending, that there is no arc in place, that he's been winging it, and that there will be no resolution to this series. The show will be cancelled next season and no further books will be published. All the cool theories that people've come up with online (i.e. Arya will band together with White Walkers and there will be a climactic battle of ice zombies vs. dragons) seem cool but unplausible given GRR Martin's glacial pace and feeling that we're treading water. I watch the show now to complain about it and to watch it expire, or perhaps settle into an long-running ecumenically written soap opera.

I did notice that the score changed dramatically this past episode and believe the budget was possibly cut for this season.. I think more perceptive people have noticed similar things about the CGI

fgti, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:03 (three years ago) link

congrats to Eddison on his new position, btw

Van Horn Street, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:05 (three years ago) link

i suspect we will remain at the wall for a bit next episode (looked like sansa was arriving there in the preview?) but i suspect we won't see it again until the white walkers overrun it at some point.

nomar, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:06 (three years ago) link

Xpost score for season 1 was cheap sounding and dimwitted, iirc he did a lot better for season 2 and 3 but I haven't noticed it much these last few, other than the incessant fucking taiko drums, and L Shankar style violin whenever we are overseas

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:23 (three years ago) link

I'm so glad Natalia Tena / Tonks / Osha is back on the show btw.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:26 (three years ago) link

Yeah but she's in nightmare city now :/

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:28 (three years ago) link

I privately hold that GRR Martin is a faker

You have failed this adverb

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 18:28 (three years ago) link

That's probably true about GRRM TBH.

Matt DC, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:31 (three years ago) link

how the fuck did they make those big ass stallion sculptures btw?
please note i don't actually want an answer to that question

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:37 (three years ago) link

magic!

Οὖτις, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:44 (three years ago) link

the way they scale in this shot they are fucking gargantuan and kind of impossible to imagine how they would be erected (especially by a nomadic tribe... that has a capital city?)
http://static6.techinsider.io/image/571fddbe52bcd022008bf1c5-1920-1080/vaes%20dothrak%20overview%20season%20six%20game%20of%20thrones.png

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:50 (three years ago) link

where's waldo bonus points for the one white lady in that shot

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:51 (three years ago) link

why did umber even bother to bring osha w/rickon?

dynamicinterface, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:55 (three years ago) link

Some of the things in this shot are small..

Andrew Farrell, Monday, 9 May 2016 18:56 (three years ago) link

Isn't Vaes Dothrak where they also bring all their slaves and captives? presumably at some point some Khal got the idea to raid him some braavosi caravans or something and bring back some ore, a few sculptors and architects, et voila

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:26 (three years ago) link

Did they show the statues when we went to Vaes Dothrak in S1?

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:28 (three years ago) link

yeah and they were nowhere near that size; that's part of my beef
http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/gameofthrones/images/0/0d/Dothrakhorses.jpg/revision/latest%3Fcb%3D20150924094615

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 19:29 (three years ago) link

wow they were MUCH smaller! damn

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:30 (three years ago) link

statues were recast obv

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:32 (three years ago) link

prob by daario

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 19:34 (three years ago) link

They just raided and stole some bigger horse statues, nbd.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:37 (three years ago) link

hardmode vaes dothrak

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:38 (three years ago) link

If pulling explanations out of our asses helps, then perhaps ancient Dothraki cultures were more advanced, and all that remains to show for it are those giant statues.

Evan, Monday, 9 May 2016 19:50 (three years ago) link

maybe the producers wanted it to look bigger so they made it bigger

ulysses, Monday, 9 May 2016 19:56 (three years ago) link

maybe the other entrance has smaller horses

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:58 (three years ago) link

man dire wolves were just garbage-tier in this all along

Dadjokke (Sgt. Biscuits), Monday, 9 May 2016 19:58 (three years ago) link

they could have gotten a lot more mileage out of Jon Snow's return tbh, like more of a reaction from the wildlings and certainly some kind of reaction from Alliser and co. i was looking forward to a moment where they bring them out for execution and their executioner is...whoa Jon Snow omgwtf. or some single moment where his return is more of a big deal. i am totally cool with him coming back but i think they sort of fucked it up a bit. looking forward to the bastard and whoever joins him facing off against the Bolton crew though.

― nomar, Monday, May 9, 2016 12:57 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

yeah, back one episdoe, gone the next, easily could have drawn it out a bit more. but i guess drawing things out is the last thing they want to do given how many plotlines they have to wrap up

, Monday, 9 May 2016 20:45 (three years ago) link

also seems weird that he came back without any, uh, impairments, other than being a bit more pale? idk i recall in the books that when dondarrion the lightning knight or w/e that is comes back it's pretty obvious that he's a zombie. like big gaping wound on his neck. or something.

, Monday, 9 May 2016 20:46 (three years ago) link

having Dayne wield two swords was a total Darth Maul move (props to whoever mentioned that upthread)

, Monday, 9 May 2016 20:47 (three years ago) link

lol ulysses

xp

Οὖτις, Monday, 9 May 2016 20:48 (three years ago) link

Dondarrion looked like a zombie because he incurred injuries from actual physical combat; fortunately for Jon, he was stabbed in his torso, not his pretty face.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 9 May 2016 20:55 (three years ago) link

http://i.imgur.com/TrmsdG8.jpg

, Monday, 9 May 2016 21:05 (three years ago) link

so we're just not gonna get Lady Stonheart, huh?

ian, Monday, 9 May 2016 21:21 (three years ago) link

I thought the showrunners had already said no to that...?

Οὖτις, Monday, 9 May 2016 21:24 (three years ago) link

So does Jon just have big, open, non-bleeding wounds?

schwantz, Monday, 9 May 2016 22:03 (three years ago) link

i guess there's a lack of reference for how the logic of revivification works on the show? like it's either the Mountain or Jon Snow, at least going by the tv show? we don't have the benefit of Dondarion and Lady Stoneheart like we do in the books?

i guess this is the first season where book-readers don't really benefit from the books since it's gone so off course, now we're in the same boat as the rest of you fuckers

, Monday, 9 May 2016 22:11 (three years ago) link

Dondarion was in the show

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 9 May 2016 22:12 (three years ago) link

Can the reticence around Howland Reed's role at the Tower of Joy be explained solely because he stabbed a dude in the back (of the throat), and everyone was kind of embarrassed by this breach in protocol?

xxp Dondarrion was on the show a couple times, once before and once after revivifying. Also, BD and JS seem to be reborn because of religion, whereas the Mountain comes back through evil science (that's how I'm reading it anyway).

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 9 May 2016 22:13 (three years ago) link

oh dang i forgot all about that

, Monday, 9 May 2016 22:18 (three years ago) link

xpost ha always thought it was Howlin' Reed

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 9 May 2016 22:19 (three years ago) link

I read something that suggested Lady Stoneheart is still gonna happen

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 9 May 2016 22:20 (three years ago) link

Howlin' Mad Reed!

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Monday, 9 May 2016 22:21 (three years ago) link

If I hadnt read all those book speculations about Ned, Howland and the jon snow thing, I'dve had no fucking idea what I was watching with the Bran flashback bit last night.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 9 May 2016 23:16 (three years ago) link

Like I dont know if its just me, but it feels like they more and more rely on people being backstory speculation nerds?

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 9 May 2016 23:16 (three years ago) link

I think the Bransposition is providing exactly as much information as they want you to have

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 9 May 2016 23:25 (three years ago) link

Thats a good point, given that stuff *is* just speculation. I'm terrible at going "what the hells going on?" in movies when *thats precisely the point*.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 9 May 2016 23:39 (three years ago) link

my money's on rickon to win the game of thrones

We havent heard from Littlefinger in a while...

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 9 May 2016 23:50 (three years ago) link

he's in the preview for next week

, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 00:15 (three years ago) link

Smalljon Umber is totally playing Ramsay with the offer of hostages. Ramsay's dead before the end of the season.

thought the exact same, the tone of the scene wasn't tragic or hammed up enough for osha and rickon to really be in the shit. shame about shaggz tho.

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 01:01 (three years ago) link

Could it be a random wolf's head? It didn't look that big.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 01:06 (three years ago) link

Wtf with the fart escaping pycelle's ass when he turns and sees franken-gregor?

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 01:12 (three years ago) link

...I missed that! (you sure it wasnt just a chair squeak?)

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 01:19 (three years ago) link

fart was funny. and ya umber is totally playing ramsay. why else would he have brought osha along. she's just a rando wildling. i wonder if they know ramsay is gonna try his usually shit on her and she's gonna shiv him

dynamicinterface, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 01:21 (three years ago) link

def was a toot

dynamicinterface, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 01:21 (three years ago) link

ramsey getting got is the perfect end to this season and to begin what I hope is the fucking end of the series

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 02:17 (three years ago) link

I know right, like I keep telling people how stupid the show is and to please let me leave the living room or change the channel and it's like they can't even hear me. I just keep watching, unable to walk away.

http://lovelace-media.imgix.net/uploads/273/1eeff950-ed5f-0133-243e-0e1b1c96d76b.jpg

Evan, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 02:30 (three years ago) link

Can I ask what Lady Stoneheart's function is in the books? I mean, it sounds like a cool idea but where's the necessity in it?

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 09:34 (three years ago) link

Remember this is extremely spoilery

Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 09:36 (three years ago) link

I think many book readers are asking the same question.
xpost

That was a perfectly decent episode, I thought. It looked very handsome, and all the segments worked pretty well. Glad Arya's making some progress.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 09:37 (three years ago) link

There's a couple of things with Lady Stoneheart. First of all, I guess it's just sorta cool? It's a surprise, and intriguing. Secondly, it prepares the reader for other things like it to happen, though book readers still don't know if it will happen... It also helps with remembering that there's still trouble in the Riverlands, the fact that Lady Stoneheart is rooming makes the readers more interested in what is happening there - and a lot is in the books, Jamie goes to the Riverlands, not Dorne, in the books, and Brienne is there as well. And lastly, it plays into the theme of transfiguration and fluent identity, which is one of the main themes of the books, imo. Almost every major character, that doesn't die, goes through an identity change, or a purification phase. Theon becomes Reek and Arya becomes No One, for instance. Jon Snow, obviously. This also plays into how ridiculous the feudal system is, based on an idea of immutable identity, which is broken left and right as the books goes along.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 10:01 (three years ago) link

I tried to keep that non-spoilers, but...

Frederik B, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 10:02 (three years ago) link

I'd briefly summarize stoneheart as the personification of violent revenge as terribly persuasive, extremely confused, and (literally) not a great look. Which seems to me to tie into a lot of Martin's issues with war.

Clay, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 10:04 (three years ago) link

Good analysis, Frederik.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 10:05 (three years ago) link

I'm assuming they're not bothering with the Riverlands given all of that, and it would probably be a mistake for the series to widen the scope even more at this stage.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 10:22 (three years ago) link

I don't know what the riverlands are like but sounds cool though.

My enthusiasm tends to drop when we go to the sunny sandy places and I don't know how much that's due to the story or me just not being too fond of those settings. Probably both.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 10:54 (three years ago) link

Okay, thanks, I think I get it now. Not sure if the tv-series really needs it though. Seems like a very writerly device that wouldn't necessarily translate too well into the series as we have it.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 10:58 (three years ago) link

The Riverlands are where Catherine Stark, née Tully, was originally from, and it's where the war mainly took place in seasons 1-3 (the whole reason the Freys and their castle at the Twins are so significant is because they control strategic passage over one of the rivers). It's located between the North and the Crownlands with Kings Landing to the South, and to the west is the Westerlands, where the Lannisters has their gold mining empire. So it's quite often the area mainly destroyed by warfare in the kingdom. Arya also spent most of her travels in the Riverlands. The devastation of the area is also described in much more detail in book 2, I think, and it does make the whole campaign of Robb Stark more nuanced when you see the consequences for the common folk.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 11:36 (three years ago) link

I've been really missing Joffrey this season.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:00 (three years ago) link

^ Still my favorite parts of this show.

Hadrian VIII, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:22 (three years ago) link

one thing bugging me is how casual and "oh yeah" everybody is about RESURRECTION, there's no way the Lannisters wouldn't have at least one full-time miracle-worker in case the king gets poisoned

Hadrian VIII, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:24 (three years ago) link

Nah, Lannisters are quite anti-magic. Qyburn's science of semi-ressurection is a very new innovation.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:26 (three years ago) link

oh boy

Hadrian VIII, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:43 (three years ago) link

I actually think the resurrection stuff is some of my least favorite stuff in this show. If you need a character alive, then don't kill them. Zombie Mountain is still the Mountain, with little to no discernible change. Zombie Jon Snow is still Jon Snow, and if that's what it took to get him off the Wall, fine, but there were probably easier, less confusing, less convoluted ways. Especially since we are operating in a world with magic snow zombies already, why bother with all these one-off back-from-the-dead-ers?

I've started to enjoy watching the show try to juggle all its characters and subplots in a limited space of time/season. I think I'm also enjoying the more contemporary writing style this season has embraced, more like the first season (iirc), probably less successful at delivering us to another world but certainly fun/funny/goofy..

The Brans-splaining is a solid if hackneyed shortcut, though I've got to admit my wife is at a total loss at to what's going on. I'd been recently thinking of this show in terms of "Lord of the Rings," the movies, specifically the amount of stuff they squeeze into 11 hours of film, which is basically only one season of GoT. And yet GoT is struggling to reconcile Martin's vast convolutions of history (which are important) with telling the story, driving it forward. Tolkien's world is no less complex, but I doubt there were many moments in the films that made the armchair nerd ask "what the hell is going on?" But I can sense this show leaving behind anyone who has not done their homework, and even some who have read all the books as entertainment and not as text. As I think the AV Club review pointed out, all roads still seem to be leading to R+L=J, but the narrative machinations necessary to set that up are surprisingly complex and probably have to be revealed sooner rather than later. Which the show appears to be doing, but short a history lesson might be hard to convey.

Maybe we'll get a flashback to Jon's brain when he was dead where his ghost father will appear and tell him (us) what's going on? We're already getting pretty Star Wars-y with all the training, might as well go full force ghost.

Every time I see that green forest sprite I giggle btw.

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:54 (three years ago) link

So yeah, kind of important question that the writers are presumably gonna get round to at some point - who becomes king when Tommen inevitably gets whacked with no heir?

Matt DC, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:57 (three years ago) link

Margaery would be Queen, right?

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:58 (three years ago) link

After some late night visits to King Ser Pounce.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 13:58 (three years ago) link

Does it work like that? Westeros isn't exactly big on women's rights.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:10 (three years ago) link

I mean unless you have several dragons and an army of Unsullied.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:11 (three years ago) link

Dunno really. The show seems to treat lineage as massively important and then tear it up when it suits them.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:13 (three years ago) link

what makes you say that? can't think of much that has happened that really fits that

since consorts don't officially count in succession, the next in line to the throne after tommen baratheon is his nearest blood relative, daenerys targaryen

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:19 (three years ago) link

Just that generally, for example, there seems to be major importance placed on there still being a living Stark, when at the same time people are just murdered all the time, so who cares if there's still a living Stark. Like these claims don't seem to mean a lot in reality. Not least when it's a child. Like if the lineage was that important, surely all the people desperate for the rightful kings of the north to be in power would be the ones hunting down Rickon to put him back in the throne.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:22 (three years ago) link

That's a fair point, that for all the importance placed on name and lineage and divine right or whatever, it's pretty easy to just take someone out and usurp their power. We've seen it a lot. Clearly it's all a lot of place holding/throne juggling while the show gets together its Grand Joseph Campbell Prophecy.

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:26 (three years ago) link

xp a big chunk of storyline has been about ppl absconding with or trying to find the stark kids. and recently we've seen the value of the stark lineage to the boltons with sansa and now rickon.

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:27 (three years ago) link

in fact, if lineage wasn't so important most of the conflict in the story wouldn't exist at all

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:28 (three years ago) link

Yeah I mean virtually any of the Stark kids would presumably be able to raise an army of loyalists without too much trouble, it's why Sansa is so important to a range of different sociopaths for one thing.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:30 (three years ago) link

And yet, dragon people trump all. If only there was some way to unite the dragon people and Starks, hmmm ...

Of course, someone would probably just kill one of them again and start the story all over again.

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:33 (three years ago) link

xp a big chunk of storyline has been about ppl absconding with or trying to find the stark kids. and recently we've seen the value of the stark lineage to the boltons with sansa and now rickon.

