from http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/27/movies/27waxm.html?ex=1112590800&en=c2669710ded1df04&ei=5070
March 27, 2005
They're In on the Joke: Hollywood's Funniest CliqueBy SHARON WAXMAN
LOS ANGELES
THE pitch took five minutes. And it went something like this: "Will" (that would be Will Ferrell) "is the driver." (That would be a Nascar driver.) "His whole thing is: I wanna go faster." Does it sound funny yet? Does it matter? Adam McKay, a former head writer for "Saturday Night Live," was doing the pitching. The studios, in competition, were doing the catching. In the end, Sony Pictures agreed last June to pay Mr. Ferrell $20 million to act in the then-unwritten film "Talladega Nights," with a green light almost certain if Mr. McKay, the director, and Judd Apatow, the producer, could keep their budget in the area of $70 million.
It helped that the principals had certain things in common. They'd worked together on last year's "Anchorman: The Legend of Ron Burgundy," for instance. And they were all clients of both the United Talent Agency and a pair of powerhouse managers, Mosaic Media Group's Eric Gold and Jimmy Miller, making them key members of a very select group.
Ever since Bill Murray, Dan Aykroyd and John Belushi hit Hollywood 30 years ago, screen comedy has been something of a circle game. For protection, inspiration or just plain fun, Hollywood's comic talent has tended to cluster and take care of its own. But never, perhaps, has the circle been tighter, or the financial stakes higher, than now.
Mr. Ferrell, Mr. Apatow and Ben Stiller are among the club's kingpins. Mr. McKay, Owen Wilson, Jim Carrey, Vince Vaughn and Jack Black belong, as do Nick Stevens, a United Talent agent who represents Mr. Carrey and Mr. Stiller, and Mr. Gold and Mr. Miller, who have much of the group in their stable.
The funnymen appear in one another's movies, from "Dodgeball" to "Anchorman" to "Elf" to "Zoolander," creating a wheel-of-comedy effect that can leave viewers wondering just whose movie they're watching. What's more, the stars and their representatives live, work and play in a continuum that has virtually shut the studios out of the development process. By coming up with their own concepts, finding screenwriters and then offering the whole package for production - script, director and cast, take it or leave it - this group is reshaping screen humor to their liking.
"What interests me most about this group is they all participate in readings of each other's scripts, without the studios present," said Stuart Cornfeld, Mr. Stiller's producing partner in their company Red Hour Films. He cited a recent reading of "Tropic Thunder," Mr. Stiller's new project for DreamWorks, at which Mr. Apatow took notes, and Mos Def and the British actor Steve Coogan - recent additions to the in-crowd - read various roles.
Studio executives are well aware of the power in such cohesion. "They seem to function somewhat as an informal kind of comedy troupe," said Hutch Parker, president of 20th Century Fox. "If you check around town and see what projects they all have in development, you find the same alliances."
In fact, the interaction has spawned a new brand of comedy that steps beyond the consciously dumb gross-out humor of the last decade, when the filmmakers Peter and Bobby Farrelly ruled the roost with pictures like "Dumb and Dumber" and "There's Something About Mary." Next-generation humor is "smart-dumb comedy, as opposed to dumb-dumb comedy or smart-clever comedy," Mr. Cornfeld said. The humor is often character-based and owes a lot of its knowing silliness - think of Mr. Ferrell as an oversized Santa's helper, or Mr. Stiller as a vapid runway model - to "Saturday Night Live."
"We are all the spawn of Hal Ramis," Mr. Apatow said, referring to the director or co-writer of the last generation's touchstone comedies, like "Animal House" and "Meatballs." "We all grew up on 'Stripes' and 'Caddyshack' and 'Animal House.' We're heavily influenced by Second City and Albert Brooks. As a result, a lot of us have similar sensibilities."
One such "smart-dumb comedy" was in its birth throes recently, as Mr. Apatow and Steve Carell, another "Anchorman" veteran, found themselves, scripts in hand, sitting at a table in Santa Monica with a few other actors, exchanging stories of their early sexual exploits. What started as a read-through of Universal Pictures' "40-Year-Old Virgin," set for an August release, had quickly devolved into a discussion of how the central character - Mr. Carell as an electronics store clerk - happened to still be a sexual naif.
The cast tossed out situations that might have led to his giving up on sex. Paul Rudd suggested a problem of premature ejaculation. But Mr. Apatow, one of the film's producers, was still thinking. "This one guy told Garry Shandling he lost his virginity to two women," he mused.
"That's a good story," Mr. Carell said.
Mr. Apatow told of an eighth-grade experience when he panicked after his girlfriend guided his hand beyond first base. "In my head I thought, 'Oh my God, I'm going to pee on her,' " he recalled, to general laughter around the table. "I literally stayed in the shower until she was gone."
Romany Malco, a cast member, cheerily told of being seduced by the family baby sitter when he was 6, then by a string of sitters for years after. (No one said comedy doesn't hurt.) Mr. Malco, who served in the military, also told a raunchy tale from the barracks involving masturbation and killing roaches.
Mr. Apatow slapped the table. "That's going in," he said, grabbing a pen.
The concept for this movie came from Mr. Carell, who had riffed on the idea years ago during improvisations in Chicago at Second City, the comedy troupe where he got his start. During down time on "Anchorman," he tossed out the idea to Mr. Apatow, whom he had met on the set, and they sold it as a pitch to Universal. "The 40-Year Old Virgin," which they wrote together and which Mr. Apatow directed with Mr. Carell starring, just wrapped. This has become a fairly normal scenario for a group that has become accustomed to hearing the word "yes" from executives who are willing to rely on the comics' instincts and track record.
Similar telegraphy was behind more than one film that has hit the screen. Mr. Stiller had only to call his agent, Mr. Stevens, and say, "I have five words for you: Owen Wilson. Starsky and Hutch." Mr. Stevens got it. Within days he had sold the idea to Warner Brothers, which owned the title but was doing nothing with it, and eventually landed a budget of $60 million.
In the next several months, a new wave of films from the group will include New Line Cinema's "The Wedding Crashers," the summer's most buzzed-about comedy, starring Mr. Vaughn and Mr. Wilson as overgrown bachelors who prey on women at weddings, and Universal's "Kicking and Screaming," with Mr. Ferrell as a demented soccer dad. Then there's "Bewitched," an update of the television series with Mr. Ferrell and Nicole Kidman, and later in the year comes "Fun With Dick and Jane," with Mr. Carrey and Téa Leoni as a married couple who turn to robbery, both films for Sony Pictures.
