Your 2008 Democratic Convention Thread

-- Dr Morbius (wjwe...), September 27th, 2006 12:50 PM. (Dr Morbius) (link)

EXCEPT YOU RUINED IT, MORBIUS.

Hillary for keynote speaker?

http://www.2004dnc.com/2008presidentialelection/DNCC_logo_dnc2008_1_500.jpg

I read first Dem con to start w/ a religious service?

Who do you think should keynote? Kaine's got the best communication skills maybe, but isn't glitzy enough. Warner might be, but I think I gotta concede Hillary would be a much bigger deal. She's an older face, but definitely a current figure, and we've got enough novelty already, probably. But wait, we're in the West - should the branding extend to the keynote? Would Schweitzer work? Maybe not so much? Is Napolitano a good compromise? Not really, I don't think.

lol, Al Franken, lol

nah, Clinton makes a lot of sense given what's happened.

clinton is a good idea

she could make the case for the female veep

actually, I should say I've only seen Napolitano as a talking head - her style might work a lot better on the podium

she could talk about John McCain from his backyard

but yeah, Hillary seems like a pretty easy choice

http://thepage.time.com/2008/08/13/mark-warner-named-keynote-speaker-for-dem-convention/

livevid of gabbneb

fuck you, hillary

this arguably signals that warner (and not hillary) is an intended successor in an obama party. mbcarl at dkos thinks that signals the veep will be an older dude who wouldn't run for president in 8 years, like biden, which may well be the case. but i don't think it necessarily rules out sebelius. she would be 68 in 2016, ready to either retire or become the first female prez. would 62-year-old warner be too old to be a veep?

nor does it necessarily rule out bayh - who i think probably is not the veep anyway - who's only a year younger than warner and more heartland-oriented

it might suggest that kaine is not the guy, though

a contrary view

are they trying to play with mccainco's heads?

http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/08/a_virginiacentric_convention.php

this goes even further to suggest that Warner is not the Veep, but it does say "resisted," not "refused"

country music interludes and appearances by NASCAR stars, huh?

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/08/bayhdenkabelius.html

Mark Ambinder says there's no profit in interpreting. But I think he may be underinterpreting - you don't have to know who the veep is to schedule Tuesday night, only who the veep isn't. And if say you're Sebelius you don't have to tell everyone, only point in the right/away from the wrong directions. And if you're Sebelius and also the veep, things might be even easier. If she's scheduled for Tuesday, it wouldn't be hard for her to change the schedule at the last minute, subbing in someone else who's in on the deal. McCaskill's appearance on Monday - http://www.demconvention.com/the-2008-convention-monday-august-25th-one-nation/ - in some respects makes perfect sense - it doesn't get more middle-American and welcoming. And Monday's like the soft opening of the convention. But isn't it also a little conspicuous for her to be the only pol announced on Monday, while Tuesday is packed wall-to-wall?

Symmetry required gabbneb to start this.

was it really worth breaking up his Rain Man act for that, Rev?

Heck of a job, Brownie.

http://www.johnmccain.com/images/citizens/joe_name.gif

^ from mcain's site waht

Where have you been for the past 4 years?

srsly homie is prob gonna speak at convention and is an improb but bandied veep choice

i pray he picks Lieberman so everyone can revive that "Loserman" nickname

joementum!

^ from mcain's site waht

-- Catsupppppppppppppp dude 茄蕃, Thursday, August 14, 2008 9:55 AM (56 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

Where have you been for the past 4 years?

-- HI DERE, Thursday, August 14, 2008 9:56 AM (55 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

Dude is an "independent" who caucuses with the dems, dontchaknow!

he's been supporting McCain for like, months and months, though

arkansas's democratic party head and a superdelegate to the convention was murdered yesterday in little rock! awful awful awful.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/promos/politics/blog/02blog-mccainlieberman.jpg

^ wnkiw

who's that in drag to McCain's left?

that's his brittle boned wife

he's been supporting McCain for like, months and months, though

-- Mr. Que, Thursday, August 14, 2008 10:56 AM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

So how is he a "democrat"?

ah sorry, I thought you were boggling at him supporting McCain

? pretty sure he's an independent now. i know i've read at least a couple of articles in the Post or The Times about how unpopular Joe is around the Senate w/the Democrats

Right, so the linked graphic is super misleading.

i mean i don't know how they put up with him either or why they don't kick him out of the caucus--i'm sure it has something to do w/how close the balance of power is between dems and reps in the senate

here we go

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/14/us/politics/14lieberman.html?_r=1&pagewanted=print&oref=slogin

Connecticut for Lieberman is a Connecticut political party created by twenty-five supporters of Senator Joe Lieberman. The party was created to enable Lieberman to run for re-election following his defeat in the 2006 Connecticut Democratic primary.[1] [2] In the succeeding general election, Lieberman received 50% of the vote, defeating Democrat Ned Lamont and Republican Alan Schlesinger.[3]

/wiki

he is an "independent democrat" and caucuses with dems

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5DNpJBzxG8

^ can someone tell me what triggered this again?

Dear HUNTER --

We've been amazed by the number of people expressing interest in attending Barack's acceptance speech on the final night of the Democratic National Convention here in Colorado.

Unfortunately, there are only a certain number of seats in the stadium, and we cannot fulfill every Coloradan's request to attend the event.

Due to the high demand for Community Credentials, you have been placed on a wait list.

no luv

Who calls a candidate by his first name?

Ludacris

Anne Filipic
General Election Director
Colorado Campaign for Change

her

Timothy Egan on the New West-ern vote

Obama reportedly in Billings Tuesday

wtf, eyesore podium?

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_10270047

wau, lol

Welcome to Obamacenter

I'm glad it has lots of flags

also, a trapdoor for Captain James Tiberius Clinton

yeah, it's going to look exactly like that. for the whole convention.

those aren't screens or test graphics or anything like that.

it looks like they're testing the Parallax View.

BRUCE

shit that's awesome, maybe even true!

maybe even utterly predictable!

you'd figure Bam would call in that Boss chit. this being the MOST IMPORTANT, TIDE-CHANGING etc.

wtf you were hoping for Rage Against the Machine?

Report: Flipper to convert millions of undecided female suburbanites at rare Invesco Field performance

Obama invites Ying Yang Twins to perform at DNC

I'll let you Dems plan the bread & circuses for their infomercial, thx

wonder if that DNC podium will be anything like

http://wmdeez.files.wordpress.com/2007/08/daft-punk-harder-better-faster-stronger.jpg

what time does Obama go on?

Obama O'Clock

Oh broma.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3254/2788105962_91ef48f549.jpg

Thanks for ruining the DNC, nothing could possibly compare to whatever scenario would have led to that.

Obama has great taste in synthesizers!

Obama is playing at my house

my house

uh huhhuhhuh HAW

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/aug/25/the-boss-bon-jovi-headed-for-obamas-acceptance/

go jersey

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/08/25/no_red_meat_from_warner_speech.html

Oh come the fuck on. Chuck Todd just said on MSNBC that apparently Bill Clinton is unhappy he has to give a speech on something boring like national security and would rather give a speech on the good the Democratic Party has done in recent history (read: his stay in office).

!

RPhillips writes:

I'm not surprised that Springsteen and Bon Jovi would appear at the Democrat Convention. But I'm disappointed, because they are helping elect the first genuine marxist presidential candidate (Eugene Debs was conservative by Obama standards).

Ir appears if your from the entertainment sector, you automatically support Obama. Otherwise, you just don't belong, I guess. The herd instinct.

But then, Obama is a fellow performer--the smiling, dissembling villain.

loool

lolololololololollolollll

from whence this hilaruss and widespread wingnut meme that hrc or so many other centrists are "super-liberal commies"

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2008/0821/20080821_104902_ae22dnc_podium.jpg

and on the side stage...

http://www.merryswankster.com/images/Coachella_DaftPUnk_red.jpg

RAWK. VOTE BA RAWK.

haha i missed clay's post. Sorry.

anyone see the clip of that fox dude accusing demonstrators of hating free speech because they refused to talk to him?

http://www.latimes.com/media/alternatethumbnails/photo/2008-08/41822017-25110437.jpg

So, I only have one television station: Fox - which is not broadcasting the convention, at least not in my area. For some reason, I can watch Fox clearly, while all of the stations that will show the convention (NBC, CBS, ABC, PBS) don't come in at all.

I browsed the major network's websites, but I don't think it's possible to watch it live on any of them.

Anyone know of any other website?

don't you think cspan will at least show speeches?

The Democratic National Convention site looks like it's streaming coverage. Of course, it will be pundit-free, which is either a good or a bad thing, depending on how you look at it.

http://www.demconvention.com/

Perrin watches C-SPAN:

I came in when Prof. Cornel West was in mid-sermon. I wasn't quite sure what West was talking about, as he has a tendency to free associate. But he did mention the "American empire" that covers the globe through various means. Rep. Jesse Jackson, Jr. cut West off to remind him that there was a huge audience watching at that very moment, and that the Prof. should reconsider his language, lest "independents" or even Republicans who might be leaning toward Obama be offended. West shot back that Jackson knew what he was saying was true, and while Jackson quickly agreed, he reiterated that this was "Barack Obama's platform," and talk about an American empire was potentially alienating. This was followed by former Virginia Governor Douglas Wilder's claim that the planet looks to the US for guidance, and that an Obama presidency would reassert American power and influence abroad.