I don't understand what you mean here. What is the actual value of the kids? The Boltons are in charge, it doesn't seem as if people are banging down the door in support of Rickon Stark.

Not saying you're wrong, I guess I just don't quite see your pov.

To me, lineage is feted as important but when everyone can just kill someone and seize power, how is it important? Some religious guy threw the queen in jail. Some other family murdered the eldest Stark and his mother. Robert Baratheon was murdered as well, right? As a viewer of the show the lineage doesn't seem important at all - not as important as killing your way to the top.

Weren't Dani and her shithead brother claiming themselves rightful heirs to the throne at the beginning of the show? Didn't seem to matter much.

xpost is that true? the show doesn't seem to make that clear - if that's the case why aren't people bothering to do anything about walder frey or the boltons?

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:34 (three years ago) link

Middle Earth (and the rest of the Tolkein universe and its history) is waaaaaay less complex, there are two sides and only two sides to every conflict.

GoT has to spend a lot of time on motivation, and a lot of that time on stuff that doesn't make immediate sense to people who haven't lived under feudalism.

Has anyone done a compare & contrast with Chinese & Japanese medieval epics?

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:34 (three years ago) link

I mean, if I was to defend the show I'd say it's actually been a theme that all these idiot families think their name is important but actually they're just a few murders away from being yesterday's news. Or a zombie apocalypse away.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:40 (three years ago) link

it's not like those events you described happened and were just brushed off, most of them resulted in wars. re the stark kids the reason the boltons wanted sansa so much was because their rule is extremely tenuous and they could rally support and legitimacy around connection to the stark house - and, more importantly, prevent anyone else from doing so.

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:41 (three years ago) link

Westeros is in transition, dudes. The same line ruled the entire continent for 300 years up until a couple of decades before the first book / first episode. Everyone is confused about what lineage and nobility really means.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:42 (three years ago) link

Lineage matters, but we're specifically seeing all of the relatively rare times that someone is daring enough to kill someone else notable. It's like if we were watching a show about street racing, of course we're going to see all of the times that people were speeding or driving in the wrong lanes or whatever. Would you ask "Does anyone even follow the rules of the road? They seem pretty easy to ignore"? We're just seeing all of the exciting events condensed for the sake of the story. And of course the GoT universe is being majorly disturbed by all these shake ups via domino effect, so that helps with the frequency of these abnormal murderous power grabs.

Evan, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:44 (three years ago) link

the frey murders ended a war though, and surely were the most heinous act against the starks.

i dunno, at the least i think the line between what murder gets you and what lineage gets you is a bit confused. i don't mean that it should be entirely clear, or that it could be, but it seems for narrative purposes sometimes it's a world in which lineage limits everything and everyone, and other times violence conquers all.

xpost fair enough evan, to a point, but the consequences of those murders don't necessarily seem consistent or build any clear picture of how lineage works in this world. it's more like i'd naturally expect a show about street racing to feature the cops in it.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:47 (three years ago) link

I actually think the resurrection stuff is some of my least favorite stuff in this show. If you need a character alive, then don't kill them.

Worth remembering that the possibility of ressurection in this world has been shown from the end of season 1, with Khal Drogo, but since then it's been shown to come at a heavy cost. If Jon's being brought back from the dead has a fundamental impact on the character then it's worthwhile. Remains to be seen if it will, though.

Like if the lineage was that important, surely all the people desperate for the rightful kings of the north to be in power would be the ones hunting down Rickon to put him back in the throne.

Don't forget everyone thinks Bran and Rickon have been dead since the end of S2.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 14:59 (three years ago) link

I feel like the wildlings should be more suspicious of resurrected Jon Snow, considering that their only other experience with people coming back from the dead is the zombies raised by the white walkers. I mean, I get that Jon Snow doesn't look like a zombie, but still, I wouldn't trust him.

silverfish, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:07 (three years ago) link

The show seems to treat lineage as massively important and then tear it up when it suits them.

this is v true, but also neat description of how the actual monarchy has functioned

ogmor, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:12 (three years ago) link

yeah i guess that's the realisation i was coming to when i said:

I mean, if I was to defend the show I'd say it's actually been a theme that all these idiot families think their name is important but actually they're just a few murders away from being yesterday's news. Or a zombie apocalypse away.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:13 (three years ago) link

daenerys' story line v explicitly about this theme atm

ogmor, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:21 (three years ago) link

the widow spa retreat seems weird 2 me

, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:22 (three years ago) link

You can kill your way to the top but without a power-base of loyalists you're not going to stay there for very long. It's not like anyone in Winterfell is going to fight much in the name of Ramsay Bolton when they could fight for even the lamest Stark or for that matter virtually anyone else.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:26 (three years ago) link

xpost fair enough evan, to a point, but the consequences of those murders don't necessarily seem consistent or build any clear picture of how lineage works in this world. it's more like i'd naturally expect a show about street racing to feature the cops in it.

― japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, May 10, 2016 10:47 AM (37 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

True, though I also think there's universal confusion as a result of all the transitions. This is a world where news is spread almost exclusively via carrier ravens and poor children that ease drop.

Evan, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:29 (three years ago) link

And nobody carries ID!

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:39 (three years ago) link

the widow spa retreat seems weird 2 me

it's worse than dorne imo

i like this show though!

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:42 (three years ago) link

Let's see how much they drag it out. It certainly has the potential to be a bore.

Evan, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:45 (three years ago) link

What's with the set design though? I had a much more interesting vision of it in my head, but it turned out to be a big-ish hut amount the rest of the huts all sitting in a dusty, flat valley. They should have consulted me. I'm not expensive.

Evan, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:47 (three years ago) link

among*

Evan, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:48 (three years ago) link

Set design all around has seemed very cheap this season. There is very little sense of scale/population, and every scene seems to take place in one stagey foreground spot. Green screen budget must be down as the salaries go up.

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:51 (three years ago) link

i'm getting the sense that very little is going to be dragged out from here on -- i bet dany isn't there longer than a couple three episodes. if there's really only 13 eps after this season, then my guess is that she's ready to head to westeros by the end of this season, which is only what? seven eps away? i could see there being a lot more movement over round her end of things than in westeros, tbh.

if the endgame is dragons v white walkers, then dany's plot has got to hustle butt.

jason waterfalls (gbx), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 15:52 (three years ago) link

i was trying to think of a resolution to this plotline other than 'dragons come and save daeny' and couldnt

, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 16:00 (three years ago) link

In some way, the whole thing about identity vs violence as the basis of rule is perhaps THE major theme of the story. The rule is already less stable because a 'usurper' took the throne 15 years prior, and the whole conflict kicks into gear when people figure out the crown prince is not who he's supposed to be. And already Renly plans to take the throne simply by force, even though his brother had a better claim. It's a bit fuzzy though, as questions of identity and blood and destiny seems to guide what happens to Jon and Denaerys anyway.

I won't blame anyone for thinking the story is screwing it up at this point, though. There's been a spectacular amount of kinslaying this season, and the ease with which the Sand Snakes killed off their uncle, or Ramsay his father and brother, and continued to be able to govern, is pretty questionable. Normally I would have agreed with Matt DC: t's not like anyone in Winterfell is going to fight much in the name of Ramsay Bolton when they could fight for even the lamest Stark or for that matter virtually anyone else. But that really seems to happen in the show. He straight up murdered a Frey woman as well, and we've heard no response from the Freys.

All these complicated rules are a huge reason why the books are so complicated, btw. Nobody takes their oathbreaking lightly, which means there has to be a HUGE buildup for anything to happen. Which also gets pretty dull after a while.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 16:02 (three years ago) link

xpost

the other possibility is that jorah and daario show up and rescue the princess, with the help of dragons

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 16:05 (three years ago) link

Maybe Jon Snow's on his way to save her.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 16:09 (three years ago) link

Pfffft. Daenerys is the liberator. She's not "getting rescued." She'll get all of those crazy widows to bow before her and march on whoever stands in their way.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 16:25 (three years ago) link

All getting ready to spring a painstakingly planned two man + two dragons ambush rescue operation and then Dany and an army of empowered widows burst out of the spa and slaughter the dothraki and Jorah and Daario do a face at each other and one of them does a quip

Dadjokke (Sgt. Biscuits), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 17:46 (three years ago) link

Wasn't there some Dothraki prophecy about their spiritual savior or something coming back to where she is being held?

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 17:51 (three years ago) link

yes

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 17:54 (three years ago) link

To me, lineage is feted as important but when everyone can just kill someone and seize power, how is it important...?

I mean, if I was to defend the show I'd say it's actually been a theme that all these idiot families think their name is important but actually they're just a few murders away from being yesterday's news...

i dunno, at the least i think the line between what murder gets you and what lineage gets you is a bit confused. i don't mean that it should be entirely clear, or that it could be, but it seems for narrative purposes sometimes it's a world in which lineage limits everything and everyone, and other times violence conquers all...

hmm... where are you from again?

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 17:56 (three years ago) link

xpost Or specifically a "stallion that mounts the world." Which could be a dragon, maybe, say, the pseudo-literal child of Dany, erstwhile Dothraki queen. Or Prince - tow princes! - Jon Snow.

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 17:56 (three years ago) link

Whoops, two princes. I messed up my Spin Doctors joke.

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 17:57 (three years ago) link

Or three?

Frederik B, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 18:00 (three years ago) link

i'm getting the sense that very little is going to be dragged out from here on -- i bet dany isn't there longer than a couple three episodes. if there's really only 13 eps after this season, then my guess is that she's ready to head to westeros by the end of this season, which is only what? seven eps away? i could see there being a lot more movement over round her end of things than in westeros, tbh.

if the endgame is dragons v white walkers, then dany's plot has got to hustle butt.

― jason waterfalls (gbx), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 16:52

Yeah, I've been thinking that most characters are only 3 or 4 moves from the end.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 18:06 (three years ago) link

How many direwolves are left now?

Is it just Jon's & Bran's?

And Arya's roaming wild somewhere?

groovypanda, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 19:24 (three years ago) link

yeah! I thought nymeria was killed but circei executed sansa's wolf instead..

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 19:33 (three years ago) link

In the books Nymeria is in the wild (the Riverlands?), leading a pack of wolves and terrorizing the country side -- so that's where she is on the show, in my head at least.

I'm holding out hope that that wasn't Shaggy. I mean, if I'm Rickon, I wouldn't want to decapitate my direwolf for the sake of some ruse.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 20:30 (three years ago) link

i could see the ol bait and switch happening here, i mean he learned it by watching reek

nomar, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 21:04 (three years ago) link

So who will Arya kill by the end of the season? I'm putting my money on faceless douche.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 22:02 (three years ago) link

hmm... where are you from again?

where do you think i'm from? if you're right, i'd be very interested to hear your thoughts on lineage/violence.

Normally I would have agreed with Matt DC: "it's not like anyone in Winterfell is going to fight much in the name of Ramsay Bolton when they could fight for even the lamest Stark or for that matter virtually anyone else". But that really seems to happen in the show. He straight up murdered a Frey woman as well, and we've heard no response from the Freys.

this is exactly it. there isn't really any sense of repercussion in the show. i don't mean that i want to see hours of people furiously moaning in taverns. just that there's no sense of support for the family powers. there seemed to be big support for frey killing the starks - and again no real repercussions. like wouldn't someone have done something about that if the starks were so popular? they must be barely popular at all to be murdered by one family at a wedding and for everyone to just basically shrug.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 22:10 (three years ago) link

I guess you could argue that the institutions that once exercised control over everyone have been ripped to pieces - targarean (sp) rule for 300 some years exploded by Robert's rebellion then 3 new kings in a very short amount of time plus all the other heads of the houses finding ways to get killed from miscellaneous circumstances like the starks, whatsherface in the aerie, tywin, etc.

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 22:18 (three years ago) link

i thought brit. apologies if i got that wrong.

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 22:19 (three years ago) link

no worries - i'm irish - which significantly complicates the idea of monarchy v violence i guess :)

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 22:29 (three years ago) link

Indeed. Sorry for having got that wrong all these years!

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Tuesday, 10 May 2016 23:27 (three years ago) link

this is exactly it. there isn't really any sense of repercussion in the show. i don't mean that i want to see hours of people furiously moaning in taverns. just that there's no sense of support for the family powers. there seemed to be big support for frey killing the starks - and again no real repercussions. like wouldn't someone have done something about that if the starks were so popular? they must be barely popular at all to be murdered by one family at a wedding and for everyone to just basically shrug.

― japanese mage (LocalGarda), 11. maj 2016 00:10 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yeah, it's a weakness. And at risk of repeating myself too much: It's better in the books. The Theon chapters in book five deal with the Bolton army in Winterfell, and the intrigues, alliances and subterfuge among the disgruntled Northmen. There's also a bunch of stuff about the importance of dealing with every smaller house. For instance, in the books Smalljon Umber, who in this episode delivered Rickon to Ramsay, is killed at the Red Wedding, but his father the Greatjon survives, and is held hostage at the Twins. And therefore House Umber chooses to stay calm, to avoid Greatjons execution. Other houses are wiped out in the Red Wedding, or is stripped of their holdings by the new leaders. Really, the simple answer is that people don't avenge the Starks because the Starks already tried avenging and lost badly.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 10 May 2016 23:48 (three years ago) link

Can I just say, are all of you who seem to know every damn characters name and how to spell it, readers of the books. I cant keep all these people straight in my head!

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Wednesday, 11 May 2016 01:56 (three years ago) link

Frederik B otm re: Northern Bannermen. My thing with the North is that it's tenuous, and Roose knew he was only holding onto his control there because a huge majority of the Stark bannermen armies were killed at the Red Wedding. Roose knew there was a long game to play (those armies will be replenished at some point in the future, after all), and Ramsay's mistake is thinking short term.

Gukbe, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 02:35 (three years ago) link

Can I just say, are all of you who seem to know every damn characters name and how to spell it, readers of the books. I cant keep all these people straight in my head!

lol Trayce me too, I can barely remember who the Baratheons were let alone two separate characters called Beric

There's a place near my parents' called Castle Drogo so I remember that one.

kinder, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 11:35 (three years ago) link

There's admittedly some spellchecking involved :)

Wait, are there two characters called Beric?

Frederik B, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 11:46 (three years ago) link

Didn't you even know that? pfft.

Actually there are three. I only know this because I searched the GOT wiki for 'Beric'. Two of them are 'not expected to appear in the series, being dead by the time it starts'.

kinder, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 11:49 (three years ago) link

Beric Dondarian, Beric Jeter, and Beric May.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 11 May 2016 11:51 (three years ago) link

Oh, right. Beric Dondarion, his father Beric Dondarion Sr, and his his cousin Beric Oscar Dondarion (or Bod! as he likes to call himself), son of his uncle Oscar Dondarion.

Frederik B, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 12:02 (three years ago) link

http://i.imgur.com/QRKxcFa.png

, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 12:52 (three years ago) link

http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/34500000/sansa-and-joffrey-sansa-stark-34551621-610-342.jpg

I've made a huge mistake

kinder, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 13:02 (three years ago) link

Jon Snow leaves Castle Black to Charlie Brown music.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Wednesday, 11 May 2016 13:06 (three years ago) link

ok I didn't realise this was a thing
http://arrestedwesteros.com/

but it's a brilliant thing

kinder, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 13:09 (three years ago) link

I don't read the original story but I remember the names well enough. But all the discussion probably helps.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Wednesday, 11 May 2016 13:24 (three years ago) link

I'm guessing they are going to unify some of the magic soon. I'm convinced that Daeny birthed dragons by stumbling onto the resurrection formula, with Khal Drogo being the royal blood. I could see Hodor being an imperfect resurrection.

remove butt (abanana), Wednesday, 11 May 2016 14:55 (three years ago) link

i just reminded myself of what went down at the red wedding and i hadn't realised before that it was roose bolton who killed robb stark, i think in that period of the show i was struggling to tell apart the vast number of stern white men who haven't shaved for a while

There's a new excerpt of Winds of Winter released. From Dorne. It's a pretty fun reminder of how different that stuff is from the show (the POV character isn't on the show, the people she's seeking out aren't on the show) It's really not well written at all, though, as in, even worse than usual. Right? But it's a draft, so that's probably ok.

http://www.georgerrmartin.com/excerpt-from-the-winds-of-winter/

Frederik B, Thursday, 12 May 2016 10:47 (three years ago) link

p weird that he is sharing drafts. is his confidence totally shot or something?