Audiences are likely to sense the connections among these films, if only because everybody on the circuit lends a bit of screen time to everyone else. Mr. Ferrell, for instance, did a cameo in "The Wedding Crashers." That's partly because Mr. Vaughn did a cameo in Mr. Ferrell's last picture, "Anchorman." For that matter, so did Mr. Stiller (as Arturo Mendes) and Mr. Black (as the Angry Biker).
The camaraderie owes much to connections that go back many years, sometimes decades, to shared experience in the grimy comedy clubs of Lower Manhattan and Los Angeles. It extended to "Saturday Night Live" circa the 1990's; the innovative Wayans brothers' show, "In Living Color"; and the ratings-challenged "Ben Stiller Show," canceled in 1993 after one season on Fox.
"Everybody hung out more together when we were unemployed," Mr. Apatow said. Actually, that much of the group became not just employed but also richly compensated owes much to the influential management company run by Mr. Gold, 48, and Mr. Miller, 47. The managers, who rarely talk to the media, are both from Pittsburgh and met during their college years. At the time, both were dabbling in comedy, though it was Mr. Miller's older brother, Dennis, now a talk-show host, who was the rising star of their group. Jimmy Miller spent 13 years as a manager in comedy clubs, from 1981 to 1994, five or six nights a week in the back of the room, first in Pittsburgh, then in Hermosa Beach, Calif. Mr. Gold was a stand-up comedian before moving to Los Angeles to become an agent, then a manager.
Their practical experience in the clubs became invaluable. Mr. Apatow, a friend, became a client. Tipped by him, Mr. Miller booked Mr. Carrey into his Hermosa Beach club and gradually started booking him into clubs on the road, long before the comic made his mark in the movies.
"It's really a small business, still, the comedy business," Mr. Miller said during a recent interview in his conference room on Sunset Boulevard. Contemporary comedy, even as it evolves, still owes its essence to "Saturday Night Live," he said.
Mr. Gold agreed: "It's 30 years old as we know it. It hasn't gotten so big that the people involved don't know each other. We all know each other."
Today, the managers do much more than just represent Mr. Carrey, Mr. Apatow, Mr. Ferrell, Mr. Vaughn, the Wayans and many others. They actively edit and shape their clients' ideas; the stars implicitly trust their comedy judgment.
Which means Mr. Gold and Mr. Miller can keep people out of the "wheel of comedy" too. One film executive complained that the young comedy club is exclusionary and not always in a good way. "There's always a wall being put up with those guys," he said, declining to be identified for fear of jeopardizing future relations with the group.
During the making of "Elf," Mr. Miller and Mr. Ferrell differed with the editing choices of the director, Jon Favreau, executives close to the production said. Both versions were tested with audiences, but the creative differences led to Mr. Favreau's not being involved in the sequel at New Line, executives in both camps said. Though Mr. Favreau's choices tested better with an audience and won out, he is considered creatively out of sync with Mr. Miller and Mr. Ferrell, and New Line has confirmed that he will not be part of the sequel.
Mr. Apatow came from New York and worked as a stand-up comic at the Improv in Hollywood. That's where he met Adam Sandler, who became his roommate but who today appears to remain outside the club, in an orbit of his own. Mr. Apatow met Mr. Stiller standing in line at an Elvis Costello concert. "Within two weeks we were friends," he recalled. Together, they wrote a sketch show for MTV, then wrote and produced the critically adored but doomed "Ben Stiller Show." Mr. Apatow, who once opened in comedy clubs for Mr. Carrey, also produced "The Cable Guy," which starred Mr. Carrey and was directed by Mr. Stiller, in 1996.
Mr. Stiller further expanded the group when he became a fan of Mr. Wilson after seeing him in "Bottle Rocket" and called up the actor to propose collaborating. He had given Mr. Black a role in "The Cable Guy," and used both Mr. Wilson and Mr. Ferrell in "Zoolander."
Some executives say they are happy to be schooled by the collective, with its accumulated comic lore. "What these guys do, and what makes them exciting, is they're very cutting edge," said Adam Goodman, the president of production at DreamWorks. "These guys are teaching us what comedy is, and where comedy's going. We're simply following their lead here."
Though Hollywood may be following now, the studios were initially slow to catch on. The pitch for "Anchorman" was rejected by the DreamWorks production chief, Walter F. Parkes, who told his executives after the meeting that Mr. Ferrell was no star, more than one person present says. He changed his mind after "Old School" became a hit. Asked about his decision, Mr. Parkes said: "We weren't ready to go forward with a green light with that picture, with that cast, at that moment. It had to do with concerns about the concept of the film, not the star. We were the ones who cast Will in 'Old School' in the first place."
Similarly, DreamWorks, MGM and other studios passed on "Dodgeball." Fox finally agreed after Mr. Stiller reduced his fee to well under $1 million, a fraction of his usual price. The film has so far taken in $114 million domestically and cost $23 million to make.
Indeed, part of the appeal of these films has been their low production cost and their huge return at the box office. But that formula is quickly disappearing as the success of the young comedy-makers is forcing the studios to engage in bidding wars.
And some worry that a comic oligopoly is inevitably raising the cost of doing business with stars like Mr. Ferrell, Mr. Black and lately Mr. Vaughn. After all, Mr. Carrey already costs upwards of $20 million, and Mr. Ferrell is hovering in that neighborhood. In January, Mr. Stevens and Mr. Gold held an auction among the studios for Mr. Vaughn's latest project, a romantic comedy. The script for the film, "The Breakup," sold for $2.25 million, and Mr. Vaughn received his highest payday ever, $12 million, to star and produce.
"Smart guys like Eric Gold and Jimmy Miller are figuring, 'Let's put our own stuff together, go out in a competitive way, and the studio that wants it the most will pay the most and give us the most creative autonomy," said New Line's president of production, Toby Emmerich, who has found himself on the losing end of a couple of recent bidding wars from the Gold-Miller workshop.