Empire? Where?

http://dennisperrin.blogspot.com/2008/08/mule-notes.html

http://timrileylive.wordpress.com/2008/08/25/593/

Vid of Fox News guys getting a strong reaction from the crowd, who, realizing that they have a live feed, start chanting 'Fuck Fox News!'

anyone see the clip of that fox dude accusing demonstrators of hating free speech because they refused to talk to him?

-- gbx, Monday, August 25, 2008 11:59 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Link

that's the clip, i mean.

as close to self-parody as i've seen fox come lately

That brightened my day.

coverage begins at the following times tonight for the following media:
5: C-Span
6: CNN
7: MSNBC (and Fox?)
8: PBS
10: Nets

gavel in is at 5

well this is spectacularly lame so far

Are The Decemberists going to play? 'Cause that would pack Invesco Field.

and now suddenly it got much better

but seriously a '70s soul house band for a Denver convention?

howard dean needs to learn how to read from a teleprompter

I'm ready to party with some delegates tonight!

Oy vey.

first we had the introduction of The Female Convention Co-Chairs, most of them in absentia; now we have The Hispanic Congressmen, the lead speaker of whom called for the election of Barack Arama

i need to remember this - http://politicalwire.com/archives/2008/08/25/this_week_is_about_democrats.html

um, maybe i'm hearing things, but i think the next Rep called him Babar Obama

Has this bit been mentioned yet?

http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=98286&catid=188

DENVER - A sprinkler system partially flooded part of the Pepsi Center Monday morning.

The Denver Fire Department, which has a crew stationed at the center all week, was able to respond quickly before 5 a.m. when the sprinkler went off.

The sprinkler was located on the club level in a skybox which had recently been renovated to host a news crew. It appears the skybox belongs to Fox.

people are so weird

I agree with the Hillary supporters. I have voted Republican since Gary Hart didn't get the nomination. Its because of my fierce loyalty to Gary Hart that I will never vote for a Democrat again. I became so happy when George HW Bush became president in 1988 just to show those Democrats that because Hart didn't get the nomination, they wouldn't get my vote then or forever. When 2000 came around, even though I believe in global warming, a woman's right to choose, science, mathematics, education, alternative fuels, the separation of church and state, a responsible justice department and Supreme Court justices, I had to vote for George W. Bush because of what happened to my champion Gary Hart. In 2004, when the Iraq war turned out to be as predicted, a sham and perhaps a $3,000,000,000,000 quagmire for our country, the attack on science in our classrooms, the Patriot Act tearing apart our constitution, I couldn't vote for John Kerry because I made an allegiance to vote against myself interests because of Gary Hart. Now, in 2008, when perhaps the very soul of our country is at stake, I will once again vote for Senator McCain and take great rejoice in it because of my fierce allegiance to Gary Hart. Hillary supporters can finally feel my pain from what happened to my candidate back in '88. Why don't the Hillary supporters, all 18,000,000 of them mail her a check for $1.22 so she can pay off her debt, $11,000,000 of which is from her own bank accounts. You Hillary supporters are the biggest bunch of stone cold losers imaginable.

i think that post is a joke mandee :B

OH DANG i was really entertained by it!!

i just envisioned this person with a GARY HART shrine!

Poor Gary Hart is writing James Monroe biographies.

gary hart would be a good contender for secretary of state

Matthews is almost unwatchable on this live set

The Democratic National Convention site looks like it's streaming coverage. Of course, it will be pundit-free, which is either a good or a bad thing, depending on how you look at it.

http://www.demconvention.com/

Yeah, for some reason it tells me I don't have the prerequisite system requirements to stream video there, even though I do.

Oh well, hopefully I'm not missing much today and tomorrow.

also if you want to see speeches by junior-Senator level (and female) figures, you gotta watch C-Span - apparently MSNBC considers Joe Scarborough more important than Amy Klobuchar

you can watch C-Span's coverage on the web

Ah, and it's on MSNBC.com too. Thanks ya'll.

lol msnbc

god, pelosi's story about her 5yr old grandson's smitteness with obama surely veers into mccain's 'celebrity' narrative territory

yeah, i'm missing the smittenness

i can't believe i'm typing this, but still: is katrina the democrats' 9/11?

hmm, dunno if getting carter to narrate this is the smartest move...

so tonight may answer the my why-aren't-they-using-michelle-more-she's-a-great-speaker question - she gets her own prime time introduction

republicans are post-rational, they make no sense

crush of shame: caroline kennedy

Obama assassination plot: http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/25/202351/297/530/575086

god who the fuck cares about ted kennedy

hey we get Jim Leach in prime time

I just tuned in a few moments ago. Is this convention as lame as it seems?

Someone from Massachusetts remind me why Kennedy is such an "icon."

seriously, idk if ive ever felt so out of touch with the media and the dem party as seeing all these people on TV act like jesus christ just descended from the rafters to crown barack president of the entire world.

does no one remember kennedy endorsing obama and obama losing massachusetts? ppl need to wake the fuck up and move on

seriously no one in the real world gives a flying fuck about him

maybe its a symptom of 8 hr convention coverage tonight, but seeing matthews and kerry and esp olbermann rhapsodizing over this pointless speech is just crazy to me

I think old people in the northeast care, and that's a rich, powerful group. But yeah, I don't get it.

he's a kennedy & he's about to die whats so hard to udnerstand

tonight, we are all Shakey Mo.

fantastic speech by Leach

So, like lots of American stars, he's famous for Something no one can quite place?

you had to watch PBS for it

fucking network talking heads not showing McCaskill either

too busy bloviating

Sebelius is looking scripted but coming across well on CBS. Plus her mic looks like a fish bone.

I am not easily bored but wow this is boring

we get Barry from KC after Michelle

Seriously, is there an open bar, any bar, at the convention hall? You can drink, right? Where would Mencken find his beer and pretzels?

they interviewed Sebelius on CBS?

um, deeznuts actually otm ... kennedy has been a member of the liberal wing of the dem party for like 40 yrs, whats not to understand??

god who the fuck cares about ted kennedy

-- J0rdan S., Monday, August 25, 2008 8:52 PM (27 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

lots of people?

fucking network talking heads not showing McCaskill either

Probably for the best. I'm -- sorta -- watching it.

um, deeznuts actually otm

ban deej

um, deeznuts actually otm ... kennedy has been a member of the liberal wing of the dem party for like 40 yrs, whats not to understand??

You win the Tautology Award.

http://cbs4denver.com/investigates/assisination.plot.obama.2.802827.html

god who the fuck cares about ted kennedy

-- J0rdan S., Monday, August 25, 2008 8:52 PM (27 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

lots of people?

-- deej, Monday, August 25, 2008 9:22 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

deej are you serious

oh geez

for one obv the question is rhetorical, secondly, seriously, who cares about him besides old ass ppl from the east coast.

does anyone on this board care about anything kennedy says? does anyone on this board know anyone who cares about anything kennedy says?

i know one, my grandmother, who is like 85 years old and a kennedy die hard.

I think I'll listen to 808 State until Michelle O comes on.

Never mind.

Go Beavers!

he carries no clout nationally anymore, as evidenced, and ppl on TV could've moved on to something more pressing and actually newsworthy, like say, kkk members trying to assassinate obama

I do, J0rdan. I think Kennedy matters, as recently as his firey opposition to the Iraq War. But if you're complaining, at some level, about the very lame nature of the convention so far (which would tend to make Kennedy's speech seem more important than it is, because the other speakers have been so uninspiring), I agree with you.

(xp)

And now (I pray) for something better. Michelle Obama looks hot (hope that's not too sexist).

Gad, these things are so scripted that even Michelle's endearing awkwardness -- her best trait -- seems pinched. I mean, we've heard for DAYS how Mrs. Obama must sound "human" and "American" and a "family person."

I do, J0rdan. I think Kennedy matters, as recently as his firey opposition to the Iraq War. But if you're complaining, at some level, about the very lame nature of the convention so far (which would tend to make Kennedy's speech seem more important than it is, because the other speakers have been so uninspiring), I agree with you.

-- Daniel, Esq., Monday, August 25, 2008 9:36 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link

ill pose the question again: who cares about him besides old ass ppl from the east coast.

j/k daniel :D

WOO

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Ah, thanks.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f185/PappaWheelie/WOOWWOO.gif

j0rdan, if you live long enough and troll hard enough, maybe someday someone will give a shit about you. maybe.

again, if you are an old ass person from the east coast, please don't answer my question

You know, you can offer a defense instead of being an asshole about someone offering an honest opinion, gabbs.

here, ill pose another one: who cares about him besides old ass ppl from the east coast and lesbians who wear capris from the east coast

Alfred's right about all this being overly-scripted. Another reason I'm anxiously awaiting Joe Biden. He's probably going to extemp his whole speech.

haha whoops xxp

anyway im serious gabnebb, if you want to gimme some links or whatever that's cool, but no one cares about ted kennedy anymore except entrenched dems who read about politics 24/7, like yourself

I'm off to the "ILX'ors who are in their 40s" thread.

My mom loves Ted Kennedy; my sis loves Caroline.

Michele Obama 2016!

"this is why i love this country"

^^fuck this, i hope everyone recoiled from the tv as i did

Was the 2004 GOP convention this scripted? Mostly I remember bug-eyed Zell Miller screaming into the camera. Obv., too early to judge this convention.

michelle obama is so hot right now

She needs to put that finger down.

Watching Michelle Obama. She looks lovely.

however, she does pronounce EYE-RAWK like my boss and most Americans do.

Gad, these things are so scripted that even Michelle's endearing awkwardness -- her best trait -- seems pinched. I mean, we've heard for DAYS how Mrs. Obama must sound "human" and "American" and a "family person."

i dunno, it took a few minutes to warm up, but i kinda think she's killing this.