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Thursday, 12 May 2016 10:53 (three years ago) link

As far as I can tell, it's described as a 'sample' or an 'excerpt' rather than a draft - where are you getting that from, Frederik?

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 12 May 2016 11:12 (three years ago) link

It replaces one (an excerpt from the next book) that's been up there for the last year, I think it's just something he does as the lowest possible level of "I haven't forgotten about this book".

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 12 May 2016 11:15 (three years ago) link

http://imgur.com/IqaFJFh

, Thursday, 12 May 2016 14:56 (three years ago) link

That fight reminded me the silly Phantom Menace swordplay too.

remove butt (abanana), Thursday, 12 May 2016 17:44 (three years ago) link

That excerpt was rough. Reminds us why we're glad Dorne has been backgrounded on the TV show...

schwantz, Thursday, 12 May 2016 17:48 (three years ago) link

Why did everyone start calling Gregor Clegane/The Mountain by the name Robert Strong now?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Thursday, 12 May 2016 21:28 (three years ago) link

I think in the books we don't actually know he's the mountain. is that right?

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Thursday, 12 May 2016 21:30 (three years ago) link

We don't ~officially~ know that the Mountain has been reanimated, but it's like the "Is Jon Snow really dead" cliffhanger.

I presume that Qyburn came up with a pseudonym because people knowing that he brought the Mountain back from the dead would freak them out.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Thursday, 12 May 2016 22:11 (three years ago) link

Except didn't he/someone call him Clegane in the more recent ep? I guess it's more mysterious in the book, where you can't actually see a 7 foot, 300 pound killing machine.I love how people are predicting a Cleganebowl. That's funny. Just the word/concept.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 12 May 2016 22:14 (three years ago) link

they definitely called him Sir Gregor in the latest ep. but maybe just amongst Cersei/Jamie/Clyburn.

dan selzer, Thursday, 12 May 2016 22:19 (three years ago) link

xpost poly that's correct. in the show it's always been explicit to the viewer and known to cersei's circle. to what extent any will or consciousness that could be called gregor clegane is left under the helmet is another matter.

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Thursday, 12 May 2016 23:19 (three years ago) link

So to help my addled brain Ive been doing some reading back of plot summaries and the like. Apparently in the books Balon was killed way back before the red wedding? I wonder why they waited so long in the show? It also raises hope that maybe zombiestark will happen after all.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Friday, 13 May 2016 01:12 (three years ago) link

tbh I was confused they brought up the entire pike islands kings moot business at this point. I thought that was something that was going to be kept out of the show to keep it simple. Maybe it's a bigger part of the plot? The "next week" previews already has Theon back on Pike but in the books I don't remember where he was left.

dan selzer, Friday, 13 May 2016 01:44 (three years ago) link

well dany's whole fleet and harbor got burned and a bunch of insane pirates who know their way around westeros could prove useful, is my guess why they didn't streamline the pike plot out entirely

Clay, Friday, 13 May 2016 01:46 (three years ago) link

Theon was last seen jumping off a Winterfell wall with Sansa in the books, IIRC.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Friday, 13 May 2016 01:47 (three years ago) link

in the books sansa and theon haven't met again since she split for king's landing in book 1. she's last seen off glad-handling with littlefinger in the vale. theon/reek is stuck in winterfell being theon/reek.

Clay, Friday, 13 May 2016 01:56 (three years ago) link

Theon was last seen jumping off a Winterfell wall with Sansa in the books, IIRC.

Except it's not actually Sansa in the books

groovypanda, Friday, 13 May 2016 09:42 (three years ago) link

At this point I think I'm just going to skip reading those books altogether. I tried once years ago but was quickly put off by the heavy handed prose. Maybe if GRRM actually finishes this I'll give it another go but at the moment it all seems very confusing. .

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Friday, 13 May 2016 09:44 (three years ago) link

Oh right, it was the fake Sansa, right?

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Friday, 13 May 2016 17:29 (three years ago) link

Fake Arya.

Frederik B, Friday, 13 May 2016 17:35 (three years ago) link

reading those book summaries is kind of hilarious

so the real Mance Rayder, not the fake executed one, helps rescue the fake Arya
ok dawg

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Friday, 13 May 2016 17:44 (three years ago) link

fake Arya and Theon had escaped and were chilling (very literally) with Stannis in the woods at the end of book 5.

sarahell, Friday, 13 May 2016 17:49 (three years ago) link

Yeah, and to make fake Mance Rayder even more fun, it's all explained through Theon's eyes, who don't know who Mance Rayder is, so I for instance managed to not get that was him at all...

Frederik B, Friday, 13 May 2016 18:01 (three years ago) link

i recall it being fairly clear that fauxMance was exactly who he was ... could have been context clues or another chapter idk

sarahell, Friday, 13 May 2016 18:05 (three years ago) link

Oh, iirc Jon says that's what's going on. You're told Mance Rayder will go to Winterfell, and then somebody who looks like Mance Rayder shows up in Winterfell. I just missed it anyways.

Frederik B, Friday, 13 May 2016 18:12 (three years ago) link

I just remembered Craster's liberated ladyslaves. Wonder how they're all getting on.

nashwan, Friday, 13 May 2016 21:43 (three years ago) link

http://i.imgur.com/7DtSPu3.png

mick signals, Saturday, 14 May 2016 00:07 (three years ago) link

Interesting that both Snow and Dondarrion were resurrected by people who had lost their religious faith at the time:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2MGg_8TF9g

Brakhage, Monday, 16 May 2016 00:30 (three years ago) link

DANY FUCKING TARGARYEAN

balls, Monday, 16 May 2016 02:06 (three years ago) link

booooooo

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 16 May 2016 02:19 (three years ago) link

ramsay's apple slicing skills are v suspect. the end was cheese city

dynamicinterface, Monday, 16 May 2016 02:22 (three years ago) link

I wouldn't have guessed I would get sick of Jonathan Pryce prattling on but ok, enough, I'm ready to confess, please

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 16 May 2016 02:23 (three years ago) link

or convert

Brakhage, Monday, 16 May 2016 02:38 (three years ago) link

A lot of Dhany's victories come from her having dragons and/or being able to withstand flames (I always forget about that one...good job GoT for not overdoing it), plus the music was terrible and I always slightly groan at all the bowing-before-the-Queen business (even though I get it, she killed all the Khals and withstood fire).

AND YET I still get a thrill from Dany being a total badass in just the right way. "You are all small" etc was just perfect.

Will be interested to see what happens when her pro-slavery Dothraki hordes start hanging in Mereen. Or what she's going to think of Tyrion's "negotiations".

I liked the High Sparrow's speech. Feel like they would normally have written him off as just the villain by this point waiting to be dispensed with but they're admirably sticking with it and trying to flesh out his character. Plus Pryce is too good.

Fuck that Osha/Ramsay scene.

Also, Story Movement!

Gukbe, Monday, 16 May 2016 02:53 (three years ago) link

ramsay's apple slicing skills are v suspect. the end was cheese city

Think it was meant to signal it was a blunt knife?

, Monday, 16 May 2016 02:54 (three years ago) link

uuuuuugh bringing Osha back just for that was the goddamn worst

a serious and fascinating fartist (Simon H.), Monday, 16 May 2016 03:12 (three years ago) link

Oh, looks we'll get to see the whole ironborn primary season. Yay.

schwantz, Monday, 16 May 2016 04:12 (three years ago) link

best ep in a while

lag∞n, Monday, 16 May 2016 07:57 (three years ago) link

i like the high sparrow its good how he tortures royals

lag∞n, Monday, 16 May 2016 07:57 (three years ago) link

the khal fire was very satisfying

lag∞n, Monday, 16 May 2016 07:58 (three years ago) link

Flag Post Permalink

best ep in a while

― lag∞n, Monday, May 16, 2016 3:57 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark

agree

, Monday, 16 May 2016 13:16 (three years ago) link

jon arron continuing the tradition of hateable snotty nosed tyrant brats

, Monday, 16 May 2016 13:16 (three years ago) link

that was a good one. it would be cool if daenerys would just permanently surround herself with fire.

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Monday, 16 May 2016 13:18 (three years ago) link

Was that fire supposed to spread by itself or was the ground covered in something flammable?

Poor Osha.

I thought the Brienne, Davos and Melisandre scene was interesting, totally forgot about that possible conflict. Didn't realise Davos still doesn't know about Shireen. Wonder what he'll do if he finds out.

Was Tormund making eyes at Brienne?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 13:34 (three years ago) link

Oh yeah totally. Tired of bears I guess

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 16 May 2016 13:57 (three years ago) link

wld watch tormund-brienne romcom

I loled especially because people have been shipping Tormund and Sansa for awhile now

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 16 May 2016 14:02 (three years ago) link

Was that fire supposed to spread by itself or was the ground covered in something flammable?

I thought about this too - assuming those were oil lamps, then the fire was just spreading across the spilled fuel. Though why nobody had ever had an accident with them in that tinderbox of a temple before Dany showed up is anyone's guess. Or maybe that building is just the Dothraki version of Gävlebocken and they just count on that door never being locked from the outside.

bothan zulu (El Tomboto), Monday, 16 May 2016 14:42 (three years ago) link

I thought maybe the boys snuck in and spread oil or something, but then I thought that would have a noticeable smell, then I thought I was thinking too hard about it.

dan selzer, Monday, 16 May 2016 14:48 (three years ago) link

ha i had not noticed it was a dull knife. that's a pretty cool plan by rams. sit around in your room and cut through a bunch of apples with a cheese knife while the real knife hides somewhere out of frame.

dynamicinterface, Monday, 16 May 2016 14:55 (three years ago) link

i thought that was the inference, given that the scene starts/ends with him peelin that apple

, Monday, 16 May 2016 15:18 (three years ago) link

Dany's plan did seem a bit risky for her to be so confident.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 15:22 (three years ago) link

this was better than it's been and it was still kinda not so good.

ulysses, Monday, 16 May 2016 17:24 (three years ago) link

p much just a tv show now. thx for that link btw brakhage -- hits on a lot of what what mad that scene such a disappointment

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 16 May 2016 17:38 (three years ago) link

So it sure seems like the High Sparrow told Tommen that Margaery was going to do the walk of shame, knowing that he would tell his mother, who would enlist the Tyrells to march into town to stop him, and then he also sent Margaery to see her brother knowing that Loras was past all hope. The way these things are presented to the audience we're meant to believe Margaery is actually going to "atone" via the walk but there's no affirmation of this whatsoever, it's all second or third hand.

I just can't figure out what his endgame is for having the Tyrells march into town unless he really thinks he can get Margaery to greet them at the front door as a septa.

El Tomboto, Monday, 16 May 2016 17:47 (three years ago) link

only cersei said marg would be doing the walk tho right? we didn't hear that directly from either the HS or tommen i thought?

Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 16 May 2016 18:13 (three years ago) link

Odd that Davos hadn't been more persistent in asking Melisandre what happened to Stannis, his wife and Shireen.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 18:35 (three years ago) link

Maybe high sparrow wants to be martyred?

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Monday, 16 May 2016 18:37 (three years ago) link

The really weird thing about the Rickon scenes is that everyone is supposed to think that him and Bran are dead, yet nobody comments on that. Neither Sansa or Jon seems to think it weird, or asks themselves where Bran might be.

Frederik B, Monday, 16 May 2016 18:56 (three years ago) link

Odd that Davos hadn't been more persistent in asking Melisandre what happened to Stannis, his wife and Shireen.

― Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, May 16, 2016 2:35 PM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

It's probably just that the writers didn't find it convenient to show him doing this until after Brienne arrived, so that they could have her intervene in the way she did.

Evan, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:01 (three years ago) link

I think he already asked twice and probably assumed by her manner that everyone was dead. But considering how long he's served these people I thought he'd ask more.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:19 (three years ago) link

Terrific and really well thought out review of the Tower fight scene

― Brakhage, Sunday, May 15, 2016 8:31 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I have some issues with this. Two main rebuttals:

1) There was only so much time allotted for this scene. They made it exciting and kept things moving. It indeed flirted with Darth Maul style silliness but they admirably didn't have his foes attacking one at a time and overall was not anywhere near as choreographed looking to me. So it felt tense and dramatic and lasted exactly as long as it needed to.

2) Arthur Dayne is supposed to be one of the most skillful fighters who has ever lived in this fantasy universe. In fantasy universes, we can safely assume that the most skillful fighter that ever lived has abilities that compensate and go far beyond the restrictions and resourcefulness real life sword fighters need to rely on. Therefore, complaining that his fancy moves and stances left him too exposed, or that his techniques (down to using two swords in the first place) aren't correct- it all can be explained by just saying "Well he is at a mythical level of skill in a fantasy universe and what doesn't work for the greatest possible Earthling swordsman works for him."

Evan, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:23 (three years ago) link

Except he ended up dead...

Frederik B, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:27 (three years ago) link

He was a great fighter, but like everyone else in this dang show he is extremely vulnerable to being stabbed in the back.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 16 May 2016 19:29 (three years ago) link

Sure, so maybe insanely skilled fighters can be vulnerable to enemies they thought they already killed. I don't think that takes does his reputation any harm.

Evan, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:32 (three years ago) link

oops, delete "takes"

Evan, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:32 (three years ago) link

When the guy who played Barristan Selmy was on the UK aftershow he was quite up front about being pissed off and disagreeing with the decision to kill off his character (still alive in the books). I thought it might become clear why they did it but it seems like a bad decision to me.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:33 (three years ago) link

Sure, so maybe insanely skilled fighters can be vulnerable to enemies they thought they already killed. I don't think that takes does his reputation any harm.

Nah he sucked at fighting and deserved to die

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 16 May 2016 19:36 (three years ago) link

Too many characters supporting Dany for her storyline. Trying to pare it all down + adding stakes to the Harpy threat. I imagine. Now that they're free from the books you can see they're moving towards the endgame with some level of pace.

Gukbe, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:37 (three years ago) link

Sure, so maybe insanely skilled fighters can be vulnerable to enemies they thought they already killed. I don't think that takes does his reputation any harm.

― Evan, 16. maj 2016 21:32 (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I really don't think this is the first time in military history that someone wounded has turned up not dead. Seems like something the best fighter in the realm should consider.

Frederik B, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:46 (three years ago) link

do people watch this show for the realistic swordfights?

, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:48 (three years ago) link

Honestly, I feel as if almost every scene could be nitpicked to death at this point on this show. Why did Dayne use two longswords? Why is nobody surprised Rickon is dead? Why didn't Davos ask Melisandre before? Etc. On the other hand, I kinda like it, it makes it seem as if the books will have a lot of details to fill in. + I image GRRM sitting in his sofa yesterday, with four chapters written slowly describing Daenyrys rediscovering her invulnerability to fire, getting her hands on bottles of wildfire through complicated dealings, looking at the last scene in Vaes Dothrak and going 'Oh, fuck you guys!'

Frederik B, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:50 (three years ago) link

The sword fight thing doesn't bother me at all. Even films devoted to martial arts sacrifice realism and practicality for spectacle and that's what I'd do too.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 19:59 (three years ago) link

That said, I would like to see films with swordfighting the way that woman envisions it.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 20:01 (three years ago) link

so re the tower of joy thing... the battle was a little underwhelming and shot pretty flat but I don't think much was lost for pure show-watchers. for anyone who had read the books, the appearance of Ser Arthur Dayne and his legendary greatsword would have been a much-anticipated Big Deal so seeing him get the Holy Grail treatment would be understandably disappointing.

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 16 May 2016 20:15 (three years ago) link

given how much crap Frederik B takes, and that iirc we've locked horns in this thread, I want to be the first to offer a hearty OTM. looking forward to reading Winds as its own thing whenever it happens.

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 16 May 2016 20:17 (three years ago) link

do people watch this show for the realistic swordfights?

― 龜, Monday, May 16, 2016 3:48 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Exactly. All that matters is that it holds a sense of risk and tension. It shouldn't be designed to satisfy fencing professionals or medieval arts experts. If you want it to be realistic, have the larger party all run at their enemies with swords pointed forward until those enemies are helplessly and pathetically overwhelmed, all while various fighters with throats already cut reel around on the ground gurgling horribly. Is that the kind of exciting "epic" showdown we want to watch on TV? Should we celebrate its realism at the expense of theatrics? A happy in-between is probably best.