For Mr. Emmerich, the trick is not to get into the club but to get ahead of it: "Right now I'd say those guys are worth their weight in gold for comedy. But for us, the bigger challenge is to figure out: Who's the next guy?"
― firstworldman (firstworldman), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:03 (twenty-one years ago)
― La Monte (La Monte), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:11 (twenty-one years ago)
― n/a (Nick A.), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:18 (twenty-one years ago)
― firstworldman (firstworldman), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:20 (twenty-one years ago)
― jones (actual), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:21 (twenty-one years ago)
― TOMBOT, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:36 (twenty-one years ago)
― TOMBOT, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:44 (twenty-one years ago)
― firstworldman (firstworldman), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:47 (twenty-one years ago)
― firstworldman (firstworldman), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:48 (twenty-one years ago)
Like the fact that at one point WB was going to make a Speed Racer movie and had HYPE WILLIAMS lined up to direct.
― TOMBOT, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:50 (twenty-one years ago)
― firstworldman (firstworldman), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 02:58 (twenty-one years ago)
― mookieproof (mookieproof), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 03:08 (twenty-one years ago)
― Allyzay Subservient 50s-Type (allyzay), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 04:08 (twenty-one years ago)
― miccio (miccio), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 04:10 (twenty-one years ago)
haha 'ruining' speed racer
― mookieproof (mookieproof), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 04:41 (twenty-one years ago)
FUCK YOU
― TOMBOT, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 04:45 (twenty-one years ago)
If I wanted to go to hell I'd've left already.
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 04:46 (twenty-one years ago)
― mookieproof (mookieproof), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 04:47 (twenty-one years ago)
― TOMBOT, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 04:56 (twenty-one years ago)
― Huk-L, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 05:11 (twenty-one years ago)
And as Racer X: VIN DIESEL OMG
― Stupornaut (natepatrin), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 06:43 (twenty-one years ago)
― latebloomer: AKA Sir Teddy Ruxpin, Former Scientologist (latebloomer), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 07:27 (twenty-one years ago)
― scout (scout), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 07:35 (twenty-one years ago)
― Pete (Pete), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 12:14 (twenty-one years ago)
Anna Paquin w/ haircut = Trixie
― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 13:30 (twenty-one years ago)
― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 13:33 (twenty-one years ago)
― Huk-L, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 13:34 (twenty-one years ago)
― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 13:38 (twenty-one years ago)
― Huk-L, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 13:43 (twenty-one years ago)
― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 13:53 (twenty-one years ago)
― David Allen (David Allen), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 13:58 (twenty-one years ago)
― N_RQ, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 14:04 (twenty-one years ago)
― Huk-L, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)
― Brian Miller (Brian Miller), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)
― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 14:08 (twenty-one years ago)
― Huk-L, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 14:08 (twenty-one years ago)
― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 14:21 (twenty-one years ago)
stiller has just been overworked.
― N_RQ, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 14:23 (twenty-one years ago)
xpost
― Huk-L, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 14:24 (twenty-one years ago)
― Drew Daniel (Drew Daniel), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:33 (twenty-one years ago)
― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:36 (twenty-one years ago)
― jones (actual), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:43 (twenty-one years ago)
Ahem.
― William Crump (Rock Hardy), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:48 (twenty-one years ago)
― Huk Wank!, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:49 (twenty-one years ago)
Actually it's Jack Black as Jack and Owen Wilson as the voice of his motorcycle. Ben Stiller directed. So retarded. So I guess you haven't seen it either. ZING!!! OH!!!
http://www.altslashgo.com/hvaj/cast.html
― TOMBOT, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:55 (twenty-one years ago)
― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:56 (twenty-one years ago)
― Huk-L, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:57 (twenty-one years ago)
― miccio (miccio), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:58 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ken L (Ken L), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 17:59 (twenty-one years ago)
― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 18:00 (twenty-one years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 18:02 (twenty-one years ago)
Great '80s and '90s TV:
Saturday Night Live (at least as long as Tim Meadows was on)The Ben Stiller ShowMr. ShowThat '70s ShowIn Living ColorBeavis and ButtheadKing of the Hill
The comedies fans love them for:
Bottle RocketSwingersFlirting With DisasterRushmoreCluelessSchool of RockLegally BlondeMeet the ParentsAnalyze ThisMadeThe Ladies ManThere's Something About MaryThe Royal TenenbaumsElfThe Original Kings of ComedyPunch-Drunk LoveThe Ladies ManEternal Sunshine of the Spotless MindThe Zero EffectMystery MenOcean's ElevenRun Ronnie Run!Office SpaceDude, Where's My Car?Ace Ventura: Pet DetectiveAce Ventura: When Nature CallsThe MaskMelvin Goes to DinnerHigh Fidelity
Signs of strain and/or laziness:
ZoolanderLiar LiarJust MarriedShallow HalLegally Blonde 2Charlie's AngelsDodgeball: A True Underdog StoryThe Cable GuyHappy GilmoreMe, Myself & IreneDickAustin Powers: International Man of MysteryShanghai NoonThe Wedding SingerThe WaterboyBilly Madison50 First DatesTenacious D (1999 TV Series)
The decline:
Punk'd (TV series)Saving SilvermanOld SchoolStarsky & Hutch (watchable only for Har Mar Superstar scene)Analyze ThatOcean's 12Boat TripJay & Silent Bob Strike BackDumb & DumberLittle NickyMean GirlsBig DaddyGuess Who
God-awful:
DuplexBruce AlmightyShanghai KnightsMr. DeedsCharlie's Angels: Full ThrottleStuck on YouSweet Home AlabamaAnger ManagementHow the Grinch Stole Christmas
As a result, I have not seen:
Meet the FockersAnchorman: The Legend of Ron BurgundyI SpyDumb and Dumberer: When Harry Met LloydEight Crazy NightsOrange CountyBe Cool
― Pete Scholtes, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 19:53 (twenty-one years ago)
― Pete Scholtes, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 19:56 (twenty-one years ago)
― Huk-L, Tuesday, 29 March 2005 19:56 (twenty-one years ago)
― miccio (miccio), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 20:08 (twenty-one years ago)
DOES NOT COMPUTE
― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 20:12 (twenty-one years ago)
― miccio (miccio), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 20:13 (twenty-one years ago)
These movies are all VERY VERY funny, imo.Owen Wilson's scenes in I Spy had some genuinely funny moments.I thought Mean Girls was pretty funny at times.And I will defend Ocean's 12 to the death, for a variety of reasons... though I don't know that it really belongs in this discussion anyway.