^^fuck this, i hope everyone recoiled from the tv as i did

helllooooo, trying to win an election here. americans demand that you love them and pat them on the head.

BAH-RAWK and EYE-RAWK.

OK, she's warming up. Maybe I'm not a human being, but I'm baffled by how expert boilerplate like this can make women cry.

Did anybody count the "you see"s in that speech?

that speech is gonna get big wet sloppy pundit kisses.

olbermann offtm

It was a good speech. They're playing Isn't She Lovely! And so she is.

Jordan, as a former resident of CoMo and a non-old ass (albeit, currently living near East Coast style), I care about Ted Kennedy! Gawd, though, the first night of this convention is HORRIBLE.

Gegorge Stephanopolololololopoulous' jaw trembled.

omg floating barack head.

that was a completely pedestrian speech with some stomach turning lines

she's still the shit but ppl need to come the fuck on

Obama's daughters giving the first lifelike moment to the evening.

My gosh, this moment is going to help Obama.

leave it to barack's youngest daughter to be the most relatable person at this fucking convention

Cokie Roberts will finger herself after this moment.

did anyone catch him say "here in st louis"

obama making the slip up between kc and st. louis: there goes the MO vote

The unscripted interaction there were Effective Moment Nos. 1 -- 10.

OMG they let the little girl run away with the mic.

HI DADDY

"Daddy what city are you in?"

"... I'm in Kansas City sweetie."

Sullivan crows:

One of the best, most moving, intimate, rousing, humble, and beautiful speeches I've heard from a convention platform. Maybe she should be running for president. You don't need any commentary from me. This was a home-run. And sincere. Thank God that in the end, the truth struggles out there. Just look at her mother's face

McCain campaign scrambling to script their own "HI DADDY" moment over the next week.

maybe they could have his ex-wife up on stage or something

just thinking out loud though

Hopefully M. Obama's speech will help with the HRC constituency.

Maybe McCain will ask his Vietcong captors onstage for a reconciliatory moment.

what if they set up the feed in the wrong house :-/

alfred beat me to that one by like 5 seconds.

Maybe McCain will ask his Vietcong captors onstage for a reconciliatory moment.

And then he'll kill them.

You know, you can offer a defense instead of being an asshole about someone offering an honest opinion

honest opinion, lol. i would never dignify j0rdan's shit that way.

btw, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

try to win the young married suburbans now, oldman

gabbneb, i value the unique perspective that you, as a lesbian, bring to this thread, and i'd wish that you would extend the same courtesy to me

leave it to barack's youngest daughter to be the most relatable person at this fucking convention

lol she's the closest in age to you

lol true but u old

Gabbneb's not wrong about the effectiveness of M. Obama's speech, but OTOH, McCain has a whole constituency of white men out there thinking, "WTF? Why aren't we talking about killing terrorists?"

And I'm guessing I am older than Gabbneb. So I'm OLD.

j0rdan - i care about ted kennedy, im not old or from the east coast, and you're acting like deeznuts in this thread

Michelle O should kill the terrorists with her TEETH.

why would michelle obama talk about killing terrorists?

That was a great speech. I'm a softie for shit like this, calls out to family and so on, though. And wow what a progressive speech! Basically, family + progressive politics, more convincingly tied together than a richster like Kerry or his wife could pull off.

ouch deej

did you watch the reactions on tv to kennedy's speech? if you didn't think it was ridiculous, over the top and unnecessary, then you are way into deep

i didnt watch them

but you posting over and over again "WHO REALLY CARES ABOUT TED KENNEDY? COME ON HES SO LAST WEEK" is really corny

where does he stand in relation to Flo Rida and Plies? perhaps you can use helpful greater-than or less-than symbols

I know I'm just a concern troll, but has anyone WTF'd at this piece of news?

http://cbs4denver.com/investigates/assisination.plot.obama.2.802827.html

Is there any update on this?

Basically, family + progressive politics, more convincingly tied together than a richster like Kerry or his wife could pull off.

otm. she rules.

more like he's so last two decades ago

and sry dude but it was really repulsive to see ppl on msnbc and cnn drooling over this speech with absolute zero perspective

yes, Mordy, we are the ATF

j0rdan do you really not get making an explicit & direct connection b/w obama & JFK??

ATF?

i did

say wtf, i mean

you're acting like deeznuts in this thread

-- deej, Monday, August 25, 2008 11:07 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

deej, shut the fuck up. me and everyone else has had enough of this insecure meta bullshit from you lately. youre the worst poster on ilm and on 77, no joke. worse than deeznuts. i wanted to say this a couple months ago but seriously you need to quit ilx if this is what it's come to. go back and live in your moms house and leave the rest of us alone.

-- J0rdan S., Tuesday, June 3, 2008 11:04 PM (2 months ago) Bookmark Link

boys get a room

the dude has a brain tumor and has been at the center of actually significant and largely positive legislation for over 40 years. no question that in many ways hes been a douche, has often done things i disagreed with, bu hes one of the most significant figures in u.s. political history. think about how long our country has been around - not even 250 years - and hes basically been involved for politics for 1/5th of this country's existence, and has generally been on 'the right side' of things more often than not. i think that = lots of people 'care' about him

if they did some sort of cheesy soft-focus tribute then whatever, call it cheesy, but getting mad about a tribute bcuz he doesnt have facebook groups from midwest colleges devoted to his existence is weird

j0rdan, kennedy is the second in the senate only to robert byrd, who's been a senator since teddy roosevelt was president. this is probably his last convention, and they gave him less than 20 minutes on the first night. and this is too much for you?

boys get a room

i think they already have one at their mom's

deej, shut the fuck up. me and everyone else has had enough of this insecure meta bullshit from you lately. youre the worst poster on ilm and on 77, no joke. worse than deeznuts. i wanted to say this a couple months ago but seriously you need to quit ilx if this is what it's come to. go back and live in your moms house and leave the rest of us alone.

-- J0rdan S., Tuesday, June 3, 2008 11:04 PM (2 months ago) Bookmark Link

-- and what, Monday, August 25, 2008 10:14 PM (36 seconds ago) Bookmark Link

this was like when pharoahe monch ghostwrote that song for diddy

the amount of ppl in this country who care about flo rida and plies is like 3x the amount of ppl who care about ted kennedy~~

oh snap hard zing from gabbneb!!!!! did you SEE what he said about you guys living with your MOMS?????

0rdan, kennedy is the second in the senate only to robert byrd, who's been a senator since teddy roosevelt was president. this is probably his last convention, and they gave him less than 20 minutes on the first night. and this is too much for you?

-- Mr. Que, Monday, August 25, 2008 10:15 PM (37 seconds ago) Bookmark Link

que, im not talking about the dem party specifically, or kennedy specifically, just the reaction to the speech on tv, which was so over the moon that it was basically self-parody

an unexpected move, trolling without the use of a sockpuppet account

j0rdan i watched the convention on pbs. maybe you should turn msnbc or fox or whatever you have on and watch a halfway decent tv coverage of the convention--just a thought.

i get watch your saying though--i am watching charlie rose on this right now and it's pretty awful.

you guys should watch fox news all their male broadcasters look like scary wax mannican monters

"guys remember, deej knows nothing about politics"

lmao at jordan vs deej pt2 being all reheated and what zings

lmao at self-lionization on a message board

i just remembered i still have a bag of popcorn left

msnbc should be devoting an hour of coverage to and what's groundbreaking message boarding

still wishing for the proverbial ilx tv talking head show

hey deej

"guys remember, deej knows nothing about politics"

-- J0rdan S., Monday, August 25, 2008 11:20 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

this is a quote of one of my posts

thats why i said that

gtfo

lol i had no idea what u were talking about, *shrugs shoulders*

*cold-clocks gabbneb, knocks over teleprompter, flounces off*

still wishing for the proverbial ilx tv talking head show

Inspired idea. Nominations for ILX's talking heads. . .

*corrects spelling of cold-cock*

Josh Marshall OTM here. Here's what must happen next: attack, attack, attack.

Dowd and Halperin identify insufficient temperature in the room, probably Hillary-related, that has to be resolved by Thursday. if I recall correctly, that was a day 1 problem four years ago too, but i'll defer to their greater familiarity.

btw, the need for attack, attack, attack is totally wrong. of course you have to draw the contrast and ridicule mccain, but you've got 70 days for surrogates to do that, and the convention is about awesome free media to define the candidate. the election is a referendum on obama - mccain can't win, but obama can lose. as charlie rose's roundtable is saying, he has to use the opportunity to connect with voters first.

and no, kerry didn't lose because he didn't attack enough at the convention. he probably should have attacked more, but primarily because he, unlike obama, had already passed the commander-in-chief test and was more of a known quantity, and because he, unlike obama, probably lost votes in direct proportion to the extent to which his ordinary guy-ness was subject to public exposure.

Are you kidding me???? Did that woman just say "my word is my bond" "word is bond" is sooooo incredibly GETTO. I worked in a prison for 10 years and that's all the inmates said!! That is NOT what I want in the White House. Hell no! I'll take McCain and his 7 houses any day!!!

Posted By: moving on | August 25, 2008 at 11:16 PM

We'll have to agree to disagree. The GOP 2004 convention was attack!, attack!, attack!, and they never let up for the following 70 days. And it worked.

yeah, Bush didn't exactly have to introduce himself to the country by that point. the GOP 2000 convention was very different.

gabbneb, who i hate, is otm. i think the spectacle angle is the one to go w/; let obama continue to appear in control & not desperate

i think gabbneb is right. surely kerry should've attacked more than he did, but his downfall in that regard was also parallel to the fact that to many ppl he became more unlikable and uninspiring as he became more visible and more well-known. i don't think barack has that problem.