Agreed with Robert.

Evan, Monday, 16 May 2016 20:20 (three years ago) link

re Rickon. Did Theon confess to Sansa what he'd actually done? I seem to recall him confiding to someone but might be mistaken.

groovypanda, Monday, 16 May 2016 20:59 (three years ago) link

theon told sansa the truth, yes

Rewatched and this time I noticed that when Brienne enters, Tormund is agape.

Glad to see Sansa meets Littlefinger in the next episode. Bran surrounded by white walkers.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 22:09 (three years ago) link

best line of this was "this is good soup"

best shot was maister whoever taking a full 10 secs to shuffle out of a room

goole, Monday, 16 May 2016 22:12 (three years ago) link

So much throat stabbing in GoT currently. I swear an average of two throats get stabbed per episode.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Monday, 16 May 2016 22:16 (three years ago) link

Dany's shit at the end was quite exciting but only about a fifth as exciting as when she killed the Masters in season 3.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Monday, 16 May 2016 22:17 (three years ago) link

i found jon and sansa's reunion weirdly touching, not that it was particularly well done or that i even remember their interactions before, but five whole seasons having passed since they were last onscreen together lent some serious weight to it

Yeah it was nice.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 16 May 2016 22:25 (three years ago) link

liked the way jorah couldn't resist gawping up at naked dany

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Monday, 16 May 2016 22:29 (three years ago) link

dany needs some fireproof clothing if she plans on making a thing of this superpower

Apparently (according to the HBOGO thing after the show) Jon and Sansa had NEVER been on screen together before.

schwantz, Monday, 16 May 2016 22:52 (three years ago) link

And NO CAPES (x-post)

schwantz, Monday, 16 May 2016 22:53 (three years ago) link

TBH this was an episode that I felt like I "noticed" the sets in a way I hadnt before. There was a scene with Daario and Jorah running around some narrow streets in wherever Dany was holed up, and my immediate thought was "lol this looks like a Star Trek episode".

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 16 May 2016 22:53 (three years ago) link

Feeling pretty cheap these days. Wonder what thy're saving the money for...

schwantz, Monday, 16 May 2016 22:58 (three years ago) link

contracts w/ the principals have presumably ballooned big time, is one thing

Clay, Monday, 16 May 2016 23:01 (three years ago) link

But the show must also be raking it in so yeah maybe we're up for some major CGI scenes ala Hardhome (which would have cost a bomb to make).

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 16 May 2016 23:03 (three years ago) link

I don't think there's any part of HBO revenues that are directly tied to GoT

, Monday, 16 May 2016 23:16 (three years ago) link

How do shows this big afford to do what they do then? I mean someone must be budgeting for it.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 16 May 2016 23:23 (three years ago) link

(that may be a massively dumb question sorry, I dont know much about how cable tv works)

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 16 May 2016 23:23 (three years ago) link

Just coming in here to quote myeself and go nahnahnah for a sec

Pfffft. Daenerys is the liberator. She's not "getting rescued." She'll get all of those crazy widows to bow before her and march on whoever stands in their way.

― human and working on getting beer (longneck), Tuesday, May 10, 2016 5:25 PM (1 week ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Also hoping Daenerys never gets fireproof clothing.

Good episode with lots of moments though. Ramsey's letter was pure ether by horseback.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Monday, 16 May 2016 23:36 (three years ago) link

well let me walk that back - they probably make money on GoT through merchandising, DVD sales, etc.

but it's not like the superbowl where revenues are tied directly to viewership numbers - there are no ads! that's the whole premise of HBO, innit? you pay a monthly subscription fee and you get ad-free prestige TV programming.

, Monday, 16 May 2016 23:39 (three years ago) link

LOL well you do if you're american. We dont/cant. So we all just pirate the damn thing :P

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Monday, 16 May 2016 23:47 (three years ago) link

GoT prob keeping a lot of subscribers around bc their other dramas aren't really setting the world on fire rn

Clay, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 00:03 (three years ago) link

I'd happily pay per episode, but Fox have their claws in the AU rights, so the only way to see GOT is to have to pay for premium cable at like $50 a month. Fuck that noise.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 00:38 (three years ago) link

Here in Vietnam, HBO is a standard cable channel, not a premium channel, but the version they show is heavily edited, so... not a whole lot of point in watching on TV

Vinnie, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 02:55 (three years ago) link

God an edited GOT there'd be nothing left of!

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 03:09 (three years ago) link

how would they do the climactic moment from last night's episode? like just a text box explaining what happened?

Clay, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 03:10 (three years ago) link

black bars over her boobies?

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 03:16 (three years ago) link

Last night's episode is a cliffhanger?

nickn, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 03:18 (three years ago) link

How so?

Evan, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 03:49 (three years ago) link

Keeping with the censored Vietnam showing theme - there wouldn't be any shot of her naked, so we wouldn't know whether she survived the fire or not.

nickn, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 05:05 (three years ago) link

Oh, right. Yeah or they're all bowing to the magical floating head in a surprise twist for her character.

Evan, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 05:13 (three years ago) link

I thought Emilia Clarke said she was never going to get her kit off on GOT again?

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 17:19 (three years ago) link

Also GRRM said that her surviving Drogo's funeral pyre would be a one-time magick thing re: her resistance to fire.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 17:20 (three years ago) link

Then nothing is true!

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 17:23 (three years ago) link

I thought Emilia Clarke said she was never going to get her kit off on GOT again?

"Clarke wrote: “I feel now… I should clarify my statements, if for nothing else than for posterity. In drama, if a nude scene forwards a story or is shot in a way that adds insight into characters, I’m perfectly fine with it. Sometimes explicit scenes are required and make sense for the characters/story, as they do in Westeros. If it’s gratuitous for gratuitous sake, then I will discuss with a director on how to make it more subtle. In either case, like a good Mother of Dragons, I’m always in control.”

groovypanda, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 20:40 (three years ago) link

I'm not mad.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 21:00 (three years ago) link

I haven't seen that many people burned alive by great whites since the Station nightclub fire

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 21:05 (three years ago) link

Yikes

Evan, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 21:06 (three years ago) link

Can taps aff really be described as getting your kit off?

Chewshabadoo, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 21:36 (three years ago) link

If I understand you correctly, yes.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 21:44 (three years ago) link

Something bothering me about the last ep.:
Littlefinger tells Robin that Sansa was kidnapped & escaped to Jon and that it's time for the Vale to 'join the Freys'.
So I assume Littlefinger is going to team up with the Freys to wage war against Ramsay...

I feel like there is a scene here missing. Like, I guess the Freys (and everyone) knows that Ramsay murdered Roose's wife? And I guess they can see right through his lie about her being poisoned, which he was telling people in the previous ep.? It's not really clear what people in Westeros know about the Winterfell situation or how they know about it.

the thrill of it all, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 22:18 (three years ago) link

I thought he said it was time for the Vale to join the fray?

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 22:20 (three years ago) link

he says "join the fray" - an expression meaning to take part in something, usually implying the thing is violent or involves a load of lairy men.

xpost otm

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 22:20 (three years ago) link

Ahh I wondered about that, but then decided I heard 'Freys'. Makes way more sense though.

the thrill of it all, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 22:24 (three years ago) link

Enter the freys

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Tuesday, 17 May 2016 22:27 (three years ago) link

Yeah, I was a bit confused as well. It's not particularly good writing.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 22:28 (three years ago) link

Join the Freys of Benteros
everything is at steak

kinder, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 22:48 (three years ago) link

could've been foreshadowing wordplay

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 23:01 (three years ago) link

Flag Post Permalink

could've been foreshadowing wordplay

― Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, May 17, 2016 7:01 PM (38 minutes ago) Bookmark

given some of the in-jokes I feel like definitely the case

, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 23:40 (three years ago) link

I've never actually watched GoT on HBO here, but I have seen movies on HBO where they cut whole scenes for sex/violence and the movie makes no sense as a result. Continuity is the last of the priorities here

Vinnie, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 04:12 (three years ago) link

I just tried to google to see if someone explained exactly what gets cut in Vietnam, but all I found was a story about Emilia Clarke getting punched by a Vietnamese prostitute on vacation here

Vinnie, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 04:19 (three years ago) link

https://twitter.com/TheOnion/status/732951346068983808

Roberto Spiralli, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:12 (three years ago) link

Best thing about this episode was how many of the characters are now pointing back towards the centre again, as opposed to drifting further and further away from one another. I give Ramsay another five episodes max.

I actually cheered when Littlefinger reappeared.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:46 (three years ago) link

I actually cheered when Littlefinger reappeared.

My girlfriend shuddered! Yeah it was good to see a proper villain again, though his scene was maybe a little pointless? Other than reminding us him and Robin are still alive, all it did was forecast that the knights of the Vale may be riding to aid Jon Snow, which would probably have been better as a surprise reveal later down the line imo.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:22 (three years ago) link

No, we needed that scene to set up *why* he's suddenly reappearing in the north in the next episode

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:25 (three years ago) link

thought it was an unusually neat, succinct and exposition-free reminder of how/why p.bae can mobilize the vale. it has been a season's worth of episodes since we were last there after all.

Roberto Spiralli, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:29 (three years ago) link

Yeah it's more important to establish that Littlefinger knows which way the wind is blowing than it is to show some dudes we don't know turning up as reinforcements.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:41 (three years ago) link

well he set up the whole premise, didn't he? It isn't just that he knows which way the wind is blowing, he built the windmill, as it were.

sarahell, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:49 (three years ago) link

It's classic switching sides, isn't it? Unless he was playing a very long game marrying Sansa off to the Boltons. I can't really remember what his motivation was for that.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:51 (three years ago) link

my recollection of the episode when he was at winterfell is that he got a glimpse of how much of a psycho ramsay actually is and was surprised, and i am sure that is the line he is giving sansa in their convo in the preview for next ep, but it fits much better with his character than he knew all along and that the plan was to drop sansa in the shit and then come and 'rescue' her/the north.

his stated motivation was to tie together the north and the vale, which would be a powerful bloc.

Roberto Spiralli, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:54 (three years ago) link

xp - long game of course.

sarahell, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:57 (three years ago) link

So I know this has been the subject of speculation for years, but it seems just as likely that Littlefinger (not Ramsey) sent Jon that letter to ensure that the Wildling army would assist him in an attack on Winterfell

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 18 May 2016 17:21 (three years ago) link

no not really

sarahell, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 17:22 (three years ago) link

Matt DC otm, i've always been on board with this show but i'm preferring it now that everyone now has their sights set on either winterfell or king's landing again. the iron islands is doing its own thing right now but i suspect that's just to set up their move back to the center as well. hoping next episode jon snow stops in at a tavern in the north and finds benjen stark, gendry, blackfish, and the revived hound just hanging out sharing a pitcher of ale.

nomar, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 17:36 (three years ago) link

There wouldn't be any reason Ramsey wouldn't send that letter himself, therefore a twist like that would do nothing for the story.

xxp

Evan, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 17:37 (three years ago) link

xxxp Has that letter happened in the books then (to generate years of speculation)? As Jon's story in the books has got no further thannthe point he was stabbed by members of the Night Watch.

groovypanda, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 19:00 (three years ago) link

The letter was in the books prior to Jon getting waxed.

pratt truss it (dan m), Wednesday, 18 May 2016 19:02 (three years ago) link

xxp we are talking about someone who sent a dad his son's dick in the mail.

sarahell, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 19:03 (three years ago) link

I don't understand why Gendry hasn't been in this fwiw - I'd be much more invested in his story than I am with half the characters here.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 20:49 (three years ago) link

they haven't really done anything with him in the books either.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Wednesday, 18 May 2016 20:51 (three years ago) link

i could see gendry as a character who we only see at the end of the saga as the dust has settled and someone else has taken the throne, with him as the sole living baratheon heir who's been convinced by a small band of believers that the throne is rightfully his and is starting to make his danys-like maneuvers to assemble an army to take the throne back. some circle of westeros life kinda shit.

nomar, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 20:59 (three years ago) link

^I like this

schwantz, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 21:46 (three years ago) link

I didn't get why the Dothraki bowed so easily to Daenerys. Don't they dislike magic? Doesn't having powers like this basically make her a witch to them?

(I guess witches are supposed to burn, so maybe not)

silverfish, Thursday, 19 May 2016 13:37 (three years ago) link

good ep though.

Maybe it's just lowered expectations, but so far I'm enjoying this season a lot more than I enjoyed last season. Stuff is actually happening, even if not all of it makes sense.

silverfish, Thursday, 19 May 2016 13:43 (three years ago) link

would be a good thread title

ulysses, Thursday, 19 May 2016 13:45 (three years ago) link

sums up my feelings about it, p much

jason waterfalls (gbx), Thursday, 19 May 2016 13:58 (three years ago) link

i am SO OVER memes but that's good'un. i lol'd.

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Friday, 20 May 2016 00:26 (three years ago) link

i could see gendry as a character who we only see at the end of the saga as the dust has settled and someone else has taken the throne, with him as the sole living baratheon heir who's been convinced by a small band of believers that the throne is rightfully his and is starting to make his danys-like maneuvers to assemble an army to take the throne back. some circle of westeros life kinda shit.

Game of the Wire

Vinnie, Friday, 20 May 2016 03:46 (three years ago) link

you want it to be one king but its another king

, Friday, 20 May 2016 03:47 (three years ago) link

lol

Clay, Friday, 20 May 2016 03:48 (three years ago) link

with the hilarious opening shot of two members of the new kingsguard buying a staplegun from an earnest tradesman

sarahell, Friday, 20 May 2016 05:39 (three years ago) link

xpost It's easy to dislike magic, it's another thing to watch this pale little woman go all firestarter, kill every Khal and walk out nekkid engulfed in flames, I guess.

I think I read that in the books or in interviews Martin made a point of stressing that the dragon-people are not fireproof, and that her birthing the baby dragons was a one off miracle. Which sounds kind of dumb compared to, yeah, fireproof. It seems all the people of this world have their distinct powers. Starks can warg,. Dragon-people are fireproof (except her brother). Boltons flay. Iron born are grouchy. Dothraki like horses. Lannister are rich and incestuous.

Liked how this episode has continued the recent tradition of contemporary-sounding zingers and comedic timing.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 20 May 2016 14:46 (three years ago) link

i would've paid five dollars american directly to GRRM by paypal if she had walked out proudly from the burning tent and caught a spear to the midsection. the dany storyline is the worst of the bunch and lately that's saying something.

ulysses, Friday, 20 May 2016 15:38 (three years ago) link

What are the odds that next Dani finds a way to cure the Stone Men and add them to her army

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Friday, 20 May 2016 15:53 (three years ago) link

I'm looking forward to where her storyline goes next only because of the hypothetical sense that having a Dothraki army suddenly implies a big shake up and momentum again, finally. Hopefully.

Evan, Friday, 20 May 2016 15:54 (three years ago) link

Some of the specifics have been botched pretty badly but I have always been a fan of Dany in general, and it makes me a bit sad when people aren't.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Friday, 20 May 2016 15:56 (three years ago) link

I'm not sure the Stone Men are portrayed as anything but mindless zombies, so that seems unlikely.

Evan, Friday, 20 May 2016 15:56 (three years ago) link

xp out of curiosity, what do you like about her and her whole shaggy dog storyline? the character has had zero development for about five years.

ulysses, Friday, 20 May 2016 15:57 (three years ago) link

I know it's been going round in circles for a bit now, but when her story is on point (such as in most of season/book 3) it's the most exhilarating and mythic section of the series. I have no idea why you would say she hasn't developed, although the majority of that development happened in the first three seasons, granted.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Friday, 20 May 2016 16:00 (three years ago) link

Dany's storyline promises big developments, so you watch it in anticipation of her gaining more momentum. When she's stuck in one place for too long it's extra excruciating.

Evan, Friday, 20 May 2016 16:00 (three years ago) link

i feel like her "development" stopped right around the time she walked out of the funeral pyre and she has been the arisen imperial one true queen full of haughty impervious attitude ever since.

ulysses, Friday, 20 May 2016 16:04 (three years ago) link

eh iirc there was a period when the dragons were still pups and she didn't quite believe her own hype and she'd say "I am the mother of DRAGONS" like she was trying to convince herself and more powerful people thought it was cute.