― firstworldman (firstworldman), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 20:15 (twenty-one years ago)
― Drew Daniel (Drew Daniel), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 20:22 (twenty-one years ago)
― firstworldman (firstworldman), Tuesday, 29 March 2005 20:27 (twenty-one years ago)
― jaymc (jaymc), Friday, 30 September 2005 18:08 (twenty years ago)
― Huk-L (Huk-L), Friday, 30 September 2005 18:23 (twenty years ago)
i like that judd apatow hates going to the gym.
― carly (carly), Friday, 30 September 2005 19:29 (twenty years ago)
ok im a total fanboy but this sounds lol
http://film.guardian.co.uk/news/story/0,,2288537,00.html
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 13:49 (seventeen years ago)
Jeremy Brett snickers from the grave.
― Ned Raggett, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 13:51 (seventeen years ago)
oh wait, what if we make a movie about sherlock holmes and dr watson, but, get this, it's poking fun at them, and they're actually incompetent/corrupt/insane/drug-fiends/gay/aided by their crime-fighting young female client who's oblivious to their uselessness? that's never been done before, right?
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:09 (seventeen years ago)
what am i, barry norman?
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:10 (seventeen years ago)
who the hell cares if the concept is originial as long as its hilarious? i cant wait for this
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:11 (seventeen years ago)
xp what are your pickled onions like?
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:11 (seventeen years ago)
tru. i can't wait for their next one, where baron-cohen plays a suave english spy, who's a bit of a ladies-man,and has every gadget you can possibly imagine to defeat bad guys. except, get this, played for laughs, yeah? blew your mind didn't i?
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:18 (seventeen years ago)
the only good thing about this is that they got in there with the concept before Jack Black
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:19 (seventeen years ago)
Man I'm so sick of comedies with unoriginal plots. Those Airplane films are the worst.
― Party Sausage, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:20 (seventeen years ago)
Yeah but what if he turns out to be Moriarty?
― Ned Raggett, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:21 (seventeen years ago)
xp ^ no you're right. all those dozens of movies that came before 'airplane' parodying the disaster genre...
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:22 (seventeen years ago)
(seriously tho, you couldn't have picked a worse comparism if you'd spent a moment thinking about it)
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:24 (seventeen years ago)
i dont think anyones patting themselves on the back over the brilliancy of the idea, i just think they believe they can execute better than anyone else has & theyre probably right
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:24 (seventeen years ago)
for a fresh angle i suggest some jokey homo-eroticism between Holmes and Watson
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:27 (seventeen years ago)
tha'll show those victorians
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:28 (seventeen years ago)
that'll show this terrible film which does not even exist yet
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:30 (seventeen years ago)
im thinking you guys are both britishers so maybe thats why it sounds so stale - its not like in america were inundated with comic bits about these guys, & at any rate i think cohen + farrell couuldnt be more perfect for the roles, & tropic thunder looks pretty hilariuos xp lol nv
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:31 (seventeen years ago)
cohen + farrell better? worse? can't decide!
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:33 (seventeen years ago)
http://www.sporting-heroes.net/files_football/COHEN_Avi_1981_GH_R.jpg
^^^better
― The stickman from the hilarious "xkcd" comics, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:34 (seventeen years ago)
even better would be colin farrell and crusading journalist nick cohen. but the british film industry lacks this kind of vision.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:35 (seventeen years ago)
frogman do you also think a shot in the dark should never have been made because it was just repeating the same basic, tired devices as the originial pink panther?
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:36 (seventeen years ago)
Need somebody unbiased to read the script for this and tell us if it's great.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:36 (seventeen years ago)
'this guy, he's a detective, but...he's bumbling & clutzy!'
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:37 (seventeen years ago)
nick cohen he'd show that terrorism is like, rly rly bad
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:38 (seventeen years ago)
OMG AWESZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:39 (seventeen years ago)
edgar wright's next 4 projects all sound more original (apart from Ant Man, maybe)
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:39 (seventeen years ago)
Maybe he could put some lolz in one of them for a change.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:40 (seventeen years ago)
casting will ferrell as watson isn't inspired, it's more like "can't think of anybody, do we have the budget for will ferrell? ok cool"
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:40 (seventeen years ago)
well deeznuts, i certainly think my jokey posts on this thread should be applied in retrospect to a classic film starring a genius comic at the peak of his powers made forty four years ago, yeh.
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:41 (seventeen years ago)
maybe you could put less crack in your pipe
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:41 (seventeen years ago)
Nah, most important thing about a comedy movie is definitely being original.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:42 (seventeen years ago)
Anchorman, Old School and Mean Girls are all absolute classics, even Dodgeball is pretty funny. I will forgive ALMOST anything Will Ferrell does.. though I couldn't stand Talladega Nights. I see that there is a new Ferrell/John C. Reilly movie coming out soon called "Stepbrothers" or some such. Off to IMDB I go..
― Finefinemusic, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:42 (seventeen years ago)
incidentally, cook and moore's 'hound of the baskervilles' is fuckig lol, to anyone who doesn't know it.
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:43 (seventeen years ago)
Are we now going to pretend that Ferrell has a hitrate of above 0.5?
― The stickman from the hilarious "xkcd" comics, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:43 (seventeen years ago)
the man has a family to feed, of course he's gonna suck some of the time.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:48 (seventeen years ago)
I KNOW I DO
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:48 (seventeen years ago)
http://z.about.com/d/movies/1/0/k/M/6/melindaandmelindaposter.jpg
― The stickman from the hilarious "xkcd" comics, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:51 (seventeen years ago)
forget about original concepts, concepts that havn't been done to death can up the lol factor. like, say, anchorman, 40 yr old virgin.
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:51 (seventeen years ago)
all these movies are completely interchangeable to me. they just rearrange the order of things a little and change the costumes. "oh look, it's the part where the hero falls from grace and is down and out! ahahahahahaha! it's so sappy!"
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:52 (seventeen years ago)
borat etc.