^^two ringing endorsements here

That's true; Bush was in a different place in 2004. And he could have had his convention speakers remain "above the fray" and remained "Presidential." Instead, those speakers snickered and sneered and laughed at and ridiculed and attacked and mocked Kerry. And they never let up. And it worked: both at a literal level (i.e., the attacks themselves stuck) and at a meta-level (Kerry not fighting back defined him as the passive guy that you don't want leading the country (despite Kerry being the real tough-guy as between himself and Bush)).

of course you have to draw the contrast and ridicule mccain

BTW, this isn't too far off from what I mean, anyway. Drawing the contrast and ridiculing McCain is the attack. The 7-houses thing is icing on the cake.

the problem is thats totally expected from the republican hype machine & totally antithetical to the one obama's constructed

I hear you. It's my opinion (useless as it may be) that this is a recipe for Democratic Party failure.

Besides, I'm not saying Obama has to be the attack dog. He should be Presidential. But I want scathing attacks in speeches from, say, HRC and Joe Biden. We need that fire.

hrc for SURE, she's totally set up to say some really really biting shit

Yeah, but biting toward whom, is what I'm worried about.

But yes, I expect her to attack McCain.

I agree they need to hit McCain hard, but tonight featured two of the three speakers who need to stay above the fray (the other being Barack himself, obv.)

But somebody needs to step up and play the role Rudy played for the GOP in 04. It needs to be Hillary, who can bust McCain up specifically on core issues her own voters presumably care about: economy, health care, choice. I'd like to see her really rip into her good friend John McCain, but dunno if she will.

x-post

Drawing the contrast and ridiculing McCain is the attack.

yeah, i know, i'm saying you have to do some of it at the convention, but that it should be secondary to the primary goal of introducing obama

I'm not sure we're disagreeing, then, except maybe in tone.

But somebody needs to step up and play the role Rudy played for the GOP in 04. It needs to be Hillary, who can bust McCain up specifically on core issues her own voters presumably care about: economy, health care, choice.

Yeah, HRC is the natural choice. Heck, her message in the primaries was that she -- unlike Obama -- would attack the GOP relentlessly. Now let's see it happen, in a different role.

Also, Biden should go straight at McCain and the GOP.

fox new is running this great bit where they interview a bunch of dumb girls about obama, ask them loaded questions, & then talk about how he's an american idol candidate

brilliantly done

so Warner goes on around 9:30 tomorrow, and then Schweitzer's in prime time before Hillary. they probably won't show the latter, of course.

That's a shame, if it's true. They should show Schweitzer.

BTW, Chuck Todd, MSNBC, a moment ago: "The GOP's convention will not be about 'Kumbaya' moments. It will be about attacking Barack Obama."

He follows -- echoed by the other commentators -- by saying that every aspect of the GOP convention (every speech, every suspenseful moment) will be focused on attacking Obama.

right, because the election is about Obama. no one likes McCain, but they might vote for him if they don't like Obama enough.

I think you're underestimating McCain's support. But yeah, the GOP's strategy is to make the election all about Obama (his "newness," "inexperience," "oddness," "coolness," "hidden Islamic tendencies," and so forth).

I hear he's fathered a black baby, too.

I think you're underestimating McCain's support

pollster.com records 38 national polls taken in part in the month of August 2008. McCain's support is below 40% in six polls, between 40 and 44% in 12, and as high as 47% just twice (and no higher). Obama has hit or exceeded the 47% mark 14 times, while falling below 40% just once.

I hope someone points that out sometime during this week, that "Those folks will spend their entire convention attacking Barack, 'cuz really, McCain ain't got shit."

xp

Okay, you think "McCain ain't got s--t." But Bush didn't have much either in 2004, but he won, by demonizing Kerry. That's exactly the strategy the GOP will use in 2008. The issue will be whether Obama can respond to those attacks -- both at the literal and meta levels -- better than Kerry.

And Gabbneb, McCain is running even with Obama in many national polls. The enthusiasm for his candidacy isn't what I'm concerned about, except to the extent that unenthusiastic supporters of McCain won't vote.

Bush didn't have much either in 2004

Bush led fairly solidly throughout the 2004 campaign, apart from blips around the time of Richard Clarke's testimony, the convention and the first 2 debates

wtf @ cnn.com

http://i37.tinypic.com/25k4mzm.png

Right, despite the enthusiasm for his policies and personality not being especially strong. He vaulted and stayed over Kerry by (a) scaring the nation (and emphasizing his role as leader of the "Daddy Party," and (b) attacking, mocking and ridiculing Kerry relentlessly.

(xp to Gabbneb)

he stayed over Kerry by being the incumbent and pointing out accurately that Kerry is kind of a stiff guy

Okay, you think "McCain ain't got shit." But Bush didn't have much either in 2004, but he won, by demonizing Kerry. That's exactly the strategy the GOP will use in 2008.

Thing is, somebody needs to explicitly point that out.

In 2004, we had been made weaker by the idiocy of Dubya in multiple areas, but no one ever actually said that. It's like they were all just working from the point of "well, all that is obvious, of course" which is bullshit. It's one of the few bits i remember from my technical communication course: nothing is ever "obvious," especially when you're trying to persuade others who hold a different set of viewpoints, experiences, and mental frameworks.

If they get out the message enough this week that those chuckleheads will do nothing next week but try to bash and bash because they truly offer nothing, then it can undercut all the shit that will be going on next week. You cast their probable attacks in the light of being mere pathetic thrashings by cranks scared shitless by the chickens finally coming home ot roost, maybe it will set things up a bit differently.

kingfish, you don't win elections by explaining the subtext of things to people

I'm not talking about this as if it's fine shading of a point, it's just something rather obvious that actually needs to be said.

Come on. He did everything possible to portray Kerry was weak. He mocked Kerry relentlessly. He lunged across the stage during the opening handshake of their first debate like he was the dominant animal marking his territory. His convention speakers suggested their Democratic opposition were "girlie men" and wanted to fight terrorism with "spitballs." He tacitly encouraged the Swift Boat attacks, daring Kerry to fight back, an invitation Kerry declined, because he thought he was ahead on points and should remain above-the-fray. His surrogates chortled at Kerry windsurfing. He ran a commercial showing the world as full of dangerous wolves, and that you needed the toughest dog in the pound to keep those wolves away from us. Cheney actually said that voting for John Kerry materially increased the risk of a nuclear strike against the United States. The whole body language of their campaign was to bully and mock Kerry, who never significantly counter-attacked.

Bush did a very good job of framing Kerry, not just pointing out he was a stiff.

Pat Buchanon was on MSBNC bloaviating about it being a good speech and all but there was no indication in it that Michelle was actually Christian, despite others nring up the number of times she said "God" and "grace" and shit.

So I guess we can expect Fox to outrage*, "Why do the Obamas hate Jesus?"

*now a verb

(Again, my post was an xp to Gabbneb).

BTW, I'm not trying to be dogmatic. It's an interesting discussion to me, and I realize there are many reasonable points of view.

only attacking is also the last-resort approach that mccain is using - it's a tacit admission that your guy can't make the case for himself. bush didn't only attack - there was a whole lot of positive stuff on their side as well that might not be as apparent if you, you know, hate him.

what kind of positive stuff?

All campaigns use positive and negative messages. But there are dominant themes in a campaign. Are you saying that 50% or more of Bush's 2004 campaign was built around positive images of Bush? If it was, those positive images were merely the flip-side of the Bush campaign's negative framing of Kerry (i.e., unlike Sen. Kerry, Pres. Bush is "strong," "decisive," "protective," and so forth).

probably the stuff that all dem strategists point to as his positives? his ability to "connect" w/ the every day southern white guy etc

xp

btw i used a question mark not to be condescending but cuz i dont wanna speak for gabnebb

J0rdan, that's a good point. There was plenty of that, you're right. OTOH, that also dovetailed into the Bush campaign's negative framing of Kerry (an out-of-touch East Coast elitist who likes Ted Kennedy, BTW).

no i know xp. like dan says the corollaries to the grotesque picture they painted of kerry/dems were the only positives i saw projected from the right wing. and maybe no child left behind et al mentioned in passing (so as not to delve into the shortcomings of programs like no child left behind)

daniel, i dont disagree, just echoing gabbneb's point that mccain has no choice but to make sure obama loses, as opposed to making sure that he himself wins.

bush on the other hand, could play both sides of the coin, which is why, hopefully, mccain's "swiftboating" will be measurably less successful, or at least won't be able to make up the deficit that is posed by the rest of his candidacy (i probably mean personality)

i dunno how to say this without sounding corny but i think there's been a major shift in popular perception of whats going on since 2000 & 2004 & obama is EXACTLY the guy to seize on it - look at 2006, for example

kerry was a totally patrician & patrician-seeming & patrician sounding guy & any attempts he made to come off otherwise seemed patently insincere - i actually do think people are ready to 'believe' in obama: the 2004 election was about hating george bush, the 2008 ones about loving barack

It doesn't sound corny. It does sound like things I've heard before, e.g., in 2004.