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Friday, 20 May 2016 16:13 (three years ago) link

Her transition in the books is a wee bit more nuanced and gradual, so maybe I'm projecting that onto the TV version, I dunno. And I agree that her story's been stalled for the last two seasons, and I don't think Clarke is a particularly good actor. Despite all that im still very fond of the characters and am rooting for her.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Friday, 20 May 2016 16:14 (three years ago) link

Where her character development might not be evolving much anymore, hopefully her storyline does the heavy lifting by finally moving her forward (on the map) again.

Evan, Friday, 20 May 2016 16:16 (three years ago) link

i did not read the books so will certainly defer to the likely possibility that she's more engaging there. i find Clarke to be the weakest actor on the show and the symbolism of the great white emancipator to be one of the greatest missteps in the mythology.

ulysses, Friday, 20 May 2016 16:16 (three years ago) link

Dany's storyline keeps veering between reality of foreign occupation and Neocon fantasies of killing badguy leaders and people falling to knees in awe.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Friday, 20 May 2016 16:18 (three years ago) link

the symbolism of the great white emancipator to be one of the greatest missteps in the mythology.

it's totally problematic, yes, and is kinda shown that way. That's what makes it interesting to me, moreso than some of the more standard medieval fantasy storylines, and especially ... Dorne.

sarahell, Friday, 20 May 2016 16:33 (three years ago) link

a deposed noblewoman in a foreign country going quasi-native and turning herself into a liberation/cult figure is a cool-ass idea but none of the people writing this shit are smart enough to make it interesting!!

goole, Friday, 20 May 2016 16:35 (three years ago) link

Didn't Heart of Darkness do that already?

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Friday, 20 May 2016 17:47 (three years ago) link

sarahell otm

I like the idea of Dany and I do like looking at her but there's also this sense that she's the least intelligent person with any sort of power in Westeros and having her "win" this thing would sort of go against everything the series has set up so far.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Friday, 20 May 2016 18:07 (three years ago) link

was thinking a bit about how the show presents different philosophies of rule and power. almost as if cersei (matriarchal, aggressive, protective of family, self-interested, power as its own legitimacy) and ned (patriarchal, concerned with order and law, hierarchical) represent those two extremes, with other characters with power (Tywin, Dany, Jon) falling along that continuum. Maybe Jon's big flaw is that he's too much like Ned, too trusting of impersonal systems of power at the expense of random, emotional or personal elements (and maybe he's over that now). Dany is parallel to Jon and also seems to be on a narrative that seeks to balance these impulses. Power as Law/Order/Tradition vs Power as something more chaotic but also more substantial, power as Will--one without the other always fails.

ryan, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:24 (three years ago) link

she's the least intelligent person with any sort of power in Westeros

she's a teenager! And I would hardly call her the least intelligent, she actually is capable of learning from experience.

sarahell, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:31 (three years ago) link

http://i.imgur.com/q3i0htD.jpg

ulysses, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:32 (three years ago) link

^ there's dozens of these to be found

ulysses, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:33 (three years ago) link

that one bizarrely leaves out cersei!!

ryan, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:34 (three years ago) link

as if a 3x3 grid wasn't nerdy enough ...

sarahell, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:35 (three years ago) link

wtf are these new alignments

Mordy, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:40 (three years ago) link

There is a frustrating (if unavoidable) contradiction at work in this show right now. It's awesome that developments have sped up. But if the end-goal remains what many have more or less predicted, then that sort of undercuts any drama and just leaves escapist entertainment. Which is fine, but weakens portent, because the faster it goes, the more fun/entertaining it becomes, yet the less room they have to maneuver around and tie up all the loose ends and mythology, if they're even going to bother. And some of those loose ends have become (imo) kind of tedious (like the sparrow's countless sit and talks, or Ramsey being evil). Some of the fan/viewer favorite compelling characters, like Dany and Jon, have become dead ends, because they *can't* die (again) and the pot of gold at the end of their story-rainbow is just waiting for them. And some of the show's best schemers, like Littlefinger and Tyrion, have been reduced to (un)canny operators with no clear role. I suppose the show could just upend any of these things, since it's already going away from the books,, but that would just in a way lessen the stakes even more and make things more chaotic.

Anyway, I'm enjoying this season, but all the early fealty to GRRM's machinations and twists and family trees and history and stuff has backed things into several different corners. Which could make a fun endless show, but ill-serves an episodic narrative that seems to be heading right where you think it's heading. Did like the question broached by a viewer in the Ask the Maester live chat: is Dany actually a bad guy? That would be kind of an interesting twist/idea, but don't know if they will/would/can go that route.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:41 (three years ago) link

mordy otm

goole, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:45 (three years ago) link

She's from a lineage if mad rulers!

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Friday, 20 May 2016 18:47 (three years ago) link

SPOILER-ish

also, to continue with my scheme, it would make sense if the end game included some kind of union of Jon (Law) and Dany (Will).

ryan, Friday, 20 May 2016 18:52 (three years ago) link

Is that a spoiler? I thought the only thing we knew about her was that she was a targaryen with claims to the throne?

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Friday, 20 May 2016 19:07 (three years ago) link

Yeah, not a spoiler.

Evan, Friday, 20 May 2016 19:09 (three years ago) link

oh i was thinking more about the role of Jon's lineage in the endgame--though it's not so much a spoiler these days.

ryan, Friday, 20 May 2016 20:52 (three years ago) link

It only is if it turns out to be true!

Evan, Friday, 20 May 2016 20:56 (three years ago) link

If it isn't it'll be a much bigger shock than if it is.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 20 May 2016 21:45 (three years ago) link

Some of the fan/viewer favorite compelling characters, like Dany and Jon, have become dead ends, because they *can't* die (again) and the pot of gold at the end of their story-rainbow is just waiting for them.

They can care about things (including, possibly, each other), and once they care about things, they can suffer even if they win.

Andrew Farrell, Friday, 20 May 2016 22:28 (three years ago) link

Yeah having Young Ned climb the Tower of Joy to just find his sister dead + no baby would be hilarious.

El Tomboto, Friday, 20 May 2016 22:30 (three years ago) link

I don't think there's any way that both Dany AND Jon survive the dragons v. zombies finale

El Tomboto, Friday, 20 May 2016 22:31 (three years ago) link

by the time they get to it, I don't think there's any way that both the cast members will live long enough

ulysses, Friday, 20 May 2016 22:38 (three years ago) link

dany and john can continue the proud targaryen heritage of incest if the rumors are true

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Friday, 20 May 2016 22:43 (three years ago) link

Targaryens incest[TM] is between siblings, and Dany would be Jon's aunt.

Jenny Ondioleeene (Leee), Friday, 20 May 2016 22:53 (three years ago) link

I get so bored I find myself wondering inane things. Where are the wildlings getting food? When they invade castle black and hugely outnumber the Knights watch then where are they being fed and where does the food come from? They don't have animals and can't grow anything. I know this is a fantasy show by the way.

Diana Rigg as head of the Tyrells is fucking awesome in this. Amazing performance. Grey worm is sure,y the worst performance other than that handsome chunky london accented guy who got beheaded in in dinaerys scenes the last season. Whatever happened to the guy who beheaded him btw? I forget.

CRANK IT YA FILTHY BISM! (jed_), Saturday, 21 May 2016 03:22 (three years ago) link

I feel a bit sorry for GRRM because whatever storyline(s) he'd come up with prior, the internet has so furiously worked out All Possible Outcomes that hes kinda fucked no matter what eventuates. He's been backed into a corner by the success of the show, and I dont blame him for freezing up on completing more books tbh. Caveat: havent read the books, the language frippery frustrated me.But at this point it seems like no matter what he does (or the showrunners for that matter) someone'll go AH HA I KNEW IT.

Fucking nerds.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Saturday, 21 May 2016 05:29 (three years ago) link

BTW jed OTM about Diana Rigg. She's my favourite thing in the show at this point.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Saturday, 21 May 2016 05:29 (three years ago) link

Do you think by the end of this season we'll find out whether or not Ramsay is evil?

Josh in Chicago, Saturday, 21 May 2016 13:05 (three years ago) link

The wildlings live off fish, game and raiding. Roughage from seaweed. Same as other societies north of arable land on our planet, I'd assume.

El Tomboto, Saturday, 21 May 2016 14:25 (three years ago) link

I'm sure GRRM has a few hundred pages on Wildling foraging and feasting

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Saturday, 21 May 2016 19:03 (three years ago) link

I see articles pointing out that Littlefinger said "Come and see" to Robin, the phrase repeAted in Ramsey's letter to Jon

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Saturday, 21 May 2016 19:13 (three years ago) link

pretty sure the 'come and see' in ramsey's letter is a revelations allusion

balls, Saturday, 21 May 2016 19:22 (three years ago) link

"come and see", yeah, an uncommon phrase like that is unlikely to be a coincidence I guess.

silverfish, Sunday, 22 May 2016 00:37 (three years ago) link

that was probably sarcastic but i do think that it's uncommon! at least, i've never said it, apart from when i subtly advertise my email subscription series of ocular erotica

I look forward to hearing from you shortly, (Karl Malone), Sunday, 22 May 2016 00:44 (three years ago) link

Pink Letter
Red Wedding
White Walkers
Green Day
Castle Black
Red Woman
Red Keep
Professor Plum
Greyjoy

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 22 May 2016 13:18 (three years ago) link

acc to this theory how does littlefinger know that sansa escaped ramsey and that he has rickon? inside source in winterfell?

Mordy, Sunday, 22 May 2016 13:29 (three years ago) link

I feel a bit sorry for GRRM because whatever storyline(s) he'd come up with prior, the internet has so furiously worked out All Possible Outcomes that hes kinda fucked no matter what eventuates. He's been backed into a corner by the success of the show, and I dont blame him for freezing up on completing more books tbh. Caveat: havent read the books, the language frippery frustrated me.But at this point it seems like no matter what he does (or the showrunners for that matter) someone'll go AH HA I KNEW IT.

This was the case even before the show, though.

Andrew Farrell, Sunday, 22 May 2016 13:44 (three years ago) link

OK holy shit that reveal

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 01:23 (three years ago) link

are they foregrounding the maesters conspiracy, which has been pretty much ignored prior to this?

balls, Monday, 23 May 2016 01:47 (three years ago) link

That was uneventful huh folks

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 02:04 (three years ago) link

Yeah seriously when is the plot gonna move forward sheesh I'm so done with this show

Star Wars ate shiitake (latebloomer), Monday, 23 May 2016 02:15 (three years ago) link

Hold the door :,,,,,(

Star Wars ate shiitake (latebloomer), Monday, 23 May 2016 02:16 (three years ago) link

https://twitter.com/majtague/status/734566361519804416

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 02:18 (three years ago) link

That was fucked up. Martin is fucked up. Had everybody out here making hodor jokes knowing full well what it meant.

tsrobodo, Monday, 23 May 2016 02:30 (three years ago) link

that was really silly lol

, Monday, 23 May 2016 02:40 (three years ago) link

now i know how star wars fans felt when it was reevaled the ewoks were badasses

, Monday, 23 May 2016 02:40 (three years ago) link

the whole bit where Varys couldn't help but go capital-S Skeptic on the high priestess was terrific. as was Sansa making Baelish feel like the worthless shitheel that he is.

fairy grenade was lame especially since it had barely any effect as a delaying action

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 03:17 (three years ago) link

ahahaha I am so done with this horseshit

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 23 May 2016 03:18 (three years ago) link

I'm on board.

Gukbe, Monday, 23 May 2016 03:30 (three years ago) link

me2 glad shit is finally happening hope it's all full speed ahead until the end

Mordy, Monday, 23 May 2016 03:30 (three years ago) link

I'm not mad or anything. it's just nothing has any dramatic weight any more. there's nothing in particular to hope for or fear, just things happening.

oh well I guess if brienne's getting sent to the riverlands there's another thing that could happen...

(sure there was pathos in the last few minutes but that last sequence was goofy af. like, army of darkness if it didn't know it was funny.)

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 23 May 2016 03:36 (three years ago) link

how about jorah off to go find the greyscale cure all by himself that's going to be amazing right

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 03:36 (three years ago) link

spin-off material there

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 23 May 2016 03:38 (three years ago) link

i feel stupid but i think my habit of half paying attention to things has really confused me. what exactly was going on with hodor at the end?

ryan, Monday, 23 May 2016 03:42 (three years ago) link

Game of thrones thinks its primer

, Monday, 23 May 2016 03:49 (three years ago) link

Also how dumb is Euron Greyjoy? Give away your best idea for what to do with the Ironborn fleet and then expect your relatives to just sit around and wait for you to murder them after you finish getting drowned! Yes, there is no way they'll steal your navy and your idea and just sail to Essos while you spit up seawater and get to wear some crown made out of driftwood.

OTOH if Yara & Theon sail for anywhere else, they completely deserve whatever's coming to them.

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 03:49 (three years ago) link

ah, primer indeed: http://www.vox.com/2016/5/22/11722146/game-of-thrones-season-6-recap-hodor-dies-bran-time-travel

yeah i thought it was maybe a heinlein type thing..and i guess it was.

ryan, Monday, 23 May 2016 03:51 (three years ago) link

This show lost its emotional stakes for me a few seasons ago when it became clear its ideology was primarily nihilistic and it wasn't worth attaching to any characters. Now I'm just looking to be entertained by the plot.

Mordy, Monday, 23 May 2016 04:01 (three years ago) link

Good luck, translators!

Van Horn Street, Monday, 23 May 2016 04:02 (three years ago) link

This show lost its emotional stakes for me a few seasons ago when it became clear its ideology was primarily nihilistic and it wasn't worth attaching to any characters. Now I'm just looking to be entertained by the plot.

mordy u r smart but this is nonsense. a plot without stakes is just a series of events.

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 23 May 2016 04:10 (three years ago) link

Nah like I don't care too much about any of the characters but I still want to see dragons and ships and zombies and shit go nuts

Mordy, Monday, 23 May 2016 04:12 (three years ago) link

shit went pretty nuts this night, also don't know if this is more or less nihilistic than other drama shows.

Van Horn Street, Monday, 23 May 2016 04:13 (three years ago) link

i dont get a nihilistic vibe from the show--in fact most of the protagonists that die seem to demonstrate a Point of some sort that's still developing.

ryan, Monday, 23 May 2016 04:17 (three years ago) link

though frankly if things end on a nihilistic note i'd probably respect its singularity of purpose (if not enjoy it).

ryan, Monday, 23 May 2016 04:18 (three years ago) link

i liked the hodor reveal

lag∞n, Monday, 23 May 2016 04:27 (three years ago) link

Hadn't even thought through the fact that it means Bran can possibly warg into things or affect other people in the past. Maybe he was the voice speaking from the fire when Varys got fixed. Who the fuck knows.

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 04:38 (three years ago) link

I feel kinda smug now because the white walker origin reveal is exactly what I thought it would be

Star Wars ate shiitake (latebloomer), Monday, 23 May 2016 04:59 (three years ago) link

Dope episode, imo

Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Monday, 23 May 2016 06:47 (three years ago) link

Are we supposed to know who the little green wood nymphettes are?

tobo73, Monday, 23 May 2016 10:00 (three years ago) link

the one rad episode a season - so insulting, so effective

r|t|c, Monday, 23 May 2016 11:08 (three years ago) link

So it took Littlefinger 10 episodes to get from Winterfell to the Vale, but then the episode after that he's back at Molestown? At this point I'm half expecting it to be foreshadowing for Littlefinger to be a warg of some sorts, able to turn himself into an eagle or whatever. Who even controls Moats Callin at this point?

The twist at the end of this episode has apparently been confirmed as coming from GRRM. Pretty amazing, imo.

Frederik B, Monday, 23 May 2016 12:35 (three years ago) link

Oh, right, Littefinger says he's troops are at Moats Callin. My bad.

Frederik B, Monday, 23 May 2016 12:37 (three years ago) link

she shdve killed him

lag∞n, Monday, 23 May 2016 12:41 (three years ago) link

This was directed by Jack Bender, which is probably why the ending felt a bit like Lost

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 23 May 2016 12:59 (three years ago) link

Feel sad for Hodor but aside from the warging and time travel it's so much like the cannibal in Death Line who repeats "Mind the doors" endlessly.

Don't see the nihilism either. I don't see that the stakes or principles of enjoyment have changed since the beginning.