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:52 (seventeen years ago)
(xp to myself there)
tracer, FERRELL as watson isnt inspired so much as obvious
heyhey the frogman with a post that isnt sarcastic!
xps like i said i think theres probably a pretty substantial british/american divide on this one
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:52 (seventeen years ago)
"orange mocha frappacino! that is similar to a brand name i recognize! ahahahahahahahaha!!!!"
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:53 (seventeen years ago)
-- Tracer Hand, Wednesday, July 2, 2008 4:52 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link
the "it's just a guy talking fast over somebody else's record" of film crit right there.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:54 (seventeen years ago)
Tracer OTM but careful now
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:54 (seventeen years ago)
i've already explained elsewhere how elf and anchorman are actually the same movie. zoolander is actually exactly the same as those, too, except that the down-and-out scene comes at the beginning.
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:55 (seventeen years ago)
http://purplehornet.com/blogger/images/sarcasm.jpg
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:55 (seventeen years ago)
comedy relies on familiarity + formula, tracer, with occasional pleasant disturbances
none of what you are saying is news
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:55 (seventeen years ago)
defend the indefensible: romy and michelle's high school reunion
I'm just curious what movies the AFI or whoever recommended this movie to Tracer compared it to, so that he DIDN'T expect what he got from "Romy & Michelle's High School Reunion" starring Lisa Kudrow & Mira Sorvino.
-- da croupier, Monday, 2 July 2007 13:57 (1 year ago) Bookmark Link
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:56 (seventeen years ago)
(no offence deez)
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:56 (seventeen years ago)
sure deez. and that one movie the gang referenced in the article at the top of this thread makes over and over - you like it. i never really did.
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:58 (seventeen years ago)
zoolander actually felt pretty fresh and that was a big part of why i liked it. i haven't seen a ferrell movie since altho i did recently watch all of anchorman on mute (long boring story why) - i'm hoping the dog v bear conversation was the highlight just on that basis.
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 15:58 (seventeen years ago)
what i'm taking away from deeznuts and Noodle Vague is that there's no such thing as a bad comedy! win-win! i will adjust my attitude
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:01 (seventeen years ago)
The highlight was "In English, Baxter, you know I don't speak Spanish" and "I hear their periods attrack BEARS" but not the dog/bear scene itself.
― Finefinemusic, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:01 (seventeen years ago)
pushing a dog out of a moving train is bad comedy
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:02 (seventeen years ago)
xxpost
No I think what I'm trying to say is that what makes comedy good in most cases has very little, if anything, to do with the originality or corniness of its plot.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:02 (seventeen years ago)
if only hollywood could return to the olden days when it made original films like... that one western, or that backstage musical, or the film where the detective got caught up with the bad guys' dame, or whatever that fast-paced comedy based on misunderstandings was called.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:05 (seventeen years ago)
Shoah
― Ned Raggett, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:06 (seventeen years ago)
^^^ Short on lulz
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:06 (seventeen years ago)
would just like to clarify at this point that i think this SBC as Sherlock Holmes thing sounds shit for reasons other than the originality factor. stay classy.
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:07 (seventeen years ago)
hmm...plot vs concept (vs execution)
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:07 (seventeen years ago)
vs being funny?
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:08 (seventeen years ago)
monty python does sherlock holmes
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:08 (seventeen years ago)
i dunno, he could probably pull off an RP accent, though i'm not sure he's ever acted to a script before??
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:08 (seventeen years ago)
Most comedy films that go the heavily plotted route end up with more tedious exposition and "surprise! heartwarming scene" than actual laughs.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:09 (seventeen years ago)
example?
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:10 (seventeen years ago)
Jack Black kicking dog off bridge = best part of Anchorman. That and "why don't you go back to your home on whore island"
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:10 (seventeen years ago)
SBC acts to a script in Sweeney Todd where he's decent enough given it's a small role. Sections of the Borat movie were scripted, I think. All of the Ali G movie was.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:10 (seventeen years ago)
"zoolander actually felt pretty fresh and that was a big part of why i liked it."
yes otm
"would just like to clarify at this point that i think this SBC as Sherlock Holmes thing sounds shit for reasons other than the originality factor. stay classy."
also otm/ lack of originality does not equal laziness. but y'know, if this film is funny, i'll laff. doesn't stop me wanting to be a touch cynical about the concept.
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:10 (seventeen years ago)
which is better: arguments about what's funny or arguments about what's sexy?
― n/a, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:11 (seventeen years ago)
can't wait for the scene where holmes tells watson he wants to "do something meaningful / help that poor girl" etc and loses his place in society because of it, hilariously, only to persevere and gain the envy of his former enemies
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:11 (seventeen years ago)
Prime example for me would be both of those Edgar Wright flicks but you'll just accuse me of taking crack hits I guess. Also most Steve Martin movies after Man with Two Brains.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:12 (seventeen years ago)
arguments about what's sexy? ^ more original. more plot, less gags
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:13 (seventeen years ago)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/1925000/images/_1926569_kermode_150.jpg
Tracer sticking it to the Man, earlier today
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:14 (seventeen years ago)
i'm so glad i don't understand that.
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:14 (seventeen years ago)
Which bit?
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:15 (seventeen years ago)
both me and noodle know to recycle gags endlessly
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:16 (seventeen years ago)
Prime example for me would be both of those Edgar Wright flicks but you'll just accuse me of taking crack hits I guess.
using Wright as an example is problematic because his work is never just straight up comedy and is more Other Genre Movie But With More Intentional Humour than they'd normally have. i'm totally down with this approach as opposed to films that come with big flashing COMEDY! light and LAUGH NOW signs right now personally.
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:18 (seventeen years ago)
-- Tracer Hand
no tracer, yr first point was fair - you dont have to find it funny - this one isnt. its the grounds on which you were criticizing it that i took issue with
fwiw i just saw wedding crashers on tv this weekend for the first time since it was in theaters & thought it held up really well
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:19 (seventeen years ago)
setting aside the pointless argument about originality, i think my problem with all these movies is how plot-heavy they all actually are - there's a constricted feeling to them (for me); they never feel like they could take off in any direction the way a farrelly bros. movie can, or the way a mel brooks movie can. they all have a kind of behind-the-music inevitability to them, the way they resolve. i'll concede this is part of what these movies are sending up, but it feels sort of joyless at this point - the movies have become slaves to the same structures they think they're making fun of.
to me the best comedies have a lighter touch with the plot, have less stake in the Rightness of the outcome, and simply serve as an excuse for stringing together funny sketches
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:20 (seventeen years ago)
I don't hate movies that are humorous rather than funny if the film's good. But I think out and out comedies are there to bring laughs or they've failed. I feel like the Other Genre Movie with More Humour is a bit of a cop-out with messrs Pegg and Wright tho.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:22 (seventeen years ago)
so did you like the first Harold & Kumar movie on that basis TH? xp
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:23 (seventeen years ago)
i still haven't seen it!