I do, however, agree that Obama has political skills far superior to his recent contemporaries (Kerry; Gore).

the 2004 election was about hating george bush

uh.

from the dem perspective

unfortunately it was also about tolerating Kerry. Outside of the dems who won't let go of Clinton everyone seems ecstatic about Obama, and I think that's also an important distinction.

i think an attack strategy that would play to o's strengths would be dragging Conservatism onto the philosophical carpet a little bit more, he could stay somewhat lofty (where mccain cannot follow) and still chisel away at mccain by rhetorical proxy.
he's surely got everything to lose in groundfighting abt oil drilling and this or that peripheral scandal no matter how swift his rebuttals, if the last election taught us anything it's that noise is not our friend. obama should return regularly to the sanctuary of 'vision' he was building in the primary and resist being goaded out of it by thinking the rest of the electorate is so much different and immune to 'celebrity' or whatever the haters want to call it.

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20080826/capt.fa73f9218c234b85a2aa92b03c065746.democratic_convention_corg179.jpg?x=400&y=280&q=85&sig=Pr2zAqxH5xt74TNgT0uI7w--

HI GIADORMO FAMILY

^^^ magic act

i mean however cloying you thought it was it should have been a billion times worse

but please less 'honoring the work of blah blah blather' more class warfare

(i love michelle too but imagine reading a transcript of that shite)

Uh oh. No Americans about?

earlier version of same story posted upthread, drowned in torrent of poor zings

I see now why you people don't give a fuck about Joe Biden being a whore-ass banking pimp.

whore-ass?

*crosses arms and waits*

...go on

http://www.nydailynews.com/img/2007/10/14/alg_arod-boras1.jpg

Let me know when Obama achieves a tenth of what Ted has in the last 40 years, you starstruck yobs.

u old

wow morbs i didnt peg u for a kennedy guy!!

right on tho

AND I know how to wipe my ass, gbx. Lessons at reasonable rates.

anyway: distasteful as the biden thing may be to some, is it enough to keep them away from the polls?

xp sorry dude, but grousing about old guys not getting enough props (btw, i think you're right) makes for easy, lazy zings

i dont know if everyone upthread was being serious about why all the adulation for kennedy but...

- hes one of the five or six most powerful and visible democrats in the country
- hes the oldest and most famous living member of an enormously respected democratic political dynasty, one that obama's campaign has taken pains to evoke (and one that democrats tend to be quite proud of)
- hes been a symbol of the progressive wing of the democratic party since before clinton
- he has BRAIN CANCER and hasnt made a public appearance since he was HOSPITALIZED with a tumor (i.e. this is probably one of his last moments in the spotlight)
- he was one of the first nationally visible democrats to endorse obama

i get that not everyone is a teddy fan but i feel like u really have to not be paying attention to not get why he got such a huge response last night

yah

that durn obama is just too popular for people like morbs and mccain and PUMAs

that link about an assassination plot is chilling, especially since I just read this in the New York Times.

The race issue can come up in peculiar and jolting ways. After hearing that some union voters had openly wondered about Senator Obama’s possible “demise,” I asked Dan Hammersmith, president of Unite Here Local 748 in Grand Rapids, if workers were really talking about whether Mr. Obama could survive as president.

“That is a concern that I’ve heard, yes,” he said. “But I tell people, ‘Are we supposed to be afraid of that and not go ahead and try to do something different?’ ”

Over the weekend The Detroit Free Press ran a chart showing how people responded when asked if they agreed with the statement that “there are people who want to hurt Barack Obama because of his race and sometimes I fear for his safety.”

Fifty-seven percent agreed.

I was ten years old when RFK and Dr King got shot, old enough to remember the shock and fear. and riots. at this point I feel despair about this country like never before, even cynicism doesn't work anymore. WTF.

Bush didn't have much either in 2004

That's just wrong. We were in a war and the default was to stay with the guy who started the war, esp. since it wasn't as widely thought of as a failure then as it is now. From the perspective of the people I live around, Bush was a good guy who was right with God and who was steadfastly leading our nation to victory against terrorism. He played the commander-in-chief crap well. They weren't going to respond to Kerry's substantive points, so they brushed him off, but that wasn't the main reason they won. It was because enough people were already on with Bush's points that Bush didn't need to take Kerry seriously to win.

i jokingly told my coworker a couple weeks ago that hillary would be the best VP pick because it would discourage any assassination attempts on O.

that link about an assassination plot is chilling

I thought the first story I read about it this morning was a joke, I admit.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080826/D92PU35O0.html

A half-hour after that, 33-year-old Shawn Robert Adolf jumped from a sixth-story window when authorities tried to arrest him at a hotel in suburban Glendale, police said.

Nice surname

shades of John Hinckley, who was arrested for stalking Jimmy Carter while armed, just months before he shot Ronald Reagan. only in a county with our insane gun laws could a guy issuing threats while armed to the teeth be deemed "not a credible threat." but he was on DOPE.

http://www.rumproast.com/index.php/site/comments/puma_pac_members_think_blackface_and_other_racist_garbage_is_funny/

odd

That's just wrong. We were in a war and the default was to stay with the guy who started the war, esp. since it wasn't as widely thought of as a failure then as it is now. From the perspective of the people I live around, Bush was a good guy who was right with God and who was steadfastly leading our nation to victory against terrorism. He played the commander-in-chief crap well. They weren't going to respond to Kerry's substantive points, so they brushed him off, but that wasn't the main reason they won. It was because enough people were already on with Bush's points that Bush didn't need to take Kerry seriously to win.

Bush's popularity had plummeted from its high point after 09.11 by the time of the 2004 election. The war in Iraq was going poorly, and there was a (resigned) sense that the Administration wasn't fully candid with the American people in the run-up to the war, and that they did no post-“regime change” contingency planning. The Administration's reaction to Hurricane Katrina turned many people against them, and was the key event for much of the nation (who previously felt that even though the Bush Admin. were vicious and underhanded, at least they were efficient leaders; but Katrina exposed them as somewhere between confused, lacking initiative or ability to lead, or merely unconcerned). I'd say Bush was unpopular -- and vulnerable -- in the 2004 election, and he saved himself with fear mongering and his negative campaign against Kerry.

(Also, Kerry was a horrible candidate).

(Daniel - Katrina was 2005)

YIKES -- I am old, and senile. Apologies on that part.

yeah I think among left-leaning people things seemed really bad in 2004, but I don't think the elusive middle felt the dread yet. By 2006 that had come, and it's not over yet

check the sneakers:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3255/2798310491_5388ba1552_b.jpg

lol pumas. I can't stand that guy since Old School, which I know is pretty lame.

I don't think Carville does anything by accident. Asshole.

http://i38.tinypic.com/2lvke15.jpg

yeah I think among left-leaning people things seemed really bad in 2004, but I don't think the elusive middle felt the dread yet. By 2006 that had come, and it's not over yet

So, Euler, why do you think McCain is -- by some polls, at least -- in a dead heat with Obama? Especially given (a) the dismal state of the Republican brand and (b) McCain's awkward delivery of speeches; cringeworthy, forced smile; and so many gaffes on key issues?

Daniel, look around. The United States is full of conservatives and fence-straddlers. Democrats may win, but they'll always do it by tiny margins. Jesus Christ could get the Dem nomination and he'd still only win by a point or two because the GOP would make him look bad.

lmӕo ice crӕm

Johnny, I agree with you. In fact, I think the conservatives and right-leaning fence-sitters are the majority, perhaps even today. But I sense, from his earlier post, that Euler disagrees. That's why I'm asking (I'd be thrilled if he could convince me that we're likely to win!).

Drudge w/ big gay quote

if the national mood is in a 51.5% dem direction in a congressional year, that's called a landslide because so many seats change hands. the same margin in a presidential year is called a squeaker because it's not a big powerful number like 55. the secret to this mystery is to never listen to the press when they talk about anything numerical.

Conservative commentator Ben Stein said Michelle Obama's speech "was just a mass of cliches." He took issue with her comments about her background as a mother and wife.

"I don't get what is so impressive about her. Lots and lots of people are mothers. Lots and lots of people have sick fathers. Lots and lots of people have children," Stein said.

It gets even funner:

"Tucker Bounds, spokesman for presumptive GOP presidential nominee Sen. John McCain, had kind words for both speakers. He said Kennedy's appearance "was a moving moment for everyone," and Michelle Obama's remarks were "well delivered" and "really impressive." Watch Bounds' reaction to Monday's convention speeches »

Bounds, however, stressed the speeches were just speeches, and he suggested that McCain had the upper hand in substance."

(from CNN)

lol stein explaining the appeal of the speech while simultaneously missing the point

I picture him delivering those words in his deadpan, droopy-dog voice.

guys who is puma pac

Yeah, he did that on Larry King Live while I was watching last night. Between Stein's monotone and King's rasp it was the first time I've ever thought about suicide.

an unfortunate group who came along right as the slang term 'cougar' is en vogue

xp

I think this might have been linked above, but there is a good editorial on the Gallup.com site about how the national mood and approval ratings of the incumbent party are not good predictors of the presidential outcome in years when no incumbent is running for president. Sometimes the margins have been much slimmer than one would expect from those indicators:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/109663/ReAssessing-Obamas-UnderPerformance-Polls.aspx

Also, I think there may be some effect from the fact that Democrats have nominated someone who is perceived to be from the more liberal end of the spectrum, and the Republicans have nominated someone who is perceived as more of a centrist. Obama's campaign is trying all it can to link McCain to Bush, but it remains to be seen if the electorate will buy that line.

Daniel, I think the election is a dead heat because a lot of people follow their guts/feelings, and McCain, despite recent right-wing failures, generates good feelings. But the dread is out there, and Obama can try to connect that to McCain. It's the key to the election, I think.

http://i.usatoday.net/news/_photos/2008/08/25/michelle-topper.jpg
OMFG GUYZ LOOK IT SAYS "3AM" OBAMA IS HATING HILLARY AGAIN

Hopefully the fears among some Democrats, such as Paul Begala, that Warner's keynote tonight will be too tame will turn out to be misplaced.