The visualization of the Children Of The Forest is really jarring. Why the tv science fiction alien race bumpy face? Why the Green Goblin grenades?
Am I right that they created White Walkers to save the trees and it didn't go too well? I wasn't expecting a great origin story but I don't like this one as it currently seems to stand.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 23 May 2016 13:16 (three years ago) link

It's a bit screwy. According to the legends, the Children were the first people of Westeros. When the men came from Essos, they fought them bitterly, called upon magic to smash the landbridge connecting Dorne to Essos, flooded the Neck making it that much tougher getting to and from the North (which is why Moats Callin is so important, god dammit, and why Littlefinger shouldn't just turn up in Molestown proclaiming that he's taken the place). The White Walkers came during the Long Night, and was fought by men and children together. So. Something is off with the legends if the children actually created the walkers, though I suspect that is the case in the books as well. It makes a twisted kind of sense, and I think one of the Bran visions could be seen as hinting at it. Notice also how the walker is created in a land without snow, credence to the theory that they might have something to do with the strange way the seasons pass in the land.

There was a lot of history on the show, I also liked the story that the faceless men came from the mines of Valyria and founded Braavos. I'm not sure how that jibes with the books, but it's a nice story.

And that final sequence might be the best thing the show has ever done.

Frederik B, Monday, 23 May 2016 13:42 (three years ago) link

Oh yeah.. Kevin Eldon! Most surprising appearance so far.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 23 May 2016 13:53 (three years ago) link

i hode interesting dor

― usic, Sunday, September 14, 2008 10:08 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

am0n, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:02 (three years ago) link

So are Theon and crew going to sail to Dany with 20 ships to strike a fellowship before Euron and his 1000 ships arrive?

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 23 May 2016 14:08 (three years ago) link

i like the twist, but they didnt really set it up at all did they? who knew there were significant number of men loyal to theon's sister? no one really spoke up for her when the crazy uncle showed up. and how did they all sneak off during the drowning/coronation?

ryan, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:11 (three years ago) link

those ships seemed to matter quite a lot, you'd think they would be protected!

ryan, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:11 (three years ago) link

Yeah that was all a bit convenient for them, but for the sake of moving things along I'm OK with it.

Evan, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:12 (three years ago) link

so he held the door long enough for bran to get dragged what 30, 40 feet into the snow? they'll never get him now

am0n, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:13 (three years ago) link

It happens in the book as well, but... The whole thing is massively overcomplicated in the books, and the show streamlined it which left in a bunch of plotholes. Story of the last few seasons, kinda.

Frederik B, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:14 (three years ago) link

i was hoping the uncle wld just drown and everyone wld be all welp

lag∞n, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:15 (three years ago) link

Remembering the book now and remembering how there were like a dozen different plots of different characters all on their way to be Dany's husband. Glad the show is ignoring most of them.

dan selzer, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:18 (three years ago) link

Yes, that was a major WTF for me. As powerful as that scene was, it ultimately shows Hodor's purpose in life was to give a person dragging another person through deep snow maybe a football field of distance ahead of a super nimble undead army?

I guess next episode will probably just cut to them holding their lead but still.

xposts

Evan, Monday, 23 May 2016 14:19 (three years ago) link

Is Bran going to be trapped in trance state or something? Seems like he should have woken up given the minor racket.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 23 May 2016 15:02 (three years ago) link

Normally you have to click "eject" before disconnecting.

Evan, Monday, 23 May 2016 15:15 (three years ago) link

I kine of wondered if he hadn't already disconnected. On one hand, Hoder only did things like that when Bran was warged into him so you'd think he was in there, but on the other hand we want to believe that this was Hoder's whole life's purpose (at least since Bran went back and put that in his head, literally). I'm assuming Hoder was being a hero on his own at the end there, with a lot of mystical prompting past and present of course.

dan selzer, Monday, 23 May 2016 15:23 (three years ago) link

how many direwolves are left ?

(•̪●) (carne asada), Monday, 23 May 2016 15:30 (three years ago) link

2 technically(?) Arya's ran off, right? Otherwise there is Jon's.

Evan, Monday, 23 May 2016 15:31 (three years ago) link

I guess next episode will probably just cut to them holding their lead but still.

Nah. Next episode Coldhands / Friendly Zombie Benjen is going to have to show up and save them from certain death AGAIN. you watch.

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 16:44 (three years ago) link

Summer dying was such a drag :(

ian, Monday, 23 May 2016 16:44 (three years ago) link

good ol uncle benjen is gonna rescue bran.

dynamicinterface, Monday, 23 May 2016 16:49 (three years ago) link

calling it now: arya runs off with the mummers

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 23 May 2016 17:16 (three years ago) link

Otm re coldhands, this is exactly the time for him to butt in

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Monday, 23 May 2016 17:22 (three years ago) link

so he held the door long enough for bran to get dragged what 30, 40 feet into the snow? they'll never get him now

― am0n, Monday, May 23, 2016 10:13 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

otm

, Monday, 23 May 2016 17:32 (three years ago) link

final children of the forest death scene was so cliched

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha4Nvw4YFls

, Monday, 23 May 2016 17:33 (three years ago) link

exactly what I thought of

El Tomboto, Monday, 23 May 2016 17:34 (three years ago) link

I'm guessing this part of Arya's story will conclude soon. It's not always the most exciting plot thread but right now it's the one I'm most interested in seeing where it goes. There's pretty much no way she'll become a faceless person.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 23 May 2016 17:39 (three years ago) link

They've got to get on with it though! When she got her eyes back I was convinced that was that, but nope- more scenes of her getting whacked with a stick.

Evan, Monday, 23 May 2016 17:41 (three years ago) link

calling it now: arya runs off with the mummers

― Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, May 23, 2016 1:16 PM (29 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

like it

lag∞n, Monday, 23 May 2016 17:46 (three years ago) link

the setup for arya's impending departure from the house of black and white would've made more sense if she had kicked that girl's ass in their fight this episode. arya is established as a bad ass and it's time to move on. maybe that is too pat and obvious but the alternative - that she leaves and the whole drawn out experience hasn't really resulted in anything at all - is surely worse. it wasn't even close either, that girl fucked her up. the story should be about her instead.

Roberto Spiralli, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:08 (three years ago) link

the whole thing is shes not really cut out for this religious assassin life

lag∞n, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:13 (three years ago) link

I feel like they're driving towards her ultimately leaving without converting fully while still being able to abuse the face-swapping/fighting skillz she picked up during her training.

Evan, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:14 (three years ago) link

also like how far will she go against her presumed innate starkian qualities before turning back xp

Clay, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:15 (three years ago) link

What's a Stark quality? Dying?

Evan, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:17 (three years ago) link

She's gonna pull a Luke Skywalker.

dan selzer, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:18 (three years ago) link

I think a lot of that audience hates that girl and wants Arya to beat her up. I think the girl also has a bit of an ego for a supposedly faceless person and she might suffer for it.

I really don't think Arya will be able to complete the training because Jaqen will probably know if she still wants to be a Stark. And I don't think all this training will yield nothing.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:20 (three years ago) link

where did bran get the clothes he's wearing? didn't know there was a balmain x rick owens outlet in the big tree.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Monday, 23 May 2016 18:41 (three years ago) link

Did Littlefinger really expect Sansa to accept his claims of ignorance and his apology?

sarahell, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:48 (three years ago) link

final children of the forest death scene was so cliched
― 龜, Monday, May 23, 2016 1:33 PM

haha i could throw this grenade which is what you tend to do with them but nah i'll stand and hold it

am0n, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:51 (three years ago) link

tree also gives out cool bowl cuts to all students

am0n, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:53 (three years ago) link

Did Littlefinger really expect Sansa to accept his claims of ignorance and his apology?

― sarahell, Monday, May 23, 2016 2:48 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

prob not

lag∞n, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:56 (three years ago) link

just wondering what his game is, outside of inciting a war between North ppl that will ideally kill a lot of them off

sarahell, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:57 (three years ago) link

seems like hes just trying to get her to attack winterfell and the point of that meeting was to tell her that her uncle has an army that can help, once the boltons are gone he becomes the warden of the north

lag∞n, Monday, 23 May 2016 18:59 (three years ago) link

unless the other Northern houses are stoked on House Stark and then he has competition? Like wouldn't he want the Boltons and the Starks to die?

sarahell, Monday, 23 May 2016 19:00 (three years ago) link

cersei did promise it to him but ya obvs in reality it cld get messy, maybe hes planning on swooping in and defeating sansa after shes weakened from fighting the boltons, his whole scheme seems kinda weird and bad like what was the point of giving sansa to the boltons in the first place if he wants to replace them it just alienated her

lag∞n, Monday, 23 May 2016 19:10 (three years ago) link

all the gripes ITT are either nonsense or nbd, this was good. there's still scope for at least one more big face-swapping betrayal ala mission impossible 2, could make for a stylish exit for arya

ogmor, Monday, 23 May 2016 19:25 (three years ago) link

it's kinda his Gulf of Tonkin though

sarahell, Monday, 23 May 2016 19:25 (three years ago) link

whatever happened to Sansa, he would still conceivably win -- if she stayed with the Boltons and was mistreated, it would be a pretext for war, if she escaped the Boltons, it would still be a pretext for war.

sarahell, Monday, 23 May 2016 19:34 (three years ago) link

plants vs. zombies was fun

i like the arya joins the mummers concept. hope that happens

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 23 May 2016 19:34 (three years ago) link

yes, more rhyming

goole, Monday, 23 May 2016 19:45 (three years ago) link

was wondering why the children didn't have dragonglass weapons other than the one spear they threw

, Monday, 23 May 2016 19:50 (three years ago) link

they did when the first girl tried to hit him it just hit his armor

Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Monday, 23 May 2016 20:27 (three years ago) link

lol @ the actor kevin eldon
yay @ zombie fight

kinder, Monday, 23 May 2016 20:33 (three years ago) link

final children of the forest death scene was so cliched
― 龜, Monday, May 23, 2016 1:33 PM

haha i could throw this grenade which is what you tend to do with them but nah i'll stand and hold it

― am0n, Monday, May 23, 2016 2:51 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yeah but they swarm her if she holds it so better kill count. If she threw it they wouldn't have any reason to stop and accumulate so it'd be less effective DUUUUHHHH

Evan, Monday, 23 May 2016 20:54 (three years ago) link

Why did the children of the forest want to sacrifice themselves for Bran? I wasn't sure on that point, seemed overly altruistic

I am using your worlds, Monday, 23 May 2016 21:01 (three years ago) link

I think old tree dude is actually bran. That would explain it, I guess.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:04 (three years ago) link

he's not bran in the books

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:07 (three years ago) link

he's still just bran from the block

, Monday, 23 May 2016 21:08 (three years ago) link

Who is he in the books?

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:09 (three years ago) link

There's a theory that 3 eyed sparrow or Bran was behind the whispers that drove the Mad King mad

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:10 (three years ago) link

in the books he's brynden rivers, bastard of the mad king. also known as lord bloodraven

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:12 (three years ago) link

only to close friends

nashwan, Monday, 23 May 2016 21:22 (three years ago) link

Well the "now you become me" comment combined with the time warp suggests that this show wants him to be bran but what do i know?

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:29 (three years ago) link

well they omit all the bloodraven stuff in the show so you could be right. but i thought he just meant that he's old and his replacement is ready.

reggae mike love (polyphonic), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:32 (three years ago) link

Can you or can't you envision Max von Sydow as a young, legless britpoper is what it all boils down to, I guess.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:37 (three years ago) link

lost really did stuff to people's ability to watch televison huh

Clay, Monday, 23 May 2016 21:43 (three years ago) link

def

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Monday, 23 May 2016 21:47 (three years ago) link

Wonder who's idea it was to give Jon a man-bun?

Next episode preview shows the Lannisters gearing up to stop Margaery's walk of shame.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Monday, 23 May 2016 21:49 (three years ago) link

i was hoping the uncle wld just drown and everyone wld be all welp

― lag∞n, Monday, May 23, 2016 9:15 AM (11 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i was so ready for this

jason waterfalls (gbx), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 01:36 (three years ago) link

Me too.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 02:03 (three years ago) link

How did none of those guys notice them slip away and run off to the boats, though?

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 02:04 (three years ago) link

they were at the beach but the rest were at the marina

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 03:56 (three years ago) link

I love Eurons hubris. "oh. they took all our boats. WELP! LETS GO BUILD MORE COME ON PEOPLE HUP HUP"

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 04:06 (three years ago) link

Shit is certainly happening i guess.

ulysses, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 06:31 (three years ago) link

Lol at the idea of 50 ironborns making a thousand boats though.

human and working on getting beer (longneck), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 06:48 (three years ago) link

the euron guy is a p terrible actor. that whole scene was amusing but the "ironborn cheer and chant euron's name"/"ironborn murmur approval" were all kinda thin.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 07:31 (three years ago) link

I'm so bored of interminable scenes of Arya and that other girl stick fighting.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 07:58 (three years ago) link

The Euron guy is Danish actor Pilou Asbæk, who is pretty good in films such as A Hijacking, but clearly don't have the necessary grasp of the English language to play an intimidating leader.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 08:58 (three years ago) link

Emilia Clarke was good this week. Sansa/Brienne v Littlefinger scene was great. Lots of forward momentum storywise; good ep.
Was it Euron who was behind the burning of Dany's fleet of ships? He seemed to know a lot about her situation, and that she would be needing some boats asap.

painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture (DavidM), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 09:01 (three years ago) link

this show is going down the dumper very quickly. not having read the books there was so much of this that made no sense and/or was boring. The Bran storyline especially feels like it's been cut to ribbons. Characters / creatures just seem to turn up unannounced and without explanation. It's really hard to feel a connection to any of them when I literally haven't a clue who any of them are, what they're questing for, what they're talking about or why they're even doing all this stuff in the first place. 'Hold The Door' has to be the biggest shark-jumping moment of the show so far. And don't get me started on Arya. Why replay the same scene over and over again, week in week out with her getting beaten up and then getting told she's not ready yet when, y'know, they could explain who the tree women are or why some white walkers can walk through fire and others can't or even maybe who half the characters on the Bran quest EVEN ARE and why they're blindly helping this kid??

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 09:23 (three years ago) link

I think there's enough info for what is the biggest unfolding mystery of the story. I'm not really confused about any of the info so far.

I'm guessing the White Walker kings are just cold enough to withstand that level of fire.

'Hold The Door' has to be the biggest shark-jumping moment of the show so far.

Honestly?

Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 10:10 (three years ago) link

I figured the white walker boss men could cross the fire because Bran got scratched by the Night King - there was a line of dialogue roughly to that effect.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 10:37 (three years ago) link

Hold the door was a nice, and quite affecting, reveal. The show seems to be gaining momentum now it isn't so beholden to the books.

painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture (DavidM), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 10:39 (three years ago) link

I think the dialogue was about them being able to find and/or enter the cave, not cross the fire. I assumed the senior civil servant white walkers are just able to cross fire but the minions are not.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 10:42 (three years ago) link

I quite liked "hold the door" but the mention of Lost upthread has soured it a little for me. It did have a bit of that about it.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 10:43 (three years ago) link

I enjoyed the mummer's play actually - nice that it can still ease off the blood n zombies every now and then for that kind of textural world building detail. Plus Kevin Eldon. Didn't recognise Richard E Grant at all till he had de-wigged.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 10:44 (three years ago) link

I think Hold the Door worked well, felt like something GRRM had planned since the beginning.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 10:45 (three years ago) link

The white walkers can deal with fire, the zombies can't. I don't think the fire was the magic, the white walkers destroyed the magic with the pounding of the ground and the shaking and all that. That part of it was definitely weird.

Also, the show has kinda fallen down on the companions to Bran (except Hodor). Jojen and Meera Reed are introduced in book 2, and have much more depth in the books. Bran keeps on having visions, and dreams, and discussions with other people about things like the Children, which helps a lot when they show up. I also think another child pops up in book 3, in a completely different story, and they cut that out on the show. So that whole thing has kinda been underdeveloped. It's pretty weird and complex and dreamlike, though, so it's not that easy to portray.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 10:51 (three years ago) link

the mummers play was good yeah. not sure what the point of it was, other than showing that maybe the Starks (particularly Ned) weren't all as respected as we might have thought?

the whole 'Bran being scratched' thing - why did the tree man jeopardise him by taking him there in the first place? seems a bit weird.