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:23 (seventeen years ago)
there's a constricted feeling to them (for me); they never feel like they could take off in any direction the way a farrelly bros. movie can
eh? it's more like they're totally thrown together out of improvs, and do go in any direction. (not necessarily a good thing.) in what way does 'something about mary' confound expectations? not that it matter since the film is lol.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:24 (seventeen years ago)
yes, i don't think this is about plot for anyone here. who introduced the 'plot' talking point? that's what i was getting at with my 'plot vs concept' post upthread. what makes a comedy good (funny) is how you approach the concept plus the concept you had to start with and its potentials.
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:25 (seventeen years ago)
right, i dont think theres anything particularly brilliant about being totally open-ended/slapdash - sometimes working within a fairly rigid framework can be an advantage xp
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:25 (seventeen years ago)
i mean, were talking about spoofs here. or were.
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:26 (seventeen years ago)
funny: zoolander, anchorman, dodgeball, superbad, etc not quite so funny but still lol: wedding crashers, elf, old school, etc not hardly funny at all: semi-pro
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:27 (seventeen years ago)
were not talking about 'the philadelphia story'
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:27 (seventeen years ago)
I feel like the Other Genre Movie with More Humour is a bit of a cop-out with messrs Pegg and Wright tho.
how is this a cop out? their approach is intentionally more sophisticated and it seems churlish to say 'fewer jokes=less funny movie thus fail' (obv the goal is not joke quantity but joke quality). if you just don't like their style of humour then fair enough tho.
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:28 (seventeen years ago)
how many lols must a film provideth before you can call it lol?
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:30 (seventeen years ago)
give it a go but i would say don't read anything (more) about it before doing so
HOW CAN THEY CALL THIS LOLDAY LOL??
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:31 (seventeen years ago)
if you just don't like their style of humour then fair enough tho
This is the obvious limit-point of these kinds of debates really isn't it?
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:33 (seventeen years ago)
deeznuts i don't contend, and have never said, that there's anything "particularly brilliant" about a comedy being less structured than the stiller/apatow/ferrell brand of comedy. just that i like it better when it is. i also have never once in this thread mentioned liking "slapdash" comedies, whatever they are. though i'm sure a comedy described as slapdash could be hilarious. i don't know. you'll have to tell me more about what you mean by that!
for what it's worth - not that i think you'll actually take the time to read and understand what i'm saying before exaggerating it into an extreme position that you can then dismiss - i like the plot to seem to unfold naturally in all kinds of movies, not just comedies. movies where i can feel the screenwriter forcing the characters into situations just sort of grate. it can occasionally be done brilliantly, and ding your brainpan into a new consciousness of how you're usually manipulated by plot, with the whole thing being a kind of meta comment on screenwriting, but i think those occasions are rare.
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:38 (seventeen years ago)
setting aside the pointless argument about originality, i think my problem with all these movies is how plot-heavy they all actually are - there's a constricted feeling to them (for me); they never feel like they could take off in any direction the way a farrelly bros. movie can,
I couldn't disagree more. Watching Knocked Up, I thought that Paul Rudd, Leslie Mann, and Rogen were capable of any lunacy; within the scope of their performances they suggested they could go as far with their characters as their imaginations could take them.
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:38 (seventeen years ago)
yes 'course but it would probably be much worse to go into why Pegg/Wright humour is better/worse than Ferrell+Apatow, for those who don't like both. think of the straw man massacre.
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:43 (seventeen years ago)
a lot of the things people like in these films -- like zoolander's friends getting killed in a petrol fight -- is not exactly predictable.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:45 (seventeen years ago)
and i couldnt disagree more w/ you, alfred - i think the whole appeal of apatow at his best, & what makes him brilliant, is that his characters seem like very recognizeable caricatures of people we know as opposed to comic foils (like jim carey, peter sellers, mel brooks characters, all of which i adore)
tracer, i was focusing on brooks w/ that comment, because you repped for him - his movies seem to kind of exemplify what youre getting at in the second paragraph to me, in their own way. just saw history of the world pt 2 & its a collection of forced gags with a shoddy unfunny ending thats supposed to be a meta cocmment on movies & screenwriting but falls flat on its face
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:46 (seventeen years ago)
xp dunno if TH was lumping Knocked Up in with all the 'Ferrell/Stiller does THIS for a living' type stuff
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:46 (seventeen years ago)
i dont think knocked up is in the same vein at all myself
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:47 (seventeen years ago)
haven't seen knocked up! no interest AT ALL!
heh brooks is.... hit and miss
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:48 (seventeen years ago)
well quite altho maybe there are some similarities in terms of how they're made and operate
xp
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:48 (seventeen years ago)
yeah the Knocked Up/40 YO Virgin/Forgetting Sarah Marshall-Apatow-centered stuff is pretty different in tone and construction from the Ferrell-Stiller-Wilson "let's parody THIS livelihood/sport/pasttime" kinda schtick. Its also quite a bit better and waaaaaay more full of surprises.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:50 (seventeen years ago)
for lack of a better term the Apatow/Freaks n Geeks crowd stuff has more of a sense of realism going for it. Stiller and co. usually go for more deliberately surreal, meta-commentary silliness
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:51 (seventeen years ago)
wonder if stiller and apatow have worked together...
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:52 (seventeen years ago)
Comparison isn't really fair. First three of those FSW movies (Zoolander, Anchorman, Dodgeball) versus first three of those Apatow flicks (FYOV/KO/Superbad) is probably a win for the former
xxxp.
― The stickman from the hilarious "xkcd" comics, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:52 (seventeen years ago)
I laughed once during Anchorman.
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:54 (seventeen years ago)
i love the idea of all these dudes hating Jack Black
― blueski, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:54 (seventeen years ago)
cos of deez I've just had to do a search to see if Brooks made a History of the World: Pt 2 when I wasn't looking.