Some Democrats were already complaining, saying that Warner's job is to put a dent in Republican John McCain's image.

"This isn't the Richmond Chamber of Commerce," said Democratic consultant Paul Begala.

...

Now, in the race to replace a moderate senator, Warner is appealing to independent and even Republican voters by billing himself as a "radical centrist" in his campaign against rigidly conservative former Gov. Jim Gilmore.

"I'm not going to say one thing in Richmond or in Danville and another thing at the Democratic Convention in Denver. I understand some folks may not like that, but ... you know, I'm a job applicant," Warner said.

http://news.yahoo.com/story//ap/20080826/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_warner

I don't think that being a centrist precludes attacking Bush & McCain. Even a lot of self-identified conservatives would agree that Bush has made some terrible mistakes.

lol at this commenter:

I vote for Warner and would have voted for him for prez over Mccain. Cant vote for Obama too liberal and he will raise my taxes on my measely $95k a year. I am an independent. I vote for the Depends wearing Mccain. Obama also has a problem with his TV image he comes across as slightly effete law school prof. Not the image ne needs to project in today's world.

I just wish Dick Cheney had run for the Republican nomination. Anyone who shoots a lawyer gets my vote. And I have to hold my nose and vote for Mccain since he is USNA puke!

Will not vote for that crook Connolly because the man has taken more bribes from from area businesses than any crooked Chicago pol. And Fairfax Cty is facing a budget crisis because of his failure to go after illegal immigrants.

My only hope is my State Senator Ken Cucinelli loses his bid for staewide office. You shouldnt be allowed to run for any office if you are ignorant enough to home school your kids.

Mccain is every middle class and working class mens idol. Who wouldnt want to marry a attractive hot babe who will inherit one of the largest beer distributorships in the US. And he dated strippers back in flight training! A mans man! Do you think Obama ever dated a stripper or has seen one!

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/rawfisher/2008/08/_virginia_really_doesnt_matter.html

"my measly 95k a year" fuck you

that is a superb troll

and you fell for it ha ha

hmm. guess i did!

I'd be thrilled if he could convince me that we're likely to win!

Daniel based on reading and arguing with you for the past year this comment is like some kind of Bill Kristol level of disingenuousness

It's all well and good to have low expectations so you can be surprised when good things happen but your attitude on these threads is kinda get a new passport already

A rising sixth grader just told me that McCain doesn't have a chance and that Obame is cool. The youth of America has spoken.

following the PUMA blogs + assassination plot + no biden bounce = i'm in a dark fuckin place this morning

Tom, I think Obama can win. I'm sure it doesn't sound like it very often, but I do think he has a fighting chance.

But, to me, he has to fight. Here's what he's up against:

And he (McCain) dated strippers back in flight training! A mans man! Do you think Obama ever dated a stripper or has seen one!

A joek? Maybe. Either way, it's not far off of what lots and lots of people belive, I think.

stop reading the newspaper, hoos

and stop falling for obvious trolls, all of you

actually those pieces of advice are basically the same

PUMA Parallel Universal Message Passing Architecture
PUMA Periscope Mirror
PUMA Polyurethane Methyl Acrylate
PUMA Power User's Macintosh Association
PUMA PowerPC Ultrafast Multi-chip module Architecture
PUMA Precision Underwater Mapping
PUMA Processor Upgradable Modular Architecture
PUMA Programmable Universal Machine for Assembly
PUMA Prostitutes Union of Massachusetts
PUMA Protected User Mode Audio (Microsoft)
PUMA Public Use Microdata Area (US Census)
PUMA Purple Martin (bird species)
PUMA Power User'S Macintosh Application

which one has to do with HRC

Party
Unity
My
Ass

Hopefully the fears among some Democrats, such as Paul Begala, that Warner's keynote tonight will be too tame will turn out to be misplaced

you know that a) Paul Begala is a Hillary guy, and b) Hillary and Mark Warner are the leading contenders to succeed Obama, right?

I don't trust Begala as an unbiased observer, though Warner apparently has pretty much come out and said he's not planning to go after McCain tonight.

Unfortunately, it seems like it's the attacks that get the most resonance in the media echo chamber. I'm not sure what nice, centrist things Warner can say about Obama that will get much coverage. Hopefully he'll come up with something good.

This was spawned by Tom's advice to stop reading the newspaper. It's hopefully the last soapbox I'm going to hop on this election.

I want everyone who wants to vote for Obama to follow as much of this shit as they can stomach, then make sure that they debunk the shit that's false whenever it comes up and challenges the shit that's illogical whenever it's presented. Some of this means talking to people who either haven't made up their minds or disagree with you; other parts of it means co-opting a lot of the annoying tactics we all hate (for example, passing around mass emails with facts about Obama's positions and links to them contrasted against links to McCain's positions and how they differ; passing around stories about the stuff McCain's done that is shady/bad/politically uncool; etc etc etc). Complaining to people who are in (for purposes of the binary state of voting for Obama/not voting for Obama) in agreement with you is not going to get Obama into the White House.

Apathy and naivety gave the US 4 more years of GWB. I'd really not like to see apathy and naivety give us 4 years of McCain. (Obv people who have decided to go third-party are not apathetic nor naive, before anyone wants to play that card.)

good post, i agree 100%

see, nobody I know buys any of that shit, except my crazy landlady, who makes up her own puma garbage. that's part of why I think this is mostly trolls/rat fucks/other assorted isolated lunacy and the media feeding them because they need a story other than "Obama raises 3x as much money as McCain, has 27x as many volunteers" ad nauseam

The problem, as the example of MC Hammer so aptly shows, is that people buy a lot of bullshit stories.

Yeah, on these threads they do

People on these threads are still representative of people across the country, some of whom may buy these stories and use them as a basis to vote McCain (remember the 2004 USA Today study that unscientifically showed that people who were informed about the issues tended to vote Kerry but people uniformed voted Bush?)

well uniformed people have always leaned republican

hey don't malign our veterans that way xp

(xp) Right, which is why I wrote a self-important rant that said "stop bitching to each other and inform people".

oh shit nvrmind, I need the proofreading buff

btw I agree with you hi dere/whatever I should call you; I kinda view this threads as a way to talk out among friends the thoughts I need to engage others.

yeah dan yr post didn't come off as self important at all. it was a good post. we need more of that around here

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/210488.php

Halperin gave Leach a poor grade because his unglitzy delivery (on C-Span and PBS, lol) likely failed to come close to his objective of bringing Republicans over to Obama, never mind the thoughtful and eloquent content. Well, fuck that, and this from a guy who likes to talk about the dumb boobs in the middle.

if you guys want to help convert yr older and more rational or upper midwestern or Rockefeller Republican type swing-voters or other waverers, you might want to consider forwarding that Leach speech to them

I didn't catch the Leach speech since I was watching it on CNN, and as soon as they realized he was going to be talking in that monotone they cut away to commercials and pundit blather. I'm curious enough to give it a read though.

I'd forward that but the relative in my family like that was on the Obama bandwagon months before I was.

Maybe I'll forward it to the ex-bassist in my band, though; he posts Coulter rants on his blog, though, so it may not do anything.

yeah that's what i figure, xp

wow he really does sound like kermit

"no Biden bounce" = people starting to smell talentless phonies?

Leach speech transcript linked here - http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/8/26/9746/11541/231/575393

people starting to smell talentless phonies?

not by the looks of ILM

ha

The Leach speech reads pretty well. Kind of ironic that CNN cut away from this detailed critique of the opposition to feature some pundit moaning about how the convention wasn't offering a good detailed critique of the opposition.

that leach speech is pretty good on paper. but then I do like eisenhower

James Carville physically resembles an "X-Files" creature, his marble-mouth syntax harder than ever to decipher. Plus, he looks like he really doesn't give a shit about the convention.... David Brooks acts like a balding, nearsighted hyena, baring his blunt fangs while making predictable, pre-chewed points. Jim Lehrer looks nearly dead, and no amount of pancake can make Mark Shields appear as if he's 98.6. Probably the freezer he's kept in between segments.

Of course, those who matter, or wish they did, are extolling Michelle Obama's daytime talk show speech. The infantilization of American politics continues, as those looking to manage us on behalf of their corporate backers and contributors talk to the public in simple, patronizing tones. I'm happy that Michelle Obama found success in her life and loves her family, but why the fuck should I care? Her husband presumes to exert state control over me and mine, spending my tax dollars for expanded war in Afghanistan, continuing misery for the Palestinians, narco-war and repression in Colombia, among other wonderful projects, and I'm supposed to melt because his wife can read hackneyed, Hallmark copy from a teleprompter?

http://dennisperrin.blogspot.com/2008/08/demver-day-two.html

Sorry, what's the source for the Colombian thing? I hadn't heard/read that before.

that's referring to Biden I take it?

I'm happy that Michelle Obama found success in her life and loves her family

this was the only giveaway that you didn't write the whole thing, Morbs

Who is this Dennis Perrin again?

so who is on in primetime on the networks tonight? no cable here

http://www.mts.net/~hooch/images/loser.jpg

Dennis Perrin is an ex-arugula farmer.