Think 'Hold the Door' was a bit ruined for me by a fan theory which i shouldn't have read that said that Hodor was a warg and warged into Ned's sister's horse one too many times. I'm still a bit confused as to who was warging into who and from where at the end. I thought it was Bran in the past warging into Hodor in the present via his past self? Or was it Past-Hodor hearing the same voice as Bran and taking it on himself to warg into his future self so he could hold the door? Why doesn't Present-Hodor just hold the door anyway without any warging? I dunno...

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:11 (three years ago) link

so is there a difference between walkers and zombies now? what about those goblin things that chased Bran in the last episode of s5?

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:13 (three years ago) link

And who are these tree women? I don't remember them ever being introduced properly, they just seemed to rock-up? The whole a-ha moment with them creating the Walker-King felt very rushed and ill-explained because of that. I take it they're nature spirits or something, but why would they lose control of the Walkers if the were the case? Another climate-change analogy?

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:15 (three years ago) link

The whole 'White King can see you and find you now' is very LOTR Wring Wraiths. I don't know why they decided to hang around a bit to do more pointless warging considering the very real and imminent danger.

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:16 (three years ago) link

are you doing something else while you are watching the show?

Roberto Spiralli, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:24 (three years ago) link

Mummers play was to show Arya not being able to let go of Stark past and become nobody or w/e

Tree man didn't take him there. Bran touched the tree without guidance or permission and ended up at the same place but in the present.

Hodor is normally a cowherd and wouldn't have hodor'd without being warged into.

Pretty sure Bran was warged into Hodor both in the past and the present creating the link that destroyed his mind.

Always been a difference between walkers and zombies. Zombies don't get the cool ice swords and undead ice horses and don't get to wear death metal costumes. Goblin things you mention were zombies iirc

Children of the forest weren't introduced very well, if at all.

I'm guessing tree man knew that Bran needed to be there at that exact moment in time for history to be fulfilled and Hodor to Hodor. The fact that he encourages Bran to warg into Hodor while in the past supports this.

tsrobodo, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:25 (three years ago) link

paying attention so you don't have to

ogmor, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:28 (three years ago) link

The walkers are ancient beings, there aren't that many of them. The zombies are dead people raised again by the walkers, there are more and more of them. The children of the forrest are the first inhabitants of Westeros, before the humans came over from Essos thousands of years ago, though most people believe them to be legendary like the walkers.

I get the confusion, though. If it wasn't for the books giving out a guideline for people like the guy doing 'Ask the Maester' I think there would be a whole lot more confusion.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:29 (three years ago) link

don't get to wear death metal costumes.

More like black metal costumes if I'm allowed to be a metal pedant.

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 11:47 (three years ago) link

the mummers play seemed to presuppose a lot of political knowledge from the commoner audience, everybody in braavos must read the newspapers closely

A show has no plot

calstars, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 12:18 (three years ago) link

I thought the play mostly showed how the commoners rely on rumor and prejudice. It's all blamed on Tyrion, who wasn't even in Kings Landing when it happened, he only became Hand of the King afterwards. Stark is portrayed as a stupid bumpkin with a weird accent, probably anti-Northern prejudice. Robert is fat and farting. The heroes are the blond and beautiful.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 12:20 (three years ago) link

I also liked how they were terrified of Tyrion marrying Sansa. A completely pointless thing in the grander scheme of the plot, but for everyone outside, the thought of a middle aged dwarf marrying a beautiful young maiden is absolutely horrifying, and must be proof to hist lustful evilness.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 12:22 (three years ago) link

http://i.imgur.com/WRCnkuT.jpg

, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 12:30 (three years ago) link

http://i.imgur.com/9uJ4CZu.jpg

, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 12:34 (three years ago) link

I can't believe Hodor's origin story turns out to be the punchline to a racist joke I heard in middle school.

a 47-year-old chainsaw artist from South Carolina (Phil D.), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 12:35 (three years ago) link

hey guys I was confused during that flashback Arya was watching. Did they totally recast Ned and Joffrey and Tyrion? Contract issues? Sansa's boobs were a body double's right? Show is going down the dumper.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 13:32 (three years ago) link

Nah, it just looks different than you remember because every actor and actress has gone through puberty since then.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 13:40 (three years ago) link

they obviously can't guarantee getting sean bean or joffrey to come back for it, but duh, that was tyrion. dwarves are allowed to have a different haircut too!

xpost

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 13:42 (three years ago) link

oh yeah guess i was fooled by the fake nose!

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 13:46 (three years ago) link

And how could it be anyone but roly poly lovable Northern rogue and star of the Full Monty Richard E Grant as King Robert?

the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 13:56 (three years ago) link

it was nice they evened up the nudity by that split-second shot of possibly a ballsack

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 13:59 (three years ago) link

1 ballsack, 10,000 breasts

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:00 (three years ago) link

the golden ratio

ogmor, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:03 (three years ago) link

6 seasons and a ballsack

nashwan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:05 (three years ago) link

I can't keep track of any of the characters in this show. Was the guy farting on the stage the Night King?

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:10 (three years ago) link

I quite liked "hold the door" but the mention of Lost upthread has soured it a little for me. It did have a bit of that about it.

It at least established that everything we've seen so far has either happened because or in spite of what Bran does in the past. So if he can change bits of the past he can't change the events of the show (ie magically saving Ned or whatever). Which would be a massive shark-jumping moment.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:12 (three years ago) link

10,000 breasts when all you need is a sack

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:14 (three years ago) link

Did Littlefinger really expect Sansa to accept his claims of ignorance and his apology?

Littlefinger isn't that dumb but I genuinely don't think he's prepared for Sansa's ongoing transition from passive princess/Key to the North to Joan of Arc.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:15 (three years ago) link

I can't keep track of any of the characters in this show. Was the guy farting on the stage the Night King?

The Yellow King IIRC.

Chewshabadoo, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:18 (three years ago) link

UGH they don't explain ANYTHING!

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:19 (three years ago) link

I gotta say I did love Brienne telling Littlefinger, "Lady Sansa asked you a question," and his realization that she would straight up kill him if given the order.

a 47-year-old chainsaw artist from South Carolina (Phil D.), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 14:29 (three years ago) link

why doesn't someone just kill him? like he's supposed to be some genius arch-manipulator, but really he just acts like a dick and everyone hates him. it seems amazing he has lasted so long in this world.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:05 (three years ago) link

he looks suspiciously like a human version of the Night King. it's too confusing, also read fan theory somewhere that they are the same person

sarahell, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:13 (three years ago) link

here for Brienne x Tormund

also Brienne's description of Jon as "a bit brooding". should've seen him before he died.

Roz, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:18 (three years ago) link

I guess Littlefinger is useful to people so they don't kill him.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:27 (three years ago) link

Littlefinger betrayed Ned Stark to Cersei and Joffrey, then brought Tywin to the battle of Blackwater in the nick of time. He orchestrated a lot of the chaos and ensured his side would win, in the bargain ending up a grand lord. Then he took off with Sansa and brought her to her aunt, whom he married, and started consolidating his power in the most easily defendable part of the continent. Then he sold Sansa to Ramsey which... Yeah, I don't get that part either...

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:32 (three years ago) link

sansa shdve killed him tho

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:32 (three years ago) link

he looks suspiciously like a human version of the Night King. it's too confusing, also read fan theory somewhere that they are the same person

― sarahell, Tuesday, May 24, 2016 11:13 AM (19 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

There's a nutty fan theory for everything. We know what the previously human Night King looks like because of this most recent episode.

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:34 (three years ago) link

According to awoiaf, Littlefingers first benefactor was the Tullys, where he was fostered, whom he repaid by sleeping with Lysa Tully and embarrassing Catelyn when he challenged her betrohed, Brandon Stark, to a duel. Then Jon Arryn became his new benefactor, and he kept on sleeping with his wife Lysa, and in the end they poisoned him. This is probably where he was quite lucky to not be caught and killed.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:40 (three years ago) link

R.I.P. my joke post

sarahell, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:40 (three years ago) link

can we speculate freely on this thread now? in any case i was reading the wiki for the children and this part was interesting:

For roughly 2,000 years the two races fought a desperate war for dominance. The children used their magic to shatter the Arm of Dorne, the land-bridge through which the First Men came, in a futile attempt to end the invasion and later flooded the Neck - where legend has it that the children called upon their gods from the Children's Tower to send the hammer of the waters to smash the Neck, as they smashed the Arm of Dorne, but it was not enough to stop the advance of the First Men. The histories say that some of the First Men, the crannogmen, grew close to the children of the forest in the days when the greenseers tried to bring the hammer of the waters down upon the Neck.[5]

Eventually the First Men and the children fought one another to a standstill. The two races agreed to peaceful coexistence and signed the Pact on the Isle of Faces, granting the open lands to humanity and the forests to the children.

The Pact lasted for 4,000 years before the enigmatic Others invaded from the uttermost north, bringing death and destruction to both races, during an extended period of winter known as the Long Night. The children of the forest joined with the First Men, lead by the last hero, to fight against the Others in the Battle for the Dawn. Eventually the Others were driven back into the Lands of Always Winter.

so...if they created the Others during that 2000 year war why did it take 4000 more years for the Others to become a problem? im sure there's an explanation, it's just a weird timeline.

ryan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:42 (three years ago) link

You know, it's so in line with fan theories that actually exist that I didn't even blink.

xp

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:42 (three years ago) link

Not your fault though I skimmed over the "it's too confusing" giveaway.

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:44 (three years ago) link

Then he sold Sansa to Ramsey which... Yeah, I don't get that part either...

I figured that was his way to break the Boltons from the Lannisters. And Cersei sent him to take Winterfell so it worked i guess.

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:44 (three years ago) link

every time i hear night king i think
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzaVd6zl2bA

ulysses, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:45 (three years ago) link

A show has no plot

― calstars,

lol - just wanna give some respect for this one

Οὖτις, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:48 (three years ago) link

did anyone ever watch the youtube back history videos, with the story told via a series of drawings and narration from some of the actors?

i reckon i enjoyed them as much as the show. i recommend them highly. they also give a good context for everything and remove the need to read the books.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 15:59 (three years ago) link

i liked those videos a lot. i think one of the main strengths of Martin's universe is the layered and complex historical/mythological context.

ryan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:00 (three years ago) link

yeah they were really nicely made - and short enough that i found myself just checking them out bit by bit.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:02 (three years ago) link

hey guys I was confused during that flashback Arya was watching. Did they totally recast Ned and Joffrey and Tyrion? Contract issues? Sansa's boobs were a body double's right? Show is going down the dumper.

― Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, May 24, 2016 9:32 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark

but within the show we're watching average citizens playacting as the characters we know, so why would the show cast the actors we know as those characters in the play instead of new actors who look kinda like them? to have sean bean playing an actor impersonating ned stark would be weird & wouldn't make any sense

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:16 (three years ago) link

as for littlefinger he more or less fled to a place he knew he would be protected and disappeared for like multiple seasons. he ventured out again to see sansa -- which was a miscalculation on his part because he prob underestimated her & she could have brianne kill him -- but i suspect she doesn't mind having him around because he's already shown a willingness to go to great lengths to protect her and because he has this devotion to her she prob feels like she can manipulate him if need be (and in this episode we see her manipulate jon)

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:19 (three years ago) link

Plus, when his head gets chopped off and you pause it you can clearly see it's not the actor's real head.

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:19 (three years ago) link

the guts were real tho i think

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:21 (three years ago) link

but within the show we're watching average citizens playacting as the characters we know, so why would the show cast the actors we know as those characters in the play instead of new actors who look kinda like them? to have sean bean playing an actor impersonating ned stark would be weird & wouldn't make any sense

it would be more obviously ned stark. the fact they cast another acting as someone ACTING as ned stark confused me at the beginning. still not sure i understand it really.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:22 (three years ago) link

thought ned died but in this show who knows.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:22 (three years ago) link

Can no longer tell who is taking the piss itt

Mordy, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:30 (three years ago) link

I liked the theater scene anyway - felt somewhat Shakespearean

Mordy, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:30 (three years ago) link

Maybe Ned was warging the actor playing Ned in the play

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:30 (three years ago) link

Can no longer tell who is taking the piss itt

― Mordy, Tuesday, May 24, 2016 12:30 PM (26 seconds ago) Bookmark

me either!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

it's sort of fun actually because i can usually tell who is getting mocked in a thread

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:31 (three years ago) link

leaving aside how ned stark came back to life - he did seem a bit different also when playing himself in the play. sending a message to arya?

he is looking great tho, hasn't aged a day since the devil's own.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:33 (three years ago) link

hey guys I was confused during that flashback Arya was watching. Did they totally recast Ned and Joffrey and Tyrion? Contract issues? Sansa's boobs were a body double's right? Show is going down the dumper.

― Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, May 24, 2016 9:32 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark

but within the show we're watching average citizens playacting as the characters we know, so why would the show cast the actors we know as those characters in the play instead of new actors who look kinda like them? to have sean bean playing an actor impersonating ned stark would be weird & wouldn't make any sense

― J0rdan S., Tuesday, May 24, 2016 12:16 PM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol my post was making fun of dog latin's questions

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:33 (three years ago) link

i assumed you were being sincere.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:34 (three years ago) link

feel so stupid now. of course that wasn't sean bean.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:35 (three years ago) link

i think it was sean bean

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:35 (three years ago) link

oh lol dog latin's questions must have been under the fold for me

:-)

J0rdan S., Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:36 (three years ago) link

oi LG and ryan: which set of vids do you mean? there are many many many explainer vids on youtube...

goole, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:36 (three years ago) link

There's too many characters

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:36 (three years ago) link

it was some has bean

ulysses, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:37 (three years ago) link

I think the videos were included in a DVD box

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:38 (three years ago) link

ohhhhh

goole, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:39 (three years ago) link

i think it was sean bean

otm that's what i thought

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:39 (three years ago) link

i don't think it would have made sense to cast sean bean?

, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:40 (three years ago) link

it was cool how they had jaime lannister playing ned/sean bean/actor playing sean bean guy, when bran warged back to warg into hodor. really messed with my head!

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:41 (three years ago) link

why not hes good u dont like him xp

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:41 (three years ago) link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0t0uCWjQ6Og

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:41 (three years ago) link

tho i read a theory that was the original rob stark xpost

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:41 (three years ago) link

who better to play an actor playing sean bean than sean bean?

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:42 (three years ago) link

its the perfect role if you think abt it

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:43 (three years ago) link

I hope they reveal who Warg really is next episode.

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:43 (three years ago) link

warg is an acronym we know that much

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:46 (three years ago) link

warg is a feeling

ulysses, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:47 (three years ago) link

I think the videos were included in a DVD box

yes, and narrated by the actors not some randos.

ryan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:50 (three years ago) link

Without Any Religion, God

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1Kj8K-vlrQE/0.jpg

Andrew Farrell, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:51 (three years ago) link

Oh great, was Daario recast again?

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:53 (three years ago) link

what's theon greyjoy got to do with this?

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:53 (three years ago) link

lol

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:53 (three years ago) link

one thing this show loves to do is have characters give meaningful, heartfelt speeches and then someone nearby says "yeah but you have no penis" and everyone laughs

ulysses, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:55 (three years ago) link

It was weird when they did that after Cersei's speech

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:56 (three years ago) link

the ultimate own

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:56 (three years ago) link

i admit i laughed when Euron (sp?) responded to Theon's use of "galvanting" with "is that the kind of word you use when your cock has been cut off?" or something like that.

ryan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:56 (three years ago) link

so...if they created the Others during that 2000 year war why did it take 4000 more years for the Others to become a problem? im sure there's an explanation, it's just a weird timeline.
― ryan, 24. maj 2016 17:42 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I wrote a bit about this upthread, but I'm guessing the histories might be wrong. After all, they're mainly based on legends. The 4000 year peace might be self-serving from the human perspective. I hope some more info will come in book 6.

Frederik B, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 16:59 (three years ago) link

oh ok. because it definitely feels like *something* is missing from that account.

ryan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 17:00 (three years ago) link

i really hope the TV show and the books have different endings

, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 17:00 (three years ago) link

I feel like the climax of this season will obv be the revelation of whatever is going on inside the tower (which we can presume). and perhaps Dany setting sail for Westeros.

ryan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 17:01 (three years ago) link

Was that guy playing the Sean Bean character the comedian guy who has appeared in Stewart Lee stuff and Nighty Night?