― Noodle Vague, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:56 (seventeen years ago)
quite the reverse imho
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 16:57 (seventeen years ago)
heavy weights
― impudent harlot, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 17:01 (seventeen years ago)
i was joeking: they've done like a grillion things.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 17:02 (seventeen years ago)
When I first saw this movie 6 years ago, I loved it in theaters, I loved it when I bought the VHS, and it was the first DVD that I ever bought! I watch this move as often as I can, because it is a true wonder to behold when it comes to movies about camp. You feel sorry for the poor kids as they are ridiculed and belittled by the sadistic Tony (played perfectly by Ben Stiller), and root for them as they exact there revenge. Yes, the ending is a bit clichéd (I still wish they had lost..it would go great with the movie's lessons). All in all, I believe this is a great movie for kids that love a silliness with a bit of seriousness.
My rating: 10/10. SEE THIS MOVIE IF YOU HAVEN'T ALREADY!
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 17:04 (seventeen years ago)
SMALL SCENE SPOILER For example, Tony Perkis goes to give this one fat black kid a hug, then he pats him down and finds a pez dispenser in his sock. Tony goes on to say "Hey, It looks like my mans PACKIN!, then he proceeds to unload that "clip" of pez and as it hits the floor it sounds like bullets hitting the floor. ITs in a class totally of its own.
i fucking loved heavy weights but i was like 9 or something
also love the idea of heavy weights being like a proto-apatow as hinted in that last sentence, which tracer was probably mocking
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 17:07 (seventeen years ago)
blount reps for heavyweights iirc -- it's not exactly WHAS, but then it is a disney film for kids. it's kind of proto-freaks and geeks and proto-dodgeball at the same time. i wouldn't watch it a second time.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 17:14 (seventeen years ago)
more like posto-tarantino, i was thinking.
deeznuts you should see poison ivy, starring michael j. fox and nancy mckeon!
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 18:23 (seventeen years ago)
fight the real enemy, guys. guy ritchie "to shoot an "all action" Holmes adventure tale"
― omar little, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 18:42 (seventeen years ago)
will definitely see this. i like holmes shit, even 'without a clue'~
― omar little, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 18:43 (seventeen years ago)
yeah, the ritchie one will def. be 1000x worse.
― Simon H., Wednesday, 2 July 2008 18:48 (seventeen years ago)
as i havent seen this movie im guessing this post is supposed to be some kind of meta-commentary in its own right but if not why?
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 18:54 (seventeen years ago)
SBC sucked hard in the otherwise OK Talladega Nights.
So I'm not looking super forward to this, might be alright.
― Bodrick III, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 19:52 (seventeen years ago)
SBC so unbelievably overrated
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 19:56 (seventeen years ago)
I like his interviews in small doses. About ten funny minutes in the whole Ali G flick, imo.
― Bodrick III, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:16 (seventeen years ago)
I still collapse into hysterics when he interviews Gore Vidal.
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:19 (seventeen years ago)
The only way it will succeed is if he gives that a Van Helsing style treatment. (Not that this is a good sign either.)
― Ned Raggett, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:25 (seventeen years ago)
setting aside the pointless argument about originality, i think my problem with all these movies is how plot-heavy they all actually are - there's a constricted feeling to them (for me)
This statement really sums up how i feel about most of these big studio mainstream comedies. It's not about whether or not the plot is predictable; it's about knowing that the story is going to follow a certain arc... and with a lot of these you can almost predict at what point in the movie it's cool to get up, take a piss, and grab some popcorn without missing anything funny.
I buy a lot of comedies that I consider to have pretty good replay value, and I don't think I have managed to make it through any of them further than the point where the plot takes over and that familiar 'hero falls down and comes up with a wacky solution to win' pattern emerges.
I'm OK with a structure, but I wish some of these movies would tell a different kind of story once in a while. Give me a comedy with some of the fine comedic actors mentioned throughout this thread, with a plot like an episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm or something. I want to see funny people saying and doing funny things, not being propelled through some lame ass Screenwriter 101 plot that distracts from the laughter.
― rockapads, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:46 (seventeen years ago)
Have you seen the Aqua Teen Hunger Force movie?
― HI DERE, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:48 (seventeen years ago)
Apatow stuff has almost gotten to be the worst for this shit, because now you can always count on this whole "raunchy comedy with a heart (plus male bonding)" business going down.
― rockapads, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:48 (seventeen years ago)
I haven't seen the Aqua Teen Hunger Force movie, but I don't like the show all that much. Should I see it anyway?
― rockapads, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:49 (seventeen years ago)
CYE may not be 'screenwriter 101', but its definitely totally formulaic & totally predictable. also, great.
damn these comedies with a heart & male bonding! damn them to hell!
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:50 (seventeen years ago)
everyone should see the Aqua Teen Hunger Force movie (note: should not be confused with "everyone will enjoy the ATHF movie)
― BLACK BEYONCE, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:52 (seventeen years ago)
"The only way it will succeed is if he gives that a Van Helsing style treatment. (Not that this is a good sign either.)"
STEEMPUNK HOLMES!!!!1
― Frogman Henry, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:54 (seventeen years ago)
-- rockapads, Wednesday, July 2, 2008 9:48 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link
so far he's done, i guess, four films that fit this description, and with a fair amount of variation within them: easily as much as within ford's westerns or hitchcock's thrillers.
but also they deal with incredibly basic--i won't say 'universal' because it will upset people--themes, like losing your virginity, having a baby, going through a break-up, all of which are kind of amenable to syd field-type story arcs.
i think the curb or AD-type zany plot is better suited to the sitcom format, where you don't have to do much in the way of 'character development'* once they've been set out. (*again, i realize this is the kind of concept that pisses people off.)
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:54 (seventeen years ago)
I don't think Forgetting Sarah Marshall follows all that predictable an arc. There's no villain, no "wacky solution to win", etc. I guess 40YOV and KO do to some extent but I think Apatow's ascendancy is pretty well-deserved. I will always rep for him hard just cuz of Freaks and Geeks anyway.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:55 (seventeen years ago)
if anything 'forgetting sarah marshall' needed a more formula-minded script-editor.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:56 (seventeen years ago)
banriquit otm
sitcoms (hell all tv shows) hinge on familiarity w/ the characters; theyre way less entertaining otherwise. apatow is master at insta-familiarity, in a way that runs much deeper than 'this guy is a clutz/this guy is wacky' etc. xp
― deeznuts, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 20:58 (seventeen years ago)
"I don't think Forgetting Sarah Marshall follows all that predictable an arc."