LOL

Who is this Dennis Perrin again?

like, morbs, he failed at comedy, but on a bigger stage

I got nothing on Wiki for him (Perrin, not Dr. M).

like, morbs, he, failed, homo, house, music

is perrin an internet doctor like morbius?

http://www.zmag.org/znet/viewArticle/16802

This is the biggest reference to Colombia that Google is bringing up (assuming that blogger's interpretation of international law is correct, I agree with his conclusions). I don't see how this is "spending my tax dollars for ... narco-war and repression in Colombia" so I'm presuming there's something else...?

the back and forth about whether they should or should not attack mccain is fucking annoying. The big criticism of the Biden speech this weekend was "too much attacking McCain, time to start talking about yourselves". Convention starts = "too much talking about your message, start attacking McCain". These puppetheads are just going to complain about whatever the fuck.

I got nothing on Wiki for him (Perrin, not Dr. M).

I guess visiting his actual blog for info isn't an option?

I'm the author of "MR. MIKE: The Life and Work of Michael O'Donoghue, The Man Who Made Comedy Dangerous," "AMERICAN FAN: Sports Mania and the Culture That Feeds It," and "SAVAGE MULES: The Democrats and Endless War." I wrote jokes for Bill Maher and countless other comics, some of whom ran for public office. I've done the media/public speaking thing, pounding podiums when not singing and dancing for tossed coins.

hahahaha wait

It was an option, but not the preferred one.

I roll my eyes, maxlike, at alla you

so if the punditocracy is irrelevant, and most Americans don't watch conventions anyway, who was Michelle O supposed to impress – OpEd page writers (i.e. the punditocracy)? I hinted as such here last night, and Perrin's not wrong about how patronizing this shit is. I dunno what the fuck he's on about re Columbia though.

He's not wrong about that, but a good deal of all nat'l politics is patronizing.

most Americans don't watch conventions anyway

close to most Americans don't vote either. lots of people will be exposed to her speech via the broadcast nets, including the morning shows and nightly and local news, and radio and cable and internets

Perrin's not wrong about how patronizing this shit is

if he doesn't want to be treated like a moron, maybe he should stop being one

xp: esp the backtrack on her now-redacted (and correct) statement that this country has done nothing to make any of us proud in a generation.

get in line behind 'neb, ja wohl!

so if the punditocracy is irrelevant

how can the punditocracy be irrelevant? all of us quote the shit out of them on ilx politcial threads all day long.

blap or no blap?
http://www.barrycrimmins.com/images/links/links-Dennis02.jpg

yeah dude and all of us are irrelevant too xp

i know it's really ingrained in the way the media covers campaigns but god i'm just so sick of the constant benchmark-setting by the networks -- "michelle obama needs to reassure people of her values tonight, can she do it?" "hillary really needs to show enthusiastic support for barack obama and make a compelling case for him, will she do it?" and pretty soon it will be "joe biden needs to really be aggressive at this debate tonight, blah blah blah"

i mean UGH

no max, you're wrong. with this thread we can change america.

What's this? A candidate Morbius isn't fond of?

-- nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, February 1, 2007 5:36 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark Link

politics is not really showbiz anymore so much as sports. Long, bad, unending sports. Like, worse than the NFL or NHL.

i know it's really ingrained in the way the media covers campaigns but god i'm just so sick of the constant benchmark-setting by the networks -- "michelle obama needs to reassure people of her values tonight, can she do it?" "hillary really needs to show enthusiastic support for barack obama and make a compelling case for him, will she do it?" and pretty soon it will be "joe biden needs to really be aggressive at this debate tonight, blah blah blah"

i mean UGH

-- elmo argonaut

yeah i was just thinking about that, but how should it be done? like someone was saying thats basically what we do on threads here too

ethan, have you tried saltpeter for that woody you have for me?

so if the punditocracy is irrelevant

I don't think they're irrelevant, because they do have some power to shape the debate, at least the debate that is carried in the media. The consensus of talking heads can be difficult to shake off. Last night, the consensus was that the Dems had opted for a feel-good night at the expense of issues and substance. Anything that didn't fit with that storyline - such as Edward Kennedy's impassioned plea for national healthcare - was ignored by them. There was lots of talk about the emotional power of his appearance, but nary a mention of what was clearly a pre-eminent issue to him. After a while, you start to wonder if maybe you imagined it.

IT'S ALL LASERS, LIGHTS, AND THE GLOWING MANE OF COKIE ROBERTS

ethan, have you tried saltpeter for that woody you have for me?

let he who has not erection cast the first zing

or: everyone everywhere stfu

how come the Lords of ILX didn't pitch in a few bucks towards getting us a box in Denver? We'd discuss woodies, Cokie Roberts, and feast on screaming lobsters of hope.

i don't know, i think this "forecasting the story" benchmarking act is an avoidance mechanism used in part to exempt the commentators from discussing the content of convention speeches and debate performances and such, and in part to make sure that everyone's remarks can be prepared. if you've seen candi crowley try to speak extemporaneously, you can kind of sympathize. i dunno.

it seems more like making entertainment of it (& fuck it, it is entertainment) - you set guidelines for the politicians that you imagine theyre setting for themselves, clue the audience in, & see how well they stick to them & hit them - like morbius says it makes sport out of the spectacle

i was thinking the media should go for an outsider instead of insider image but then all i could think of was bill oreilly

see? You've been contaminated.

I think that the media commentators are naturally drawn to the horse-race aspects of the political process, because those seem to be the aspects where some kind of non-partisan analysis is possible. Liberals and conservatives can agree about what makes an effective speech, even as they disagree about the issues of the day. So sticking to this field allows journalists to maintain a modicum of objectivity, while also appearing to be savvy and knowledgeable about their field.

I think this tendency is exacerbated by the cable-news 24-hour format, which asks its talking heads to be able to respond extemporaneously to almost any piece of news. Naturally, not having time to do any research on the topics of substance, they fall back on the horse-race commentary, which is easy to do off-the-cuff.

yeah i guess it's not such a mystery but it's so infuriating when all the major sources of coverage are clogged with meta-narratives and issue-framing

i'm like, stfu paul begala, you got nothin to say

my wife got mad when I said I felt like I was watching the cnn national convention

srsly tho, when they cut away from kermit the frog I was like wtf, adhd much?

PBS, dudes.

the only way to see everything is C-Span. even PBS is cutting a lot.

I remember past conventions where commentators actually waited until there was a break, now it's like if it's not thrill-a-minute they're scared to death someone's going to change the channel, society is in the gutter, etc.

xp Like I have cable.

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2008_08/014414.php

NPR asks Warner if he'll run for Prez. Warner says he has three teenage daughters who have to get through high school. Hello 2016.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/25/tuesdays-convention-schedule/

is anywhere in UK showing this (the speches etc) live?

apols if this has been asked before.

you can watch it on the c-span and other websites

Joe Scarborough unleashed.

Meanwhile:

http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/KellyDNC.jpg

I still want one of those skimmer hats

s anywhere in UK showing this (the speches etc) live?

BBC Parliament (it's on freeview) is showing yesterday now, and, starting from 2am, live tonight.

For those upthread, demconvention.com has done a very nice job with fullscreen streaming live video as well as video segments of stuff you might have missed.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x18/gr8080/Purple-weirdo.gif

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x18/gr8080/Flip_Off.gif

Joe Scarborough unleashed.

OH NOES ITS DA LIBERAL MEDIA BIAS RUN

per Drudge, more than 21 million people watched the convention on one of the broadcast networks or cable (not including PBS or C-Span). that's more than watched any given broadcast of the Olympics.

OH NOES ITS DA LIBERAL MEDIA BIAS RUN

Yeah, Joe was upset when the MSNBC reporter accused him of being a Republican (instead of, understood in context, an independent). Then Joe asked the reporter to disclose his party affiliation, and when the reporter said, "independent," Joe mocked him, implying that political "independence" is just a fashion accessory that reporters wear to make them seem pure when, in fact (again, understood in context), reporters are really as partisan as anyone else. But he can't have it both ways. It was all a bit surreal and stupid.

http://static1.firedoglake.com/1/files//2008/08/housepin.jpg

Douchebags to douchebag away tonight, film at 11

..."With this action, there are many different levels of success," the site says. "First and foremost, the complete abolition of the state (Unconventional Denver will foot the bill on the after-party) is our goal. Barring that, we are seeking to disrupt the convention."

On Monday night, about 100 protesters were arrested following an un-permitted march that began around in or near Civic Center Park and ended at a wall of officers in riot gear on 15th Street at the intersection of Court Place.

The DNC Disruption 08 Web site says in an entry for Monday that those interested in being a part of the protest were to gather at 6 p.m. at Civic Center Park.

The says to look for "spritely (sic) elves" in orange bandannas who will be giving out "top secret" information on a couple of the choicest fundraisers and parties in Denver.

Folks were encouraged to come play "direct-action games," and "get some last-minute training before going into action," the site says.

"When they least expect it, at the appointed time Monday night, we’ll emerge from the shadows to reconvene in downtown and get down and dirty," the site said...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080826/ap_on_el_pr/cvn_convention_abortion

Curtis said the group wanted to send a message to Democrats gathered in the Mile High City because he believes Obama's support for abortion rights is extreme. Posting the sign is a violation of the country's open space regulations.

American Right to Life Action said the sign is also an attempt to set a Guinness record for largest protest sign. The group says it's 530 feet tall and 666 feet wide.

bob casey bringgingg it
"4 more months, 4 more months" - awesome
"mcain votes w/ bush over 90% of the time...that's not a maverick that's a sidekick" followed by shiteating grin - priceless

kingfish where do i get one of those buttons

olbermann and matthews really hate each other don't they?
you don't care do you?

god, ted stickland is hard to listen to.

olbermann and matthews really hate each other don't they?