Stevolende, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 17:21 (three years ago) link

I think it was Sean Bean

, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 17:27 (three years ago) link

glad we settled that now whats this abt a tower and whats going on inside

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 17:29 (three years ago) link

also i was just made aware of the R + L = M theory as well, which is intriguing.

ryan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 17:31 (three years ago) link

The Tower of Joy is the guy from Fawlty Towers iirc

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 17:40 (three years ago) link

http://watchersonthewall.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Kevin-Eldon-263x300.jpg
Kevin Eldon whose name I couldn't think of earlier, if I've ever really known it.

Stevolende, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:15 (three years ago) link

2013 People's Sexiest Man Alive apparently

ulysses, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:17 (three years ago) link

Think I've read somewhere that he's an actor rather than a comedian?

Dadjokke (Sgt. Biscuits), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:23 (three years ago) link

I initially assumed that the fact he was playing an actor on the show was an injoke about that but it was actually super unclear whether he was meant to be playing an actor or actual resurrected Ned Stark

Dadjokke (Sgt. Biscuits), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:26 (three years ago) link

a good picture of sean bean

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:26 (three years ago) link

ned's back, baby!

Clay, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:28 (three years ago) link

he was in the tower then he came out!

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:29 (three years ago) link

Seeing him alive and then beheaded again was a rollercoaster for me.

Evan, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:31 (three years ago) link

it was obviously a fake head though, think it was just their way of slyly confirming the fan theory re how he survived the execution in season 1

Dadjokke (Sgt. Biscuits), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:33 (three years ago) link

I thought about the earliest appearance I'd seen of Kevin had him doing a stand up routine on a show introduced by Stewart Lee.
Could be he's better known as an actor now. Wonder if we'll see much more of him & the troupe in this?

Stevolende, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:37 (three years ago) link

Was the actual execution of Ned Stark in season 1 fake or did they actually execute a fake Ned Stark?

silverfish, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:37 (three years ago) link

or (given that this is Game of Thrones) was it a fake execution of a fake Ned Stark?

silverfish, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:38 (three years ago) link

does GOT exist in the lost universe

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:41 (three years ago) link

not sure why yous are so obsessed with who's playing who, it's called ACTING, there's no reason why sean bean should play sean bean

sean bean shd play sean bean because hes been sean

lag∞n, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:44 (three years ago) link

I think the circei actress is the lead in miss fishers murder mysteries show from australia that my wife is obsessed with

carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:52 (three years ago) link

In other news, seems like a lot pof people's suspicions itt have been confirmed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMI_HBO5FOM

tsrobodo, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 18:56 (three years ago) link

Ask The Maester is live right now

https://www.facebook.com/ringer/videos

groovypanda, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 19:09 (three years ago) link

does GOT exist in the lost universe

It was noticeable that there were no polar bears north of the Wall.

Probably off gallivanting in Dorne or something.

groovypanda, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 19:12 (three years ago) link

The Cersei actress is Essie Davis, she was in the Babadook.

nate woolls, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 19:14 (three years ago) link

&does apparently play Miss Fisher in yer gf's fav rave, like.

Stevolende, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 19:40 (three years ago) link

Cersei Lannister appears in Marmaduke?

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 19:45 (three years ago) link

better than the other way around i guess

goole, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 19:50 (three years ago) link

Essie Davis is also the short haired crew member in the last 2 Matrix films.
Do love those cheekbones.

Stevolende, Tuesday, 24 May 2016 21:13 (three years ago) link

cool they brought sean bean back to play whoever this kevin eldon character that ned stark has returned as is. is. bean.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 24 May 2016 23:50 (three years ago) link

This thread is bringing the major lols, good work all.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 00:40 (three years ago) link

How long will it take Euron's 40 men and their families to make a thousand ships do you think?

CRANK IT YA FILTHY BISM! (jed_), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 01:06 (three years ago) link

you all haven't considered that turn out at a kingsmoot is comparable to that of a municipal election? This could be like 5% of the Iron Island population

sarahell, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 01:07 (three years ago) link

If there were 5% there would only be around 800. Yes, of course I'm being stupidly disingenuous but the arithmetic on this show is ridiculous considering there were about one man to each of the ships they stole.

Although none of that was as wtf as the cock and balls close up of the young guy playing Joffrey in the play.

CRANK IT YA FILTHY BISM! (jed_), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 01:15 (three years ago) link

One man in yen gathered company to each of the stolen ships, I mean.

CRANK IT YA FILTHY BISM! (jed_), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 01:17 (three years ago) link

What a crap episode. I like that they're speeding things up, but it's so annoying and slapdash. As yet motiveless (yet not unthinking?) snow zombies not threatening and silly, like any CGI horde(or). And super lame that the huge CGI snow zombie horde is apparently the only time you ever see a number of anything gathered in one place in this show, whose every scene appears to be 2-3 people talking with 20 people standing in the background, like a stage play rather than a big budget epic. It's bad enough that they don't have enough computer money to show dragons or that the same limitations have made them take out wolves at a, er, dire pace, but why does this huge film-around-the-world production cultural juggernaut suddenly seem so cheap and backlot? And even gullible Sansa, who finally gets a chance to stand up to someone, is immediately taken advantage of in dumb fashion.

"I don't trust you anymore and should just kill you!"

"What if I told you ... your uncle the Black Adder has gathered his army to defend you?"

"He did? Oh, that's great news! OK, now go back wherever you came from."

"Um, Sansa, don't you think we should send a raven to confirm that intel?"

"Nah, what's the worst that can happen? Besides, we have not seen a raven in this show in several season, I think the raven budget has been severely curtailed."

At least we finally find out how Hodor got his name. It's the number one reason people have been watching the show, and I was convinced that wasn't going to be revealed until the very end of the last book. Now if only they would establish whether Ramsay is a bad guy or not.

RIP green nature sprite, whatever you were, whoever you were, killed by the things you somehow created for some reason to do something.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 03:09 (three years ago) link

Ask the Maester:

RIP, Three-Eyed Raven. You were a bad teacher of greenseeing, my dude. If the fate of the world hinged on my ability to pass on my knowledge, I’d tell my only student, “DON’T LET THE NIGHT’S KING TOUCH YOU,” five times a day.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 03:11 (three years ago) link

Did you not just read the last jillion posts, or.

xpost

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 03:12 (three years ago) link

Prolly not, I just saw the episode so was avoiding the thread.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 03:16 (three years ago) link

Whenever I see the wildling head guy I think of Graham Chapman in "Yellowbeard:"
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/ba/13/24/ba132487cd9feaa999512e120804f2a8.jpg

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 03:22 (three years ago) link

How long will it take Euron's 40 men and their families to make a thousand ships do you think?

Once they have built the ship factory and assembly line I reckon they could knock out around 50 a day? Give or take a weekend or two they should be good to go in a month.

For bodies we are ready to build pyramids (wtev), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 05:36 (three years ago) link

Maybe he wants them to make model ships?

Chewshabadoo, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 06:33 (three years ago) link

It reminded me of that bit in Vikings where the lead guy was like "fuck it lets go OVER THE CLIFF with our boats!" and next thing you know theyre in Paris.

Stoop Crone (Trayce), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 06:52 (three years ago) link

Iron Islands seem pretty light on trees, and you'd think their obsession with boats (and habit of losing battles) would have further depleted their forests. So tack on a few more months of gathering supplies, or a few more years of growing trees.

Anyway, Oliver Reed in "Baron Munchausen:"
http://www.chud.com/articles/content_images/106/BARON/bmReed.jpg

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 11:46 (three years ago) link

The Iron Islands are supposedly a quite big landmass all in all, so there should be a lot of trees. But they've never made particularly sense to me. They are poor areas, sparsely populated, and there really aren't that many trade routes nearby they can raid. It's as if the people of the Hebrides decided to try and conquer Scotland. Like, how?

Frederik B, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 12:21 (three years ago) link

Maybe Bran can travel back in time and tell them to plant extra trees.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 12:40 (three years ago) link

tormund mostly reminds me of pirate steve from dodgeball

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 12:56 (three years ago) link

There aren't many trees in the Hebrides either.

CRANK IT YA FILTHY BISM! (jed_), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 13:40 (three years ago) link

I have a crazy fan theory regarding the Iron Islands, so bear with me here. I believe that they're subtly implying there are even MORE men and trees somewhere off screen. If my theory is true, they'll have at least double the 40 men shown on the screen or more, and if the tree part is true as well they'll be able to build those ships after all. I wonder if Yara and Theon knew about this or if they were placing their bets on it taking hundreds of years for 40 men to build 1,000 boats out of imported wood. If so, hoooo man they're in for a BIG surprise!

Evan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 13:42 (three years ago) link

I'm not sure Euron literally meant 1000 ships. I doubt they even have room for all that.

I was also hoping Euron would just drown or fail ridiculously.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 13:45 (three years ago) link

We've been a bit short on hubristic chumps lately so he's a very welcome presence, especially as they Iron Islands have been 100% tedious every other time they've appeared.

Matt DC, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 13:47 (three years ago) link

I like Euron, but I wish there were more opportunities for him to say "brutha" like he did in his first scene. the whole "lets just rebuild our fleet while they get a few months (at least?) head start" thing is odd though.

ryan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 13:49 (three years ago) link

Actor playing Euron was also in that c4 show about a stag weekend where a bunch of lads and the stag went to shoot stags on a stag hunt. Can't remember the name of it.

kinder, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 13:49 (three years ago) link

100% treeless more like. Xp

CRANK IT YA FILTHY BISM! (jed_), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 13:50 (three years ago) link

xpost I was sooooo hoping he would drown, to keep with the contemporary comedy beats of this season. Would have been too conspicuously hilarious for the show to pull off, though.

"Drink! Drink deep of the Drowned God! Let him into your lungs! Accept the salt until your blood turns saline! Breath! Drink and breathe, and die, so that you might live forever!! And now ... rise again!"
...
(clears throat) "And so I say ... rise again!!!!"
(Nudges his motionless body with his foot)
"Aw, shit. Where are Yara and Theon?"
"They fled, my lord, along with all of our boats and our legion of invisible extras."
"Dammit! Fucking Kingsmoot, I thought this shit was supposed to work. Well, I guess it was worth a shot. Now let's build some boats!"

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 13:59 (three years ago) link

I think the lack of trees on the Iron Islands means that someone used them all to build a 1000 ship fleet and is hiding it in their bathtub

Blowout Coombes (President Keyes), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:04 (three years ago) link

"Now build me a bathtub! The biggest bathtub the world has ever seen! The Iron Born will be a joke no longer!!!!"

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:07 (three years ago) link

I quite like the scenes there, it's a pretty cool place. I liked the bridge scene.

Robert Adam Gilmour, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:20 (three years ago) link

theyre all so depressed and bitter and wear drab clothing

lag∞n, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:27 (three years ago) link

The Ironborn parts were the mitigating factors in this. Got some neat unintentional Hillary v Trump vibes off those scenes, plus Euron is hilarious - part psychotic Amsterdam hosteler, part overenthusiastic skydive instructor.

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:44 (three years ago) link

Part Live Schreiber as Sabertooth!
http://static1.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/3/33572/1011696-sabretooth_08.jpg

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:46 (three years ago) link

Liev, gah. Stupid computer.

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:46 (three years ago) link

Euron Swanson more like

nashwan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:47 (three years ago) link

next GoT theater play should be "Euron First" (parody of Who's On First)

, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 14:51 (three years ago) link

What a crap episode.

The last couple episodes have been my favorites in quite a while. Though not particularly well-structured or clever, they've catered to my sympathies and no one got raped. Loved Dany's immolation of the chest men. Loved her moist-eyed reunion w/ the woeful Ser. Loved Hodor doing that, Sansa getting all steely, and Theon enjoying a moment of relative dignity (however fleeting). I'm beyond glad we're out of that dismal old Sydow tree and hope soon to see the last of the Faceless Men. Glad too that that the Iron Throne is finally at least considering a response to High Sparrow's coup. Hate that smug fuck almost as much as Ramsey B.

But yeah, all criticisms otm. Uncle Spouty's "now run off and meet me back here tomorrow with a thousand ships" business was comedy. Esp as the Iron Islands have always been presented as A) barren, and B) basically uninhabited. Was so hoping he'd stay drowned. And Sansa's continued gullibility is such lazy writing.

da vinci beaver testicles (contenderizer), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:11 (three years ago) link

I'm not sure where this Iron Islands presented as barren stuff keeps coming from. They've merely only depicted the shore and castle areas, maybe a port as well. Otherwise it's not that far-fetched to assume there are non-barren sections...

Evan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:17 (three years ago) link

The Ironborn are just hilarious. The whole lot of them are absolutely deluded in their station.

TARANTINO! (dog latin), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:22 (three years ago) link

I'm not sure where this Iron Islands presented as barren stuff keeps coming from.

comes from what we've seen, inc the little model in the intro. of course it's possible that the iron islands also contain trees, factories, cocoa pebbles, etc.

da vinci beaver testicles (contenderizer), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:22 (three years ago) link

I don't remember the exact image in the intro model but I'm sure it focuses on the iconic castle with peripheral towns/villages not necessarily emphasized. I had more of an issue with the criticism that the 40ish men surrounding Euron are for some reason the only or majority of people still on the island after Theon & Yara flee.

Evan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:28 (three years ago) link

criticism hinging on the idea that*

Evan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:29 (three years ago) link

Trees actually do well on the Iron Islands and we get almost offended when people say otherwise – as stupid as that sounds.

https://wowair.us/magazine/trees-in-iceland/

niels, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:33 (three years ago) link

From awoiaf -

"The Iron Islands are small, barely-fertile rocks with few safe harbors. The seas around the islands are stormy, frequently wreaking havoc with their considerable force."

Hydroelectric New Deal Demiurge (B.L.A.M.), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:34 (three years ago) link

I think since the beginning of the show they've skimped on crowd scenes, CGI or otherwise, to a degree that has let many scenes feel strangely underwhelming. I think if you watch the show and just assume there's another couple hundred people in any scene that seems like there should be more people, it makes more sense.

dan selzer, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:34 (three years ago) link

but the iron born will just go steel the wood to build ships right? that's what they do.

dan selzer, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:35 (three years ago) link

Who wood they steel from?

Evan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:37 (three years ago) link

i hope they find some hair conditioner on their travels

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:37 (three years ago) link

Windy salty air does that to hair.

Evan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:38 (three years ago) link

wood steel iron throne

dan selzer, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:41 (three years ago) link

what is dreads may never die

xpost

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:44 (three years ago) link

I think since the beginning of the show they've skimped on crowd scenes, CGI or otherwise, to a degree that has let many scenes feel strangely underwhelming. I think if you watch the show and just assume there's another couple hundred people in any scene that seems like there should be more people, it makes more sense.

pretty much this. When I watch this show I just imagine that everything is happening on a grander scale than what is actually depicted. Basically just like when you watch Star Trek or similar shows you just have to assume that there are more than 12 people living on the planet they are currently on.

silverfish, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:46 (three years ago) link

I think it has been stretched thin for certain scenes in an even more visible way this season, even though I believe the budget is now huge. like certain scenes just feel really cheap and weak, and they're not helped by bad acting or crappy functional writing. Whenever Dario appears or basically anywhere sandy it becomes a bit sort of stock or something. like certain locations have no real character to them and no chance for you to feel any affinity to them - they just kind of appear. i think the show generally has more weight when people are in dark medieval-type sets, or in the ice and snow near the wall. all the sunny or desert places and costumes and characters have a pretty cheesy feel to them.

not slating the show, i like it fine. i just think you can see the joins sometimes as they try to tell so many stories all at once.

japanese mage (LocalGarda), Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:51 (three years ago) link

Maybe I'm just better at ignoring this stuff than other people. I mean I definitely noticed the Star Trek-like sets when Dario and Jorah were in Dothraki City, but it doesn't really affect my enjoyment of the show. Same thing with the Iron Islands, if they say there's enough people and wood to build a fleet of ships I just assume that it's true, I don't need a shot of a huge crowd and a forest.

silverfish, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:56 (three years ago) link

^^^^^^

Evan, Wednesday, 25 May 2016 15:58 (three years ago) link

yeah it doesn't really affect my enjoyment of the show either. it's just kind of amusing, like isn't it possible to balance the budget a bit. i guess not, what would i