Then you have not watched enough romantic comedies.
― Alex in SF, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 21:15 (seventeen years ago)
i see the AD/Curb zany plot less as sitcom plots, but something closer in spirit to old farce comedies with, like, Hepburn and Grant or whoever. Let there be many minor plots and characters revolving around some stupid event or series of misunderstandings, not just one big event which develops only the main character, and that the whole story hinges on. This, I suppose is more a response to the Will Farrell sporting/career type movie than the Apatow stuff.
― rockapads, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 21:17 (seventeen years ago)
entirely possible
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 21:19 (seventeen years ago)
i sorta understand the con arguments re: this movie's potential since i get sick of that shit a lot as well, but when something's done really well it doesn't matter how formula it is (cf. the bourne flicks) whereas some of the worst shit i've seen has been what i guess could be called "original".
― omar little, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 22:09 (seventeen years ago)
The problem is that formulaic part of this movie isn't done very well. In fact, they are done very boringly (mostly because the central characters in the formula are with the exception of the rocker guy pretty boring and before you argue that Jason Segal is not boring, he's exceedingly boring when he's interacting with Veronica Mars and That 70s Show girl.) The good parts are where the movie strays from the formula, the female leads aren't on screen and everyone gets to relax a little.
― Alex in SF, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 22:15 (seventeen years ago)
frankly I don't see these two strands as binary opposites, for god's sake. Katherine Hepburn wasn't Groucho Marx.
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 22:27 (seventeen years ago)
Are you responding to me or something upthread?
― Alex in SF, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 22:33 (seventeen years ago)
The direction in which this thread's gone all day (I include myself).
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 22:41 (seventeen years ago)
Well I think that Katherine Hepburn might have done a better job than Veronica Mars.
― Alex in SF, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 22:47 (seventeen years ago)
katherine heigl and elizabeth banks (and maybe catherine keener?) are excellent improvisers, is part of why 'knocked up' and '40-year-old virgin' work. veronica mars is not. but then i don't know that katherine hepburn would have been.
― banriquit, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 22:50 (seventeen years ago)
im guessing this post is supposed to be some kind of meta-commentary in its own right but if not why?
no subtext! see it!
― Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 2 July 2008 23:18 (seventeen years ago)
alright will do! if'n i can, since imdb lists it as a tv movie from the 80s
― deeznuts, Thursday, 3 July 2008 02:11 (seventeen years ago)
http://www.weeklydig.com/news-opinions/feature/200809/pedovan
The film centers around misguided hipster Glenn Davis (played by Jonah Hill), who makes several failed attempts to bring the children of his community joy. Hill's character sports a bushy mustache, sideburns, dark glasses and thrift-store apparel. "He wears his clothes ironically," explains Apatow. "People think he's a pervert, but he's a soft, lovable lug."
After creating numerous doomed youth programs, Davis founds Ped-o-van ("Why walk when you can ped-o!"), a ZipCar-like community service where drivers pick children up from the park, their school or their extracurricular activities, and drive them home. All the vans are refurbished, soon-to-be junked conversion vans from the '70s. "He loves these vans," says writer Evan Goldberg. "And he loves these kids." Davis equips the vans to run on biodiesel, so he must stop at fast-food restaurants to fuel up. The vendors start offering the kids free fries, inciting the wrath of high-strung parents concerned about children's nutrition.
http://www.ped-o-van.com
― James Mitchell, Saturday, 20 September 2008 11:19 (seventeen years ago)
no
― Every Day Jimmy Mod Is Hustlin' (Jimmy The Mod Awaits The Return Of His Beloved), Saturday, 20 September 2008 13:18 (seventeen years ago)
faaake
― update prefs (ice crӕm), Saturday, 20 September 2008 14:37 (seventeen years ago)
It reads as if someone thought up the phrase "ped-o-van", thought it was funny, blurted it out to a frind, who laughed, and they proceeded to elaborate a whole movie script around it, in about - oh - fifteen minutes.
― Aimless, Saturday, 20 September 2008 19:24 (seventeen years ago)
Would this also be the thread wherein we un-anticipate Zach and Miri Make a Porno (actually a Kevin Smith film that stars Seth Rogen)? That and the Infinite Playlist movie look like they came out of some kind of generation Y movie idea generator.
― Everything is Highlighted (Hurting 2), Saturday, 20 September 2008 20:32 (seventeen years ago)
did anybody actually see the foot fist way?
― TOMBOT, Saturday, 20 September 2008 20:38 (seventeen years ago)
some kind of generation Y movie idea generator
Although I guess that's what Stiller/Apatow/Ferrell/Rogen/Smith etc. collectively are
― Everything is Highlighted (Hurting 2), Saturday, 20 September 2008 20:52 (seventeen years ago)
― TOMBOT, Saturday, September 20, 2008 10:38 PM (49 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
yeah, there's a thread on it. it's good.
― spanish girls, they like to call me pancho (special guest stars mark bronson), Saturday, 20 September 2008 21:28 (seventeen years ago)
That and the Infinite Playlist movie look like they came out of some kind of generation Y movie idea generator.
Infinite Playlist is a remake of 200 Cigarettes as a non-period piece.
― King Boy Patio (sic), Sunday, 21 September 2008 03:13 (seventeen years ago)
hey I actually found Rogen funny in a film! He's onscreen for about 10 mins. (in 3 roles)
― Dr Morbius, Friday, 23 January 2009 20:20 (seventeen years ago)
http://revlu.com/images/horse/4horsemenL.jpg
― shook pwns (omar little), Friday, 23 January 2009 20:24 (seventeen years ago)
Together, like Lenin and Trotsky, Phillips and Apatow have engineered a comedic-cinematic putsch. “Old School,” in 2003, was the April Theses for this uprising, and “The 40-Year-Old Virgin,” in 2005, was its October Revolution.
words actually published in the new york times
― so brycey (history mayne), Thursday, 14 July 2011 23:49 (fourteen years ago)