I haven't been watching tonight, but this isn't my impression.

this convention is like the longest most boring Live Nation presentation ever

haha otm

I was thinking how much it must suck to be standing in that arena right now being forced to listen to all these speakers. At least I can flip to see a House rerun, or an Office rerun.

George Will was snarky and dismissive -- what a relief, in context.

my old sony-ericsson phone had q-bert on it, I would be bouncing on boxes like a man possessed if I was in Denver

Rachel Maddow and Pat Buchanan came together in agreement on the lameness of Mark Warner's speech. I missed all but the last few minutes, so I dunno.

I didn't see it, but I'm sure it's true. Warner is l.a.m.e.

i can't decide if schweitzer's yee-ha avuncular cheerleading is actually stirring or kinda annoying.

maybe they watched tape of themselves last night and decided to just shit on everything tonight instead

what the fuck @ these "tribute" videos? i feel like im at a fucking bar mitzvah

altho lol @ them using "are you gonna go my way"

fuckin Hillary I was diggin the kinks and then you had to bust out Lenny Fucking Kravitz

fuck that

This video intro is like the entrance video for a WWE wrestler.

10k to the Obama campaign if a staffer hijacks the audio and blasts Masonna

haha daniel

seeing bill on screen with the subtitle 'hillary's husband'... lolz.

the music is ridiculous.

18 million cracks in the glass ceiling gets me every time though

THEY WENT WITH THE ORANGE PANTSUIT

10k to the Clintons if that orange suit means she's going to begin her speech "the sankirtana movement is spreading under the direction of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada"

wow, guatanamo-orange. brave.

the screaming lobster of hope: actually screaming.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7459669.stm
live on BBC for anyone who wants it.

what's that tune?

Still thinkin' there's a 10% chance HRC says ''There's still time! Reject Obama; Nominate ME.''

i can't tell if she looks fly or too much like a http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/11_01/CarrotDM_228x814.jpg

ok, stop it now people. enough.

i mean the clapping people.

AND A PROUD SUPPORTER OF BARACK OBAMA

feelin you Hilz

ok, she's pulling out big guns from the get go.

watching these speeches turns me into morbius

everything that makes her contemptible also makes her good - she knows to hit the "support the ticket" note early, which lesser speakers would try to save for the build

even money says there's a lot of prednisone keeping that speaking voice in shape for tonight

ok mega-weak punchline there

AND SHE'S ON THE ATTACK!

YOU GO HRC!

okay wow hillary clinton i love you when you're being awesome.

NO WAY, NO HOW, NO MCCAIN

headline news ppl

i liked that line cuz it wasn't boilerplate!

For a moment the paraffin mask slipped, and she was clearly moved and angry by the fervor of the applause. No one noticed?

OK, clearly, she's savvily hitching her campaign to Obama's and setting herself up for 2012 in case this all goes horribly wrong.

this is like a medley of Simon Bates's OUR TUNE.

ok now she's launched wholeheartedly into party convention deliver-the-meaninglessness-w/feelingspeak

humility announced, anecdote delivered, reaction shot, 2ndary anecdote, won't somebody think of how this sort of thing is bad for children or something

OOOH

ref'ing the pantsuit! no matter who you are you gotta feel that

Sisterhood of the Traveling Pantsuits??

Funny! ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK

ok here comes the build

"money borrowed from the Chinese to buy oil from the Saudis"

Daniel's hard.

PERORATION TIME

OK, she's angling for a Reagan-in-'76 moment.

She'd be so much more effective as an elder statesman of the Senate. If this all somehow does go horribly wrong, then she's going down with the ship.

"of the public good, not of private plunder"

this is like an Yngwie solo right now

These well-delivered platitudes would move me more if her husband hadn't done so much to borrow money from the Chinese to buy oil from the Saudis.

She'd be so much more effective as an elder statesman of the Senate. If this all somehow does go horribly wrong, then she's going down with the ship.

this is OTM btw

xpost lol so is Alfred

but A you've read Didion, you know it's narrative not substance that counts

The orange/blue combo is working for me. It's a nice high contrast.

She's not busting out that flat 'A' in her voice anymore; good.

humility announced, anecdote delivered, reaction shot, 2ndary anecdote, won't somebody think of how this sort of thing is bad for children or something

hillary's let it go let's all join in. it does remind me how she's uniquely positioned to do a hell of a lot of good right now, more power to her* if she does prove cynics wrong

*figure of speech

WERE YOU IN IT JUST FOR ME? (yes!)

man this is a proper speech is what this is

So this is only the fifth reference to the presumptive party nominee she's made.

Ha -- Michelle is SEETHING.

WERE YOU IN IT JUST FOR ME? (yes!)

-- Daniel, Esq., Tuesday, August 26, 2008 9:57 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link

liked this line a lot

Bill was happy there for a second.

any minute now she's going to raise the ring of power and start calling it "my precious" as darkness falls across the electric ceiling

OOH very cleverly holding Obama's feet to the fire.

dammit, she said 'tax relief'

i.e. she WILL make a go at it in 2012 if the Ring of Power falls into Sauron's hands.

ohhh health care. i don't mind her putting the screws to barack over policy, shape up mister

this is like some dictionary-definition team player shit imo

OK, that line was too self-consciously clever.

TWIN CITIES FTW

She's hammering thru this; not pausing for the audience responses.

Oooooh, awesome "Twin Cities" line

Clinton is scarily on point, but whenever they cut to Bill I get an attack of the willies (if you pardon the pun). Whenever I hear either of them speak, my B.S. detector vacillates wildly from belief to disbelief.

You know, I keep hearing news pieces about how Barack Obama still needs to "introduce" himself to America. Well, if that's the case, I have a hunch he's going to knock this one out of the park and remind "America" why he's headlining this house party and not her. I also have my fingers crossed for another McCain "green backdrop" moment, if only for the schadenfreude.

wow, yeah. twin cities line. terrific.

oh fuck yes Seneca Falls. fuck YES.

aww snap twin cities joke xxxpost haha

please let them play the Distillers song, please please PLEASE

this is a great speech. im not going to read any analyses or any bullshit about this. <3 u hilz

That shot of Chelsea made her look like lil' Damien in "The Omen II."

hdogg is earning her sec state nom rite now

or sc or whatevz

She's rockin' the house.

apparently i am on a lag because i am streaming online :\

UNDERGROUND RAILROAD, WOO WOO

she's done so much better and so much more than I thought she would. This is fantastic.

Bill Clinton on the edge of his seat, biting his ring in anticipation.

holy crap that swell was just some straight heavy metal glory

tubman reference also wonderful.

Finally the convention feels alive.

And I think Chelsea looks kind of cute. I must be crazy.

hillary clinton is awesome

If she were this convincing throughout her entire campaign ...

OK, fine, the last two minutes have been superb -- as a campaign speech.

!!!

That was just awesome.

seriously!

Wow.

Good speech but God, wtf with the music?

speech of her career, easy. imagine if she gave one like it during the campaign. that Warner and Sebelius better watch out.

Sorry, but this framed the urgency of the moment around her campaign and the Democratic party, not Barack Obama.

Jeez, Brokaw's slur has gotten worse

homegirl brought it like eruption dead serious

OK, clearly, she's savvily hitching her campaign to Obama's and setting herself up for 2012 in case this all goes horribly wrong.

You are NOT just realizing this now.

yeah, good job lady!

absolute fire. unity achieved, image restored.

Eric, you're seven months behind!

NO WAY, NO HOW, NO MCCAIN

A+

i lol'd at the pantsuits line

So now that she's spoken, will this put an end to all the drama? Or will people just waste still more time talking about any alleged lingering drama (oops)?

More importantly, did she convince the old, white, uneducated contingent that still isn't sure about the colored kid?

Sorry, but this framed the urgency of the moment around her campaign and the Democratic party, not Barack Obama.

Alfred you brought too much baggage. The center of that speech was party unity. Her campaign also bore historical importance, and she was right to declare that in drawing the moment down to welding that importance to the broader importance of electing Obama. speech was awesome quit hating.

if she'd been like that during her campaign she probably would have won

is it just me, or is this prayer kinda wtf?

Sorry, but this framed the urgency of the moment around her campaign and the Democratic party, not Barack Obama.

glad i didn't have to be the SOUR motherfucker but i was gonna say...cue 'buyer's remorse' media meme, she's raised the bar for barack, if he does what he do on thursday it's off to the races, fuck a minneapolis (you know what i mean)

Oh, he'll do what he do, alright. Dude doesn't do anything else when the stakes are high.

I stumbled into the wrong thread, Alfred.

lol @ cnn.com

# Story Highlights
# NEW: Democrats look to tie McCain to Bush policies

what prayer? I'm watching liberals wring their hands on PBS

Uhhh . . . Obama will knock the ball ot of the park in his acceptance speech. He'll hurdle the bar -- with ease.

WAR: CLINTON TO SNUB OBAMA'S BIG SPEECH

C-SPAN, people. Disco party on C-SPAN.

538.com: "Hillary started out a little slow, but there are Republicans kicking chairs over right now in RNC offices all across America."

Why? Because she didn't endorse McCain?

speech was awesome quit hating.

I'm the scorpion, you guys are the frog, etc.

B+

She still needs to explicitly retract some of the criticisms she levelled at Obama during the primaries, particularly with regard to his readiness to govern, which are now being repeated verbatim by the Republicans.

The twin cities line was a classic though.

i missed the twin cities thing, what did she say

She said, "I love Husker Du and The Replacements, two bands made up of real Americans making real music."

and then she kissed Bob mould